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[G] Griffith's Magic Box - Page 4

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Tyrannon
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany113 Posts
February 23 2011 15:48 GMT
#61
Can somebody make a video about this?

Can´t imagine the use in that without a doubt right calculation.


I can see it with mutas, i know how it works for them, but how can Banelings, Marines or any other Units take advantage of that?
junemermaid
Profile Joined September 2006
United States981 Posts
February 23 2011 16:02 GMT
#62
Useful to know, less useful in practical situations due to the pacing of the game.

Magic boxes were used extensively in brood war because of the different mechanics of the game (no smart casting for one) such that blanket psi-storms were very useful if you knew how magic boxes work.

Not so much in SC2, though.
the UMP says YER OUT
Obsolescence
Profile Joined August 2010
United States270 Posts
February 23 2011 16:09 GMT
#63
Very nice job and thorough analysis, but I sort of lost all respect for you when you chose to call "general magic box," "Griffith's Magic Box," as if it was an improvement or credit owed.
It doesn't think. It doesn't feel. It doesn't laugh or cry. All it does from dusk till dawn is make the soldiers die. -Phyrexian Hulk
morimacil
Profile Joined March 2010
France921 Posts
February 23 2011 17:15 GMT
#64
[image loading]


Here you go, a video explaining it, since ppl seem to want that
kcdc
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2311 Posts
February 23 2011 17:17 GMT
#65
Mmmmm....yeah, it's good to know what the magic box sizes are, but it's SC2's magic boxes. Credit to Griffith for working out the exact sizes, but the thread title is a little ridiculous.
Yotta
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States270 Posts
February 23 2011 17:20 GMT
#66
I'm just going to call this the Magic Box, sorry Griffith.
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
February 23 2011 19:13 GMT
#67
well it was general knowledge that magic box works for every unit. When i played zerg for some time i always used to magic box my banelings vs siege tanks/thors. (was before terrans used to split up there marines use a few as blockers and all the nice moves that are out now, and most of the time my burrowed banelings finished the deal anyway =) )
Against Colossi army its always nice to send in a burrowed roach group in magic box before engaging. But thats only low apm cutesy against low apm aoe a click.

At the moment tvt is again the most creativ MU where you see bio only against heavy mech play, were people split up small bio groups before engaging points only defended by a few tanks, that have no chance at all, and makes defending expos impossible to do with only tanks.
Tyrannon
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany113 Posts
February 23 2011 20:08 GMT
#68
Thanks for the Vid. So Only Mutalisk fan out to the magic box. With every other unit you have to make it manually.

That was the Problem i had.

Thank you
Tyrannon
Coriolis
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1152 Posts
February 23 2011 20:18 GMT
#69
On February 24 2011 05:08 Tyrannon wrote:
Thanks for the Vid. So Only Mutalisk fan out to the magic box. With every other unit you have to make it manually.

That was the Problem i had.

Thank you
Tyrannon


All air units should fan out, not just mutalisks.
Descolada in everything not TL/Starcraft
morimacil
Profile Joined March 2010
France921 Posts
February 23 2011 21:08 GMT
#70
On February 24 2011 05:08 Tyrannon wrote:
Thanks for the Vid. So Only Mutalisk fan out to the magic box. With every other unit you have to make it manually.

That was the Problem i had.

Thank you
Tyrannon


Every single unit "fans out" to the point where they arent on top of each other anymore, but just side by side instead.
even ground units, you can get speedlings to stack on top of each other when giving them a repeated move command, but then they "fan out" again so that they are next to each other, and not on top.
With mutalisks, and thor splash, 2 mutalisks right next to each other wont get hit by splash, they only get hit when they overlap. So by just letting them sit for a few seconds, its fine.

That has nothing to do with the magic box though.
The magic box is just useful in that if your mutalisks are in a group equal to or smaller than the magic box, then giving them a move command wont cause them to clump up to get there, they will simply fly in formation to the location.
Ilfirin
Profile Joined November 2010
United States102 Posts
February 24 2011 00:41 GMT
#71
Griffith, please, figure more stuff out, and make more threads with your name in the title so I can watch more people cry.

In other news, excellent find man, awesome implications for fighting banelings/tanks/collosi. Any chance you could post some sort of short video showing us the easiest way to take advantage of this? I appreciate the hard work but this is a tad confusing to me (and obviously some others), and a demo would really rock. Thanks for all of the work you put into all of this, and sharing it with the community.
Zombo Joe
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada850 Posts
February 24 2011 03:36 GMT
#72
Marine Splitting just got easier.
I am Terranfying.
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-24 03:41:23
February 24 2011 03:41 GMT
#73
This is a pretty neat clarification but the arrogance of all these new players naming stuff after themselves that has been discovered in BW and only rediscovered in SC2 is rather...off-putting.

Kudos anyways though.
MangoSluSH
Profile Joined January 2011
Philippines10 Posts
April 01 2011 04:54 GMT
#74
Sweet work man. Dealing with banes just got alot easier.
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
Mephiztopheles1
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
1124 Posts
April 01 2011 05:05 GMT
#75
Yeah, thanks for the work you put into, but the self naming thing was going overboard. Also, no offense but it's a hard nickname to make something rhyme with :S
TibblesEvilCat
Profile Joined March 2010
United Kingdom766 Posts
April 01 2011 06:01 GMT
#76
im cönfused actually, could you show us i a slow video, what you do that diffrent from spread troops and move far ahead.
Live Fast Die Young :D
LF9
Profile Joined November 2009
United States537 Posts
April 13 2011 05:19 GMT
#77
Very nice find, but dude, did you REALLY have to say:

On February 22 2011 05:54 Griffith` wrote:
for the sake of clarity, the general magic box will be referred to as "Griffith's Magic Box".


Come on, man. No disrespect meant, but you had to know how that would sound when you posted it. I know you didn't actually mean that people should refer to magic boxing as "Griffiith's Magic Box" and that you just meant to use the term in your guide, but you can see how it could be (and was) misconstrued as insanely big-headed.

Frivolities aside, do I understand correctly that the smallest "magic box" size will always be the one to use in any unit composition, even if the ratio is pretty lopsided, say, 25 stalkers and like 3 zeals?

SlapMySalami
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1060 Posts
April 13 2011 06:24 GMT
#78
it's definitely griffith's magic box in my group

does griffith's magic box work in actual games? i never knew that i guess i never had groups that small or if they were that small it was in early game and theres no reason to spread slow lings like that
marineking will u huk my bigtt1 ilu
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
April 13 2011 08:22 GMT
#79
btw, there is a trick to further improve the magic box: (which I will refer to as "Big J's Magic Box", just kidding)

spread your units in really BIG boxes, like 10*10, then move them to the furthest away point they can reach without having to move around obstacles:
the units will move to that point and will slowly start to move closer to each other, but if you move far away with them and then hold position in close proximity (e.g. to attack a target in that location) to their starting point, they will still be in something like a 9*9 box.

in comparison:

S-->O-->E/M (Griffith's Magic Box)

S-->O
S-->O-->E-->O-->O
S-->O-->E-->O-->O-->O-->M (Big J's Magic Box )
S-->O-->E-->O-->O
S-->O

S being the starting point, E, being the end point, and M being the moveorder point

btw, magic boxing makes sense for Melee Units on big open fields, because they sourround faster.
(think about having your units in front of your gold base as zerg, and a terran is pushing through the center on shattered temple)
(just to be precise: dont give them the hold order, once they are in close proximity, use the attack order instead for zerglings/Ultras/Zealots, or keep the banelings moving...)
I dont think magic boxing is good for small ranged units, because it gives melee units more surface area and reduces the firepower, as less units will be able to attack (they defend each other less effective) and it makes them less effective against medium or big non splash ranged units (think about marines vs stalkers, marines vs roaches or roaches vs thor; you really want to have the smaller unit as clumped up, as possible in these situations)
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