EPTThere are still dumbass idiots who are convinced that maradeurs are ok and nothing can make them think otherwise. Don't waste your nerves and time. Just have fun and wait.
TvP Marauder Cheese - Page 14
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hellitsaboutme
Singapore118 Posts
There are still dumbass idiots who are convinced that maradeurs are ok and nothing can make them think otherwise. Don't waste your nerves and time. Just have fun and wait. | ||
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SoFFacet
United States101 Posts
On April 04 2010 22:14 Slick348 wrote:And which Terran ground unit sucks against toss? Stop just saying they suck and give us explanations All of them. All bio raped by Collosi and Storm. All metal raped by Immortal (with help from Storm and Stalker). All non-BC air raped by Stalker. BCs (if you live that long) raped by Void Rays. The most stupid game I've played this beta, I was 2 base vs 2 base vs Toss on Steppes. He A-moved my natural with an equal food army and won easily even though I had several preseiged tanks, a bunker in front, and EMPed most of his army. | ||
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yarkO
Canada810 Posts
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xnub
Canada610 Posts
On April 05 2010 01:05 hellitsaboutme wrote: Oh, please stop now. Almost everyone understands that maradeurs are overpowered (not Terran race). Wait and see what Blizs will do about it. There are still dumbass idiots who are convinced that maradeurs are ok and nothing can make them think otherwise. Don't waste your nerves and time. Just have fun and wait. Think 95 % of the people here think they are OP just lots of the nerfs people are calling for are way to much when marines where just nerfed so much and MM is our Main ground army. Really just Marauders need there counters they have none right now with good micro. Without the micro the zealots and zergling do great VS them make them immune to slow problem sloved. If you want more Marauder nerfs need to unnerf marines. Remove reactor nerf and toss on another 5 sec to Marauder build times or somthing. Can't do all these heavy nerfs that people want tho right after the marines were hit so hard. | ||
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
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MassAirUnits
United States66 Posts
On April 05 2010 00:58 Floophead_III wrote: So much wrong info in this post. Stalkers take 5 hits to kill marines. Immortals take 3. "Void rays can outmicro marines." Why the hell would that situation even occur, and no, they really can't. A handful of marines handles a voidray fine. Marauders are not the dragoons of SC2. Do goons have stim? Do goons slow their targets? Do goons cost 100/25? Marauders have too much going for them right now. Notice how protoss players in BW don't make 100% goons. Goons are very versatile early, but you can't just make goons. People actually are making JUST marauders, and it's working. They just need some nerfs. I'm pretty sure nujgnoy even said that he didn't mean SC1 Dragoons and SC2 Marauders were both similar, but that they're both staple units and removing or greatly nerfing them would severely hurts Protoss/Terran. Would you disagree with that point currently? Note that I agree with Marauders currently being far too powerful and prevalent in SC2 Terran, but there are some other problems in TvP that need to be sorted out as well. If you DO have some good Terran strats for TvP that don't involve Marauders, it'd be interesting to hear about them. The only good one I've seen is mass nuking and drop/air harassing all the time by TL1, and that involved not engaging the P army at all. | ||
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
I prefer going 1 fact FE into ghostmech (1 rax 4 fact) and doing a strong midgame push to take my 3rd or even kill him. Most toss will play really aggressive and this seems to counter aggression pretty well IF you play super tight. It's very fragile though, and every tank and turret has to be so perfect, and you need to scan constantly. However, it is really good. It also leads to really exciting and interesting games. | ||
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MassAirUnits
United States66 Posts
On April 05 2010 05:43 Floophead_III wrote: Until recently I've had a lot of success with hellion drops into tank/shee with dropships on some maps, but people actually learned to make stalkers early now so it's not too effective anymore. I prefer going 1 fact FE into ghostmech (1 rax 4 fact) and doing a strong midgame push to take my 3rd or even kill him. Most toss will play really aggressive and this seems to counter aggression pretty well IF you play super tight. It's very fragile though, and every tank and turret has to be so perfect, and you need to scan constantly. However, it is really good. It also leads to really exciting and interesting games. Interesting. What is your unit composition/positioning like for this strat? You mention Tanks and Turrets, so I'm assuming you have them in the back. What do you have protecting them in front? It seems as though Chargelots, Immortals or blinky Stalkers will be able to handle a Tank/Turret push, but it'll depend on what you have defending them. | ||
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xnub
Canada610 Posts
On April 05 2010 04:28 Floophead_III wrote: We don't have to do all the nerfs. Just one should be sufficient. It's more of a "we're laying the uptions on the table, choose one" kind of deal. In fact, someone should just go ahead and make a "how do we nerf maras?" poll. =P Ya another problem nerfing them late game and not just early game where they need the nerf. Late game they are balanced with all the tech and units the protoss can toss out and it becomes and real close to 50/50 battle with toss in lead maybe by a bit. Nerf needs to be early game only | ||
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Yamoth
United States315 Posts
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Koffiegast
Netherlands346 Posts
On April 05 2010 08:02 Yamoth wrote: My suggestion is to make marauder slow an upgraded ability. Put it on tech lab and makes the upgrade takes 2 minute to finish. The upgrade will also be dirt cheap, something in the ball park of 25/25 so the main thing the upgrade is there is so that it will stop marauder from doing super lame cheese. Isn't going to add much imo. | ||
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Yamoth
United States315 Posts
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xnub
Canada610 Posts
marauder are the counter to stalkers ... This is why you make the zealot immune to slow and not make it upgrade Counter list by blizzard to Marauders Zealots, rines and zerglings Marauder strong vs thor stalker roachs only problem with this is the micro make the zerglings and zealots weak VS them with slow | ||
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RoosterSamurai
Japan2108 Posts
On April 02 2010 08:46 Bibdy wrote: Its all the rage in Platinum at the moment. Its hilariously strong considering they're just spamming a single unit. They'll get around to fixing it eventually. Without a three-way combination of a wall of Zealots to take the hits, Sentries to Force Field and Immortals to gun them down, you're pretty much screwed. Orb is always raging over marauders lol | ||
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xnub
Canada610 Posts
On April 05 2010 09:03 RoosterSamurai wrote: Orb is always raging over marauders lol And everyone rages over the forcefields he does lol its the circle of life ! lol | ||
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Slick348
Canada26 Posts
On April 05 2010 02:04 SoFFacet wrote: All of them. All bio raped by Collosi and Storm. All metal raped by Immortal (with help from Storm and Stalker). All non-BC air raped by Stalker. BCs (if you live that long) raped by Void Rays. The most stupid game I've played this beta, I was 2 base vs 2 base vs Toss on Steppes. He A-moved my natural with an equal food army and won easily even though I had several preseiged tanks, a bunker in front, and EMPed most of his army. Wrong lol, I find marines are the best starting off unit 1. Because it can attack both ground and air at a cost of 50 minerals each 2. In a group it can take down buildings, carriers, void rays, phoenix, zealots and archons if microd properly Terran has such good units that your stupid for saying they all get raped. Colossus go down pretty vast by vikings(far range), banshees are good against fighting stalkers. Ghost has such good abilities, if they don't wanna nerf him then don't, but they need to change EMP(splash). Nukes(splash) are really good since you win the resource battle, you make him lose more resources than you lost by making the nuke. Raven's good, deploys a sentry bot and something else that does splash damage. Tanks(splash) are especially good. I could go on and on, but don't feel like repeating myself to 50 different ppl | ||
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Rakilonn
France4 Posts
At the first battle, use the barrier ability behind the marauders in order to cut their options to kite. This first battle is just made to force the terran player to play more defensively. Then, tech quickly to colossus and keep the squad of zealot enough large. Yes, it's a 3-unit strategy but I guess if you have a large squad of zealot and one or a couple of colossus, the marauders squad will be obliterated. Is it better than the zealot-sentry-immortal strategy ? For sure you must micro the colossus and keep the pressure with the zealots squad in order to keep the colossus alive. | ||
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cHaNg-sTa
United States1058 Posts
The passive slow effect REALLY needs to be adjusted. Some of you may say it's not a big deal, but when you really think about it, it completely goes against the nature of SC1's e-sportness. SC1 had several counter features. Lurkers were great against zealots and marines. Goons are great against vultures. Archons are great against mutalisks. But what have we seen from the pro-scene? Despite these counters, pro players can still utilize these "countered" units in a fashion that they can still compete back. How is this possible? The "countered" units can micro to compensate for the counter. You can split marines or run a couple of zealots pass the lurkers to even the fight. You can place mines and trap goons to even the fight. You can stack mutalisks and attempt to out-range/hit and run the archons. These excellent displays of micro are key to both increasing the in-depth gameplay and become much more appealing to the audience as an e-sport. But establishing a unit that out-ranges AND slows your units, you'll never have a single unit that can combat this army alone. Suddenly, micro is taken out of the equation. This is just against the philosophy behind SC1 imo. | ||
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BigDatez
Canada434 Posts
A healthy mix of gateway units + immortal will destroy a marauder force VERY cost efficiently. An immortal can kill a marauder in 3 hits, whereas it has hardened shield. If marauders target fire the immortal, it's under heavy fire from all units. If marauders ignore the immortal, it's under heavy fire from the immortal. I'm not saying 1 immortal will destroy an entire force of marauders. I'm saying, a 3000 resources' worth of mixed protoss army has devastatingly destroyed a 3000 resources' worth of marauder heavy army in platinum games. I'm quite sure the issue here is a marauder rush, not a midgame marauder mass, then attack. I mean, rushing 1-gate to cyber core to robo takes too long to defend well against a rush, and any terran scouting this will be able to initiate an attack before immortals can even start to pop out. In Tone of ZvT, some Well-placed banelings can demolish an early M&M attack since the buff to 20/15. Zealots and Zerglings countered Ultras in SC1 for a fraction of the cost. I may not be in the beta, but I think Terran and Zerg need a little more army diversification. This doesn't mean they necessarily have to nerf Mauraders or Roaches. too bad roaches alone cant stand up to any type of marauder, or immortal army and are cheese for ZvZ vanilla fights in the North american servers ATM. | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
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