On August 30 2022 04:12 deconduo wrote: Anyone who's posts I like always turns out to be mafia
The question is, if you've noticed this pattern before, didn't you just vote for the people whose posts you liked? How did it go?
Don't remember, its been years
I usually put this kind of thing (people whose posts i like tend to be mafia') down to cognitive bias. You'll always remember the times that this did happen, not so much when it didn't imo. Its probably a bit too much of a vague criteria to be actually true.
On August 30 2022 04:12 deconduo wrote: Anyone who's posts I like always turns out to be mafia
The question is, if you've noticed this pattern before, didn't you just vote for the people whose posts you liked? How did it go?
Don't remember, its been years
I usually put this kind of thing (people whose posts i like tend to be mafia') down to cognitive bias. You'll always remember the times that this did happen, not so much when it didn't imo. Its probably a bit too much of a vague criteria to be actually true.
Well yes, I wasn't actually claiming that my subconscious is a highly honed mafia finding machine that can sniff out scum 20 minutes into day 1
Or maybe ...
You say that as if NO-ONE would ever claim such things.
But I've played against people who really do think that
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
Also I will infer from this that your mind is close to made up and that you actually are trying to lynch me.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" plus the later you vote the more townie you are and I only care about how townie I look
Why would you only care about how townie you look? That's a really weird thing to be your main objective. I mean, to me you don't look particularly townie right now, and that's because you say you're trying to look townie.
Why would you assume that people will go off how many votes someone has made without reading into the context? If you're town and your posts show that you're town why should it matter how many votes you make, as long as you can detect some reasoning behind the votes.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" (1)plus the later you vote the more townie you are and (2)I only care about how townie I look
1) since when, and why? 2) when ever have you cared about this?
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
What?
But responded to the very next one:
On August 30 2022 03:14 deconduo wrote:
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote: I'm town
Awesome we have one confirmed town. Anyone else?
But then you posted your clarification at the same time I posted my question
Am I wrong or was his clarification to do with a totally different post, not the 'lol?' or hf's post? Confused.
He didn't reply to HF post directly but addressed the question (at least a little bit, we'll apparently get the full context of the Vivax trap later)
So yeah, "this game i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb" is a reference to the last game where i was mafia with vivax and he rb'd trfel who we knew was jailer, just to realize after night phase that even though trfel got roleblocked he could still jail me (apparently "before getting roleblocked" roflmao) and our night kill didn't go through. It actually sparked a stupidly idiotic post game discussion where some people actually considered that is not bs hosting.
Anyways it was originally a prod towards Vivax since not once or twice have i figured out his alignment based on some random looking comment which he should be actually responding to (at least jokingly if not otherwise), and here also feeling the same way in case he is also town. He's known to pay way less attention to the game as mafia than as town, especially early on in the game. But yeah i typoed and it is what it is now, useless.
I don't really think i should have any response about HF's posts because my post is not directed to him (same as Jock a bit later). I don't remember if i actually talked about the incident later with HF in discord but anyways he's gonna claim he doesn't remember it or doesn't genuinely remember it (in case we did talk about it) and there is no way to confirm that so there really is nothing for me to respond. _____
I liked Jock's eagerness in the beginning, although now i don't really know what he's trying to do especially with deconduo, after deconduo's first couple of posts i don't think there is anything could be alignment indicative, yet for some reason Jock's pushing that forward, it seems quite useless to me. I was about to say i think he's town earlier, but i will take that back.
deconduo's a bit... idk. I don't think his response to HF's "im town" is alignment indicative necessarily, just very... stupid? However i really don't get this:
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
What incentive would you EVER have to NOT claim town as town in your mind deconduo?
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" plus the later you vote the more townie you are and I only care about how townie I look
Why would you only care about how townie you look? That's a really weird thing to be your main objective. I mean, to me you don't look particularly townie right now, and that's because you say you're trying to look townie.
Why would you assume that people will go off how many votes someone has made without reading into the context? If you're town and your posts show that you're town why should it matter how many votes you make, as long as you can detect some reasoning behind the votes.
As town my objective is to not get lynched and if no townie gets lynched mafia get lynched and town wins surely this is not too difficult to understand
idc about your read on my because I am currently lynching you so it will stop mattering in 22 hours
It doesn't make sense to me. If all you want people to know is that you want to look town, that is literally counter productive, because if I think about what mafia want on day 1 its to look town. Its a contradiction in of itself.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" (1)plus the later you vote the more townie you are and (2)I only care about how townie I look
1) since when, and why? 2) when ever have you cared about this?
On August 30 2022 03:27 raynpelikoneet wrote: [quote] lol?
did you skip HF post on purpose?
Which post and whatsm i supposed to do eith it?
Was wondering why you didn't address this post:
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote:
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
What?
But responded to the very next one:
On August 30 2022 03:14 deconduo wrote:
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote: I'm town
Awesome we have one confirmed town. Anyone else?
But then you posted your clarification at the same time I posted my question
Am I wrong or was his clarification to do with a totally different post, not the 'lol?' or hf's post? Confused.
He didn't reply to HF post directly but addressed the question (at least a little bit, we'll apparently get the full context of the Vivax trap later)
So yeah, "this game i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb" is a reference to the last game where i was mafia with vivax and he rb'd trfel who we knew was jailer, just to realize after night phase that even though trfel got roleblocked he could still jail me (apparently "before getting roleblocked" roflmao) and our night kill didn't go through. It actually sparked a stupidly idiotic post game discussion where some people actually considered that is not bs hosting.
Anyways it was originally a prod towards Vivax since not once or twice have i figured out his alignment based on some random looking comment which he should be actually responding to (at least jokingly if not otherwise), and here also feeling the same way in case he is also town. He's known to pay way less attention to the game as mafia than as town, especially early on in the game. But yeah i typoed and it is what it is now, useless.
I don't really think i should have any response about HF's posts because my post is not directed to him (same as Jock a bit later). I don't remember if i actually talked about the incident later with HF in discord but anyways he's gonna claim he doesn't remember it or doesn't genuinely remember it (in case we did talk about it) and there is no way to confirm that so there really is nothing for me to respond. _____
I liked Jock's eagerness in the beginning, although now i don't really know what he's trying to do especially with deconduo, after deconduo's first couple of posts i don't think there is anything could be alignment indicative, yet for some reason Jock's pushing that forward, it seems quite useless to me. I was about to say i think he's town earlier, but i will take that back.
deconduo's a bit... idk. I don't think his response to HF's "im town" is alignment indicative necessarily, just very... stupid? However i really don't get this:
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
What incentive would you EVER have to NOT claim town as town in your mind deconduo?
What's the benefit of claiming town?
You didn't answer his question though.
Who, me? If you are referring to me, yes i did, there is none.
On August 30 2022 04:53 Jockmcplop wrote: [quote] Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" plus the later you vote the more townie you are and I only care about how townie I look
Why would you only care about how townie you look? That's a really weird thing to be your main objective. I mean, to me you don't look particularly townie right now, and that's because you say you're trying to look townie.
Why would you assume that people will go off how many votes someone has made without reading into the context? If you're town and your posts show that you're town why should it matter how many votes you make, as long as you can detect some reasoning behind the votes.
As town my objective is to not get lynched and if no townie gets lynched mafia get lynched and town wins surely this is not too difficult to understand
idc about your read on my because I am currently lynching you so it will stop mattering in 22 hours
It doesn't make sense to me. If all you want people to know is that you want to look town, that is literally counter productive, because if I think about what mafia want on day 1 its to look town. Its a contradiction in of itself.
you are correct here.
1: I don't buy what dandel ion is selling. I ain't picking up what he's putting down.
On August 30 2022 05:30 Dandel Ion wrote: what if jock was town and im just reading him as mafia because he convinced himself somehow that town is supposed to look like mafia because only mafia try to look like town
i think im onto something here
hmm There's a huge space between 'looking town being the number 1 objective for town', and 'town should try to look mafia'. I never said town should try to look mafia, I said if you're town and your posts show that you're town you shouldn't have to try, or have it be an objective.
On August 30 2022 05:30 Dandel Ion wrote: what if jock was town and im just reading him as mafia because he convinced himself somehow that town is supposed to look like mafia because only mafia try to look like town
i think im onto something here
hmm There's a huge space between 'looking town being the number 1 objective for town', and 'town should try to look mafia'. I never said town should try to look mafia, I said if you're town and your posts show that you're town you shouldn't have to try, or have it be an objective.
no, nuance is a myth and i am now going to lynch my strongest townread, deconduo, because he looks way too town. observe how i am currently in the process of lynching him
Well I was too until you refused to vote for me! All I wanted was to see how he reacted to it after the little exchange you two had but NOOOOOO dandel ion doesn't want to play.
On August 30 2022 05:30 Dandel Ion wrote: what if jock was town and im just reading him as mafia because he convinced himself somehow that town is supposed to look like mafia because only mafia try to look like town
i think im onto something here
hmm There's a huge space between 'looking town being the number 1 objective for town', and 'town should try to look mafia'. I never said town should try to look mafia, I said if you're town and your posts show that you're town you shouldn't have to try, or have it be an objective.
no, nuance is a myth and i am now going to lynch my strongest townread, deconduo, because he looks way too town. observe how i am currently in the process of lynching him
sarcasm is a mafia tell because they're just trying to play off their posting the truth
On August 30 2022 05:30 Dandel Ion wrote: what if jock was town and im just reading him as mafia because he convinced himself somehow that town is supposed to look like mafia because only mafia try to look like town
i think im onto something here
hmm There's a huge space between 'looking town being the number 1 objective for town', and 'town should try to look mafia'. I never said town should try to look mafia, I said if you're town and your posts show that you're town you shouldn't have to try, or have it be an objective.
no, nuance is a myth and i am now going to lynch my strongest townread, deconduo, because he looks way too town. observe how i am currently in the process of lynching him
sarcasm is a mafia tell because they're just trying to play off their posting the truth
A little summary of my thoughts on the start of the game before I went to bed, before i have look at the rest. Overall thoughts on dandel ion's start: I often end up in exchanges like that on day 1. For some reason people tend to post stuff that doesn't make sense from a town perspective, be openly and obviously evasive about answering questions, and invariably end up being town. He certainly doesn't appear to be 'hiding' the way i would expect mafia to, but I just can't get over how scummy some of his reasoning is. Its just a case what should we be paying attention to, the content of his posts or the fact that he was happy for the attention to remain on him while making it clear he wanted to lynch me or decon? I think on balance i'm leaning town tbh. I can put his reasoning down to just provoking responses as a way of scumhunting.
On August 30 2022 03:04 deconduo wrote: So we are definitely lynching Chezinu D1 right?
Deconduo's first post. I'm calling it now. If one of decon or chezinu is mafia, the other is too. Like obviously we're never lynching chezinu on day one and posting this is a good way to get some suspicion on anyone who agrees with him and tries to lynch chez. Also, it might just be a joke post, but even if it is, i think its possible to make this connection from it.
Serious question to decon:
Can you go back through your posts, there's been plenty of them, and tell us which ones we can take seriously, except for the posts you make telling us not to take other posts seriously? Because it seems to me like every time you post something and someone comments on it, its either a joke post, or you didn't actually mean what you were saying, or its tongue in cheek. If you don't put your tongue back in its natural position sometime soon you're at a terrible risk of it getting stuck in your cheek.
Vivax normally comes straight into the game with reads and then sticks to them for the whole game. I know this because I'm usually on the receiving end. His posting so far all falls into the 'irrelevant' category, which bothers me. Its not very Vivax.
Rayn+hf both feel normal, but I wouldn't really lynch either on day 1 anyway.
Copcake is just neutral to me at the moment. She hasn't really questioned anyone or started to scumhunt. Its an awkward start, but not scummy per se.
So if I were to put this in list format it would be:
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
But... but it wasn't serious!
On August 30 2022 09:36 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I am also down to lynch copcake for fluffposting.
Naaaah. I'd like to see more from copcake but it doesn't really feel like she's started to play properly yet.
On August 30 2022 09:40 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: There was so much discussion of this quote:
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
On August 30 2022 05:51 deconduo wrote: 100% confirmed town Holyflare
Leaning Town: Dandel Ion + Jockmcplop (Lovers quarrel)
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
But that's the best list post of the ENTIRE game!
Why don't you see that as a mostly joke post with 1 (technically 2) useful read? He looks pretty playful to me.
What does playful mean though? Is it necessarily a town trait? I don't really think so. You can be too playful, and as MZ says, end up not really contributing.
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
On August 30 2022 05:51 deconduo wrote: 100% confirmed town Holyflare
Leaning Town: Dandel Ion + Jockmcplop (Lovers quarrel)
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
But that's the best list post of the ENTIRE game!
Why don't you see that as a mostly joke post with 1 (technically 2) useful read? He looks pretty playful to me.
I didn't really read it as a joke post, you hit my point spot on when you say the post only has 1 useful read. It's completely filler and adds nothing. Even if it's a joke, I get a lot more red vibes from that type of post than I do playful townie.
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
Although since it's so early in the game I wasn't focused on it at first, I only saw it again when rereading for the HF post I quoted above.
I don't know how you get that HF's post here is 'townie joking'. Anyone can claim town with their first post, it tells us nothing. Other than that I agree with what you're saying about decon.
On August 30 2022 09:40 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: There was so much discussion of this quote:
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
For my own clarity rayn, this was the section of the OP that made you make this comment right?
Mafia roleblocker has precedence. If mafia roleblocker and jailkeeper target each other the jailkeeper's action will not be counted.
No, later Rayn said it was an inside joke. That he messed up.
Ah my bad, I'll have to go reread that bit.
On August 30 2022 10:53 Tubesock wrote:
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
On August 30 2022 05:51 deconduo wrote: 100% confirmed town Holyflare
Leaning Town: Dandel Ion + Jockmcplop (Lovers quarrel)
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
But that's the best list post of the ENTIRE game!
Why don't you see that as a mostly joke post with 1 (technically 2) useful read? He looks pretty playful to me.
I didn't really read it as a joke post, you hit my point spot on when you say the post only has 1 useful read. It's completely filler and adds nothing. Even if it's a joke, I get a lot more red vibes from that type of post than I do playful townie.
To me, a townie jokes more along the lines of
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote: I'm town
It's harmless, in the first couple pages of the game, and unambiguous.
I personally strongly dislike decon's "joke" here as well:
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
Although since it's so early in the game I wasn't focused on it at first, I only saw it again when rereading for the HF post I quoted above.
I like his joke list post better than Jock's quote every post try-hardness. They both move the thread a little forward at least.
Putting HF as top town on one self claim post is pretty hilarious. Then essentially doing the opposite for Vivax bussing absent Koshi is pretty funny too. And of course the Chezinu read is spot on too. Now we can wait and see who nitpicks him for it and why.
I really dislike this bolded sentence. Say what you want about the reads list, but framing it as 'anyone who questions it is nitpicking' is a level of protection above what is necessary or useful.
On August 30 2022 09:40 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: There was so much discussion of this quote:
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
For my own clarity rayn, this was the section of the OP that made you make this comment right?
Mafia roleblocker has precedence. If mafia roleblocker and jailkeeper target each other the jailkeeper's action will not be counted.
No, later Rayn said it was an inside joke. That he messed up.
Ah my bad, I'll have to go reread that bit.
On August 30 2022 10:53 Tubesock wrote:
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
On August 30 2022 05:51 deconduo wrote: 100% confirmed town Holyflare
Leaning Town: Dandel Ion + Jockmcplop (Lovers quarrel)
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
But that's the best list post of the ENTIRE game!
Why don't you see that as a mostly joke post with 1 (technically 2) useful read? He looks pretty playful to me.
I didn't really read it as a joke post, you hit my point spot on when you say the post only has 1 useful read. It's completely filler and adds nothing. Even if it's a joke, I get a lot more red vibes from that type of post than I do playful townie.
To me, a townie jokes more along the lines of
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote: I'm town
It's harmless, in the first couple pages of the game, and unambiguous.
I personally strongly dislike decon's "joke" here as well:
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
Although since it's so early in the game I wasn't focused on it at first, I only saw it again when rereading for the HF post I quoted above.
I like his joke list post better than Jock's quote every post try-hardness. They both move the thread a little forward at least.
Putting HF as top town on one self claim post is pretty hilarious. Then essentially doing the opposite for Vivax bussing absent Koshi is pretty funny too. And of course the Chezinu read is spot on too. Now we can wait and see who nitpicks him for it and why.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this for now, considering you've also got issues with jock's posting as well I'm definitely interested in hearing more of what you've got to say.
Any thoughts so far on copcake? Personally not loving what I'm seeing there.
Because it's first 24 hours or so I'll pass his nitpicking since everyone has to basically nitpick due to there not being any content around. His tryharding seemed a bit over the top to me, but moving the thread a bit and trying to make content outweighs that. It does set him up for more scrutiny later though. If he's not town then it'll get harder and harder for him to keep pace or produce anything of substance.
I remember Copcake showed up. I don't remember anything about her posts. Which doesn't really mean anything to me yet.
Meh. I told myself I was going to quote every post but that's a harsh toke. Instead I'm sticking to relevant posts.
----------------------------------
I like MZ. His posting seems focused on the right things and quite townie to me. In fact he's probably my strongest townread just from these few posts.
Don't really have any kind of read on tubesock, although he does seem to be going out of his to protect decon, which is weird, as I can't see a townread there.
Can you go back through your posts, there's been plenty of them, and tell us which ones we can take seriously, except for the posts you make telling us not to take other posts seriously? Because it seems to me like every time you post something and someone comments on it, its either a joke post, or you didn't actually mean what you were saying, or its tongue in cheek. If you don't put your tongue back in its natural position sometime soon you're at a terrible risk of it getting stuck in your cheek.
None of them are particularly serious, but they are meant to ruffle feathers a bit. How people respond to them is always interesting. We have plenty of time left in the day for more serious posts, and shitposts do help get some insights on day one
OK. I'll take this at face value and I look forward to learning what you actually think later today
On August 30 2022 12:43 Chezinu wrote: It looks like Grackaroni has vanished. Can anyone see the cruiseship? It appears the canoe is here... *eyes open outward* His body mustn't be far. Smells like the stinch left by fecal in the cave.
I'm to assume that what happened to fecal was some kind of very accidental cave diving accident, yah?
On August 30 2022 04:17 Holyflare wrote: Wait where did Rayn clarify his post? I don't think the typo changes the question lol.
Yes it does.
Indeed. This confused me a little at the time. hf looked like he was going to push on this but then just kind of went away. I don't know if we can read anything from it though.
On August 30 2022 05:30 Dandel Ion wrote: what if jock was town and im just reading him as mafia because he convinced himself somehow that town is supposed to look like mafia because only mafia try to look like town
i think im onto something here
hmm There's a huge space between 'looking town being the number 1 objective for town', and 'town should try to look mafia'. I never said town should try to look mafia, I said if you're town and your posts show that you're town you shouldn't have to try, or have it be an objective.
no, nuance is a myth and i am now going to lynch my strongest townread, deconduo, because he looks way too town. observe how i am currently in the process of lynching him
Well I was too until you refused to vote for me! All I wanted was to see how he reacted to it after the little exchange you two had but NOOOOOO dandel ion doesn't want to play.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" plus the later you vote the more townie you are and I only care about how townie I look
.....
................ Which is scummy as he'll? Wtf? I thought you knew this?
Which must mean there is a facetiousness or something that is slinging smirks over my head. Hijole.
I didn't put it into words but this is the kind of feeling i got from dandel too. Like he's playing a game i don't really understand, but is fully aware of how scummy his posting was, and it was a part of whatever he's trying to do.
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
In what way?
It scares the sheep "On no I can't believe he's mafia he has more votes than players in the game" plus the later you vote the more townie you are and I only care about how townie I look
Why would you only care about how townie you look? That's a really weird thing to be your main objective. I mean, to me you don't look particularly townie right now, and that's because you say you're trying to look townie.
Why would you assume that people will go off how many votes someone has made without reading into the context? If you're town and your posts show that you're town why should it matter how many votes you make, as long as you can detect some reasoning behind the votes.
As town my objective is to not get lynched and if no townie gets lynched mafia get lynched and town wins surely this is not too difficult to understand
idc about your read on my because I am currently lynching you so it will stop mattering in 22 hours
Could achieve this by no-lynching and mafia would still win every time, all mafia has to do in what you propose here is do the same thing so they get harder to detect.
Decidedly anti-town way to play, but then I have been scum with people who wanted to NK me to assert dominance so I don't SR you for it yet lol. Don't know you well enough to go so far when it is looking too scummy to be scum.
On August 30 2022 09:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I wanted to lynch jock for spamming the thread and questionablevibes but now I want to lynch Decon for this post
On August 30 2022 05:51 deconduo wrote: 100% confirmed town Holyflare
Leaning Town: Dandel Ion + Jockmcplop (Lovers quarrel)
Leaning Mafia: Vivax (Pretending to bus Koshi) Koshi
Chezinu: Chezinu
Seriously, a reads list like 6 hours into the game solidly falls into something I call "contributing without contributing" because it really adds nothing to the conversation.
Well fuck me M_Z tunnel incoming like a sidewinder missile after page 13
On August 30 2022 17:10 deconduo wrote: Morning all. I heard you like lists. I like lists. I'm gonna make another list.
People who are fun: Jock Dandel Slam Koshi Vivax CopCake Tube
Neutral: Rels Matt
People who are not fun: Rayn
People who are attempting to suck every molecule of fun from the game: MZ
Chezinu: Chezinu
this list is unironically revolting koshi in the fun category smh
your last list was better, you fell off
It made me feel good, which gave me bad vibes instantly. Man this game is so anti-human sometimes.
I think is the opposite, I tend to put so much "feel" I tend to feel exhausted at the end. Specially the times when I roll scum several times consecutive.
Its definitely exhausting. I get what you mean, I think we're saying similar things. I get exhausted constantly having to second guess myself remembering not to like people who are being likeable. That's what i mean by anti-human. Do you have any reads yet?
On August 30 2022 17:10 deconduo wrote: Morning all. I heard you like lists. I like lists. I'm gonna make another list.
People who are fun: Jock Dandel Slam Koshi Vivax CopCake Tube
Neutral: Rels Matt
People who are not fun: Rayn
People who are attempting to suck every molecule of fun from the game: MZ
Chezinu: Chezinu
this list is unironically revolting koshi in the fun category smh
your last list was better, you fell off
It made me feel good, which gave me bad vibes instantly. Man this game is so anti-human sometimes.
I think is the opposite, I tend to put so much "feel" I tend to feel exhausted at the end. Specially the times when I roll scum several times consecutive.
Its definitely exhausting. I get what you mean, I think we're saying similar things. I get exhausted constantly having to second guess myself remembering not to like people who are being likeable. That's what i mean by anti-human. Do you have any reads yet?
I honestly feel like people hasn't posted enough, the only thing that gave me a bad sensation was Vivax, he feels like another person and not himself.
I liked how deconduo reacted with the whole claiming town situation.
You seem too happy/freely while not pocketing so I think you are town.
I disliked how Ziphh took Deconduo list seriously. Still waiting for his answers.
I want more HF but overall Rels tho.
And the game sometimes can be too overwhelming as town, specially in the last couple of days and there is a misslynch or you lose situation (even tho it is also fun in a strange way) or as mafia when I have to give a performance and fake my emotions/reactions to events. And as you might have noticed I "tone read" most of the time.
Then I just close the tab and watch tv or do something else.
Looks like we're agreed on vivax, but have opposite reads on MZ and deconduo.
Tone reads is all you can realistically have on day 1. Where I struggle is with long chains of logic. They break my brain like proper.
The whole thing between koshi and copcake... I'm not going to quote all the posts because the entire thing reads almost like a diversion. I don't have any specific bad feelings about either of them but the interaction is filed under 'interesting' for use later maybe.
On August 30 2022 22:23 Holyflare wrote: Playing on MU has ruined this website for me lol.
Also, I've grown and adapted as a human being so take this in full faith that I, as a townie, am doing this with the utmost sincerity because I really liked Koshi's MZ points (yes, this parrots what Rayn is saying above). I just think he extrapolated the read a smidge too far to apply it to copcake and then distracted himself.
##Vote MZ
Koshi didn't post anything sheepworthy about MZ imo.
The entirety of what koshi has posted on mz:
On August 30 2022 16:43 Koshi wrote: I think MZ and copcake are potential mafia. I want to give MZ points for pointing copcake out but I can't.
On August 30 2022 16:47 Koshi wrote: Quick reasoning so they can defend themselves: MZ: sticking out but not in a helpful way. Creating discussion around problems he created. Like "this joke" is mafia. Yes, I like Tube for pointing out the joke reads were hilarious. Should I like MZ for helping me like Tube? No. I dont think I will. But maybe I should. MZ helped me like Tube. Hmmm
Copcake: there was a post in the beginning I felt didnt fit in the thread. Cant remember what it was. I will revisit later.
On August 30 2022 16:49 Koshi wrote: Ah no. If MZ is mafia. Tube called him out. I like Tube. MZ still mafia. That I like tube doesnt change that.
Holyflare koshi's main read was on copcake from the beginning, and it almost made him change his mind about MZ, as you see in the first post above, so when you say he got distracted by copcake i think that is actually incorrect. Nothing major but it suggests to me you are only skimming/half reading.
I think HF's post and vote here are lazy.
I also find it a bit... odd that Vivax also goes for MZ on the basis that it was the first filter he read.
Or maybe MZ is being super scummy and I just don't see it.
On August 30 2022 22:57 Holyflare wrote: Well you're right about me being lazy, I didn't really extrapolate more because I feel like Koshi summed up MZ pretty well. I think his posts are a bit robotic, needlessly antagonistic and nitpicky about things that I don't think people would normally take qualms with.
MZ: sticking out but not in a helpful way. Creating discussion around problems he created. Like "this joke" is mafia. Yes, I like Tube for pointing out the joke reads were hilarious. Should I like MZ for helping me like Tube? No. I dont think I will. But maybe I should. MZ helped me like Tube. Hmmm
Then he gets distracted with copcake and his copcake read is causing him to have back and forth thoughts on MZ. For instance, even though he concludes that it's probably tinfoil and could be a bus I think if you read between the lines in #285 his mind kind of settles on that maybe he's taking the MZ read too far (at least IMO).
After a bit of back and forth with Cop, he then kinda derails even further and just throws out random names.
As far as MZ is concerned:
• #246 I don't think Copcake could be considered fluff posting at any stage of the game (in fact, I get the same tinfoil vibes that Koshi did even because Copcake is such a random name to throw out that it doesn't look like anything more than partner vibes). In my view, it's obvious why Cop was asking Rayn about if I was in the game because that leads to the evaluation of whether what I'm posting has any merit to it or not. It doesn't seem like fluff at all. This is made even worse because #247 in the very next post he's even asking Rayn about his original post. Sure, it's a clarification and slightly helpful but it's the height of hypocrisy just after saying Cop was fluff posting about stuff like this.
• I think his general approach to Dec has been bad. Dec's post was obviously a joke, I'd made like 1 post calling myself town. In the same breath that he calls Dec mafia in #250 for not making it an obvious joke, he's highlighting my post saying "This is an obvious joke" but not putting two and two together that that was basically the only post I made so Dec's post is obviously massively facetious. In my mind, I would expect MZ to admit he might have misread it as serious when it was a joke and back off a bit but he doubles down and that's bad.
• #252 is what I would classify in my initial summary as "robotic". The "agree to disagree" into "talk to me about Jock" into "what do you think of Cop?" is such an awkwardly written post in comparison to anything else he's done. It feels clumsy, like he doesn't actually care about the follow up but he's just kind of leaving out empty questions. He hasn't elaborated any more about Cop since his first statement, hasn't highlighted any posts about Cop, nor has he been really determined to do anything about Cop. Compare this to what he talked about with regards to Dec and the tinfoil team is just reinforced even further.
Hope that clarifies stuff for you.
It does clarify it, thanks. I disagree and I don't think MZ is mafia. Especially with your explanation, although I can see where you're coming from, my previous experience with MZ consists mainly of me being mafia and trying to lynch him on day 1 for the same kind of thing. I don't see it being alignment indicative for MZ specifically, because he always reads the game in his own way, which can come across the way you've explained it, but never ends up actually being because he's mafia. Consider what rayn said about it:
On August 30 2022 22:18 raynpelikoneet wrote: Koshi top town. I sm not sure if stuff on Cake and MZ makrs them mafia but nevertheless its legit stuff and townie thought process. Esp on MZ he uses very weird narratives in his scumhunting on what he thinks makes people mafia. Pretty sure he got lynched for it as town last game i played with him.
Do you think that this is a valid way to see the situation? It rings more true to me than MZ being mafia.
-------------
I'm more interested in Vivax with his vote timing and general lack of interest in the game. I feel like we might not even see much more of vivax on day 1 now he's voted.
Just rereading the post above i was being a little vague/general in my explanation, so here is a post i made in my first game. I was mafia, MZ was town:
On March 02 2019 11:13 Jockmcplop wrote: Is it me or is meapak throwing suspicion around without actually trying to get any information? Looks like that is the only story of the last couple of pages
Which posts do you mean here? the stuff about Conversion or LS or earlier?
Well he always seems to use a question to imply suspicion, but doesn't press for an answer to the question afterwards and is happy to argue about his own motivations instead.
On March 02 2019 10:33 LightningStrike wrote: Me and Damdred aren't masons even though I wish we were masons
Y u say this?
This is the most suspicious thing in the game.
What I said or what LS said?
Again using a simple one line question to imply suspicion on LS.
The he changes up and goes after conversion, again by asking a simple question deigned to imply suspicion, this time implying suspicion whilst claiming to assume no suspicion:
On March 02 2019 10:53 raynpelikoneet wrote: What does it matter who he picked and why if he isn't actually mafia?
lol who says he's not mafia?
u said you thought he was BSing in that post, so why did you care how he chose people? especially since it was almost certainly completely arbitrary
I mean I doubt he just gave up the entire scum team (which is why I said it was probably BS) but I certainly don't think he's somehow cleared. I'm even more interested now since he has apparently read my poking at him as me thinking I've got an "ironclad case"
Then all of a sudden he really starts pushing the 'suspicion' angle again contradicting his claimthat he thinks it was BS by saying its a safe mafia move to make that kind of post.
On March 02 2019 10:53 raynpelikoneet wrote: What does it matter who he picked and why if he isn't actually mafia?
lol who says he's not mafia?
is your ironclad case of me being mafia the fact that I threw 6 random names as mafia?
On March 02 2019 10:55 Chezinu wrote:
On March 02 2019 10:50 Holyflare wrote:
On March 02 2019 10:45 Tumblewood wrote:
On March 02 2019 10:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On March 02 2019 10:36 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: [quote] Y u say this?
This is the most suspicious thing in the game.
nuh uh this is
On March 02 2019 10:44 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
On March 02 2019 10:41 Conversion wrote: [quote]
yeah we should lynch him for lying tbh
Hmm.
I'm gonna go with the assumption that you're just BSing. But I wanna know why you picked those specific players for you scum team?
I can get behind this case. Absolutely.
Holyflare,
Corporate has heard of your desires to be included in the case concerning Conversion. You are now lead investigator on the manner. The executive committee is proud of your high quality work that has been done in such a short amount of time. I am confident that you will perform well in this investigation.
Go forth! Chezinu Isunizehc
I don't think he's casing me unless I'm reading his quote wrong
I wonder where you read me having an ironclad case on you.
riddle me this: if you believe me to be mafia, in what world would my first post in a rather dull thread be exposing any of my teammates? if you were to believe I was mafia, as a townie you wouldn't care about my list as you'd have to believe I'm playing against mafia win condition by unnecessarily exposing my teammates for a joke post that wasn't even funny
if you believe I am town, then the order doesn't matter cause I'm just making a dumb joke
This is literally all WIFOM lol. Do we still say that around here?
Personally, because of Trfel already (presumably) fake claiming scum in the thread, your "dumb joke" strikes me as a fairly safe entry type post for someone who is scum. I wanted to see what reasons you had for your list since scum often have a habit of including one or two of their teammates in lists like that. And if nothing else you talking about your list could spark a little conversation.
After this he drops the thing and goes back to suspecting LS..
All the while the town has gained nothing but a couple of pages of contradictions and random looking suspicion.
There are similarities between this and the suspicions you have of MZ. Especially your third point above about how he asks 'empty questions' or throws suspicion around and seems to drop things and move on when it doesn't look like the appropriate thing to do. I'm not implying that your suspicion of him makes you mafia, but just trying to explain my thought process on why i disagree.
On August 30 2022 23:22 Holyflare wrote: It's fine if you disagree but I'm still going to pursue the MZ avenue because I will never trust anyone's individual meta reads over my own basic fact finding and interrogation on a game by game basis.
I think your explanation and Rayn's fit into the same category, although I think Rayn's can come from mafia sometimes since I feel like the explanation on Koshi is a bit overexplain-y and sure about himself (but it's been a while since I've played with rayn properly and in the back of my head it seems to fit with my picture of rayn just fine anyway).
I'm happy to give Rayn the benefit of the doubt and call him townie for it because building up town reads, especially in the form of Koshi, is nothing but beneficial in the early game and I think highlighting that Koshi got eliminated in the last game for doing the same thing really narrows down that avenue for a miselimination if Rayn were mafia (which I don't think would be his angle).
Vivax is in a bit of an odd spot. I've played a couple of games with him on MU and while he's been somewhat aloof in those games, there's been times where he's really driven down wild narratives/explanations that I haven't seen here yet. I don't think his vote on MZ is bad, obviously, and I don't really think saying it's the first filter he opened is bad lol but I do understand why he's not posting as much here. It's a bit of a tedious experience comparatively for quality of life features :D
Temporarily postponing thoughts on Vivax until he posts something useful that I disagree vehemently with (in which case he's probably town :D), or MZ shines like a townie beacon.
OK I can agree to disagree as I don't want to sit here protecting a town read all day.
Before I give anything significant on slam i need a bit of time to go through some old games. I was confident at one point on how to read him, but i've forgotten alot of that so i need to do some research. At the moment i'm kind of keeping up with new posts but i'm also in the middle of watching The Sandman on Netflix, which is very enjoyable, so right now i'm a bit too distracted for research.
On August 30 2022 04:17 Holyflare wrote: Wait where did Rayn clarify his post? I don't think the typo changes the question lol.
Yes it does.
Is needlessly regressive. If you were in the game Rayn was talking about (which Slam was) then clarifying the typo to "this game" means nothing because it should have been obvious what he was talking about from the onset, in which case nothing changes.
I'm not sure what you mean by regressive in this context, but this actually looks pretty weak and nitpicky to me. I mean its arguable whether any of this is alignment indicative, but even if it is, its a pretty common thing for Slam to just post off the cuff 'reactions' to posts upon reading them for the first time, and I don't know if I would expect that kind of post to contain a level of depth that you can really read anything from. This comes across like one of those instances to me.
Really, you could argue that he is perfectly correct, even accepting that the clarification means nothing to slam (which is debateable), he could have posted this on the assumption that someone who was not in the game would be interested in what he had to say about it, given that its meaning was up for debate in the post he quoted.
Secondly, his reference in his opening post including:
is just the right level of self-deprecation I'd expect from someone hypersensitive about how their posts come across which in my experience, Slam, at least as town, is not.
I've seen slam act hypersensitive as both town and mafia, and on day 1 too. I've seen him get really frustrated at people scumreading him when he's town and quite paranoid about it, and from what i remember it happens more in the early game. Again this is unconvincing to me.
His further posts don't really lead to any kind of evaluation either. He was going to scum read Rayn but remembered Rayn was just bitter as either alignment, he gets into some weird mechanics argument with Dandel in #263 for a while (and actually in this post hesitates in scum reading Dandel?)
Then he circularly references his original suspicion in #269 saying he has no scum reads and that maybe Rayn is just mafia after all?
It doesn't read like a genuine thought process and I think he was afraid to push too far onto Dandel for fear of repercussions, rather than a genuine intent to solve Dandel's alignment.
This is by far the strongest part of your case. It could read as either a bit of random-ish flailing around on slam's part, or scummy nothingposting, but like you i'm struggling to see the townie logic, and even though I agree with him about some points its like he doesn't want to commit to them yet.
On August 30 2022 19:12 Jockmcplop wrote: A little summary of my thoughts on the start of the game before I went to bed, before i have look at the rest. Overall thoughts on dandel ion's start: I often end up in exchanges like that on day 1. For some reason people tend to post stuff that doesn't make sense from a town perspective, be openly and obviously evasive about answering questions, and invariably end up being town. He certainly doesn't appear to be 'hiding' the way i would expect mafia to, but I just can't get over how scummy some of his reasoning is.
? What would be that way?
I'm looking for certain things that indicate town on day 1: -Blatant, simple scumhunting -Tunnelling in a productive way -Getting people to share their thought process to help catch scum later.
DI's posting looked like it fit into the third category to me. He was posting nonsense, but in doing so he was also provoking people to show why they thought he was wrong and not backtracking or diverting attention away from it like i would expect from mafia.
Compare his posts to Vivax, my scumread, and you can see how dandel's posting seems to have a point and is geared towards eventually finding scum whereas Vivax isn't really doing anything like and just jumped on the first possible vote and stayed there. Vivax is also posting enough to not die but hasn't posted anything really that will get people talking. He's hiding, like i would expect mafia too. DI isn't, his posts provoke conversation about DI and his posts.
On August 30 2022 19:12 Jockmcplop wrote: A little summary of my thoughts on the start of the game before I went to bed, before i have look at the rest. Overall thoughts on dandel ion's start: I often end up in exchanges like that on day 1. For some reason people tend to post stuff that doesn't make sense from a town perspective, be openly and obviously evasive about answering questions, and invariably end up being town. He certainly doesn't appear to be 'hiding' the way i would expect mafia to, but I just can't get over how scummy some of his reasoning is.
? What would be that way?
I'm looking for certain things that indicate town on day 1: -Blatant, simple scumhunting -Tunnelling in a productive way -Getting people to share their thought process to help catch scum later.
DI's posting looked like it fit into the third category to me. He was posting nonsense, but in doing so he was also provoking people to show why they thought he was wrong and not backtracking or diverting attention away from it like i would expect from mafia.
Compare his posts to Vivax, my scumread, and you can see how dandel's posting seems to have a point and is geared towards eventually finding scum whereas Vivax isn't really doing anything like and just jumped on the first possible vote and stayed there. Vivax is also posting enough to not die but hasn't posted anything really that will get people talking. He's hiding, like i would expect mafia too. DI isn't, his posts provoke conversation about DI and his posts.
Meh, I really disagree. Don't think there is a significant difference between both TBH. DI is posting random shit and is proud of it yeah, but I don't see any attempt to get useful info. That doesn't make him anything apart from useless.
Let me have a look and see if I can show you what I mean
First DI said he was lynching me because i was scum. He then had that exchange with me and switched and said he was lynching decon. The progression there reads to me like he's provoking reactions from players to try and get a read on them. I agree with him that decon is at least a bit scummy so it makes sense that he would go there next.
Of course, to read him town based on this depends on his futureposting too and whether the progression continues, but it looks to me like a townie player getting info and finding a target.
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
What?
But responded to the very next one:
On August 30 2022 03:14 deconduo wrote:
On August 30 2022 03:12 Holyflare wrote: I'm town
Awesome we have one confirmed town. Anyone else?
But then you posted your clarification at the same time I posted my question
Am I wrong or was his clarification to do with a totally different post, not the 'lol?' or hf's post? Confused.
He didn't reply to HF post directly but addressed the question (at least a little bit, we'll apparently get the full context of the Vivax trap later)
So yeah, "this game i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb" is a reference to the last game where i was mafia with vivax and he rb'd trfel who we knew was jailer, just to realize after night phase that even though trfel got roleblocked he could still jail me (apparently "before getting roleblocked" roflmao) and our night kill didn't go through. It actually sparked a stupidly idiotic post game discussion where some people actually considered that is not bs hosting.
Anyways it was originally a prod towards Vivax since not once or twice have i figured out his alignment based on some random looking comment which he should be actually responding to (at least jokingly if not otherwise), and here also feeling the same way in case he is also town. He's known to pay way less attention to the game as mafia than as town, especially early on in the game. But yeah i typoed and it is what it is now, useless.
I don't really think i should have any response about HF's posts because my post is not directed to him (same as Jock a bit later). I don't remember if i actually talked about the incident later with HF in discord but anyways he's gonna claim he doesn't remember it or doesn't genuinely remember it (in case we did talk about it) and there is no way to confirm that so there really is nothing for me to respond. _____
I liked Jock's eagerness in the beginning, although now i don't really know what he's trying to do especially with deconduo, after deconduo's first couple of posts i don't think there is anything could be alignment indicative, yet for some reason Jock's pushing that forward, it seems quite useless to me. I was about to say i think he's town earlier, but i will take that back.
deconduo's a bit... idk. I don't think his response to HF's "im town" is alignment indicative necessarily, just very... stupid? However i really don't get this:
On August 30 2022 03:30 deconduo wrote: Nah I haven't claimed town yet, still deciding.
What incentive would you EVER have to NOT claim town as town in your mind deconduo?
Lol until I saw this shit I was gonna SR you by pointing out you were too fucking bitter but then remembered that bitterness is not alignment indicative
It's extremely forced, for a player that I think always posts random stuff without thinking about it. I don't believe he really had the thought process he described.
This is a nice point tbh. Its a bit ambiguous, as was holyflare's case on slam, but its worth putting in the notes.
On August 31 2022 10:25 Jockmcplop wrote: Compare his posts to Vivax, my scumread, and you can see how dandel's posting seems to have a point and is geared towards eventually finding scum whereas Vivax isn't really doing anything like and just jumped on the first possible vote and stayed there. Vivax is also posting enough to not die but hasn't posted anything really that will get people talking. He's hiding, like i would expect mafia too. DI isn't, his posts provoke conversation about DI and his posts.
Bruh you're talking to the fucking devil
But since you're cheeky you pass and you get 1 hellfire iteration less
On August 31 2022 10:46 Rels wrote: I'm very sorry, also while rereading the exchange I still don't like your posts. I really don't like how it seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious
On August 31 2022 10:46 Rels wrote: I'm very sorry, also while rereading the exchange I still don't like your posts. I really don't like how it seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
On August 30 2022 04:51 Dandel Ion wrote: I lack both money and a mouth
Neo? Is that you?
are we ever truly anybody?
Yes you are Alice in a poorly constructed metaphor about a rabbit hole.
Staying on topic though, you may have no mouth and no money but you certainly have a vote. If you're going to try and lynch me as you said you were you should use it.
no I shouldn't voting is counterproductive to obtaining a lynch
Also I will infer from this that your mind is close to made up and that you actually are trying to lynch me.
What I was actually doing was trying to get him to put an early vote on me because i wanted to see what decon would do. DI and decon had previously talked about lynching me. I was curious.
On August 31 2022 10:46 Rels wrote: I'm very sorry, also while rereading the exchange I still don't like your posts. I really don't like how it seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious
What do you think i was trying to win?
Something like, the justification for an easy scumread / vote
And yet I didn't do that, so it doesn't make sense that that was my intention.
On August 31 2022 10:46 Rels wrote: I'm very sorry, also while rereading the exchange I still don't like your posts. I really don't like how it seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious
On August 31 2022 10:56 Rels wrote: What changed between those 2 posts? In the first, you're saying rayn was literally talking about mafia RB, and in the second, you have the correct interpretation of events.
On August 30 2022 09:40 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: There was so much discussion of this quote:
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
For my own clarity rayn, this was the section of the OP that made you make this comment right?
Mafia roleblocker has precedence. If mafia roleblocker and jailkeeper target each other the jailkeeper's action will not be counted.
It was in reference to a previous game, not the OP. Anyway, I agree, far too much discussion of that post.
The two are not mutually exclusive. Think about it. He was referencing a previous game, while saying that in this game, he would be fine with the mafia rb not rbing.
I do admire how much completely useless 'content' has come from that one typo by rayn lol. It could probably fill at least 3 pages now, and not one thing has come from it that i would find convincing.
On August 31 2022 10:46 Rels wrote: I'm very sorry, also while rereading the exchange I still don't like your posts. I really don't like how it seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious
What do you think i was trying to win?
Something like, the justification for an easy scumread / vote
And yet I didn't do that, so it doesn't make sense that that was my intention.
I disagree that this proves anything. For example, it would make that you changed your mind since you apparently didn't really know how to handle Dandel. Not saying that's a proof, just a counter example.
So what about it seems like i'm trying to get a win? I already explained why i wanted him to vote for me. Like 3 times. I was also pushing a bit because i felt there was a contradiction there, but I never tried to scumread him for it.
On August 31 2022 10:56 Rels wrote: What changed between those 2 posts? In the first, you're saying rayn was literally talking about mafia RB, and in the second, you have the correct interpretation of events.
On August 30 2022 04:23 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 30 2022 04:22 Holyflare wrote:
On August 30 2022 04:21 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 30 2022 04:16 deconduo wrote:
On August 30 2022 04:15 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 30 2022 04:12 deconduo wrote: Anyone who's posts I like always turns out to be mafia
The question is, if you've noticed this pattern before, didn't you just vote for the people whose posts you liked? How did it go?
Don't remember, its been years
Fair enough.
On August 30 2022 04:17 deconduo wrote: My old rule was always vote Palmar day 1
Oh its ok the rule is vote palmar day 1 or if he's not there vote holyflare.
On August 30 2022 04:17 Holyflare wrote: Wait where did Rayn clarify his post? I don't think the typo changes the question lol.
His post makes sense after the clarification. It didn't before, I assume that why you posted 'what?'.
Why does saying this game has a rber that doesn't rb make any sense? Can't find anything about it in the OP.
I think he's saying that he's ok with it if it happens.
On August 30 2022 19:43 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 30 2022 09:40 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: There was so much discussion of this quote:
On August 30 2022 03:11 raynpelikoneet wrote: Alright. This i am okay with there being mafia rb that doesnt actually rb
For my own clarity rayn, this was the section of the OP that made you make this comment right?
Mafia roleblocker has precedence. If mafia roleblocker and jailkeeper target each other the jailkeeper's action will not be counted.
It was in reference to a previous game, not the OP. Anyway, I agree, far too much discussion of that post.
The two are not mutually exclusive. Think about it. He was referencing a previous game, while saying that in this game, he would be fine with the mafia rb not rbing.
meh
There's no meh about it buddy. That's just what rayn said, and its what rayn meant, and rayn himself confirmed it pal. The fact that his purpose for posting it was to do with vivax doesn't change the inherent meaning of the post itself guy.
Well it wasn't really about the humour. I was trying to get something useful out of him, and although you are right and he wasn't really playing along, i thought maybe if push a bit he would say something that might be useful either now or later. I also get frustrated when i have genuine questions and they are met with nonchalance or dismissive comments. This can lead to arguments going on too long. I often get accused of this type of thing. In fact, another example of this is about 3 posts up from this
On August 30 2022 03:04 deconduo wrote: So we are definitely lynching Chezinu D1 right?
Deconduo's first post. I'm calling it now. If one of decon or chezinu is mafia, the other is too. Like obviously we're never lynching chezinu on day one and posting this is a good way to get some suspicion on anyone who agrees with him and tries to lynch chez. Also, it might just be a joke post, but even if it is, i think its possible to make this connection from it.
Serious question to decon:
Can you go back through your posts, there's been plenty of them, and tell us which ones we can take seriously, except for the posts you make telling us not to take other posts seriously? Because it seems to me like every time you post something and someone comments on it, its either a joke post, or you didn't actually mean what you were saying, or its tongue in cheek. If you don't put your tongue back in its natural position sometime soon you're at a terrible risk of it getting stuck in your cheek.
This it it right for dec?
Pretty much. There wasn't much to say at the time because all of his posts turned out to be jokes as soon as anyone questioned them. So that's all there is to analyse, and it looks pretty scummy to me.
On August 31 2022 11:32 Jockmcplop wrote: Rels why is vivax a good vig target in your opinion, but apparently a bad lynch target as you won't vote for him?
I think his flip will be random given what he has posted. He just hasn't started playing. I also think scum!Vivax is pretty easy to catch when given time, town!Vivax is pretty tryhard when he gets starting. In a way scum!Vivax is not able to replicate in my recollection, or at least not during multiple days.
To be clear, I'll vote for him over a lot of other people if I had to vote right now. But we still have time before deadline, and I would prefer Slam.
Ok so, If Vivax's flip would be random, and you'd vote for him over a lot of other people, that means you read a lot of people as better than random chance of flipping town. Which people?
On August 31 2022 11:32 Jockmcplop wrote: Rels why is vivax a good vig target in your opinion, but apparently a bad lynch target as you won't vote for him?
I think his flip will be random given what he has posted. He just hasn't started playing. I also think scum!Vivax is pretty easy to catch when given time, town!Vivax is pretty tryhard when he gets starting. In a way scum!Vivax is not able to replicate in my recollection, or at least not during multiple days.
To be clear, I'll vote for him over a lot of other people if I had to vote right now. But we still have time before deadline, and I would prefer Slam.
Ok so, If Vivax's flip would be random, and you'd vote for him over a lot of other people, that means you read a lot of people as better than random chance of flipping town. Which people?
rayn is town. Like, 101% town, it's cheating because it's too easy. I know him very well. Him being frustrated at me and wanting to be modkilled I was not playing when I pushed him to play is extremely real, and I'm pretty sure he wouldn't play that card if he was scum as it would be cheating in his mind. There are other stuff, but that's the cheating part. (other stuff: his plan at beginning felt very rayn-like, could have been faked, but the setup wasn't there when I checked when I confirmed 24 hours before the game, so he woulldn't have known there was a possible mafia RB)
Koshi is town. Like, 95% town. His opening spray of posts are perfect Koshi, seeing a weird stuff that might make sense, and then jumping from there, sometimes changing his mind ... Koshi is pretty easy to catch as scum I think because he just ... doesn't do that lol.
Then the maybe towns:
CopCake, the post I highlighted earlier is pretty townie, and what she was being pushed for by Koshi might actually make sense.
MZ, I really liked his opening posts basically. Let me see why. Oh yeah, entering the thread with 3 straight scumreads and no townreads. Didn't feel like MZ entered the thread trying to blend in or being townread by the rest of the town. This needs a meta check to stand.
HF, pretty good posts overall, and in particular pretty good case on Slam, highlighting the post I hate the most in the game so far.
OK I've a fairly good idea of where you're at.
I would say, however, that I've played with rayn as scum before and he's done exactly this kind of thing (getting upset and threatening to leave the game) on day 1, which in my eyes at least throws a bit of doubt on your reason for townreading him. I don't have a solid read on rayn yet, but i think its worth pointing out. I shall try and go and find this previous game i'm talking about, but my memory is sieve like so it might take me a while.
Meh rels i can't find the game i was thinking of and its 4am here so i'm going to bed. If you want me to post it tomorrow just leave a note here and i will find it.
On August 31 2022 20:03 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels is keeping his options open and not in a good way ##Vote: Rels it's real now
I could see this being true, for sure. He's doubling down on weird things, repeating stuff others have said, and being pretty ambiguous about much of the other stuff. In fact, I'm adding rels to my vote list.
Our chat last night really went nowhere. He didn't even try to get any new information out of me even though he was questioning me about all of his concerns and ended up still at the same point he was before he asked the questions. I'm like I was answering all his questions without being evasive or arguing, why can't he use that to progress his reads, or the game somehow. Instead he's still stuck on rayn's very first post which generated nothing useful? I don't buy it to be honest, and nothing has really changed at all from that interaction, except for i now scumread rels.
On August 30 2022 03:04 deconduo wrote: So we are definitely lynching Chezinu D1 right?
Deconduo's first post. I'm calling it now. If one of decon or chezinu is mafia, the other is too. Like obviously we're never lynching chezinu on day one and posting this is a good way to get some suspicion on anyone who agrees with him and tries to lynch chez. Also, it might just be a joke post, but even if it is, i think its possible to make this connection from it.
Serious question to decon:
Can you go back through your posts, there's been plenty of them, and tell us which ones we can take seriously, except for the posts you make telling us not to take other posts seriously? Because it seems to me like every time you post something and someone comments on it, its either a joke post, or you didn't actually mean what you were saying, or its tongue in cheek. If you don't put your tongue back in its natural position sometime soon you're at a terrible risk of it getting stuck in your cheek.
This it it right for dec?
Pretty much. There wasn't much to say at the time because all of his posts turned out to be jokes as soon as anyone questioned them. So that's all there is to analyse, and it looks pretty scummy to me.
I see what you mean reading his filter in isolation. Not a lot of substance. But while reading the actual game, I thought his interactions were pretty natural.
He accepts that the reason i read him as scum is both true and valid, but then counters with 'but it looks natural'.
That's a very weak way to counter the points made against decon.
Of course, I'm open to the possibility that this is just rels hedging and not necessarily a link that makes them both mafia.
On August 31 2022 04:36 deconduo wrote: Matt will either appear or be killed off at this point so
##Vote: Rels for now, posting just enough to not get modkilled
All rels has to do is turn up and post some, which he promptly does. Then decon quickly unvotes him without further participation.
On August 31 2022 19:48 deconduo wrote: Rels is alive, that's good.
##: Unvote
The whole thing looks mutually weird.
-----
I know this isn't some massive case but its not just me, right?
There's zero attempt to progress his reads throughout the day. He's doing alot of fighting against rayn's posts about him, but it hasn't seemed to arouse any suspicion that rayn might be mafia, even though he claims rayn's entire case on him was meta from 8 years ago. Given that rayn is a good town player, that would at least make me suspicious if i was decon. But all I get from his filter is that he's interested in both MZ and holyflare without actually attempting to go any further than that.
##Unvote: Vivax ##Vote: Deconduo
For someone who has posted a fair amount, there's a startling lack of actual content.
He's doing alot of fighting against rayn's posts about him, but it hasn't seemed to arouse any suspicion that rayn might be mafia, even though he claims rayn's entire case on him was meta from 8 years ago. Given that rayn is a good town player, that would at least make me suspicious if i was decon.
Rayn reads like a tunnel vision townie rather than scum, someone who has (wrongly) made their mind up and won't change it. I've seen nothing to suggest Rayn is a good town player so far this game. There was an inkling when they went to the effort of reading my old games, but again it was pointless because it's clear there was only one going to be outcome when tunneled. I don't see scum purposefully trying to build a bad case, everything points to dumb town.
Good town players don't whine and throw tantrums and ask to be modkilled either.
Hmm... I suppose this carries weight because Decon doesn't play much, but rayn is a good scumhunter, so it depends whether they have played together alot in the past.
He's doing alot of fighting against rayn's posts about him, but it hasn't seemed to arouse any suspicion that rayn might be mafia, even though he claims rayn's entire case on him was meta from 8 years ago. Given that rayn is a good town player, that would at least make me suspicious if i was decon.
Rayn reads like a tunnel vision townie rather than scum, someone who has (wrongly) made their mind up and won't change it. I've seen nothing to suggest Rayn is a good town player so far this game. There was an inkling when they went to the effort of reading my old games, but again it was pointless because it's clear there was only one going to be outcome when tunneled. I don't see scum purposefully trying to build a bad case, everything points to dumb town.
Good town players don't whine and throw tantrums and ask to be modkilled either.
Hmm... I suppose this carries weight because Decon doesn't play much, but rayn is a good scumhunter, so it depends whether they have played together alot in the past.
Shit i thought your post came from DI, misread the name at the top.
Don't argue against my case, friend, go find scum. Its the only thing that will change my mind about you.
On August 31 2022 21:37 Jockmcplop wrote: More decon
There's zero attempt to progress his reads throughout the day. He's doing alot of fighting against rayn's posts about him, but it hasn't seemed to arouse any suspicion that rayn might be mafia, even though he claims rayn's entire case on him was meta from 8 years ago. Given that rayn is a good town player, that would at least make me suspicious if i was decon. But all I get from his filter is that he's interested in both MZ and holyflare without actually attempting to go any further than that.
##Unvote: Vivax ##Vote: Deconduo
For someone who has posted a fair amount, there's a startling lack of actual content.
Read his filter. Tell me I'm wrong.
done too much reading already, want rels first
Go for it, I can change vote later if no-one is biting on the decon vote. I'm around until EoD anyway.
On August 31 2022 21:24 Jockmcplop wrote: I'm getting a tinfoil about rels and decon. They're both in my mafia list anyway, but the way they read each other is weird.
Rels reading decon:
On August 31 2022 11:40 Rels wrote:
On August 31 2022 11:29 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 31 2022 11:24 Rels wrote:
On August 30 2022 19:12 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 30 2022 03:04 deconduo wrote: So we are definitely lynching Chezinu D1 right?
Deconduo's first post. I'm calling it now. If one of decon or chezinu is mafia, the other is too. Like obviously we're never lynching chezinu on day one and posting this is a good way to get some suspicion on anyone who agrees with him and tries to lynch chez. Also, it might just be a joke post, but even if it is, i think its possible to make this connection from it.
Serious question to decon:
Can you go back through your posts, there's been plenty of them, and tell us which ones we can take seriously, except for the posts you make telling us not to take other posts seriously? Because it seems to me like every time you post something and someone comments on it, its either a joke post, or you didn't actually mean what you were saying, or its tongue in cheek. If you don't put your tongue back in its natural position sometime soon you're at a terrible risk of it getting stuck in your cheek.
This it it right for dec?
Pretty much. There wasn't much to say at the time because all of his posts turned out to be jokes as soon as anyone questioned them. So that's all there is to analyse, and it looks pretty scummy to me.
I see what you mean reading his filter in isolation. Not a lot of substance. But while reading the actual game, I thought his interactions were pretty natural.
He accepts that the reason i read him as scum is both true and valid, but then counters with 'but it looks natural'.
That's a very weak way to counter the points made against decon.
Of course, I'm open to the possibility that this is just rels hedging and not necessarily a link that makes them both mafia.
On August 31 2022 04:36 deconduo wrote: Matt will either appear or be killed off at this point so
##Vote: Rels for now, posting just enough to not get modkilled
All rels has to do is turn up and post some, which he promptly does. Then decon quickly unvotes him without further participation.
On August 31 2022 19:48 deconduo wrote: Rels is alive, that's good.
##: Unvote
The whole thing looks mutually weird.
-----
I know this isn't some massive case but its not just me, right?
Rels had made 3 posts and everyone else (except Chez) was contributing. -> Pressure vote on
Rels made 2 pages of posts -> pressure vote off
Not really much more to it
Like I said before, don't argue against my case, go find scum. If you think my case is weak, maybe i'm scum, so figure out why and tell us. So far you haven't done any of this.
A pressure vote is only good if it leads somewhere.
Let me ask you something, was rels simply posting alot of words enough for you to remove your vote, or was it something that he actually said that suggests to you he isn't mafia?
Because if he is mafia, telling him that you are voting for him because he hasn't posted much and then immediately removing your votes from him when he posts more words isn't a great way to put pressure on someone.
On August 31 2022 21:24 Jockmcplop wrote: I'm getting a tinfoil about rels and decon. They're both in my mafia list anyway, but the way they read each other is weird.
Rels reading decon:
On August 31 2022 11:40 Rels wrote:
On August 31 2022 11:29 Jockmcplop wrote:
On August 31 2022 11:24 Rels wrote: [quote] This it it right for dec?
Pretty much. There wasn't much to say at the time because all of his posts turned out to be jokes as soon as anyone questioned them. So that's all there is to analyse, and it looks pretty scummy to me.
I see what you mean reading his filter in isolation. Not a lot of substance. But while reading the actual game, I thought his interactions were pretty natural.
He accepts that the reason i read him as scum is both true and valid, but then counters with 'but it looks natural'.
That's a very weak way to counter the points made against decon.
Of course, I'm open to the possibility that this is just rels hedging and not necessarily a link that makes them both mafia.
On August 31 2022 04:36 deconduo wrote: Matt will either appear or be killed off at this point so
##Vote: Rels for now, posting just enough to not get modkilled
All rels has to do is turn up and post some, which he promptly does. Then decon quickly unvotes him without further participation.
On August 31 2022 19:48 deconduo wrote: Rels is alive, that's good.
##: Unvote
The whole thing looks mutually weird.
-----
I know this isn't some massive case but its not just me, right?
Rels had made 3 posts and everyone else (except Chez) was contributing. -> Pressure vote on
Rels made 2 pages of posts -> pressure vote off
Not really much more to it
Like I said before, don't argue against my case, go find scum. If you think my case is weak, maybe i'm scum, so figure out why and tell us. So far you haven't done any of this.
A pressure vote is only good if it leads somewhere.
Let me ask you something, was rels simply posting alot of words enough for you to remove your vote, or was it something that he actually said that suggests to you he isn't mafia?
Because if he is mafia, telling him that you are voting for him because he hasn't posted much and then immediately removing your votes from him when he posts more words isn't a great way to put pressure on someone.
This is top tier town.
I dunno, feels a bit forced/tryhard? Maybe its just me
The mindset is pretty townie. He is sure about you but gives space for you to hunt mafia. If he is wrong, then he is wrong, we all make mistakes as town.
'Here is a case against you - but no no you can't respond to all the faults in it. Go hunt scum'
It's protecting himself against any criticism against holes in the case, and either: - I don't find scum and he pushes a lynch while sitting back happy - I find scum - he takes credit for 'forcing me to go hunt'
Very convenient.
Nah anyone can criticize my post, it just doesn't carry much weight coming from you As for:
- I don't find scum and he pushes a lynch while sitting back happy - I find scum - he takes credit for 'forcing me to go hunt'
This is pretty much correct. I'm perfectly happy with my case on you, i think its as good as its going to get on day 1, so unless you change my mind by doing something townie looking, i'm perfectly happy to sit here with my vote on you (unless no-one else goes for it, in which case i switch to rels later). Although i'm not that interested in credit for forcing you to scumhunt, it'd just be nice to see you trying to help win the game for town.
Let me ask you something, was rels simply posting alot of words enough for you to remove your vote, or was it something that he actually said that suggests to you he isn't mafia?
On August 31 2022 22:19 Jockmcplop wrote: While you're here decon:
Let me ask you something, was rels simply posting alot of words enough for you to remove your vote, or was it something that he actually said that suggests to you he isn't mafia?
Just posting was enough - as I said in the original vote it was for 'Posting the bare minimum to not get modkilled'
ok thanks. This reads to me like a very shallow way to assign your vote. I was hoping you had some reasoning beyond that for removing your vote tbh. I thought rels' posting last night was hella scummy, as i posted earlier and DI also posted about (and did a better job of it than i did tbh).
On August 31 2022 21:38 Jockmcplop wrote: Also koshi has made a fairly convincing case for letting vivax live for now. I am also giving rels some credit for that too, hence the vote for decon.
On August 31 2022 21:38 Jockmcplop wrote: Also koshi has made a fairly convincing case for letting vivax live for now. I am also giving rels some credit for that too, hence the vote for decon.
On August 31 2022 16:23 Koshi wrote: Lynching/shooting Vivax on D1/N1 is just fucking dumb. We all know the guy is an easy catch later on. .
This case? What makes Vivax so easy to catch?
Mostly koshi's confidence that he can do so (I currently have koshi as a pretty strong townread), but also vivax can get stressed out as mafia and start posting very unpredictably. This is with the caveat that in more recent games as mafia vivax has been pretty good (at least before i took a hiatus from playing).
Rels also said something like 'vivax hasn't started playing yet' which is a fair-ish point.
Anyway my vote on vivax was never really based on a case, more that i expected him to be tunnelling on someone by the time i put my vote on him.
On August 31 2022 23:02 CopCake wrote: I could change my vote for rels.
But I want to know what people think of my MZ case?
I put effort and boom, ignored in the sand.
I also wonder why chezinu voted me.
And from now on I should call Jock as Detective J.
The only part of your case against MZ that really appealed to me was that maybe he's pocketing koshi. He both addresses koshi directly, in a collaborative way, and repeats some of koshi's points, without explicitly townreading him. However, he does explicitly say that he agrees with koshi, and goes on to repeat koshi's points later on, which is consistent at least. So this point is ambiguous, but i'm happy to entertain the possibility.
I like his posting about decon's start. He's aggressive and committed to his early reads in a way that says to me he's town, and he is dead right about decon.
If i'm honest MZ's first few posts have scumreads without a great deal of deep thought process, but it was early in the game. He certainly got you on the defensive, where unfortunately you seem to have remained for much of the first day.
I remain unconvinced by anything anyone has posted about MZ. If I'm totally honest much of this is based on meta from previous games where i felt his early posting was an easy target for a lynch, but he's always town in these cases.
On August 31 2022 20:03 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels is keeping his options open and not in a good way ##Vote: Rels it's real now
I could see this being true, for sure. He's doubling down on weird things, repeating stuff others have said, and being pretty ambiguous about much of the other stuff. In fact, I'm adding rels to my vote list.
Our chat last night really went nowhere. He didn't even try to get any new information out of me even though he was questioning me about all of his concerns and ended up still at the same point he was before he asked the questions. I'm like I was answering all his questions without being evasive or arguing, why can't he use that to progress his reads, or the game somehow. Instead he's still stuck on rayn's very first post which generated nothing useful? I don't buy it to be honest, and nothing has really changed at all from that interaction, except for i now scumread rels.
It advanced my read though! I didn't explicitely say it I guess, but I don't want to vote for you anymore. Your responses could make sense.
Also regardless of alignment, it was nice that at least one person was there when I was available to play, less lonely.
Well you started suspicious of me and ended on this:
On August 31 2022 12:09 Jockmcplop wrote: Meh rels i can't find the game i was thinking of and its 4am here so i'm going to bed. If you want me to post it tomorrow just leave a note here and i will find it.
I would like it actually but more to check you than rayn hahaha :p
So that's why I assumed you hadn't progressed.
Which reminds me i've looked at like 6-7 games and I can't find the one i was thinking of. Maybe i was misremembering.
On August 31 2022 23:30 Rels wrote: Jock I understand your points, but posts like these feel pretty genuine. It just, makes sense. Not hard to fake of course for one post, but every interaction dec has feel like that.
On August 31 2022 22:19 Jockmcplop wrote: While you're here decon:
Let me ask you something, was rels simply posting alot of words enough for you to remove your vote, or was it something that he actually said that suggests to you he isn't mafia?
Just posting was enough - as I said in the original vote it was for 'Posting the bare minimum to not get modkilled'
ok thanks. This reads to me like a very shallow way to assign your vote. I was hoping you had some reasoning beyond that for removing your vote tbh. I thought rels' posting last night was hella scummy, as i posted earlier and DI also posted about (and did a better job of it than i did tbh).
I never pretended it was anything else. Pretty standard day 1 pressure vote to get inactives active. Active just means posting, I don't expect anyone to instantly write a page of awesome scumhuting. I don't expect everyone to be an awesome scumhunting wizard on day 1.
Maybe I just have low standards
This is very similar to what you said yesterday about decon and his early jokeposting. That you agreed with my points but that it felt natural.
Honestly it doesn't really feel natural or genuine to me. But even if it did, the lack of town thought process is far more telling imo.
On August 31 2022 23:31 Rels wrote: I don't vote to vote dec. Who would you vote if not him? (and not me lol)
The only other person who is ringing alarm bells for me is vivax. I think both you and dec are scum anyway, so if not him and not you is kind of a moot point!
On August 31 2022 20:03 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels is keeping his options open and not in a good way ##Vote: Rels it's real now
I could see this being true, for sure. He's doubling down on weird things, repeating stuff others have said, and being pretty ambiguous about much of the other stuff. In fact, I'm adding rels to my vote list.
Our chat last night really went nowhere. He didn't even try to get any new information out of me even though he was questioning me about all of his concerns and ended up still at the same point he was before he asked the questions. I'm like I was answering all his questions without being evasive or arguing, why can't he use that to progress his reads, or the game somehow. Instead he's still stuck on rayn's very first post which generated nothing useful? I don't buy it to be honest, and nothing has really changed at all from that interaction, except for i now scumread rels.
It advanced my read though! I didn't explicitely say it I guess, but I don't want to vote for you anymore. Your responses could make sense.
Also regardless of alignment, it was nice that at least one person was there when I was available to play, less lonely.
Well you started suspicious of me and ended on this:
On August 31 2022 12:12 Rels wrote:
On August 31 2022 12:09 Jockmcplop wrote: Meh rels i can't find the game i was thinking of and its 4am here so i'm going to bed. If you want me to post it tomorrow just leave a note here and i will find it.
I would like it actually but more to check you than rayn hahaha :p
So that's why I assumed you hadn't progressed.
Which reminds me i've looked at like 6-7 games and I can't find the one i was thinking of. Maybe i was misremembering.
it was more tongue in cheek than anything else Oh no I shouldn't use that word haha :p
I thought we'd established that I can't detect that stuff very well!
I'd like to hear from holyflare anyway in general. What he thinks about my opinion on his slam case etc. Rels I'm sorry to leave you alone in the thread again but i have to go nap i had like 3 hours sleep last night and then a long hospital treatment this morning and its hitting me now. I'll be back in an hour or so.
HF given that rels is voting for slam and you're pretending to vote for rels, does that do anything to your feelings on slam? You seemed reasonably determined about him yesterday.
On September 01 2022 01:58 Jockmcplop wrote: Alright. Looks like its rels. I can do that but i was hoping for a least a few comments on my case against decon.
Still, I can kill rels.
##Unvote: deconduo ##Vote rels
Wow so non committal after your strong reaction to DI
The whole time i said i think rels and decon are mafia together. There's no-one around, so leaving my vote on decon is useless when rels and MZ are close.
I was hoping a few people would be around for EoD, but the ones that are haven't even commented on Decon.
On September 01 2022 02:19 Rels wrote: creating a second wagon so we have only wrong choices. Maybe to divert from Vivax yeah? There was a lot of talk about Vivax but no vote at the end Thing is, I'm not sure because it was kinda shut down by Koshi and I, and I don't think Koshi is scum
So who are responsible for creating the second wagon in your eyes?
On September 01 2022 02:27 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Man the amount of people who are accepting poor town play bc it's either "just joking" or "they're easy to meta read later" is really frustrating.
Vivax is absolutely not worth keeping around, especially compared to rels.
Decon can't even pay attention to the thread. Either of these two are better votes than rels.
I can get behind Vivax as well. Let's do it
Why not decon? No-one seems to be able to answer me about it. Its super frustrating like I'm just being ignored. I coudl take or leave a vivax vote, but I'm far more inclined to vote rels, and even more so decon.
Hang on:
On August 31 2022 21:37 Jockmcplop wrote: More decon
There's zero attempt to progress his reads throughout the day. He's doing alot of fighting against rayn's posts about him, but it hasn't seemed to arouse any suspicion that rayn might be mafia, even though he claims rayn's entire case on him was meta from 8 years ago. Given that rayn is a good town player, that would at least make me suspicious if i was decon. But all I get from his filter is that he's interested in both MZ and holyflare without actually attempting to go any further than that.
##Unvote: Vivax ##Vote: Deconduo
For someone who has posted a fair amount, there's a startling lack of actual content.
Guys my football team has to play against manchester city later and i'm SHITTING IT. Let's lynch scum and make my night not as miserable as its probably otherwise going to be.
On September 01 2022 02:37 Rels wrote: We still have 25 minutes, I want to undestand why you guys that are thinking of switching (Jock, CopCake, MZ) won't vote Dandel. Is it really because of that shitty case?
On August 31 2022 21:45 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels, just read along in his filter if you will I'm going chronological on this
#529 rayn and koshi top town, votes copcake and floats jock and slam as per #533 copcake is a sheep off koshi that all looks fine so far, no? #534, #535, #537 is the first instance of what I mean. HF wasn't tunneling but hey maybe he was tunneling after all. This is meant to look like progression but it's actually just nothing. #542 towncases copcake
next saga #543 vivax and dandel deserve to be shot #544 because we're both 'useless'
then #548 Slam is scummy #553 actually he has no idea how to read Slam and his filter is not alignment indicative for him. HF's case does not make Slam scum. But Slam's posts still 'feel kind of fabricated'.
back on an old horse #555 I'm just reacting to jock, which implies jock is leading and driving the conversation and I'm just being pulled along, however, #556 + #557 Jock is still the one looking like mafia here, somehow because it "seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious" When his own argument to dismiss me is that jock drove the entire conversation. But that can not possibly be townie because professional fencesitter Rels needs more pointy bits of wood to park his ass. #558 notably directly after the above, asks Vivax to participate, probably in full trust that Vivax will not, in fact do that. And you can always point back and go 'bad meanie Vivax didn't want to talk to me, big sad so scum'. This is just set-up for a future push and in no way can Rels actually think this would help him in reading Vivax.
But then, it's not really about trying to figure out who is town and who is scum, just who is 'pushable' and how believable these pushes are.
Going along #562 Jock was just looking for an easy way to fabricate a scumread When jock points out that he didn't, #569 comes to the rescue because that certainly does not prove that Rels is WRONG. It could totally be except he caps the post off by weakening his own stance to 'just a counter-example, not proof'. Yo for real my fence is breaking under the weight of this man.
YO IT'S MY HOMEBOI DECONDUO UP IN HEA #573 "hahahaha =D" jock's decon case is unconvincing but Rels will re-read it. I assume it's not terrible because he doesn't post about it further just asks about it in #578 instead #576 jock is just so scummy holy shit guyse #579 Rels is now voting Slam #583 decon's vote on Rels is "bad :p" #584 Slam is the preferred lynch #586 actually, decon is super natural, and yeah sure there's little 'substance' but for no discernable reason deconduo deserves completely different treatment than Vivax or Dandel did when decon is essentially the same slot. Decon is mafia with Rels calling it here, especially since #587 in Rels' townreads, decon suddenly doesn't appear at all! Wowzers! idk fam the last post sure read like a supposed townread to me but what do I know #588 PoE, decon is in here because Rels remembered his own strategy I assume. But Vivax should be lynched over him (or Tube/Matt) anyway, funny how that works out. Whoever's not there is supposed to be scum I guess, idk. So me/Slam/jock but Rels doesn't have the cojones to actually call out a scumteam with both me and jock on it because he knows how insane and wrong that will sound to anybody.
The only player Rels bothers to fake a shred of progression on is Copcake. That's literally it. Nothing on nobody else really means anything to this man. Rels is mafia and as a tight little bonus i'm pretty sure that if he flips red decon is the next scum.
Me too I can list every post made by a person and write a comment on it. His conclusion just doesn't make sense. Why should I have had a sense of progression in like the like hour between my catching up and me going to sleep, when nothing happened apart from Jock and I talking? And that changed my read on Jock so that's not even true.
Dandel and I mindmelded hard on the idea that you and decon are both mafia. Like made the same post at the same time about it. Dandel is my number one town and I can't see that changing unless you or decon die today and flip town.
On September 01 2022 02:37 Rels wrote: We still have 25 minutes, I want to undestand why you guys that are thinking of switching (Jock, CopCake, MZ) won't vote Dandel. Is it really because of that shitty case?
On August 31 2022 21:45 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels, just read along in his filter if you will I'm going chronological on this
#529 rayn and koshi top town, votes copcake and floats jock and slam as per #533 copcake is a sheep off koshi that all looks fine so far, no? #534, #535, #537 is the first instance of what I mean. HF wasn't tunneling but hey maybe he was tunneling after all. This is meant to look like progression but it's actually just nothing. #542 towncases copcake
next saga #543 vivax and dandel deserve to be shot #544 because we're both 'useless'
then #548 Slam is scummy #553 actually he has no idea how to read Slam and his filter is not alignment indicative for him. HF's case does not make Slam scum. But Slam's posts still 'feel kind of fabricated'.
back on an old horse #555 I'm just reacting to jock, which implies jock is leading and driving the conversation and I'm just being pulled along, however, #556 + #557 Jock is still the one looking like mafia here, somehow because it "seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious" When his own argument to dismiss me is that jock drove the entire conversation. But that can not possibly be townie because professional fencesitter Rels needs more pointy bits of wood to park his ass. #558 notably directly after the above, asks Vivax to participate, probably in full trust that Vivax will not, in fact do that. And you can always point back and go 'bad meanie Vivax didn't want to talk to me, big sad so scum'. This is just set-up for a future push and in no way can Rels actually think this would help him in reading Vivax.
But then, it's not really about trying to figure out who is town and who is scum, just who is 'pushable' and how believable these pushes are.
Going along #562 Jock was just looking for an easy way to fabricate a scumread When jock points out that he didn't, #569 comes to the rescue because that certainly does not prove that Rels is WRONG. It could totally be except he caps the post off by weakening his own stance to 'just a counter-example, not proof'. Yo for real my fence is breaking under the weight of this man.
YO IT'S MY HOMEBOI DECONDUO UP IN HEA #573 "hahahaha =D" jock's decon case is unconvincing but Rels will re-read it. I assume it's not terrible because he doesn't post about it further just asks about it in #578 instead #576 jock is just so scummy holy shit guyse #579 Rels is now voting Slam #583 decon's vote on Rels is "bad :p" #584 Slam is the preferred lynch #586 actually, decon is super natural, and yeah sure there's little 'substance' but for no discernable reason deconduo deserves completely different treatment than Vivax or Dandel did when decon is essentially the same slot. Decon is mafia with Rels calling it here, especially since #587 in Rels' townreads, decon suddenly doesn't appear at all! Wowzers! idk fam the last post sure read like a supposed townread to me but what do I know #588 PoE, decon is in here because Rels remembered his own strategy I assume. But Vivax should be lynched over him (or Tube/Matt) anyway, funny how that works out. Whoever's not there is supposed to be scum I guess, idk. So me/Slam/jock but Rels doesn't have the cojones to actually call out a scumteam with both me and jock on it because he knows how insane and wrong that will sound to anybody.
The only player Rels bothers to fake a shred of progression on is Copcake. That's literally it. Nothing on nobody else really means anything to this man. Rels is mafia and as a tight little bonus i'm pretty sure that if he flips red decon is the next scum.
Me too I can list every post made by a person and write a comment on it. His conclusion just doesn't make sense. Why should I have had a sense of progression in like the like hour between my catching up and me going to sleep, when nothing happened apart from Jock and I talking? And that changed my read on Jock so that's not even true.
Dandel and I mindmelded hard on the idea that you and decon are both mafia. Like made the same post at the same time about it. Dandel is my number one town and I can't see that changing unless you or decon die today and flip town.
Well fuck then rethink the rels part, this is town
I don't think so right now. He's trying to save decon right now and the only reasoning in his filter about it is that decon's useless early posting 'felt natural'.
On September 01 2022 02:37 Rels wrote: We still have 25 minutes, I want to undestand why you guys that are thinking of switching (Jock, CopCake, MZ) won't vote Dandel. Is it really because of that shitty case?
On August 31 2022 21:45 Dandel Ion wrote: Rels, just read along in his filter if you will I'm going chronological on this
#529 rayn and koshi top town, votes copcake and floats jock and slam as per #533 copcake is a sheep off koshi that all looks fine so far, no? #534, #535, #537 is the first instance of what I mean. HF wasn't tunneling but hey maybe he was tunneling after all. This is meant to look like progression but it's actually just nothing. #542 towncases copcake
next saga #543 vivax and dandel deserve to be shot #544 because we're both 'useless'
then #548 Slam is scummy #553 actually he has no idea how to read Slam and his filter is not alignment indicative for him. HF's case does not make Slam scum. But Slam's posts still 'feel kind of fabricated'.
back on an old horse #555 I'm just reacting to jock, which implies jock is leading and driving the conversation and I'm just being pulled along, however, #556 + #557 Jock is still the one looking like mafia here, somehow because it "seems that you want to grab an easy win while fearing to be too obvious" When his own argument to dismiss me is that jock drove the entire conversation. But that can not possibly be townie because professional fencesitter Rels needs more pointy bits of wood to park his ass. #558 notably directly after the above, asks Vivax to participate, probably in full trust that Vivax will not, in fact do that. And you can always point back and go 'bad meanie Vivax didn't want to talk to me, big sad so scum'. This is just set-up for a future push and in no way can Rels actually think this would help him in reading Vivax.
But then, it's not really about trying to figure out who is town and who is scum, just who is 'pushable' and how believable these pushes are.
Going along #562 Jock was just looking for an easy way to fabricate a scumread When jock points out that he didn't, #569 comes to the rescue because that certainly does not prove that Rels is WRONG. It could totally be except he caps the post off by weakening his own stance to 'just a counter-example, not proof'. Yo for real my fence is breaking under the weight of this man.
YO IT'S MY HOMEBOI DECONDUO UP IN HEA #573 "hahahaha =D" jock's decon case is unconvincing but Rels will re-read it. I assume it's not terrible because he doesn't post about it further just asks about it in #578 instead #576 jock is just so scummy holy shit guyse #579 Rels is now voting Slam #583 decon's vote on Rels is "bad :p" #584 Slam is the preferred lynch #586 actually, decon is super natural, and yeah sure there's little 'substance' but for no discernable reason deconduo deserves completely different treatment than Vivax or Dandel did when decon is essentially the same slot. Decon is mafia with Rels calling it here, especially since #587 in Rels' townreads, decon suddenly doesn't appear at all! Wowzers! idk fam the last post sure read like a supposed townread to me but what do I know #588 PoE, decon is in here because Rels remembered his own strategy I assume. But Vivax should be lynched over him (or Tube/Matt) anyway, funny how that works out. Whoever's not there is supposed to be scum I guess, idk. So me/Slam/jock but Rels doesn't have the cojones to actually call out a scumteam with both me and jock on it because he knows how insane and wrong that will sound to anybody.
The only player Rels bothers to fake a shred of progression on is Copcake. That's literally it. Nothing on nobody else really means anything to this man. Rels is mafia and as a tight little bonus i'm pretty sure that if he flips red decon is the next scum.
Me too I can list every post made by a person and write a comment on it. His conclusion just doesn't make sense. Why should I have had a sense of progression in like the like hour between my catching up and me going to sleep, when nothing happened apart from Jock and I talking? And that changed my read on Jock so that's not even true.
Dandel and I mindmelded hard on the idea that you and decon are both mafia. Like made the same post at the same time about it. Dandel is my number one town and I can't see that changing unless you or decon die today and flip town.
Well fuck then rethink the rels part, this is town
I don't think so right now. He's trying to save decon right now and the only reasoning in his filter about it is that decon's useless early posting 'felt natural'.
well, you're seeing everything through the "Rels is scum with dec". What about the alternative world I'm town and I would prefer to lynch Dandel?
That world exists, but i'm tunnelled on this theory and it isn't going away. I acknowledge the massive possibility of confirmation bias in the idea that you're trying to save him right now. Even so, that does nothing to change my mind overall about you two being scum together.
On September 01 2022 02:54 Koshi wrote: Ok. 6 more mins but on page 37. Quick update?
MZ is leading the vote but we're trying to get it switched to decon. Overall rels made some posts that looked a bit townie, but equally could be mafia trying to save themselves by posting legacy type stuff.
ok hi guys. i took a day off cos i was frustrated so i went and sat in the park all day. it was nice. i'll spend this morning reading because i have to type one handed and it takes too long. then this afternoon i will tell you all why vivax is still mafia. probably.
And it is like the beggining of the day also, I dont understand why people take this like toooooooo seriously when you can change your vote when something happens.
OK I'm here now... I am wondering what's the point in putting a vote down if it doesn't matter? Surely when you vote it is signalling your intention to lynch a person, regardless of when it happens during a vote cycle. Unless you had some other reason for voting. Therefore it gives us as much information as a vote near the end of the day.
I'm not trying to answer for rayn, just my own opinion. We have to go off what we can see in the thread.
On September 02 2022 15:46 Jockmcplop wrote: ok hi guys. i took a day off cos i was frustrated so i went and sat in the park all day. it was nice. i'll spend this morning reading because i have to type one handed and it takes too long. then this afternoon i will tell you all why vivax is still mafia. probably.
On September 02 2022 07:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: Wait why is Rels town in your opinion now?
Game was kinda dead, he brought life to it.
The amount of scummy LHF pushing for his wagon is above critical mass enough that I think mafia are just pushing there because it's a free place to hide currently.
The voracity of people gunning for him doesn't equate to how people have been pushing him. I made some posts, Dandel made a case, Jock kind of interacted with it yet it's not those 3 names that are really clamouring for his head currently, it's just a weird vague consensus where these other people don't really explain why they want to vote rels.
What does LHF mean?
Low Hanging Fruit
Or, easy mislynch targets
A few easy mislynch targets a day keeps the doctor away
Why do you think rels voted you when you agreed on 2/3 scumreads? Why did you then change your other scumread to agree with rels' 3rd?
I guess I'm not really a scumread of rels any more. Looks weird though. Its mostly the way rels vote on you 'to get you playing' instantly disappears the moment you arrive. Its just... is it that shallow a vote?
On September 01 2022 03:56 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I also need to look at Dandel, I wanna compare him and Vivax because in my head right now they're playing fairly similarly.
On September 01 2022 03:56 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I also need to look at Dandel, I wanna compare him and Vivax because in my head right now they're playing fairly similarly.
This is town Because it's correct I've gotten soft tbh, but I already mentioned it earlier, it was just hard to get
Vivax I'm confused by exactly what the second post here means...
EPT
![[image loading]](https://c.tenor.com/up33X0I9Uk0AAAAM/wink-and-point-finger-guns.gif)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/vDCUUiL.png?2)
