EPTWhat sounds wierd in this contest is you say you'll judge a map looking at before and after, and the winning map shouldn't be reworked too much after being reviewed. But at the same time you split the money even between the pro and amateur. So basically the perfect map would be so good right from the start that the pro would recieve money to do nothing.
MotM ProAm - Page 2
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chuky500
France473 Posts
What sounds wierd in this contest is you say you'll judge a map looking at before and after, and the winning map shouldn't be reworked too much after being reviewed. But at the same time you split the money even between the pro and amateur. So basically the perfect map would be so good right from the start that the pro would recieve money to do nothing. | ||
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Aunvilgod
2653 Posts
On June 22 2012 20:26 chuky500 wrote:What sounds wierd in this contest is you say you'll judge a map looking at before and after, and the winning map shouldn't be reworked too much after being reviewed. But at the same time you split the money even between the pro and amateur. So basically the perfect map would be so good right from the start that the pro would recieve money to do nothing. This confuses me a bit as well. As I am not on the Pro list I don´t care myself but basically every "Pro" will win or based on luck. If you are lucky you get an amateur that is good at mapping and you won´t have to change much. But if you are not lucky you get someone completely new to mapping and maybe have no chance to win unless you pretty much rework the map from the ground - up. Let´s just say an amateur submits 3 maps with 256x256 playable bounds. The Pro would be f****d. | ||
Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On June 22 2012 20:26 chuky500 wrote: I thought this was a contest to match players with amateur mappers, since Morrow is in the list. It clearly says that people who have placed in a motm contest or equivalent. Morrow happens to be a competent mapper and wound up on the list. After Iromansc's post saying there should be relationships between players, spectators, organizers, casters and the mapping community I thought this would have been a good idea. Making a distinction between pro mappers and amateurs mappers sounds awkward in my opinion, at least with such a long list. I don't think it's a good way to tie a community by discriminating its members, especially in such an elitist way. Calling 38 people "pros" and the rest "amateur". So basically if you enter the contest you're bad but it's ok since a pro will help you become a pro. It sounds more like a fraternity picking its new member imo. Not all of the 38 people on the list will be choosing maps. The post never called those 38 people pros, simply ineligible to participate. We want to encourage people who have never won a motm before to participate with hopes that they will learn something from the process as well. I don't know why you're trying to make an issue out of this. What sounds wierd in this contest is you say you'll judge a map looking at before and after, and the winning map shouldn't be reworked too much after being reviewed. But at the same time you split the money even between the pro and amateur. So basically the perfect map would be so good right from the start that the pro would recieve money to do nothing. We don't expect any submission to be perfect, indeed even at the highest level maps aren't perfect. This isn't an issue.On June 22 2012 20:40 Aunvilgod wrote: This confuses me a bit as well. As I am not on the Pro list I don´t care myself but basically every "Pro" will win or based on luck. If you are lucky you get an amateur that is good at mapping and you won´t have to change much. But if you are not lucky you get someone completely new to mapping and maybe have no chance to win unless you pretty much rework the map from the ground - up. Let´s just say an amateur submits 3 maps with 256x256 playable bounds. The Pro would be f****d. By complete rework I mean someone submitting steppes of war and the pro making ohana - there's just no relation between the maps. However a change like this; From  to  would be fine. The concept of the map is still preserved but the second version is significantly better. I know this is an SC1 example, but hopefully you can see that there is a drastic change between the two maps. I admit that the statement in the OP isn't 100% clear, but that is because it was never meant to be a comprehensive guideline. Just that there will be some consideration given to the difference between the before and after versions. It isn't something that you need to worry about anyway  the invited mappers will be well aware of what we expect. | ||
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Johanaz
Denmark363 Posts
edit: ... wait a minute... so there's a strong possibility I won't be able to participate  -well I'm still excited, good luck to all. | ||
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ihasaKAROT
Netherlands4730 Posts
edit: i dunno, theres a typo in ur name tho, so maybe youll be able to sneak thru ^_^ | ||
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Sinnwin
United States12 Posts
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The_Templar
your Country52797 Posts
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chuky500
France473 Posts
If you want to be fair give all the money to the amateur since it's his own work and the pro is a pro so he doesn't need the money anyways. | ||
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ihasaKAROT
Netherlands4730 Posts
If making a map was just making a map, there wouldnt be mappingcommunitys, mappingteams or these contests. I would pay professional mappers and gamers to help me on my maps tbh, since their imput makes the maps as good as they can be. The 50/50 is fine , im sure if a pro thinks the amateur deserves all the money they are mature enough to work that out between themselves. | ||
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chuky500
France473 Posts
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ScorpSCII
Denmark499 Posts
Also, as there seem to be some discussion about the money split, I just wanted to share my opinion. The time an amateur put into the map will most likely be higher than the pro, but the work the pro puts into tweaking the map is most likely also what gives the quality a kick. | ||
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Sea_Food
Finland1612 Posts
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Gfire
United States1699 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:17 Sea_Food wrote: What if 3 pros all want 1 of maps i submited? Don't flatter yourself. + Show Spoiler +  But Plexa said there would be a randomized ordering in case of that.Edit: Oh I see you mean the three different maps you submit? | ||
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Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:17 Sea_Food wrote: What if 3 pros all want 1 of maps i submited? Good question. Once one of your maps is chosen then your other two maps can no longer be selected. This is to maximise the number of people who get feedback. | ||
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LunaSaint
United Kingdom620 Posts
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HypertonicHydroponic
437 Posts
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Infidler
Norway49 Posts
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FlaShFTW
United States10231 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:47 HypertonicHydroponic wrote: What? No front page headline? C'mon Plexa, help build some hype for the map making community! This may not be as big as getting your map on the ladder or into a tournament, but it is for real prizes. Is this not an unprecedented occurrence? I think the map making community needs more support than just FlashFTW, Chargelot, and ihasaKAROT. The people need to be informed! Spotlight please! I feel honored that you mentioned me xD Gave me a chill down my spine. Tbh, I look at maps because I love it. The skills that people have to offer are amazing. And being a mapmaker myself (thought i dont post any of my work because im took lazy to turn my graph paper into a real map), I enjoy seeing what others bring to the table. Who knows? I might start a map. Never tried yet lol, but I think I might surprise myself. GL HF to those participating!!! | ||
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monitor
United States2408 Posts
On June 22 2012 22:17 chuky500 wrote: I get it about the map being corrected but the problem is the pro will get the amateur's money ! And this is even truer if the map has quality in the first place, so pro mappers will be able to tell. To sum up you're giving away money for a betting competition. As you said even the highest level maps aren't perfect so you could have a contest the other way around : a noname would pick a pro's map, give him some advice and earn as much money as the pro for the map the pro made. If you want to be fair give all the money to the amateur since it's his own work and the pro is a pro so he doesn't need the money anyways. First of all, I can assure you the pros will do a lot of work- there isn't going to be any amateur map that doesn't need a ton of changes. I know this because there isn't a single "pro" map that doesn't need a ton of changes. And, if you're curious, your map is no exception. Second, no, it wouldn't be fair to give all the money to the amateur. Nobody in the world makes money making maps right now. So "pros" need it just as much as the amateurs. Also if there's no money in it for the "pro" mapmakers, then it would hard to get them to participate- there is a lot of work involved, I can assure you. | ||
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ArcticRaven
France1406 Posts
On June 22 2012 23:11 chuky500 wrote: The way winners will be judged incitate pros to pick the maps that are already good, not drafts of half complete maps. I think I would definitely pick an uncomplete map that could be way better rather an a finished one. | ||
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