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On March 08 2018 09:51 Holyflare wrote:
Yeah, not saying it wasn't but this is mafia and when it goes against the collective thought for reasons other people struggle to see then it deserves to be looked into. That's quite literally the game.
Do you know about the experiment where 2 dudes told another dude that three lines of same length were different and most of the subjects responded wrongly as a result.
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/XAnNoh9.gif)
I wanna post so fucking badly but I need a role first
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Trying to re arrange my town circle is actually pretty sad. I have to look at people from scratch and I'm realizing the only person I can definitively call town at the moment is rsoultin who I thought was scum at the start of the game. And that's something I don't want to admit lol. At least Vivax also looks town
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> get out of our game ya troll
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I’m fookin back sson
I post in games even when I am not in them at all; at least I will soon actually be in this one from the looks of it but HELL IDK FOLKS NO ROLE COMIN MY WAY
I AN ON
FOOKIN
WITHDRAWALS MAN
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+ Show Spoiler +will this actually get their attention? Tune in GOD KNOWS WHEN for the result! It’s bound to be
Saucy
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On March 08 2018 07:13 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 07:10 n00bKing wrote:Ok, I'm off. On March 08 2018 06:32 n00bKing wrote:
Does anyone agree with HF's assessment of DF's play in other games?
Didn't see any backup on this, but to my eyes, the DF lynch doesn't thrill me. The push on Tubesock has been going for a long time, without much result, so I guess it's not happening today. ##UnvoteWould love to see this happen: ##Vote: KelsierSC Why him over prpl?
...huh?
Because Kelsier was a no-show (in the game thread at least) and prpl wasn't. You act like one vs. the other is an equivalent choice. It's not.
If people want to make a big deal over this, I can explain further. But I would have thought that the reasons why you lynch a literal no-show (like Kelsier or chaoser) over someone who makes a few posts and then bails for the rest of the Phase (like prpl or damdred) were fairly obvious.
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On March 08 2018 14:18 n00bKing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 07:13 Vivax wrote:On March 08 2018 07:10 n00bKing wrote:Ok, I'm off. On March 08 2018 06:32 n00bKing wrote:
Does anyone agree with HF's assessment of DF's play in other games?
Didn't see any backup on this, but to my eyes, the DF lynch doesn't thrill me. The push on Tubesock has been going for a long time, without much result, so I guess it's not happening today. ##UnvoteWould love to see this happen: ##Vote: KelsierSC Why him over prpl? ...huh? Because Kelsier was a no-show (in the game thread at least) and prpl wasn't. You act like one vs. the other is an equivalent choice. It's not. If people want to make a big deal over this, I can explain further. But I would have thought that the reasons why you lynch a literal no-show (like Kelsier or chaoser) over someone who makes a few posts and then bails for the rest of the Phase (like prpl or damdred) were fairly obvious.
meh. I disagree with this. You get more information from killing someone who is a lurker from their few posts. There is always the possibility that a completely afk person continues to be afk in which case he'll be modkilled and we wouldn't have wasted anything on him.
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On March 08 2018 07:26 rsoultin wrote:
I'll openly admit that I could probably be easily fooled by a scum df (and yes blatantly ignoring the claim cause whatevs) but I'm just not finding the arguments against him compelling when his read on me developed fairly naturally I thought.
There were arguments against him that I didn't find compelling either, obviously. But "ignoring the claim" is generous, because in a vacuum, it actually makes him more likely to be scum than if he'd not said it.
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On March 08 2018 08:11 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 08:03 darthfoley wrote:
Meh I thought we got him considering he was lurking at deadline I think he said he wouldn't be around maybe.
Looks like DF is right. Tubesock posted "GG" exactly on the deadline, so we know he was here. Not sure why he chose to not say anything else. I'll look at the last couple pages of the Day phase again, and see if there's any reason why it matters that he stopped posting.
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On March 08 2018 08:20 Vivax wrote:
In this case it might be smart to decide who gets vigged tonight. Assuming that df is town, we can decide that he can heal someone undisclosed. While town can direct the other two medics to kill someone voting or something.
No. BAD.
If DF is a legit Town medic, and the scum manage to guess who he heals, they can heal the same target, and kill him.
And if DF is a legit Town medic, but heals a different target than the other two Town medics, then if the scum manage to roleblock one of those other two Town medics, the kill won't go off.
The 3 Town medics should all choose the same target, as that will nullify both the scum roleblocker AND the scum medic, and it's like we have a reusable Vigilante, and they have NO roles at ALL.
If I'm missing something, then someone let me know. But otherwise, this should not even be a debate.
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On March 08 2018 08:58 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Also evidently this game is NOT as easy I thought it would be
On March 08 2018 09:13 Holyflare wrote:
It is easy and you plebs switched off df.
Someone double-check me, please. But it looks to me like the only player who switched off of DF was Vivax.
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On March 08 2018 09:29 Holyflare wrote:
When Tubesock posted like halfway through the cycle a bunch of walls of texts that I glossed over and pretty much said "this says nothing and it's not towny looking" but amg insta switched and it came off as really odd timing back then. If amg is mafia it could have potentially been an "oh the guy is posting responses to me I have to look like I'm re-evaluating."
Eh. I didn't really dislike the timing of the switch so much as what just felt to me like hollow reasoning for the switch. I'll read his filter again in light of the fact that we know for sure that Tubesock was Town, but as a "quick take" AMG is a very low priority for me, and I wouldn't be wanting to see him overdosed by our medics tonight.
On March 08 2018 09:29 Holyflare wrote:
Noob just dropped tubesock for absolutely 0 reason when tube was the biggest wagon(????) and then voted his not even other scum read. Doesn't make sense. Then his defence of df looks fucking weird when he says it was a reason to town read df.
Either you misremember, or you are spreading misinformation, and there are NO other possibilities. So go look again.
Tube was absolutely not the biggest wagon, and there's a 0% chance I would have switched off the presumptive lynch and then left. Not only was Tube not in the noose at that time, but it wasn't a tie, either. DF had the vote lead.
If you read the hours leading up to the moment I said I was leaving, you'll see that there was exactly NO reason for me to think that Tubesock could wind up as the D1 lynch. None. At all. The only person to vote against Tubesock before I did (though for a very different set of reasons) was you, and you had turned your attention elsewhere, and moved your vote. The person who basically said "yeah, this" to my argument against Tubesock was AMG, and he not only moved his vote, but actually dealt Tubesock a townread! (Kudos to him on that, if AMG is Town himself.) 20 pages of me trying to pressure Tubesock resulted in there being all of TWO votes on him, at the time I left: Me and Moosy. And even me and Moosy were not making Tubesock a topic of conversation anymore, in the last few hours. Tubesock stopped responding to me, telling me pointblank that "that's all you're getting" and that wasn't helping me get any other people to put votes on him, and see if maybe they would respond to THEM instead. The discussion about Tubesock was history.
Y'all act like if I'd just left my vote on Tubesock instead of moving it to start the wagon on Kelsier, you'd have been happier! lol
But based on how things looked when I made my final post, leaving my vote on Tubesock would've been approximately as productive as leaving my vote on the Easter Bunny. That would have been poor play on my part.
Instead, I put my vote on the no-show, so that if no consensus on "who's scummy?" could be reached in the final hour, then people could use the fallback option of consolidating votes on the no-show (an option I'd already mentioned before, and an option that is pretty much "standard operating procedure" on the other website I play these games at). That's good play on my part.
On March 08 2018 09:29 Holyflare wrote:
Prplhz obviously for being hipster on tubesock.
"Being hipster" means what? Being "hip" to the fact that a push against Tubesock would be misguided? If so, sure.
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On March 08 2018 14:31 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 14:18 n00bKing wrote:On March 08 2018 07:13 Vivax wrote:On March 08 2018 07:10 n00bKing wrote:Ok, I'm off. On March 08 2018 06:32 n00bKing wrote:
Does anyone agree with HF's assessment of DF's play in other games?
Didn't see any backup on this, but to my eyes, the DF lynch doesn't thrill me. The push on Tubesock has been going for a long time, without much result, so I guess it's not happening today. ##UnvoteWould love to see this happen: ##Vote: KelsierSC Why him over prpl? ...huh? Because Kelsier was a no-show (in the game thread at least) and prpl wasn't. You act like one vs. the other is an equivalent choice. It's not. If people want to make a big deal over this, I can explain further. But I would have thought that the reasons why you lynch a literal no-show (like Kelsier or chaoser) over someone who makes a few posts and then bails for the rest of the Phase (like prpl or damdred) were fairly obvious. meh. I disagree with this. You get more information from killing someone who is a lurker from their few posts. There is always the possibility that a completely afk person continues to be afk in which case he'll be modkilled and we wouldn't have wasted anything on him.
You can't get as much information from killing someone who is low-activity as you can get from seeing what they say if they aren't DEAD. In my experience, people who are low activity usually tend to come back. And if they're Town, they can still contribute (they did show SOME interest in participating in the game after it started, at least, and they have seen SOME of what happened, as it happened) and if they're Scum, their posts will give you more opportunities to catch them. As well as more opportunities to see who they end up tied to WHILE you catch them.
Conversely, I've virtually never seen a total Day 1 no-show Town player come into the thread later, and then play like a rock star. Those players hadn't shown that interest in participating, and then by the time they come along, the thread is unwieldy, and reading filters doesn't yield context if you weren't following along at the time. Even reading the thread straight through may not yield proper context, if you aren't paying attention to timestamps the whole way too. The value to the Town of a Town player who no-showed Day 1 is LOW. But the value to the Mafia of a Mafia player who no-showed Day 1 is still HIGH. His value to his team erodes at a MUCH slower rate, and that doesn't even account for the possibility that the Mafia no-show has actually been participating in the scum thread while hiding from the game thread, in which case he's already adding utility for his team.
If Day 1 discussion yields a reasonably strong consensus of who to scumread, you always lynch that player first. If not, and there's a player with ZERO posts, you fall back on lynching him, over players who are merely low-activity. That's the way the game was taught to me, and I feel like the logic is sound. My attempts to get votes onto Tubesock *lost* ground, and then stalled altogether, as he ceased to even be a topic anymore. I didn't like lynching the counterwagon, so I went to the no-shows and picking Kelsier over chaoser made good sense to me for reasons that I hopefully don't need to repeat to you.
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On March 08 2018 14:33 n00bKing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 07:26 rsoultin wrote:
I'll openly admit that I could probably be easily fooled by a scum df (and yes blatantly ignoring the claim cause whatevs) but I'm just not finding the arguments against him compelling when his read on me developed fairly naturally I thought. There were arguments against him that I didn't find compelling either, obviously. But "ignoring the claim" is generous, because in a vacuum, it actually makes him more likely to be scum than if he'd not said it.
I don't agree. Maybe I'm not seeing something important, though.
Also you're right about the triple stack medic being smarter.
I'll try to make my AMG read more clear. As well as what I mean regarding DF's read on me since hf appears to be stuck on the 'he called you town thrice!' train.
@Moosy, I'm not sure why I'm suddenly top town to you? I effectively forced a tube lynch with my vote, and I'm really not at all sure that prp is town. Nor do i recall you townreading him?
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On March 08 2018 15:42 rsoultin wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 14:33 n00bKing wrote:On March 08 2018 07:26 rsoultin wrote:
I'll openly admit that I could probably be easily fooled by a scum df (and yes blatantly ignoring the claim cause whatevs) but I'm just not finding the arguments against him compelling when his read on me developed fairly naturally I thought. There were arguments against him that I didn't find compelling either, obviously. But "ignoring the claim" is generous, because in a vacuum, it actually makes him more likely to be scum than if he'd not said it. I don't agree. Maybe I'm not seeing something important, though.
Like so many things in Mafia games, it's all just math.
We had 10 Town players, 3 were medics. Any given Town player has a 70% chance of being Vanilla. If we're about to mislynch a Town player, there's a 70% chance he's Vanilla. I'll assume that a Vanilla under duress would not fake-claim Town medic, in this setup. 3 Town players can claim Town medic, when under duress. 3 mafia players can fake-claim Town medic, when under duress. 6 players can claim Town medic, 3 are scum (50%). Yet scum make up only 3 of the 13 players (23%).
So in a vacuum (if you disregard all other factors), when a player under duress claims Town medic, the likelihood of him being scum more than doubles. If you're going to leave him alive, you need to feel like you have reasons to townread him. You felt like you did, I felt like I did.
Vivax didn't, since he was *already* voting against DF *before* the claim that *increased* the chance of DF flipping Red. That sticks out to me in a major way, and is why I wanted to make double-sure Vivax is the only one who did it.
On March 08 2018 15:42 rsoultin wrote:
Also you're right about the triple stack medic being smarter.
*thumbs up*
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So do we want our dudes claiming medic to go first, when talking about who to overdose on N1? Do we want them to go last? Think it'd be good for them each to at least put forth one target they wouldn't mind hitting, besides each other. Since we ultimately want every *Town* medic to follow Town sentiment.
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United Kingdom30775 Posts
On March 08 2018 10:06 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 08 2018 09:51 Holyflare wrote:
Yeah, not saying it wasn't but this is mafia and when it goes against the collective thought for reasons other people struggle to see then it deserves to be looked into. That's quite literally the game. Do you know about the experiment where 2 dudes told another dude that three lines of same length were different and most of the subjects responded wrongly as a result.
Yeah, but did those subjects find it odd that that was the case, discuss it with their peers, measure and compare the results and make a better decision? Don't think so.
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Ah, I see your logic, noob. You just have more faith than I do that a vanilla town wouldn't fake claim lol.
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EPT
