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Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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tuestresfat
Profile Joined December 2010
2555 Posts
May 14 2012 06:12 GMT
#12561
On May 14 2012 05:55 NrGmonk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2012 04:40 haaz wrote:
What Protoss player is considered best at:
1) PvZ
2) PvP
3) PvT
?


PvP: Squirtle, Oz, Huk are all considered fairly good at this matchup, Squirtle especially.

no NaNiwa?
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
May 14 2012 08:27 GMT
#12562
Nani is good, but still has a way to go until the top. Not sure he has the dedication needed to reach it...
Altercate
Profile Joined December 2011
Sweden75 Posts
May 14 2012 14:08 GMT
#12563
Hi! I play Terran and I have a question about Zerg. Do Z players generally (almost always?) get lair/hive in their main? If I scan the Z main and see no lair going down, how confident should I feel in my assessment that there is no lair? And what about tech buildings like spire and baneling nest, do Z players prefer to build those in main to keep them safe?
StarCraft II for Complete Beginners - youtube.com/user/AltercateSC
Iyerbeth
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
England2410 Posts
May 14 2012 14:56 GMT
#12564
On May 14 2012 23:08 Altercate wrote:
Hi! I play Terran and I have a question about Zerg. Do Z players generally (almost always?) get lair/hive in their main? If I scan the Z main and see no lair going down, how confident should I feel in my assessment that there is no lair? And what about tech buildings like spire and baneling nest, do Z players prefer to build those in main to keep them safe?


It really depends on the map, the individual Zerg and how you've played up to that point. Some Zerg players will always get their Lair in their natural as their army will generally be around there and if gives their natural more health (if they lose that base they've probably lost anyway). Generally most Zerg plays though will get their Lair in their main.

As to Baneling Nest and Spire there's almost no way to be sure other than scouting everywhere as their is no universal location. A lot of Zergs will tuck their Spire away somewhere, which is quite often in the natural, or behind their main or something, but there is never going to be one place you can scan and be sure.

If you're the kind of player who will have a viking out for killing Overlords though, it can be a great way to scout to be sure, or a flying building pre-muta will tend to last long enough to find something if it's there. You could also just be aggressive with Hellions or drop play or a Banshee (maybe even a Raven for preventing creep after initial harass?) or something depending on your play which will also allow you to see what's going on whilst getting something else done. I guess my point is you're not always or even usually going to be able to scan and know what you need to know, but there are other options.
♥ Liquid`Sheth ♥ Liquid`TLO ♥
lamehater
Profile Joined February 2012
Sweden100 Posts
May 14 2012 14:56 GMT
#12565
On May 14 2012 23:08 Altercate wrote:
Hi! I play Terran and I have a question about Zerg. Do Z players generally (almost always?) get lair/hive in their main? If I scan the Z main and see no lair going down, how confident should I feel in my assessment that there is no lair? And what about tech buildings like spire and baneling nest, do Z players prefer to build those in main to keep them safe?


I'd say that most Zerg players put their lair/hive in their main. I almost always get my lair and hive in my main, but I sometimes go for the natural as well. Generally, you can be fairly certain that there is no lair, but you should never assume anything.

When it comes to the spire, I almost never put it in my main. The spire, 95% of the times, goes in my natural. The other 5% of the time I try to hide it somewhere in my main.
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-14 17:18:58
May 14 2012 17:06 GMT
#12566
Is it possible to do MCs FE with scouting earlier than gateway and still do it cleanly? I would like to be able to scout on 11 but i don't seem able to without a tiny delay of something...

Edit: changed "rax" to gateway
tuestresfat
Profile Joined December 2010
2555 Posts
May 14 2012 18:20 GMT
#12567
On May 15 2012 02:06 TheExodus wrote:
Is it possible to do MCs FE with scouting earlier than gateway and still do it cleanly? I would like to be able to scout on 11 but i don't seem able to without a tiny delay of something...

Edit: changed "rax" to gateway

you're scouting on 11 instead of 13, so obviously you'll be a little short on minerals. It sounds extremely negligable though, I'm not sure what kind of an answer you're looking for. Considering how long MC's 1gate FE cuts probes for I really doubt it matters.

No idea why anyone still uses MC's 1gate FE, it's so overly safe (maybe close spawn metal, but that's it). If stim was 30s faster, reaper build time wasn't nerf, rax didn't require depot, and rax was 5s faster then yea it's a really good build but now it's just unnecessary.
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-14 18:35:49
May 14 2012 18:35 GMT
#12568
On May 15 2012 03:20 tuestresfat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 15 2012 02:06 TheExodus wrote:
Is it possible to do MCs FE with scouting earlier than gateway and still do it cleanly? I would like to be able to scout on 11 but i don't seem able to without a tiny delay of something...

Edit: changed "rax" to gateway

you're scouting on 11 instead of 13, so obviously you'll be a little short on minerals. It sounds extremely negligable though, I'm not sure what kind of an answer you're looking for. Considering how long MC's 1gate FE cuts probes for I really doubt it matters.

No idea why anyone still uses MC's 1gate FE, it's so overly safe (maybe close spawn metal, but that's it). If stim was 30s faster, reaper build time wasn't nerf, rax didn't require depot, and rax was 5s faster then yea it's a really good build but now it's just unnecessary.


Because I get cheesed ALL THE TIME and I'm in bronze.

Edit: Oh, and the answer I was looking for was like "Yes it's possible if you're very careful with your probe stacking" or "No sorry, not possible".
pedromundo
Profile Joined May 2012
Brazil8 Posts
May 14 2012 19:34 GMT
#12569
Question: Right now, would it be wise/useful to make 2 extra queens for a nice creep spread and early defense as soon as we start floating on those extra minerals with two saturated bases?
"Because people like you do this retarded build."
K3Nyy
Profile Joined February 2010
United States1961 Posts
May 14 2012 20:11 GMT
#12570
On May 15 2012 04:34 pedromundo wrote:
Question: Right now, would it be wise/useful to make 2 extra queens for a nice creep spread and early defense as soon as we start floating on those extra minerals with two saturated bases?


Yes, many pros make 4 queens for creep spread and denying/help denying aggression before taking gas in ZvT. That opening isn't really optimal in ZvP and ZvZ though.
DeadlyNightShade
Profile Joined November 2008
Chile43 Posts
May 14 2012 21:26 GMT
#12571
How many workers ( and how many gases) do you need to get constant production of roaches out of 2 bases??
2hatchs2queens is enough or should i add a macro hatch for this purpose?
Snoodles
Profile Joined March 2012
401 Posts
May 15 2012 01:44 GMT
#12572
I want to switch from Terran to protoss, but the learner builds in the recommended threads dont make sense to me as I never see any pros use them. For example, the PvZ "safe" build says 3 sentry expand, but every pvz ive seen is FFE, I've never seen a 3 sentry play. Also the only recommended safe build for protoss counts on you being 4gated(3 stalkers), so what do you if you're not 4gated?

What are proper protoss openers for someone that already knows about making workers and supply?
All the guides to FFE just stop after Forge-> Gateway. What's next?

Also, as a terran player im tempted to just make zealots and stalkers and be aggressive, but a few custom games have taught me i cant do that. What's the proper role of the sentry? How many do I make, when do i need shield and when do i need forcefield, etc? I look forward to A-moving to victory once i figure out how to survive the early game.
Opeasy
Profile Joined August 2011
107 Posts
May 15 2012 01:50 GMT
#12573
I got a question for any korean out there. I am watching GSL off the record, and they are telling me the pro's blood type. Does people in Korea care about blood types, and are some better than others? I can't really see any reason they find this to be an interesting fact... Would make sense, if he was fighting with lions while he played and would need some blood after the game, but he's not.
Dingobloo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Australia1903 Posts
May 15 2012 01:55 GMT
#12574
On May 15 2012 10:50 Opeasy wrote:
I got a question for any korean out there. I am watching GSL off the record, and they are telling me the pro's blood type. Does people in Korea care about blood types, and are some better than others? I can't really see any reason they find this to be an interesting fact... Would make sense, if he was fighting with lions while he played and would need some blood after the game, but he's not.


I'm not korean, so someone might have to correct me, but as far as I'm aware it's a bit like someones star sign, they link certain personality traits to blood types but not in a way like "oh you have the bad blood type" or you have a "good blood type" but just vague traits that could basically apply to anyone. There's a list over here:

http://www.korea4expats.com/article-blood-types.html
ZeroTalent
Profile Joined December 2010
United States297 Posts
May 15 2012 02:17 GMT
#12575
What is the current range of Ghost EMP, Snipe, and HT Feedback? Liquipedia says that EMP & Snipe are both 10, while snipe is 9. But I swear that I've heard casters say Feedback outranges EMP ...
Can we get an official definition of "all-in"? Please?
tuestresfat
Profile Joined December 2010
2555 Posts
May 15 2012 02:44 GMT
#12576
On May 15 2012 03:35 TheExodus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 15 2012 03:20 tuestresfat wrote:
On May 15 2012 02:06 TheExodus wrote:
Is it possible to do MCs FE with scouting earlier than gateway and still do it cleanly? I would like to be able to scout on 11 but i don't seem able to without a tiny delay of something...

Edit: changed "rax" to gateway

you're scouting on 11 instead of 13, so obviously you'll be a little short on minerals. It sounds extremely negligable though, I'm not sure what kind of an answer you're looking for. Considering how long MC's 1gate FE cuts probes for I really doubt it matters.

No idea why anyone still uses MC's 1gate FE, it's so overly safe (maybe close spawn metal, but that's it). If stim was 30s faster, reaper build time wasn't nerf, rax didn't require depot, and rax was 5s faster then yea it's a really good build but now it's just unnecessary.


Because I get cheesed ALL THE TIME and I'm in bronze.

Edit: Oh, and the answer I was looking for was like "Yes it's possible if you're very careful with your probe stacking" or "No sorry, not possible".

Yes it is possible, albeit extremely difficult with bronze level mechanics. If you're having trouble with cheese you'll have an easier time opening 2gate robo.
Dingobloo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Australia1903 Posts
May 15 2012 02:52 GMT
#12577
On May 15 2012 11:17 ZeroTalent wrote:
What is the current range of Ghost EMP, Snipe, and HT Feedback? Liquipedia says that EMP & Snipe are both 10, while snipe is 9. But I swear that I've heard casters say Feedback outranges EMP ...


The ranges listed on LP are accurate, feedback is 9, EMP and Snipe both 10. The only thing that has changed in that regard is that EMP's radius was reduced but it still out-ranges feedback.

I've only ever heard casters say the opposite, that snipe outranges feedback, you should aim to never get your ghosts hit by feedback if you can help it.
Complete
Profile Joined October 2009
United States1864 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-15 03:27:22
May 15 2012 03:27 GMT
#12578
I've been watching a few protoss streams for a few days and I've noticed quite a few of them experimenting with an interesting PvZ opening

They're foregoing scouting completely and doing some variation of pylon,gateway,nexus,pylon,zealot,assimilator,core. Basically a FFE without the forge or cannon.

I'd love if his opening was somehow viable as a standard but I'm relatively certain it's not going to work well vs a 6-11 pool in to mass lings.

I was wondering if anybody has experimented with it or seen it a ton on streams and could share!
DeadlyNightShade
Profile Joined November 2008
Chile43 Posts
May 15 2012 03:48 GMT
#12579
On May 15 2012 10:44 Snoodles wrote:
I want to switch from Terran to protoss, but the learner builds in the recommended threads dont make sense to me as I never see any pros use them. For example, the PvZ "safe" build says 3 sentry expand, but every pvz ive seen is FFE, I've never seen a 3 sentry play. Also the only recommended safe build for protoss counts on you being 4gated(3 stalkers), so what do you if you're not 4gated?


That is mostly outdated info.
If i were you i'll watch streams or reps to learn about the current metgame and start from there.
tuestresfat
Profile Joined December 2010
2555 Posts
May 15 2012 04:56 GMT
#12580
On May 15 2012 12:27 Complete wrote:
I've been watching a few protoss streams for a few days and I've noticed quite a few of them experimenting with an interesting PvZ opening

They're foregoing scouting completely and doing some variation of pylon,gateway,nexus,pylon,zealot,assimilator,core. Basically a FFE without the forge or cannon.

I'd love if his opening was somehow viable as a standard but I'm relatively certain it's not going to work well vs a 6-11 pool in to mass lings.

I was wondering if anybody has experimented with it or seen it a ton on streams and could share!

could you please link vods or at least say whose stream you were watching?
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