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[N] Uninspired Mafia - Page 5

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 12:13 GMT
#503
I am not going to be around for deadline. Here are my reads for anyone interested:


[image loading]
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 12:18 GMT
#505
On May 02 2019 21:12 Holyflare wrote:
This is gross misrepresentation. Just because I have an arbitrary list of unexplained reads doesn't mean I don't have reasons for them. Those reasons might be poe but hey ho. It's more a list of non town reads than actually being mafia.

With regards to the people I actually push, the ones that now actually matter (you and pandain) I have posted my thoughts quite well and elaborated. Pretty obvious.

I don't go into your filter where you pick out the list of like 3-4 people you said contains mafia and say omg unexplained reads no way do I? Pretty petty if you ask me.


everyone, please take note again.

HF has an "arbitrary list of unexplained reads", into which are lumped two people HF is calling scum, while responding almost simultaneously to my question about one of those unexplained reads (Vivax) saying that Vivax could go either way because they haven't done anything?

How can it be PoE if HF has two people who supposedly haven't done anything (Vivax and MZ) but one is in the "arbitrary list" and not the other?

Even if HF had reasons, HF didn't divulge them when asked, and then backpedaled with a non-answer when called out on it.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 15:29 GMT
#521
On May 03 2019 00:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I also find it remarkable that bugs now thinks BC is mafia because all BC did D1 was to push on a person bugs himself did think was mafia.


no, that's not why BC became scummier to me. I had him as town for some basic reason I don't really recall, and it wasn't great. You actually made me realize that with this post:

On May 02 2019 09:14 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 09:11 wherebugsgo wrote:
I could argue on balance that one of you should be scum but that’s not the simplest answer because it requires me to throw away my actual read on one or both of you.

if you have a real town read on us (i mean based on posts we have made) why do you ever even say this?

What is your read on BC?


I replied re: BC with this:

On May 02 2019 09:19 wherebugsgo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 09:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also why did you never ever push your read on MZ? Did you realise noone even got what your read was?


BC town, I didn’t push my read on MZ because I doubted myself and I also wasn’t insistent enough on maintaining a counter wagon.

Had Jock responded better to me I would have defended him very hard because I thought the meta case was really bad (also really HF, you should apologize for that reading comprehension insult LOL)


And then when I thought about why I have BC marked as town and read my sheet, I realized I didn't really have any good reason to think so and reread.

That's why I posted this:

On May 02 2019 09:31 wherebugsgo wrote:
actually thanks rayn, you made me realize that I have on read for not very great reasons.

BC what do you think of MZ and Pandain?


I think the one thing that makes BC look better is that his read on MZ seemed to evolve between consecutive posts, but that's so minor I'm not sure it's indicative of anything.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 15:44 GMT
#525
On May 03 2019 00:35 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If you were doubting on your read on MZ then why he is colored all red again?


why is it that neither you nor HF seem to properly understand the concept of time?

Tell me, do you find these things weird?

1. MZ asked me a question and never followed up
2. MZ claimed to be suspicious of Jock but never voted
3. MZ claimed to be wary of single wagons but didn't actually bother looking into any secondary options independently (only asked me, per #1, about Grack on Rels)

My initial vote on MZ was just like "oh this feels like scum MZ" but my confidence level wasn't super high. MZ started posting a bit and his arguments for Jock being scum jived with what others were saying (this is a big factor in why I let the meta piece on Jock go, because there were multiple voices disagreeing with me). At the time, I didn't find MZ's posts all that strange. It's only in hindsight that I found him more scummy, especially because he disappeared and didn't follow up on the questions he asked that I never answered.

I actually think a lack of vote that risks modkill/warning is slightly more of a town-tell than a scum-tell just because scum are incentivized by their teammates to vote, so one explanation might just be that MZ became busy and never showed up again. However, there aren't any good reasons for me to think MZ is town other than that.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 16:01 GMT
#527
On May 03 2019 00:55 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I dont understand what has concept of time have to do with anything here because those things happened before jock was lynched, you had an original scumread on MZ and never chose to push it instead of this:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 01:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Apparently he actually has a scumread on MZ. That in itself is weird because MZ's opening was at worst null and there was absolutely nothing scummy in it. Second point about that is that the rest of D1 bugs has wasted onto something (aka ll the posts on jock) that could have been said in one sentence - "play or die", if that's what you want to say. He never pursues the MZ lynch further and instead makes a completely useless set of coaching posts - like hf put it - onto a different person. Hell noone even knows why he scumreads MZ and he never even cared to explain that. Does that sound townie? Because to me it doesnt.



huh? it takes time to tell whether MZ is actually going to follow up, or vote, or do anything. I wasn't confident on MZ which is why I didn't push MZ. I wasn't confident on anybody, which is why I proposed no-lynch. Specifically, I wasn't confident we could avoid mislynch.

Also I'm typically not around for the last few hours before deadline because it's 5 a.m. here (currently 1 am) so I can't actually influence lynches effectively last-minute in a low-activity game.

I "coached" Jock, as you put it, because I wasn't confident on the meta read so I wanted to establish my own read by seeing Jock's responses. His responses were awful so I was fine with letting him die and didn't bother putting in any effort to change the lynch.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 16:07 GMT
#528
In before HF harps on something minor to misrepresent me, like "oh but you only talked about no lynch after you voted" or whatever noise he wants to push
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 17:49 GMT
#538
On May 03 2019 02:43 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am struggling to find third scumread since i dont really think HF is scum and i dont really think FF is scum either.


let’s assume HF and FF are town for the sake of this

If you have two reads POE should give you a third. For me, if HF and FF are not scum, MZ BC Vivax would be my top 3.

If HF is not scum, and he’s also not totally whack this game, I might be wrong about Pandain and his name rises.

The only other players left are like VE and grack. Koshi we can wait on potentially because of the night post.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 18:28 GMT
#557
On May 03 2019 03:14 VisceraEyes wrote:
Yeah I think I'd lynch Pandain. I have exactly two games of mafia on TL in the last year or so, they were the last one and this one. In the last game I started as town, had a strong townread on Pandain from D1, and ended up recruiting him the next day because he was so townie.

Interestingly, his posting from D3 onward looks a lot more like this game, though the thread was admittedly fucked by that point anyway in the last game. My read is more based on my LACK of strong townread on him throughout D1, persisting until now. I feel like Pandain is a much stronger poster than what we're seeing here. I think he's hiding something nefarious.


Do you have the link to the point where he gets recruited? I want to read that. I’m on mobile so can’t search easily atm.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:01 GMT
#618
Vivax literally only mentions FF and MZ in his filter. I think FF is 100% town
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:02 GMT
#620
On May 03 2019 05:54 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2019 04:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Vivax
Wherebugsgo
Pandain
(Fecalfeast)


VE is never mafia for anyone who will question it later. He is just too invested in teh game, i think that was the only unexplained read i had. Goodluck.

##Vote wherebugsgo


who did you shoot?
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:11 GMT
#623
Look if it makes the game easier to kill me today, so be it. I don’t actually give a fuck about living if people are going to be dumb and lynch me because rayn fucked up and thought I was scum for whatever stupid reason he cooked up in his head.

At this point Pandain is probably not scum, VE is not scum, FF is probably not scum.

BC & Meapak look worse for Vivax flipping scum.

At this point we should be killing one of them but we’re killing me instead. Whatever.

##vote wherebugsgo
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:32 GMT
#629
HF I think you played your hand too hard here

On May 02 2019 07:31 Holyflare wrote:
...
You say no, maybe only vivax.

Pandain comes up with reasons to vote vivax that don't really apply because vivax has proportional activity to normal since this thread isn't very long imo. Maybe he's busy? Who the fuck knows?
...


On May 02 2019 07:41 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 07:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Okay. I will let himself say what he has to say about that.
Why is Vivax not mafia?


When did I say vivax wasn't mafia? I don't think he's done anything good or awful. Similarly to you.


On May 02 2019 18:35 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 18:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
HF do you think any of MZ, Vivax, or BC are scum?


What a pointless trivial question which I've addressed already. Mz has posted shit all, could be anything. Vivax has done nothing to sway me one way or the other and didn't post anything I hated yet. BC has only made posts I've agreed with.

Rayn I can't believe you fell for my posts last night. Reread them as if I'm talking about actual insects :D

I will lynch bugs with you.



On May 02 2019 18:53 Holyflare wrote:
Koshi/bugs/rels/vivax/pandain

Based on bugs defence of pandain tempted to take pandain out but we'll see.

Koshi hit or miss kinda like what he posted but I trained him as mafia well and he's a complete non entity.


On May 02 2019 19:56 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2019 19:37 wherebugsgo wrote:
On May 02 2019 18:35 Holyflare wrote:
On May 02 2019 18:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
HF do you think any of MZ, Vivax, or BC are scum?


What a pointless trivial question which I've addressed already. Mz has posted shit all, could be anything. Vivax has done nothing to sway me one way or the other and didn't post anything I hated yet. BC has only made posts I've agreed with.

Rayn I can't believe you fell for my posts last night. Reread them as if I'm talking about actual insects :D

I will lynch bugs with you.



Rayn is this scum HF being fake aggressive or town HF who thinks he's posted something but actually hasn't?

I ask him about MZ, Vivax, and BC.

1. Up until this post, MZ is not at all mentioned in HF's filter. Here, HF doesn't take a stance.
2. HF did say the same thing about Vivax earlier, so sure, fine. But again, no stance.
3. "BC only made posts I've agreed with" no direct interaction besides that first weird mistake post HF had, we can come to this conclusion I suppose based on the fact that BC and HF both voted Jock but why should vote alignment matter in reading BC?

So why does HF say this is a pointless question when the only thing that HF actually said was #2?



1. What has mz done since that required me to take a stance on him? Like I said, he's done shit all. Also I quite categorically do mention him in my filter. I ask him when he's going to stop fannying around not voting Jock, which now Jock has flipped town makes him look more suspicious. Regardless, I don't have enough information because he just hasn't posted enough. If anyone says they can form an opinion on him they're either lying or wrong.

2. Yup.


BC, MZ, HF, at least one of you is town unless this is a bastard 4 scum setup. Come help me figure out the game while I'm still alive. As long as we're lynching me just assume I'm town. You can discard everything I say never, because I won't flip scum.

HF if I'm wrong about you and these are not massive scum tells of you defending Vivax for no reason but then putting him as scum for equally no reason, please do explain yourself. Why was Vivax so special, out of the "do nothingers" that he had such a great honour of being in your kill list?
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:34 GMT
#630
On May 03 2019 07:30 VisceraEyes wrote:
You know what

No.

Pandain.

No.

You don't get to come in here and jizz all over the thread about "trying to lynch the gf" when A) you had literally zero credibility beyond your ability to provide ONE vote, and not even a vote OFF the main wagon. It was a useless vote on Rels that went nowhere and meant nothing, just like the Vivax vote.

In fact, it makes sense to me that the mafia team would be trying to capitalize on a possibly MODKILLED GF.

##Vote: Pandain


actually they got 3 votes on Vivax before that train died.

If I'd been around I probably would've joined the Vivax train.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:37 GMT
#633
VE, talk to me a bit. Why does HF keep moving from lynch target to lynch target without having any semblance of trying to figure out the game? He moved from Pandain onto me almost seamlessly. It's like he's not even bothering to try and figure out the game, he just goes from conclusion to conclusion. It seems so fake.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:40 GMT
#634
On May 03 2019 07:35 VisceraEyes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2019 07:34 wherebugsgo wrote:
On May 03 2019 07:30 VisceraEyes wrote:
You know what

No.

Pandain.

No.

You don't get to come in here and jizz all over the thread about "trying to lynch the gf" when A) you had literally zero credibility beyond your ability to provide ONE vote, and not even a vote OFF the main wagon. It was a useless vote on Rels that went nowhere and meant nothing, just like the Vivax vote.

In fact, it makes sense to me that the mafia team would be trying to capitalize on a possibly MODKILLED GF.

##Vote: Pandain


actually they got 3 votes on Vivax before that train died.

If I'd been around I probably would've joined the Vivax train.

Oh me too bugs! Me too now that I know it was the godfather! I bet no one in here would say they wouldn't have voted Vivax at the end of the day had they been here.


ignore my comment for a bit and hear me out here.

That last minute wagon was pushed by rayn, Pandain, and grack. Let's argue for the sake of this that Pandain is scum.

Jock was sitting pretty at 5 votes.

There were 4 absentees who could've come in at any point and slapped down a vote, and any one of the Jock voters could also have been like "nah I've got cold feet on Jock" and swapped. Only 1 swap and 1 additional vote (or 2 swaps, I guess) would have been necessary for Vivax to die.

Do you think mafia would toy that close to deadline with a lynch that's just 2 random votes from killing off someone on your team?
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:42 GMT
#636
I'm bold af as mafia and the last thing I'd want to introduce is variability. I might do it in a situation where I'm really convinced the result wouldn't change, but when it's 5 votes vs 3 that's not something I'd ever risk. I don't consider myself a risk-averse scum, either.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:44 GMT
#638
On May 03 2019 07:43 VisceraEyes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2019 07:40 wherebugsgo wrote:
On May 03 2019 07:35 VisceraEyes wrote:
On May 03 2019 07:34 wherebugsgo wrote:
On May 03 2019 07:30 VisceraEyes wrote:
You know what

No.

Pandain.

No.

You don't get to come in here and jizz all over the thread about "trying to lynch the gf" when A) you had literally zero credibility beyond your ability to provide ONE vote, and not even a vote OFF the main wagon. It was a useless vote on Rels that went nowhere and meant nothing, just like the Vivax vote.

In fact, it makes sense to me that the mafia team would be trying to capitalize on a possibly MODKILLED GF.

##Vote: Pandain


actually they got 3 votes on Vivax before that train died.

If I'd been around I probably would've joined the Vivax train.

Oh me too bugs! Me too now that I know it was the godfather! I bet no one in here would say they wouldn't have voted Vivax at the end of the day had they been here.


ignore my comment for a bit and hear me out here.

That last minute wagon was pushed by rayn, Pandain, and grack. Let's argue for the sake of this that Pandain is scum.

Jock was sitting pretty at 5 votes.

There were 4 absentees who could've come in at any point and slapped down a vote, and any one of the Jock voters could also have been like "nah I've got cold feet on Jock" and swapped. Only 1 swap and 1 additional vote (or 2 swaps, I guess) would have been necessary for Vivax to die.

Do you think mafia would toy that close to deadline with a lynch that's just 2 random votes from killing off someone on your team?


YES

IF ITS NOTORIOUSLY AWFUL AT MAFIA VIVAX WHO IS IN DANGER OF A MODKILL!

YES ITS POSSIBLE EVEN PROBABLE! I'D DO IT IN A SECOND, BECAUSE I'M EXCELLENT AT MAFIA!


alright...

looks like I'm dead today boys
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:50 GMT
#643
On May 03 2019 07:46 VisceraEyes wrote:
Whatever I'll just read then. I fucking hate when people come in and scream about trying to lynch someone who died NOT from the lynch and flipped and now I'm tilted.


when you come back, I want to discuss with you more.

Here are conclusions I've come up with:

Town:

Grack
FF
Pandain
VE

Question marks:
Alakaslam (replaced iGrok)
Rels
Koshi

Scum:

MZ?
HF?
BC?

The last three all look bad, I would say HF looks objectively the worst in isolation and MZ and BC both look bad by association. MZ I still have a tone/meta read on as scum. Also MZ promised more activity today so it should be easy to see if MZ continues that and if MZ can provide any useful contributions.

Say MZ and BC are both town, then I think HF & Koshi is also possible. But with 6 people being in the possible scum pool I'm not sure what really to think at this point, and both MZ and BC look worse after the Vivax flip.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:50 GMT
#645
On May 03 2019 07:46 Holyflare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2019 07:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
HF I think you played your hand too hard here

On May 02 2019 07:31 Holyflare wrote:
...
You say no, maybe only vivax.

Pandain comes up with reasons to vote vivax that don't really apply because vivax has proportional activity to normal since this thread isn't very long imo. Maybe he's busy? Who the fuck knows?
...


On May 02 2019 07:41 Holyflare wrote:
On May 02 2019 07:34 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Okay. I will let himself say what he has to say about that.
Why is Vivax not mafia?


When did I say vivax wasn't mafia? I don't think he's done anything good or awful. Similarly to you.


On May 02 2019 18:35 Holyflare wrote:
On May 02 2019 18:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
HF do you think any of MZ, Vivax, or BC are scum?


What a pointless trivial question which I've addressed already. Mz has posted shit all, could be anything. Vivax has done nothing to sway me one way or the other and didn't post anything I hated yet. BC has only made posts I've agreed with.

Rayn I can't believe you fell for my posts last night. Reread them as if I'm talking about actual insects :D

I will lynch bugs with you.



On May 02 2019 18:53 Holyflare wrote:
Koshi/bugs/rels/vivax/pandain

Based on bugs defence of pandain tempted to take pandain out but we'll see.

Koshi hit or miss kinda like what he posted but I trained him as mafia well and he's a complete non entity.


On May 02 2019 19:56 Holyflare wrote:
On May 02 2019 19:37 wherebugsgo wrote:
On May 02 2019 18:35 Holyflare wrote:
On May 02 2019 18:32 wherebugsgo wrote:
HF do you think any of MZ, Vivax, or BC are scum?


What a pointless trivial question which I've addressed already. Mz has posted shit all, could be anything. Vivax has done nothing to sway me one way or the other and didn't post anything I hated yet. BC has only made posts I've agreed with.

Rayn I can't believe you fell for my posts last night. Reread them as if I'm talking about actual insects :D

I will lynch bugs with you.



Rayn is this scum HF being fake aggressive or town HF who thinks he's posted something but actually hasn't?

I ask him about MZ, Vivax, and BC.

1. Up until this post, MZ is not at all mentioned in HF's filter. Here, HF doesn't take a stance.
2. HF did say the same thing about Vivax earlier, so sure, fine. But again, no stance.
3. "BC only made posts I've agreed with" no direct interaction besides that first weird mistake post HF had, we can come to this conclusion I suppose based on the fact that BC and HF both voted Jock but why should vote alignment matter in reading BC?

So why does HF say this is a pointless question when the only thing that HF actually said was #2?



1. What has mz done since that required me to take a stance on him? Like I said, he's done shit all. Also I quite categorically do mention him in my filter. I ask him when he's going to stop fannying around not voting Jock, which now Jock has flipped town makes him look more suspicious. Regardless, I don't have enough information because he just hasn't posted enough. If anyone says they can form an opinion on him they're either lying or wrong.

2. Yup.


BC, MZ, HF, at least one of you is town unless this is a bastard 4 scum setup. Come help me figure out the game while I'm still alive. As long as we're lynching me just assume I'm town. You can discard everything I say never, because I won't flip scum.

HF if I'm wrong about you and these are not massive scum tells of you defending Vivax for no reason but then putting him as scum for equally no reason, please do explain yourself. Why was Vivax so special, out of the "do nothingers" that he had such a great honour of being in your kill list?


If it wasn't clear I've red checked you. Good day.


thanks for scum claiming

when I die, if I flip anything but miller kill this fucker
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
May 02 2019 22:51 GMT
#646
there is no framer in this game
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