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On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too.  You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable.
To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much.
FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days.
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Northern Ireland26096 Posts
Is there a database somewhere with the threat generated by different units?
I'm posting this because I had this engagement vs Terran near a Planetary fortress. I pulled collosi back and targetted a marauder in the middle of their ball, but when he died the collosi immediately switched to targetting the PF.
Would be quite useful to know how exactly A-move targeting actually works, whether it's closest proximity unit, or if there are different AI responses based on specific units
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On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days.
Thanks. And how about mid-game strategy? I see some people get mostly gateway units and delay colossi. So when do you get them? I guess when you have 3 bases.
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Where on earth are these homestory3 vods/replays I keep hearing about???
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On July 04 2011 01:45 8D wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 14:49 ptrpb wrote:I tried looking through about 8 pages backwards, I'm sure this question gets asked a lot so I'm very sorry if the answer is obvious and I am plain dumb. I'm a Silver league Protoss looking to learn a strong and flexible ZvP build that I can use for most games until I improve my mechanics and game sense. I am currently using a defensive 3 gate expand with mass sentry, but it seems to be failing against mass ling because I FF like a baboon. Is there something more simplistic, or do I have to result to timing attacks and all-ins? Thank you whoever answers this!  If you're having trouble with force fields, that is definatly something you want to improve, watch Huks force fields if you don't beleive me, they win games. But there is a really cool custom game that allows you to practice your force field micro. Search force field challenge in customs games to check it out. Also check out ForceSc2Strategy they did a really cool video on ForceFields. http://www.youtube.com/user/ForceSC2strategy?blend=1&ob=5#p/c/D481E0C4D4184836/9/XZkbP0Deqxw
3 gate expo is honestly quite delicate. If you're silver, I'd recommend working from bottom up to get used to early game. In that regard:
1. 2 gate to get the feel for zealot vs ling.
2. 10gate 4 warpgate (probes to 10, pylon, then gate immediately after pylon finishes, chrono next probe and one after, then build cyber before 2nd pylon) with a zeal/sentry push. This allows you to practice force fielding.
3. Regular 4 gate. This mixes in stalkers.
4. So on.
Purpose of this is because when you're starting out, you should not try to mimic the pros since their builds are optimized for other pros. Instead, get to know the units you are working with, and don't take ragers calling you a cheeser to heart :D
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Two questions here, one simple and one maybe not so simple. I play terran
The first question is is there a better way to hotkey a marauder/medivac army? I leave vikings/ghosts on 2 and 3 and 4 are my production buildings and 5/6 are command centers. This leaves only 1 for marauders and medivacs but to stim I need to press tab and then t because medivacs have higher priority(for some reason) than marauders.
The second question is, in TvP, am I simply stalling for 14 vikings when the protoss goes colossus? It seems like every time I try to fight a protoss I end up losing my army and then the game.
Thanks!
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On July 05 2011 14:46 GhostKorean wrote:
The first question is is there a better way to hotkey a marauder/medivac army? I leave vikings/ghosts on 2 and 3 and 4 are my production buildings and 5/6 are command centers. This leaves only 1 for marauders and medivacs but to stim I need to press tab and then t because medivacs have higher priority(for some reason) than marauders.
This may be a situation when you need to simply change your hot-key setup. Having only 2 for your army just seems like it isn't enough. Now I don't know much about micro-ing terran, but I know that one way you can make room for yourself is instead of hot-keying individual command centers, instead just have them all on one hot-key and use camera keys (f1-f8) to pan to individual bases.
I think that these hot-keys are set to something stupid like f5-f8 and then shift+f5-shift+f8 because f1-f4 is for hero units in the campaign or something (and idle workers), so you should probably rebind those to the proper setup of f1-f8. Also, if you find the reach of ctrl+f1 to ctrl+f8 (to set the hot-keys) difficult then rebind those to shift rather than ctrl.
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I use three for my army
I use fkeys for each base and my other cc is only on 6 because I usually build it in base and I want to jump to it.
I used to have my production on 6 but I changed it to 4 just because I liked it better. Many pros use 4 for their production and they seem fine.
I have 3 hotkeys for army, not two. I guess I'll just have to get used to pressing tab t
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I hear ppl say something like "I'm 1500 diamond" - I assume 1500 is the MMR Rating.
1) Where do I see my rating? Or is it just the points (which is useless)?
Thanks!
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On July 05 2011 15:49 Markstar wrote:
I hear ppl say something like "I'm 1500 diamond" - I assume 1500 is the MMR Rating.
1) Where do I see my rating? Or is it just the points (which is useless)?
Thanks!
It is points. You can't see your real MMR.
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On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days.
Got to agree with this, I personally only ever go for FFE or 1 gate stargate expands. (if you play against me and I'm seemingly doing a 3 gate sentry expand, expect DTs any moment ^^)
I've had some blue-highlighted posters tell me that 3 gate sentry was still very popular though, even at pro level. Not too sure what to make of this, but I've had the feeling that sentry expanding gave way to much liberty to the zerg player to take a crazy early third while you are stuck on 2 bases until some of your tech comes out.
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I'm gold and I don't play too much but I was messing around with my friend and I was trying the following build:
9 supply
12 rax
13 gas
Make one marine.(since I don't know the supply I make the marine at)
Orbital when racks finishes.(Look up one line and use common sense.)
After that marine a tech lab.
17 supply
After that basically one more racks then a ghost academy. On the second racks a reactor. Then get the energy upgrade for the Ghosts. On the first racks I make constant Ghosts and the second, marines of course. Then make a third racks and put a tech lab on that one. Constant Ghost production out of that one. I was able to constantly make them and a little more when my macro was doing well. I'm not very good so I was wondering if A( would this be an all-in or could you expand off of this? B( Could this be viable for a mass ghost/marine build? It's pretty good and even if the enemy goes for mech or something like that you would be able to switch to marauders or go into factory or air pretty easily. At some point I should probably expand but that's why I asked question A. Any feedback would be awesome.
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On July 05 2011 18:34 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days. Got to agree with this, I personally only ever go for FFE or 1 gate stargate expands. (if you play against me and I'm seemingly doing a 3 gate sentry expand, expect DTs any moment ^^) I've had some blue-highlighted posters tell me that 3 gate sentry was still very popular though, even at pro level. Not too sure what to make of this, but I've had the feeling that sentry expanding gave way to much liberty to the zerg player to take a crazy early third while you are stuck on 2 bases until some of your tech comes out.
I still see some pro gamers do 3 gates sentries exp, but it's probably because of the later push (i've seen at 7th minute and 9th).
Anyone else can confirm if this is the reason for 3 gates exp instead of 1 or 2?
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On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days.
How is it not safe when you have 7+ sentrys with full energy?
How it doesn't let you scout when you have hallucination?
How doesn't it give good economy when you expand early and build probes all the time with chronoboost?
You can apply real preassure only after 10 min mark, that's true but you can always poke with small group of units Huk style
And you suggest 1 gate expand into blind stargate right after criticizing build for not being safe and not allowing scounting?
3gate expand is still good standard build that let's you scout and react to your enemy while having good econ and ability to go for strong 6+gate timing with attack upgrades,
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On July 05 2011 20:30 Dariusz wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days. How is it not safe when you have 7+ sentrys with full energy? How it doesn't let you scout when you have hallucination? How doesn't it give good economy when you expand early and build probes all the time with chronoboost? You can apply real preassure only after 10 min mark, that's true but you can always poke with small group of units Huk style And you suggest 1 gate expand into blind stargate right after criticizing build for not being safe and not allowing scounting? 3gate expand is still good standard build that let's you scout and react to your enemy while having good econ and ability to go for strong 6+gate timing with attack upgrades,
It's difficult to hold off a two base roach/ling (losira style) push at 8 minutes without investing in at least 2 cannons.
It doesn't give you a good economy compared to a 1 gate FE or a FFE. Especially, it doesn't give you a good economy vs a zerg who can directly take a third and make only drones knowing that you have 0 offensive potential.
Zergs have learned not to be scared of 8 sentry pokes + a handfull of stalkers. If protoss commits to that early "shark mode" attack, they can lose everything very quickly.
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How many production facilities can a terran pull off of 2 bases?
Sorry if its a stupid question (i'm bronze xD)
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On July 05 2011 21:06 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 20:30 Dariusz wrote:On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days. How is it not safe when you have 7+ sentrys with full energy? How it doesn't let you scout when you have hallucination? How doesn't it give good economy when you expand early and build probes all the time with chronoboost? You can apply real preassure only after 10 min mark, that's true but you can always poke with small group of units Huk style And you suggest 1 gate expand into blind stargate right after criticizing build for not being safe and not allowing scounting? 3gate expand is still good standard build that let's you scout and react to your enemy while having good econ and ability to go for strong 6+gate timing with attack upgrades, It's difficult to hold off a two base roach/ling (losira style) push at 8 minutes without investing in at least 2 cannons. It doesn't give you a good economy compared to a 1 gate FE or a FFE. Especially, it doesn't give you a good economy vs a zerg who can directly take a third and make only drones knowing that you have 0 offensive potential. Zergs have learned not to be scared of 8 sentry pokes + a handfull of stalkers. If protoss commits to that early "shark mode" attack, they can lose everything very quickly.
Do you 1 gate FE or FFE on maps like Typhoon Peaks? Metalopolis? Xel'naga caverns? Shattered temple? BWG? I wouldn't consider it safe on these maps and 2 cannons you mentioned is just 150 minerals more then you should get anyways. Could you explain how is 1gate expand or ffe safer against timing you mentioned?
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On July 05 2011 21:16 Dariusz wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 21:06 Geiko wrote:On July 05 2011 20:30 Dariusz wrote:On July 05 2011 11:51 Anihc wrote:On July 05 2011 00:06 Excludos wrote:On July 04 2011 23:38 darkness wrote:What PvZ strategy is now considered modest and viable? Link to a replay/guide works, too. You mean in early phase? I believe 3gate sentry-expand is still the most used in this matchup. Of course, there are variations of it, or other cheesy builds. But to my knowledge, this is the most stable. To my knowledge, 3 gate expand is falling out of style. It is no longer really safe, doesn't give you a strong economy, doesn't let you scout, and doesn't pressure the zerg very much. FFE and 1 or 2 gate expands (especially with a stargate following it) are pretty popular these days. How is it not safe when you have 7+ sentrys with full energy? How it doesn't let you scout when you have hallucination? How doesn't it give good economy when you expand early and build probes all the time with chronoboost? You can apply real preassure only after 10 min mark, that's true but you can always poke with small group of units Huk style And you suggest 1 gate expand into blind stargate right after criticizing build for not being safe and not allowing scounting? 3gate expand is still good standard build that let's you scout and react to your enemy while having good econ and ability to go for strong 6+gate timing with attack upgrades, It's difficult to hold off a two base roach/ling (losira style) push at 8 minutes without investing in at least 2 cannons. It doesn't give you a good economy compared to a 1 gate FE or a FFE. Especially, it doesn't give you a good economy vs a zerg who can directly take a third and make only drones knowing that you have 0 offensive potential. Zergs have learned not to be scared of 8 sentry pokes + a handfull of stalkers. If protoss commits to that early "shark mode" attack, they can lose everything very quickly. Do you 1 gate FE or FFE on maps like Typhoon Peaks? Metalopolis? Xel'naga caverns? Shattered temple? BWG? I wouldn't consider it safe on these maps and 2 cannons you mentioned is just 150 minerals more then you should get anyways. Could you explain how is 1gate expand or ffe safer against timing you mentioned?
I 1 gate FE on all the maps except shakuras and Tal darim where I FFE. FFE can also be pulled off on other maps (practically all of them in fact depending on positions).
FFE is safe vs roach ling busts if you do it properly because you get cannons anyways and the zerg can't really hit a 2 base timing before your economy starts kicking in. (so you bascially only have to defend some sort of one base roach all in, or weird spine pushes)
1 gate expand into stargate is safe vs 8 minute roach ling timings because void rays shut down these types of attacks while your sentries stall for time. Also if the zerg is not attacking, the void ray gives you great map presence and scouting and can deny very early third or force some queens + spores.
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As a Terran player, what are the best ways to place static defensive structures. Two problems I have right now are mutalisk's in TvZ and heavy early gateway pressure in TvP.
Against muta's, where are the key points you should place turrets? Also, how many should you make? For reference, lets say the zerg went 2 hatch muta into expansion, so heavy muta play.
Against protoss, my default build is 2 rax reactor/tech lab pressure, and fall back into expansion. I feel I get run over by any sort of gateway pressure, 3 gate expand is very common. How many bunkers is usually needed to negate their pressure? How should they be placed? Also, how many scv's is usually ideal to pull off the mineral line to repair?
Should you be building the CC on the low ground or in your main base if you 2 rax in TvP? If I build my CC in my main, I feel I need to expand as soon as my orbital is finished, so is there even a need to expand on the high ground?
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If you neural parasite a ghost when the terran has a nuke built can you launch the nuke?
and also would this be the most awesome move in the world?
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EPT
