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plotspot
800 Posts
1. overreaction, like ok it's NAI, but it's too wifom for it's own good, if you're town there no need to do it, ok as mafia it's still bad to wifom like this, the impression remains that it's unnecssary angry wifom 2. misrepresenting my effort as scum noodling around, putting it the worst light possible, although I'm really confused 3. being opportunistic, I don't buy all his short "whys" it's really strange ##VOTE: fecalfeast | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Geript after some noodling explains to Kelsier that he thinks this On July 18 2015 11:32 yamato77 wrote: Geript also not a terrible lynch. Neither is FF for that matter. But I'm getting ahead of myself. is short and assholey, but that yamato is even more short and assholey than this with the following post. On July 19 2015 03:30 geript wrote:How can it be not short/assholey when the point I'm making is that he's more short/assholey as town? Kelsier replies with On July 19 2015 03:38 KelsierSC wrote: right but i am curious how you read that post as anything but short or being an asshole. IMO, Kelsier misreads geripts post as geript not thinking that yamato was short/assholey. If he thinks otherwise the sentence must be “right but I am curious how you can read that post as short or being an asshole.” Geripts responds with On July 19 2015 03:48 geript wrote: Like this is basic reading comprehension. How can he get that I'm trying to say that Yam's post was not short/assholey? Like me using the word more literally means that I found the post lacking an amount of shortness/assholery that town yam levels usually are. Then he's trying to make the point that the post is short/assholey but I'm not reading it that way. Like I've been really fucking clear about this. 1. geript clearly states again that he thinks yamato’s post was short/assholey. But it would be even more if she was town. 2. geript misreads Kelsier that his post was saying “he is curious as to why geript think’s yamato’s post is short/assholey” and then sort of contradicts himself by saying “I’m not thinking yamato’s post was short/assholey.” Yeah, sort of double misread into endless argument. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
On July 20 2015 07:18 Damdred wrote: It is ok, the vindictiveness isn't that huge a deal. The killer was that Geript vote (which sorta confirms geript), his weird unexplained reads and screwing off when he was unable to,be here. I think we have one,mafia on wagon and one off though. Gut feeling it's ff and rayn. I sorta had my doubts about geript, because he is so aggressive (I mean I don't know him, if you guys have better meta and read him better then that's cool), but then to the very end I tried to figure out who could be more scum: him or Kelsier and I couldn't decide because their whole argument hinged on misunderstandings from somewhere halfway in. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
My reads were about 20 hours into the game. I said these were rough reads, I put a question mark on Jonny, I even said it's just a tone read with no meta. I didn't say I townread him hard in this, there was clearly lots of uncertainty in this read. Jonny had 2 phases of posting. In the first phase he makes 4 posts. If you read again his 4 posts and say "ok, if somebody posted like that, then 95% of the time he is mafia", then you obviously have some super skills. I tended to think "ok, jonny doesn't look clean here, but it's rather he could be town and mafia uses his posts to gather a wagon on him later" At that time, remember that the most suspicion fell on geript, he had 3 votes. I was already thinking "yea looks nice, but I don't buy it, I don't think geript is gonna get lynched". Jonny came in with his reason why he had to afk 34 hours into the game. Then suddenly I see the gears shifting starting on p18. Damdred and geript talking to each other with Damdred ever so much pushing a lynch on jonny for his weird posts. Well in retrospect we can say it was good, damdred saw jonny appearing and wants to get more info out of him. But at that time it looked to me like my thoughts are being confirmed. Votes are shifting away from geript, with Damdred casting suspicion onto jonny, trying to convince geript as well. Geript disagrees for a while, but then finally jumps to jonny too. Hence later I said there was a strong connection between Damdred and geript. Geript even earlier talks about Damdred being his mason partner,which confused me a bit as there was no mason in this game. He probably simply meant they can read each other very well, which is meta meta meta again. I had a slight townread on Damdred, but the things unfolding there would fit the theory I had in mind, especially when rayn jumps in later and they both started to scumread each other. Geript was still of the opinion that we should lynch Kelsier, while rayn hard defends him (Kelsier). At that time for me, all of the 4 Kelsier, rayn, geript and Damdred could be potentially be mafia. So till the very end I was still working on figuring out the Kel vs geript story, as I believed I could find mafia there. I also looked at the case rels had against jonny and it hinges on exactly the part that he thinks the smiley argument was directed at FF and not me. The thing is I think it is NAI at best. Anybody could have made that mistake, why is such a mistake reserved for mafia? It's too blatant and irreparable, so it doesn't really matter what jonny says afterwards in his defense. This is what he chose to say as point four of Rels case: On July 20 2015 05:43 Rels wrote: Forth When I ask Jonny to confirm that explanation, he backs off and abandon his previous explanation. + Show Spoiler + On July 20 2015 03:04 JonnyLaw wrote: oh uhh...sure I don't know what I was thinking there to be honest. I was writing a quick post before I passed out after a late night. Apparently it's what I felt at that particular moment. We can debate this one line if that's what you want but I'd rather talk about someone important. So he backpedals like a mafia? If he was town, what should he have said instead? So I thought if he was screwed anyway, regardless of being scum or town, why must he be screwed as mafia. It's NAI. --- So in summary, I had a very-soft town read on jonny with some doubts. The townreading was reinforced when my paranoid senses got fed when votes were slowly piling on jonny, like I'd rather want to believe it is more difficult than that, that the scum team does something like that, rather than jonny just being scum. The case of Rels is nice, but I thought it was NAI. I voted for fecalfeast because it was the best I could do, when I was under time-pressure and not be able to clearly identify scum in either Kelsier or geript. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
The one I believe to be most townish were you, from there I tried to established whether damdred could be mafia, but it was hard, because I actually had damdred as townish too. So I left you two like that. Then kelsier and geript. The only one that matters was probably geript, because he had still 2 votes or so. I was trying to find evidences that geript was mafia, but no I couldn't, He was here fighting all this time, and the Kel vs him was some misunderstanding. I was running out of time and I thought I'm not voting for someone I'm not certain was more scummy than ff. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
On July 18 2015 07:46 yamato77 wrote: I propose a policy lynch of plotspot On July 18 2015 08:31 yamato77 wrote: I still want to lynch plotspot. On July 18 2015 11:32 yamato77 wrote: Geript also not a terrible lynch. Neither is FF for that matter. But I'm getting ahead of myself. Then Damdred reads him slightly town. On July 18 2015 12:47 Damdred wrote: Kinda think Yamato feels town. You said afterwards On July 18 2015 16:32 raynpelikoneet wrote: Nvm yamato is town. So what I said earlier On July 19 2015 05:13 plotspot wrote: You say "yamato is town" at that moment. Is it (a) you have advanced meta or (b) you think "yamato might be town" but say "yamato is town" for undisclosed reasons? Which is it? applies to this and not to your quoted posts recently. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
On July 18 2015 18:09 yamato77 wrote: rayn could be town On July 18 2015 18:09 yamato77 wrote: damdred almost certainly is btw I also think onegu is leaning town On July 18 2015 18:18 yamato77 wrote: it's early in this game and there aren't many posts overall onegu has been fairly active early in this game, however trollish he has been On July 18 2015 18:22 yamato77 wrote: so if he plays early D1 he's mafia? it is almost certainly bad meta Then you posted this On July 18 2015 18:25 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yamato is town because there is a clarly seen thought process behind his posting. Imo his posts as mafia lack that. It's hard to explain. I'll elaborate further in case people think he is mafia when i get home in ~10h. Then damdred post this On July 19 2015 00:12 Damdred wrote: Rayn and I use the same metric for reading Yamato, and a lot of it comes from experience in playing with him For instance the somewhat pushing the policy lynch and some of his other posts just feel like he's thinking about the game a little bit at least. I can't quote atm but I'm pretty sure he is town. Then you posted this: On July 19 2015 00:46 raynpelikoneet wrote: Well yeah, Damdred put that yamato read well. Yamato will explain what he is thinking eventually. At the moment i don't care what his thought process is but i can see there being one. That is how i literally read yamato early on in the game. I am not claiming i am 100% accurate on that this early on, but i am really confident i will get his alignment right when he starts posting more and making bigger posts that actually show his thought process. And yes, so far he seems town for his posts. There is no bullshit like in scumato posts there pretty much always is more or After that I came with my list where I was wondering how you can hardread yamato town so fast after his 3 initial posts. I'm not talking about his later 4 posts, after which you provided your reasonings on town-reading yamato. --- So I'm wondering about these two phases. After 3 initial posts from yamato you say "yamato is town". Was it (a) some advanced meta or (b) you think yamato might be town, but still said he IS town because you express yourself like that. Would your explanation be any different if yamato hasn't made his 4 additional posts? So after his 3 initial posts, you would still use your explanation and the 4 additional ones didn't matter and were just coincidence? I just want to know how you townread yamato after 3 posts, without the additional 4 posts, because they are there in between your actual explanation, I cannot simply ignore them. What were the reasons you townread him after 3 posts (not after 7 posts total of yamato). Like I totally accept it if you said, yeah they wouldn't have changed my reasonings at all, it's just coincidence or reinforcements of what I think and posted as reasoning. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
On July 21 2015 03:18 raynpelikoneet wrote: The problem still stands. Damdred says he has a townread on yamato at the same time i do (only 3-4 posts in). I explain my read. yamato posts more. Damdred gives his explanation after yamato posts more (but talks about only of those 3-4 first posts). I give more of an explanation which is the same as Damdred's (as it was at first aswell). plotspot agrees with Damdred's explanation but somehow mine isn't good (while he is even townreading yamato aswell). No wait, I think we have a communication problem here, this is not how the order of things were. Let's try to get the order straight first. 1. Yamato makes 3 posts. EXACTLY 3 posts. Not 3-4 or stuff, be precise here. 2. Damdred say exactly: "Kinda think Yamato feels town". NO EXPLATION. 3. You say exactly: "Nvm Yamato is town." NO EXPLANATION. (much much later I' wondering this statement here, I don't have a problem with Damdred when he vaguely thinks yamato might be town. Yes it is the wording I have a problem with, that's why I have ask again and again whether it is (a) you have some special meta or (b) it is just your way of saying "I feel Yamato might be town here". It's a perception problem I have with someone who appears VERY FIRM about it, what's the secret to his knowledge? 4. Yamato makes exactly 4 posts. NOT 3-4 or something. Exactly 4 posts. 5. You EXPLAIN your townread on yamato. 6. Damdred EXPLAINS his townread on yamato. 7. You express your feelings that Damdred's explanation is pretty good, plus some more why you read yamato town. 8. Yamato posts some more. We should agree on this first before I go on. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
I know from my head that I should push more, ask more questions, but I don't know how to do that. I'm not good at it. I'm dying to explain to you why I can't be scum playing like this, and ok that I'm bad at this game, but I can't at the moment. Just remember this. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
Just don't be like tictock, I made so little sense as town in this one game that he made a 2000 word essay imagining every little step I planned out as mafia. It was ridiculous. Yes this is my meta. Me not making sense is not a mafia trait with my current experience in games. Maybe you want to know this, before breaking your head over the fact that I don't make sense. But I of course accept it that I cannot hide behind this forever. I will fight and try to explain things to you as best as I can. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
Like if you believe Rels made that NAI case to scumread his partner, and hopes someone spots it in time to save him, it's ridiculous. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
My first thought were Kelsier, cop or not. Ok let's just say cop, because I've witnessed 2 games where cop-claims have gotten quite messy, no need to rush things. Cop play is always strange and can always have fun turn-arounds. Since I read Onegu town, I was thinking "ok let' step back, in which circumstances could he be a redchecki if not mafia? miller, framed?" The problem was it was already pointed out by yamato and I didn’t want to repeat it. Geript also made a good point about how a game with a cop, no way the third mafia is also identifiable via a cop. It made sense to me and I thought maybe Kelsier was not the cop. All the while Onegu was getting townier by the minute. It came just down to whether people believe that he as a mafia would concede or not. And it really looked to me like if he was mafia he was ready to concede, so he couldn’t? And must be town? Miller most probably then, because being framed means there is a framer and it wouldn’t go well it geripts theory. Still obviously a framer can balance out a cop, but I have no clue about setup balances so I don’t know whether a framer balances it out better than a GF or something. So ok he is miller or could framed. Then HF feels the need to make a bluepost about it that miller is unaware; so Onegu is miller? Otherwise it would mean HF explained something that isn’t actually relevant, or it’s just because people were wondering about it and he answered it very technically. I had the feeling HF really thought about whether he should explain this. Ok, I had these thoughts and wanted to put them down in one or another form, but new post kept flying over my head. It didn't help me write an organized opinion. Meh. | ||
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
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plotspot
800 Posts
And yeah rayn, while your reasons for scumreading me are good, it’s still only because I suck as town. D1 was my genuine towngame (and some people read it like that), because I only checked my role at the beginning of N1. That’s the reason why I didn’t know whether jonny was town or mafia, and really struggled with voting for him or not. I also honestly thought FF could be mafia, well not now anymore. I was thinking scumreading him, but no it’s stupid, I won’t do that. The game you read where I had the chart thing, it was also D1 blind. I could have been mafia there too. The chart thing didn’t matter.^^. I guess Kelsier who cohosted this game with cakepie, never knew about it? I just wanted to see what you guys will post for a while, but it’s kinda dead so yeah. Sorry I wanted to make it a bit more entertaining for you guys, but I guess it’s quite settled that you will win anyway so you are rather bored by it. It’s ok. I just thought I give you guys some time to “think” about stuff some more.XD I think it was my fault, why this mafia game went to crap. I was never there D1. Jonny has 1 “hi”. Milo had one “hello” after 36 hours into D1. If they came here and say they lost motivation and didn’t see the chance to win because we lacked coordination for I was never there, I’d accept it. Hmm anything else? I thought geript was funny. Lol scumato. FF was really scummy and yet so townish in his own way, I felt sorry. Suppose I was town, I could really go on, and I think I would have failed that reaction test by Kelsier, because I tend to stay back and analyze first even as town, because we still had so much time and so much things were going on. I hope Jonny’s dog is fine, I love dogs too. Yeah, sorry if you guys felt underwhelmed by this game. Lots of stuff came together.^^ | ||
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