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Not_Computer
Canada2277 Posts
On January 27 2007 02:45 asel wrote: You cant cheese saviOr. He will eat your soul. On January 27 2007 03:28 Manifesto7 wrote: Reach has no soul, thus the victory. lolz =D edit: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://img77.imageshack.us/img77/1847/larvaownjs3.png) sAviOr getting owned in Game 2. j/k j/k ! <3 sAviOr~ | ||
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Mickey
United States2606 Posts
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psychosis
Sweden107 Posts
On January 27 2007 06:49 Manifesto7 wrote: Im not talking about racial imbalance, I am talking about map imbalance. This map is unbalanced because terran does not need to take the risk of expanding outside their island to win, but both protoss and zerg do. Combine that with the ease of their fast expansion, and I think that this map is an easy map for terran. Bifrost didnt do anything other than send dropships about. He did not have to take any kind of gamble, and stared at the same quater of the screen all game long. As for Savior's "boring" rushes, well I consider them builds that counter the FE arrogance of terrans these days, who feel that they can expand behind one rax, one rine, and a placed depot. Boring it may be, it is savior destroying their ability to use those builds vs him in the future, which is extremely valuable. First of all. Maybe the maps isnt imbalance at all. Maybe Protoss and Zerg need to learn how to play and adapt on them? Sorry, but I don't buy that you can scream Imbalance about one thing and not about the other. Hypocracy ftw! Also it is quite clear that, at that level they are playing, it is just a matter of adapting and learning the map. Use it to ones advantage. Unless you listen to the Pro Zergs that say that ZvP is easy, and the Pro Tosses that say it's imbalance. Maybe, just maaaaaaaaybe they know what they are talking about. Never heard anything from them about the maps tho. Except that, apparently, Longinus is also a Zerg-killing map. [ sarcasm] OMG! Maps where Zerg aren't invincible. Must be imbalanced maps. Clearly. [ /sarcasm] I know there are maps that favours some races at times, but don't draw the imbalance card that easy. This is a competition far above most of our level and they have decided to include that map in their map pool. Bifrost sent those dropships well tho, and as I said. If savior could held off for just a tad longer, it might been a win. Don't know how much money Bifrost or saviour had in the bank 'tho. I can still think the rushgames were boring right? I never said it was "BM" or "cheating". I just said it was boring to watch. I also said it was well executed by savior. Just my personal opinion of 2 boring games to watch. Not a diss to you who uploaded the games at all either. In the end, saviour did what he thought he needed to do to win and he succeded. Good for him. | ||
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muramasa
Canada1299 Posts
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Purind
Canada3562 Posts
On January 27 2007 09:29 Mickey wrote: Bifrost-> Casy right? Nope, Bifrost = Casy[name], the fake Casy. Doesn't help that they're both normal looking guys on the same team | ||
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Night[Mare
Mexico4793 Posts
edit: or make some firebats 2x >.< edit2: w00t, 2k posts | ||
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EAGER-beaver
Canada2799 Posts
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ManaBlue
Canada10458 Posts
 I'm really impressed that both Bisu and Savior were able to win a bo3 against Terran's that got a free win from desert fox. Good for them.  | ||
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Not_Computer
Canada2277 Posts
On January 27 2007 09:29 Mickey wrote: Bifrost-> Casy right? Bifrost -> Justin Or were you asking something else? | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7230 Posts
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Blind
United States2529 Posts
On January 27 2007 09:39 psychosis wrote: Who are the zerg players who say "stfu, learn to adapt" when protoss screams pvz is imbalance? I am a z player and consider zvp imbalanced (in favor of the zerg). Then there are several good protosses on this site who say pvz is balanced, so it is the protoss players telling the other ones to stfu.First of all. Maybe the maps isnt imbalance at all. Maybe Protoss and Zerg need to learn how to play and adapt on them? Sorry, but I don't buy that you can scream Imbalance about one thing and not about the other. Hypocracy ftw! Also it is quite clear that, at that level they are playing, it is just a matter of adapting and learning the map. Use it to ones advantage. Unless you listen to the Pro Zergs that say that ZvP is easy, and the Pro Tosses that say it's imbalance. Maybe, just maaaaaaaaybe they know what they are talking about. Never heard anything from them about the maps tho. Except that, apparently, Longinus is also a Zerg-killing map. [ sarcasm] OMG! Maps where Zerg aren't invincible. Must be imbalanced maps. Clearly. [ /sarcasm] I know there are maps that favours some races at times, but don't draw the imbalance card that easy. This is a competition far above most of our level and they have decided to include that map in their map pool. Bifrost sent those dropships well tho, and as I said. If savior could held off for just a tad longer, it might been a win. Don't know how much money Bifrost or saviour had in the bank 'tho. I can still think the rushgames were boring right? I never said it was "BM" or "cheating". I just said it was boring to watch. I also said it was well executed by savior. Just my personal opinion of 2 boring games to watch. Not a diss to you who uploaded the games at all either. In the end, saviour did what he thought he needed to do to win and he succeded. Good for him. Anyway, there is a huge difference between racial imbalance and map imbalance. I thought it was pretty clear that this map favors T in tvz, but I guess you don't think so. Those cliffs that the bifrost exploited won him the game. Even when savior defended the drops, he barely won with a much bigger army, while his army and economy slowly deteriorated. What do you suggest the zerg do to "adapt" to this? Park his units at the cliff of each of his expands with scourges waiting around the terran base? He had about 5 bases that game, so now his army is split into 5 little groups vs 1 big terran drop, which is inevitable because the valks will clear most of the scourges up. Sometimes a map is just too imbalanced for a zerg to adapt. Remember Paradox? Do you think zerg could have somehow overcome that hell? I'm not necessarily saying Desert Fox is the next Paradox, but it seems pretty damn close at this point. | ||
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muramasa
Canada1299 Posts
The Light vs. Bisu series was really good. 2 close games and 1 attempted cheese that failed pretty miserably. Also, I like that sound MSL uses when they go to first-preson mode. It's cool. | ||
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Arcanis
Croatia117 Posts
On January 27 2007 12:39 muramasa wrote: Oh my. I can't believe Savior 5 pooled against Justin. I didn't think that was his style. He is the Maestro... he can do whatever he wants ^^ | ||
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Not_Computer
Canada2277 Posts
On January 27 2007 12:39 muramasa wrote: Oh my. I can't believe Savior 5 pooled against Justin. I didn't think that was his style. lol, that speedling rush first game made me LOL. + Show Spoiler + Warning: Language May Be Offensive. ![[image loading]](http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/6518/scvownedsi7.png) And the 5 pool was crazy, but in a way it kinda sucked cause there wasn't any action. =\ | ||
Last Romantic
United States20661 Posts
On January 27 2007 04:53 Slayer91 wrote: + Show Spoiler + Mani isn't a zerg player. And he savior had like 4-5 bases using everything but hive tech and all the guydid was macro dropship mnm valk and drop his main gg.  Oh come on. You can't say sAviOr is aggressive every game either. Vs Rainbow and vs Reach he played these defensive sunken/spore/lurker strategies while toss attacked with every angle, even with recall, but still couldn't win. It's so boring to watch. I will laugh when someone finds a definitive counter to savior-style. | ||
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Yogurt
United States4258 Posts
like really really like them dont stop plz | ||
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LemOn
United Kingdom8629 Posts
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Manifesto7
Osaka27158 Posts
the map is imbalanced. obviously players are going to have to adapt, im not arguing that, but that map is imbalanced, making it easier for terran to win vs different races. Im not even sure what you are arging or why. All I said is that the map is imbalanced. You haven't explained why this isnt the case except for saying that the tournament is above me in skill level. Well, I have been watching pro sc long enough to know when a map is imbalanced or not. This one is, for reasons I have already stated. | ||
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pooper-scooper
United States3108 Posts
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pooper-scooper
United States3108 Posts
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