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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On July 23 2011 01:45 galtdunn wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 01:28 Blazinghand wrote:I'm here to clear things up! I even brought evidence  Contested towers do not display any extra vision, and units by a tower from opponents contests it.On July 22 2011 23:37 galtdunn wrote:On July 22 2011 23:35 StoRm_res wrote:On July 22 2011 23:31 galtdunn wrote:On July 22 2011 22:16 Tommylew wrote:
HI i just seen the post about how fast Dt's can take down a hive and lair etc, and that was one of my questions my other question is for maps like shattered temple where if u cant get a pylon close and you are at cross positions does a cloaked DT when running through the middle and they have a unit on the watchtower will they lose vision slightly when ur cloaked unit runs through or will the unit keep vision need to know wether to run my DT around the watchtower??
Their unit will only lose vision if you kill it or make it move. Just running your DT next to the unit there won't do anything. If you want to be extra safe though, just don't walk right next to it. I'm actually pretty sure their unit will lose vision. First of all I think I saw that myself in a game, and second of all, if you wouldnt lose vision, then the dt wouldnt be able to hold the watch tower, which is obviouly not true But i think the way watchtowers work is that whatever unit that was originaly holding it keeps it powered until it dies or moves. DTs can obviously power them also, but not while an enemy unit is powering it, not without killing it. There aren't any units with priority on watchtower control. I disagree. I'm 100% sure that if there are two ground units in range, the tower remains unpowered for both teams, regardless as to which team got there first. I remember this from every game where you're having little worker fights on XNC near the towers, if you move your worker up to the tower, the tower becomes depowered On July 22 2011 23:40 Ninja_Bread wrote:
The tower would become contested and nobody would have vision until only one player's units are in its range. This is correct. From the Liquipedia article on  Xel&s Xel Naga Tower Article wrote:
When two enemy units are within activation range of a Xel'Naga Tower, it will deactivate. Haha wan't even my post but thatnk you for clearing this up. I searched liquidpedia by there was no article specifically on watchtowers  someone should get on that.
Oh, my bad. I thought this post was you. I guess the forum auto-quote thing must have mis-labeled it.
It turns out there actually is an article in liquipedia on xel'naga towers, and after many hours of careful research, I found it in the post of mine you just quoted.
Xel&
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Does anyone have the 21 drone or 24 drone roachling timing attack? Like the build order or a video or something? I have been struggling with it a lot.
in ZvP.
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On July 23 2011 03:29 AustinCM wrote:
Does anyone have the 21 drone or 24 drone roachling timing attack? Like the build order or a video or something? I have been struggling with it a lot.
in ZvP.
Here you go. Hope it helps.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=224227
This is a roach ling all-in that works fairly well in both ZvZ and ZvP.
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Sry but that's not even close to what i was talking about, I don't want just some timing, I want the roachling timing. That's a 1 base build...
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On July 23 2011 04:29 HardCorey wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 03:29 AustinCM wrote:
Does anyone have the 21 drone or 24 drone roachling timing attack? Like the build order or a video or something? I have been struggling with it a lot.
in ZvP. Here you go. Hope it helps. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=224227This is a roach ling all-in that works fairly well in both ZvZ and ZvP.
This is not a good build for ZvP, I wouldn't recommend using it in that match-up.
As for a ZvP roach ling timing, the one I use if I see a vulnerability in my opponent, then I will simply modify my 14p/14g/15h. With my opener, I only put 2 drones on gas until speed, then if I see the need to transition to the aggressive path, I'll but a 3rd drone on the gas as soon as speed starts then build the roach warren on 25. You should start saving up larva and build extra overlords about this time, as you should have enough resources for around 10 roaches as soon as the warren pops. At this point, I'll pull all but one drone off of gas and, depending on how the attack is going, start rallying lings or drone.
Here is a replay of me seeing a protoss go 1 gate expand before core... so I decided to just kill him/her. I was thrown off a bit because of the pylon block but the build is relativity the same, I just had 1 roach short and 5 less drones because of the lost larva from the late hatch.
http://drop.sc/20624
edit: OH wait, you're a protoss struggling with the build? lol misinterpretation for the win.
edit2: double misinterpretation!
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no im a zerg that needs to learn this timing, does this work against the standard 3g sentry expand with like 8 sentries and 2 zealots?
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On July 23 2011 05:17 AustinCM wrote:
no im a zerg that needs to learn this timing, does this work against the standard 3g sentry expand with like 8 sentries and 2 zealots?
It becomes a micro battle and it is also very map dependent. On a map like xel'naga or typhon you should have a definitive advantage because of the natural's openness. As long as you hit your timings right this should give a lot of trouble to a standard 3 gate expand. One thing I like about this build is that if your initial pressure doesn't look like it did too much damage, then you can simply take a third behind it and thanks to all the sentry energy you've burned, it will be a while until your opponent can move about the map again.
One thing I want to note, is that on closed naturals like shakuras or tal'darim this wouldn't work so well, but on these maps your opponent should be forge expanding anyway which is veeeery safe against this kind of pressure.
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i dnt do this against anybody going ffe but i seriously have trouble hitting a good timing, sometimes i hit iwth 6 roaches at 7:15 or 8 roaches at 7:40 and i reinforce with ligns until i supply cap myself at 52. should i be making more reinforcements?
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On July 23 2011 05:46 AustinCM wrote:
i dnt do this against anybody going ffe but i seriously have trouble hitting a good timing, sometimes i hit iwth 6 roaches at 7:15 or 8 roaches at 7:40 and i reinforce with ligns until i supply cap myself at 52. should i be making more reinforcements?
It depends on what you see in your opponent's base and on the map. For scouting, you should have your initial 4 lings poking the front and seeing the angle you need to attack, what you should attack, if you can win the battle etc. If you feel like you could win the game right there, like if your opponent had no cannons or stalkers when your roaches hit, then rallying speedlings could win you the game right there. In most cases, however, it is better to use this push as an aggressive contain, burn force fields, and cover a third base. In this case you should probably use your larva for droning.
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I've recently noticed that on maps with neutral supply depots, some Protoss players tend to destroy the depot on their own base. I was wondering why this was and why I haven't seen any other race do it.
Are Protoss players just more easily bored, or is it an actual strategic decision?
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On July 23 2011 06:04 ShadowSerpent wrote:
I've recently noticed that on maps with neutral supply depots, some Protoss players tend to destroy the depot on their own base. I was wondering why this was and why I haven't seen any other race do it.
Are Protoss players just more easily bored, or is it an actual strategic decision?
It is just idling units with nothing to do. I've seen all three races destroy it literally because "why not?"
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On July 23 2011 06:08 Soluhwin wrote:
It is just idling units with nothing to do. I've seen all three races destroy it literally because "why not?"
Allright. I haven't seen any other race do it yet, but then again I only watch a few casters. So basically it's the "easily bored" thing =p.
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On July 23 2011 06:08 Soluhwin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 06:04 ShadowSerpent wrote:
I've recently noticed that on maps with neutral supply depots, some Protoss players tend to destroy the depot on their own base. I was wondering why this was and why I haven't seen any other race do it.
Are Protoss players just more easily bored, or is it an actual strategic decision? It is just idling units with nothing to do. I've seen all three races destroy it literally because "why not?"
Sometimes, players will do it to put their own buildings in a strategic position. For example, that might be where a Protoss player wants to put a photon cannon.
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On July 23 2011 06:16 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Sometimes, players will do it to put their own buildings in a strategic position. For example, that might be where a Protoss player wants to put a photon cannon.
Well, I've only seen it in games where they didn't put any buildings in it's place; hence the question. I also think this would be a bit odd, since the 2 squares off doesn't matter that much in that location (and imo it's a really stupid place to wall off when you can just wall off at your high ground instead).
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
When doing a 1 rax Fast Expand in TvP on a long rush distance map, how many bunkers do you need, and when should you lay them down, to combat a 3 gate robo allin?
This is assuming it's on a map like shakuras or shattered where the choke at the natural is small.
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On July 23 2011 06:26 Blazinghand wrote:
When doing a 1 rax Fast Expand in TvP on a long rush distance map, how many bunkers do you need, and when should you lay them down, to combat a 3 gate robo allin?
This is assuming it's on a map like shakuras or shattered where the choke at the natural is small.
As many bunkers as you can afford units! It's never a bad thing being overly safe vs a 1 base. Generally 3-4 bunkers with scvs repairing will be fine. Also you want to stagger the bunkers so one step of FF can't eliminate all the repairing.
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On July 23 2011 03:29 AustinCM wrote:
Does anyone have the 21 drone or 24 drone roachling timing attack? Like the build order or a video or something? I have been struggling with it a lot.
in ZvP.
don't have an exact build order on hand but here's a replay:
EGIdrA v DREAMlegosu
IdrA stops at 21 drones for his attack. This should provide a good build order.
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On July 23 2011 06:47 Numy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 06:26 Blazinghand wrote:
When doing a 1 rax Fast Expand in TvP on a long rush distance map, how many bunkers do you need, and when should you lay them down, to combat a 3 gate robo allin?
This is assuming it's on a map like shakuras or shattered where the choke at the natural is small. As many bunkers as you can afford units! It's never a bad thing being overly safe vs a 1 base. Generally 3-4 bunkers with scvs repairing will be fine. Also you want to stagger the bunkers so one step of FF can't eliminate all the repairing.
Should I be cutting bunkers for rax, or vice versa, at any point? or just add more rax and more bunkers?
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On July 23 2011 06:08 Soluhwin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2011 06:04 ShadowSerpent wrote:
I've recently noticed that on maps with neutral supply depots, some Protoss players tend to destroy the depot on their own base. I was wondering why this was and why I haven't seen any other race do it.
Are Protoss players just more easily bored, or is it an actual strategic decision? It is just idling units with nothing to do. I've seen all three races destroy it literally because "why not?"
Woah woah. Definitely not an idling thing to do. It's critical to kill it in PvZ for defending against speedling runbys, since a great way to stop them is just to block your ramp with a gateway when you see it coming.
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In ZvZ on maps like Backwater Gulch how do I control my infestors and Roaches when going on the offensive to avoid getting demolished by FGs? because every expansion on that map is guarded by a choke.
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