EPTI could /in if we start at the end of the month I think. For sure if it's the 2nd.
Also this would be my 4th game. Still newbie I believe.
I'd love to be coached in Chupazi.
Newbie Student Mafia VII
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Tubesock
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I could /in if we start at the end of the month I think. For sure if it's the 2nd. Also this would be my 4th game. Still newbie I believe. I'd love to be coached in Chupazi. | ||
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On April 10 2015 07:54 prplhz wrote: you should really just answer him and answer breshke why you are voting me Soren is looking good. Dwarf, uh not so much. Dwarf, you going to scumhunt at all? Prplhz, how do you read Half The Sky? She seems different this game from what I've seen of her in the past. Seems towny to me, but to be fair, I've only seen her in 1 scum game and I thought she was strong town then? | ||
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It's like you're making an excuse already not to. You haven't questioned anyone. I think you just don't care and already have the game figured out. Do you have any town reads, anything? | ||
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On April 10 2015 08:10 prplhz wrote: uh, townie enough for now. don't know why you're asking me about some flaky meta read you're not sure about, if you have 1 game with her then i'd advice you to mostly disregard that and just focus on what she's doing this game. That's why I was asking you. You have more experience with her. Next time, I'll just ask you your read on her. That way I can get a read on you and more insight on her. | ||
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On April 10 2015 08:16 prplhz wrote: i do? i have one game with hts and i was scum that game (so i wasn't trying that hard to read her) oh haha I'm dumb. I assumed since you're a vet that you have played more games with her. My bad. Anyway, I think she's acting towny. She's obviously learned not to enter in the game with huge "I'm TOWN" statements which gets her a lot of mud thrown her way. She seemed like she was digging a little into people which I think makes her towny. | ||
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On April 10 2015 09:04 prplhz wrote: i don't know i have a better feeling about bourneq Can you elaborate? Dwarf is looking pretty bad... This is all because he doesn't care about your post about you maybe mafia or not? | ||
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Breshke and Soren are my town reads so far. BloodyDwarf still scummy till he produces. He is boarderline too scummy to be scum but most his posts make me itch. And not in the good way. ##Vote:TheBloodyDwarf Plotspot I'm trying to read but I just don't understand a couple of his posts. Like several other people I'm wondering how he towned Prplhz so fast. I could be twitchy too since it seems in many games the mafia like to insult to convey passion or whatever (Plot calling Onegu a fucktard). | ||
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I'm more or less around if you want to chat after you catch up. | ||
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On April 10 2015 13:33 Breshke wrote: Hey tube. What do you think or prplhz? You have me and soren as town reads and we seem to disagree on him so far whats your opinion? Prplhz seems carefree and saying things to further discussion and whatnot. The problem is like HTS and Rsoultin it isn't anything that I don't think he can do as scum. I don't understand his Bourneq stuff. Or at least how it's less scummy than Postpol or bloodydwarf. He scums Bourneq for not caring about his post, but then doesn't care at all that Rsoultin said she would lynch HTS for being townie? Isn't that weird? I'd place you in the same category (can't town due to fear) but your post about BloodyDwarf I don't see can come from scum. You talked about how he is probably playing like that because of the SC2 arcade, but then say he's still scum for HTS' points. I think if you were scum you wouldn't consider him town at all. If you are scum, you're making it harder on yourself to lynch him. Hence my town read on you. Soren is digging in and following through with people more than he would need to as scum. | ||
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On April 10 2015 13:58 rsoultin wrote: mmm i guess it's possible given how little prp's done, tube, but his scum game (see titanic) is horribad...he'd have to have improved his scumgame majorly It's that bad? I didn't read Titanic. So many games so little time. Man, I have a case of vet worship or something. I think everyone is really good who's played a few games. Have any reads yet? | ||
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On April 10 2015 14:13 rsoultin wrote: strong ones? nah still not liking hts cause she didn't make me want to lynch her from the get-go, but that's kinda shit-tier you know? i just always seem to get her alignment wrong early prp is prob town onegu started more try-hard than i'm used to and i don't know what to think about it yet don't like ace's wall post to sheep bloodydwarf sentiment and say nothing about prp i have a specific towntell for you that i haven't seen yet lol hrum...those are the things that stuck out to me, really...i'm focusing on players i know first I'm batting 30% on guessing HTS alignment. Although, I think that it might be higher if I count her being a ninja in one game as not town. But yeah, I know what you mean. I think Onegu is funny. I can't tell if he thinks that him claiming VT vs town is actually significant to us or not. My first thoughts about him were why wasn't he claiming mason or miller but then forgot we are in a non tricky game. I don't know what that is called closed/open setup. He is trying harder than my past game with him. Who knows. Ace's post was a lot of absolutely nothing. Literally was, "don't kill me." I'm curious about this towntell. Let me know after you see it. Well, I'm about to pass out. Have to work in the morning. | ||
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TheBloodyDwarf: What are your reads? Who is your primary lynch target? You have some time to prove your towniness and you do have some support so it shouldn't be too difficult, you have something like 30 hours left. I'll remove my vote on you, but until you show some reads and critical thinking you are still my likely lynch. ##Unvote | ||
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On April 11 2015 01:11 Bourneq wrote: here comes my reads Stutters is extremely suspicious too me seeing he has next to no activity in the game what so ever. I am getting generaly good vibes from Breshke, he has been actively driving the conversation in reasonable directions judging by his filter. I dont like him calling dwarf lynchbait and still sticking with his vote however. Onegus attitude puzzles me. Saying he is not going to tryhard and just going to try to troll and have fun makes me think; mafia wanting to look town but his other posts have not given me mafia vibes so I am unsure here. rsoultin is annoying me with his emoticons lol. And calling people retarded is just retarded. Either tryhard mafia or not trying very hard town. Hts looks really town too me but I thinks he is one of the veterans so she could be playing a really good mafia. I would put my money on town for now. prpl is looking more and more scum to me. It was resonable to jump on me after my first few comments since they were weak but I have given my reasons and continuing with this crusade makes me belive he is scheming. I am certinatly the easiest target to harras given my inexperiance and poor response at the beginning of day 1. Plotspot is screaming scum to me but I am looking forward to what he has to say when he gets back from work or whatever his excuse was. jarjar could be mafia throwing reads about early to get in the good book but at the same time I have not seen enough from him to make any quick judgements so I would not place him in either alignment. Ace is extremely quiet and this makes me think mafia. If not mafia then a town not contributing. Either way he is high up on lynch list for me untill he makes his voice heard. Soren333 is looking very town too me. I like his resoning. I like the few posts from Tubesock but would like to hear more. I really like TBD's explenation of his behaviour but not reading the OP is really reckless and I would like fellow towns to know the rules and the pace of the game. But tbd seems as new as me at this so I will tread carefully here. Boy that took a long time to write up. As for myself I have been playing poorly even if I was scum or town. I have already posted my excuse but at least it has given me some insight into who draws what conclusion from what I have said. Some conclusions are way more reasonable than others. I agree Breshke is town. I'm missing something with the scum for waffling bit. I am towning him for that specifically, so I'd like feedback on why that could be wrong. I'm not sure about Onegu either. But I think he's worth keeping around for a couple days as he will likely do something that will town/mafia him. Rsoultin was caught as scum a few games ago because her emoticon to words ratio was too low, so this cracks me up. Now you're scumming her for too high of a ratio. Ignoring emoticons and her use of the word "retarded" don't you think she's being more productive than most in the game? She's town. Agree on HTS. She has a few town posts, but again, I'm afraid of her. Prplhz. I'm nully town. You actually brought up some good points but it is pretty tainted with OMGUS. I do think it's weird he's so tunnelled on you. Haven't decided if that's mafia motivated or not. But my next point: Why is Plotspot SCREAMING scum to you? But you're not articulating it? Stuff like that makes Prplhz think you are scum. I liked Jarjar's posts too. I've been meaning to ask him if he's still using his algorithm (something I misslynched him for in my only game with him). Ace needs to step up. His giant posts basically said nothing but "don't kill me". He's my Dwarf alternate. He has a day to bleed town. So far I'm picking from these two. I've already spoken about the rest. | ||
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On April 11 2015 01:27 rsoultin wrote: -sits on tube's head- i just said that his waffling looked townie; it was his explanation for it that didn't make much sense to me. bresh waffles a lot as town thoughts on ace? (bloody is kinda reminding me of my starkingdoms buddies lol who think they can't get any info out of anything but night actions and blue claims xP and just complain about day 1 being a crapshoot) Oh, I missed that about Breshke. So, we are 2 of the 13 that think he's town for that haha. Ace had a giant beautiful post of absolutely fluff and bunnies. I felt nice reading it and then realized he didn't actually say anything but "don't kill me". No reads no nothing. He could have written that without even reading the thread. I'm confused on your thoughts about HTS? What do you mean by Bloody Centric? and that's good? what? | ||
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I'm really confused on TheBloodyDwarf. He hasn't done a single towny thing yet. He's blatantly ignoring requests for any type of read and isn't helping town at all. I mean it's so anti-town that mafia would at least try to fake something. He's not even doing that. He like doesn't care at all, he's trying to act as scummy as possible it seems. He made some posts which made me unvote him. At that time I was thinking he was basically softclaiming Vet. I didn't want to pursue anything and I think others were thinking the same thing. It would obviously defeat the purpose of him being vet. While at work i was thinking about him a lot. It just bugged me. A vet would play towny right? The entire point is to make MAFIA shoot you. But then you also have to avoid being lynched. And he's obviously not doing that. Then my tinfoil hat deflected an alien interrogation beam. TheBloodyDwarf is Godfather. BloodyDwarf comes from SC2 mafia arcade. So it's safe to say he plays SC2. He presumeably found TL mafia from the SC2 forums. He's not dumb, he's probably the more hardcore gamer type. TL Mafia does seem like the harder core version of many versions of mafia I think. So, he's fucking smart. He's not playing poorly at all. If he is Godfather, he KNOWS the setup. He knows if there is a cop/doc/vigi/vet. The OP says mafia knows. Reread his filter, doesn't it look like he's trying to make people think he's vet? "Don't shoot me" "I hope cop/vigi are guud". Yeah, he wants to make it look like he doesn't really know the setup but is telling the cop to check him so he returns town. He then knows who the cop is and mafia get to kill him. And he is basically confirmed town who gets to live at least another day. He softs vet knowing people probably won't push him since an outed vet is sooo bad for town. He then doesn't have to act towny. But in order to get cop checked he has to act really scummy so that the cop will check him over other question marks. Holy shit this is an amazing play. My tinfoils may sound crazy and stupid but holy shit in the 3 games I've finished I nailed at least 2 scum each time. Both were the strong mafia guys (Holyflare and Geript from Carol and Joat). What other scenario explains how TheBloodyDwarf is playing? The more I think about this the more I believe. Where are the holes in my thinking? | ||
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It fucking worked. People are talking about other stuff and there is ZERO direction. Exactly what mafia wants. For sweet justice ##Vote: TheBloodyDwarf | ||
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Another possible softing to cop check: On April 10 2015 06:17 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Everybody has little scum inside them. And another: On April 10 2015 06:23 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I dont want to tell you my dirty secrets  This is more interesting. And really instigated my tinfoil. And what I REALLY need feedback on due to my overthinking at times. On April 10 2015 06:25 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I hope our cop or vigi is guud. I don't want to die :| He leaves out doc and vet. This seems to me to be the soft claim. It's retarded I know, but I think the spelling "guud" is absolutely intentional. And: Maybe overthinking, but damn..."mindgames", "guud". Like it's in the weird obvious but not obvious realm. I think he's mindfucking us. He's goddamn Godfather. On April 10 2015 16:15 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: + Show Spoiler + Looks like I have to bit explain myself. After reading this I think my posts make more sense. This is not sc2 arcade mafia. I thought day 1 is just day for chat. Nothing happens before somebody brings evidency to table. Also I didnt know its insta lynch who gets most votes. So pretty much my day1 posts mean nothing. I felt like everybody is chatting (felt for me) and then suddenly Soren333 starts replying to those chatty posts. I thought it looked really funny and he even asked questions that I answered later but before he asked again. Also I didnt know that scum means mafia. I realized scum means mafia way way later. "Everybody has little scum inside them" Isn't that just like some IRC chat? like talking to friends? Nobody trying to be serious kind of answer. Why I voted somebody? Looks like you have to vote everyday or you get kicked out of the game. (again this is not sc2 mafia..). I just voted fearing maybe I forget or don't have time to vote and admins kick me out. Why fear of death some ask? Well, I want to play this game and not to die? "I hope our cop or vigi is good". Again, I was expecting cop to give some "evidence" to table and then people discuss is that person trustful and can his claims even be possible. But that's all wrong. Looks like you make your presumption based on chat. With feels quite weird to me now but I am noob playing this mafia for the first time and some here are experts. So I have to see how this works out. So I think I have time to rethink who to vote so, ##UNVOTE Like he really really wants that cop check to bring his "evidence" to the table. Like holy shit. Plus, he has done absolutely ZERO scumhunting. He's overtly and covertly trying to get the cop check. That's his entire goal so far. | ||
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On April 11 2015 18:27 prplhz wrote: i really don't think mafia godfather would risk getting lynched. just having him alive means we can't trust green checks and that's not worth the risk giving up just so he can be in LYLO. other than that i think tbd is looking townie enough. his weird d1 and low content posting is very easily explained by that's how much people from sc2 arcade mafia plays, d1 is about saying "hi" and analysis isn't really a thing. I need this. Like it seems like such a baller play to me. It's risky as fuck right? But I can't seem to think it is actually that risky. The more I'm thinking about it, the more I'm convincing myself. Bad I know! Ugh. What's he doing that is townie? Or you saying he's just not scummy because he's playing like arcade? | ||
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In my first newbie game we had a mafia guy be so afraid of posting he had to get replaced. There are other people in many games that are either too afraid of posting, can't post or don't want to post that I think this is a viable alternative to trying to blend in and be town. pretend you're scared first time mafia. You ahve a choice. 1. Blend in, be town and post lots. 2. Overtly act scummy, so scummy that it's too scummy to be scummy and hopefully you get the cop check and become confirmed town. It requires work, but at least he would live a couple more days and can be useful if not for a little while. Longer than paralyzed in fear anyway. | ||
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On April 11 2015 18:45 prplhz wrote: okay, being weird and aloof gets you lynched. that's bad for mafia (to get lynched). what does he gain from getting checked? pretty much nothing. i agree he's done very little analysis but that's really the norm for sc2 arcade mafia players. they don't bust out mad analysis on d1 of their first game. so i'm reading him on other things such as how he defended himself. it was more of a "fuck off" than actually trying not to get lynched. i think his behavior today has been entirely consistent with what i'm expecting from sc2 arcade players. anyway, explain to me, what does he gain from getting checked? I think at the very least another day of life while town talks about it. He can get support from some of his mafiamates and survive longer. Once he is checked he at least outs the cop and mafia doesn't have to worry about the other 2 teammates being checked. His goal is to be first checked. Then hopefully if he's on the chopping block then the cop says "oh hey, I have a green check" on him and then we argue and argue. Even if we still lynch him disregarding the check, now mafia kills the cop and don't have to worry about getting red checked. That's hugely beneficial to them. Right? | ||
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On April 11 2015 18:53 prplhz wrote: this is super debatable but what isn't debatable is that sc2 arcade mafia players in a newbie game would never do this. anyway, COP SHOULDN'T OUT HIMSELF TO GIVE A GREEN CHECK. I've never played arcade mafia. Why wouldn't they ever do it? It would be pretty stupid to out himself to save a green check from lynch. Hmm. | ||
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On April 11 2015 18:57 Breshke wrote: Also tube you have to think that if he actually is godfather then your stuff about claiming vet isnt the smartest play really because the real doc/vet would absolutly CC and then who gives a fuck if he has been green checked because he still gets lynched eventually and idk how good a 1 for 1 trade is for mafia in this setup. I guess that's why I think he's only softing. He's not really claiming, but he's flirting around about it. The way it is now the real doc/vet could out themselves (don't for the love of god) and he would just fall back on the fact he never did. I really think he's trying to fish for that cop check. I also kind of wonder that if he did hardclaim, he gets CC'd and everyone argues enough that he tries to get checked first? Mafia would have both blues for his death. that's a pretty good trade. I've never rolled blue. I haven't spent much time thinking about it. It's why I'm asking for feedback now. I just can't see any other explanation for his play. | ||
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On April 11 2015 19:01 prplhz wrote: because most of what i've seen from sc2 arcade mafia players hasn't been very advanced and i consider acting scummy enough to get checked but not scummy enough to get lynched but then the day after be scummy enough to almost get lynched but still townie enough that cop would out himself to be very advanced. it seems a lot simpler for godfather to just try to be townie. in any case godfather in one of the cop setups seems to draw his worth from invalidating green checks and not from being green checked himself. Put that way, it does sound insane. I was thinking be scummy as possible with the idea that people will defend you for being too scummy to be scum. And not even go for a goldilocks level of scummy. I didn't think about the value of godfather negating green checks. | ||
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On April 11 2015 19:09 Breshke wrote: Idk like obviously this is all possible but it just feels very very unlikely. I feel like if he was advanced enough to do this he would be advanced enough to also give reads and such and i know you said you think he is faking right? but i just feel it is really really out there. Can you tell me what you think of plot and anyone else that has jumped out at you I have to admit I've been pretty obsessed with Dwarf today. I've read Plot's filter, and I don't think he looks that great. My problem with him though is that there are at least three posts where I feel I need a rosetta stone. I have no idea what he's saying. The stuff I did understand, I don't remember having any eureka moment, or a sharing a brain type moment either. So far he hasn't been useful to me at all. That's not towny. I haven't invested any energy in him though. Sorry this isn't very helpful for you. | ||
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On April 11 2015 09:10 plotspot wrote: I think the word "acceptable" is the bad boy here right? I should have written "acceptable for them, in their kind of logic, to which I can agree to a certain degree, but not nailingly sure for me". I think Dwarf is a victim because, he has to justify himself and looks helpless, but that's also because he hasn't post alot right? On April 11 2015 07:43 plotspot wrote: + Show Spoiler + whoa a post from the past.^^ How should I answer this. There is a world of mind. A world of speech and a world of action. I certainly said prplhz is town, I think his early initiative and throrough way of examination befits that of a townsperson caring for the town. about Dwarf I don't know, looks like a victim so far. Onegu? 70% town. I think the host screwed up. Everybody is town^^. Or he is lazy giving out the roles according to the order on the front page.^^ This should be easy. Man don't read anything from this, I just enjoy the game ok?^^ I mean I observe, this game it really helps to know the posting style or habit or a person. I really cringe at some conclusion about me, you are all paranoid.^^ Ok, I don't have the super reading powers. I just know that Half the Sky and Soren thinks 100% that I'm town. Make of it what you can. On April 10 2015 23:00 Half the Sky wrote: How is perceived poor play alignment indicative? IIRC you were scumreading or calling out scum behaviour based on him "playing like a fucktard?" Especially in a newbie game - yes I know Onegu is not a noob but the point still stands - how are you distinguishing between poor play and scum play? Wait. I didn't call him scum. I think you are awfully suspicious for talking like you know I'm 100% town. That's my original quote On April 10 2015 08:12 plotspot wrote: I'm considering changing my vote to Onegu. He's playing like a fucktard. But of course I'm still not sure whether it's his strategy or him inadvertently not "getting" some of the things. I only said I considered switching my vote, because he made 2 strange mistakes, like wanting a voting thread or saying I didn't explain myself to prplhz when easy checking could have confirmed I did. It was very early in the game, but why am I explaining things, isn't the uncertainty what he is obvious in the quote? These reek of covering his ass as mafia. It's pretty waffly. I think it's different than how Breshke waffled on Dwarf though. I feel like Breshke didn't actually care what people though of his waffle. Yet, this is very much defensive. | ||
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On April 11 2015 19:19 prplhz wrote: like his 100% read on me and then looks like feelers so he can change his vote from the alphabetical thing. why isn't he just changing his vote away from the alphabetical vote? it doesn't mean shit so if he thinks someone is mafia then why not vote him instead of prodding the thread like this? His 100% read on you was kinda hilarious I think. Just in the timing of it. I thought he was trolling at first. I did like how he didn't sheep you when you pushed him to (which that post I also thought was hilarious because I think the vet stuff was more to me than him). I gave him some town points for not sheeping about Bourneq. More points probably too since I didn't agree on your Bourneq read. That's probably the only town posts he has isn't it? Everything else is weird or fluff. | ||
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I don't know if I can just let go of Dwarf. Anyway, g'night. | ||
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On April 11 2015 23:45 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I dont find anybody really suspicious..  Stutters695. Checking his filter and I mostly see questions. Looks like he doesn't really have own opinion but is asking others what do they think. btw, I dont like you Tubesock, you have been chasing me from the beginning  Gah. I was hoping to be in a better place this morning. First, if you're town, I'm sorry this isn't personal. I just believe you are mafia. I think you were blue hunting like mad early day 1. I think even after being pushed and asked by everyone in the game, you still pick the easiest "scum" target. It's like you did a shortest filter check, noticed it was Ace and Stutters. Realized you can't scum Ace since no one will allow you to lynch a replacement so quickly. Thus Stutters695. No one is scummy because you don't want to bus your mates and you know everyone else is town. And now you mock and troll me. Why ? Why not a normal  or . I could definitely have used a  (chill out mang) or even a  . You went with the . Shiny glitzy white teeth big smile. No one has shiny white teeth like that without artificial treatment. How the fuck can I see that and not think you are taunting me?the mindfucking. I concede you're not making a crazy assed play. At least how I lined it out. But damn I just can't shake you're 100% mafia. I need to relax and take a break. I'll probably be back an hour or so before deadline. Town, don't do any stupid shinanny shit. Vote Dwarf or vote Plotspot. He's not looking good either. | ||
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On April 12 2015 02:29 plotspot wrote: Ok it's not so important. ^^ means lie and no ^^ means truth. It's easy. Uh. This is pretty late in the day. Has anyone done the decoder with Plot? What the what? You guys should probably jump off Plot. This is I don't even know what this is. And the rest of his recent stuff. | ||
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On April 12 2015 04:27 Half the Sky wrote: I don't have a problem with you saying this, I'm used to your tinfoil theories  But there's something I don't understand from a gameplay standpoint. (See bolded). Even if the cop, if we have a cop, checks him, how is he going to know who the cop is? How do you know the cop will out with a check esp this early in the game. I haven't played student game in awhile, checked the rules, and nothing is jumping out to me that indicates if he were scum, that he'd be getting any sort of added information this way. Am I misunderstanding you? Well, Prplhz pretty well covered this. I don't think Dwarf is doing a crazy play anymore. I originally thought that he can basically do this. 1. be weird and softclaim vet and try getting a cop check. 2. if he gets in real danger of lynch then he can hard claim vet. Town will jump off. While the real vet/doc weigh to CC or not. Then town wants to lynch him but maybe his team will talk town into letting the cop check him that night and mafia sort him out. Just like -Celestial- in that game you and I were in where you were Godfather. Plus, I just read Guardians and am a bit in awe of Toadessterns play. Anyway, I was thinking that mafia could convince the cop to check him and hopefully get a CC out of it. The cop would reveal his check and then mafia would know both blues. Prp and Breshke pointed out how that's just insane. But I'm still thinking Dwarf is mafia and the better lynch. Especially with the weirdness of whatever Plotspots is doing. | ||
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On April 12 2015 04:37 prplhz wrote: okay i tentatively don't want to lynch plotspot anyway lol can we lynch soren or stutters? Man, I really like Soren. He seems really really town to me I can't let you lynch him. You were the first to mention how you liked him. What changed? Stutters. Well, he has like 5 posts but they seem to have content and I read them and think he's at least thinking about the game. I think he's WAY more towny and useful than Dwarf or even Plotspot considering his weirdness. | ||
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On April 12 2015 05:10 Half the Sky wrote: My question to you Tube is if you don't understand what he's saying why don't you (attempt to) interpret it? Or respond to some of the things I said (and maybe others) on trying to interpret plotspot? You said you needed a "rosetta stone" device or something to understand him. How do you know he's not playing dumb? I see too much crap from his end. I didn't really try because I was trying to figure out why Dwarf is doing what Dwarf is doing. I don't think I'm a very good multitasker. Plus, a lot of you were talking about him. So, I also reading through it, seeing you're putting in effort to do it. I concentrate on Dwarf, while you guys concentrate on others. I can see how critically thinking you are and then get two reads out of it. One for you (and others) and one for who the case is on. I can't read you HTS. I thought you were so helpful to me in that game you were godfather. So, I know helpfullness isn't a town tell really. So now I'm on a different theory for town reads. It's basically how much effort you put in. A mafia will put in work enough to avoid the lynch or to get some towncred. Then can relax a bit. Mafia isn't going to put in effort to solve the game though. Long story, mostly I was thinking about Dwarf. But I also wasn't too worried about others since people were doing stuff. My current towns Breshke, Soren, Prp, Rso, Jar, and you if you were posting as a smurf or something. | ||
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On April 12 2015 05:27 Half the Sky wrote: Well that's (bolded) is pretty obvious. Even if you don't have thoughts on plot yourself, did you have any feedback on my thoughts on plot? Also you've been fear reading me. I understand why. Last I recall before this post, you said I was towny, but you were afraid of me. But you can't read me? Let's say you joined as a SmurfX this game. You played the same, I'll objectively say I would town you. Problem is, of the games I've read and you've been in, I have a 30% success rate in reading you. I'm FAR more comfortable reading Sicklucker and even ALakaslam than you. I think with you I have to wait to see you solve the game or something. I don't even know how to begin. Anyway. Let's talk Plot or Stutters. We can talk tonight about you and I. I'm not comfortable lynching Plot right now because I feel like he's trying to talk to me. I said in my tinfoil post that I love to read difficult/cryptic people. He then later towns me for some reason. And does this weird ^^ "code". So, I think he's trying to get me to read him and put in effort. WIFOM if he's buddying me? Seems like a real reach, I think he's honestly trying to get someone to dig deep into him. WIFOM for newbs from Princess Bride movie Wine in Front of Me. Great scene, google it. It's either or type of argument. Unfortunately, it's too late in the day and these things take me a longtime. | ||
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##Unvote ##Vote: Stutters695 | ||
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I had no idea what the fuck i was doing. You mentioned it when you and others shenannied onto me that game. My game play changed drastically each day. I was trying to figure out the game, and then how to get peoples attention AND then get them to listen to me. Plot is making an effort to change his play to be reconsidered. If he survives and then goes back to his old behavior then we lynch him day 2. But, I'd like to hear more from him. | ||
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On April 12 2015 05:46 Onegu wrote: So we have a scum claim and you dummies don't want to lynch the shit out of him!? Please tell me what I am missing? Or is it just that you guys are being bad. Where is your vote again? | ||
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On April 12 2015 05:53 Breshke wrote: I just woke up why are people swapping to stutters??? Basically, Plots been doing some weird weird scumclaimy play. Just in the last 3 pages. Makes me queasy and Prplhz also. I'm basically sheeping Prp. | ||
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Are you in Darwin? Plot did claim scum. And literally had 2 posts that were town. Meh. | ||
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at 12:55 TheBloodyDwarf voted Stutters695. That post only had the vote in it. His previous post was at 9:50 talking about how he loves me. For the record I buy the :D vs explanation. Buuuuuttttttt still no scumhunting....There were people around talking a couple hours prior to EoD. It was not a dead thread. Possible explanations: 1. lurking about waiting to see how the vote goes. Sees a counterwagon on Stutters and goes for it. Regardless of Stutters alignment I think Dwarf could make this vote. Now that it's 20 some hours after, I see the actual numbers and think that he probably knew what the vote count was and realized that Stutters is safe from being lynched. There were 4 minutes left, when he voted. Not much time to drop that many votes. Stutters can be town or mafia in this position. It doesn't matter. But TheBloodyDwarf sees a reason to move to him as there was a shenany. And of course I think this is a mindfuckTube game. 2. He could have legitimately realized he needed to vote and placed it. Why did he wait? Why not at 9:50 when he said his only scum read was Stutters695? Why'd he wait till 4 minutes left in the day? How aware are you guys of the deadline? I mean I will vote somewhat early if I am out and about and can potentially miss the deadline. I get it that if I KNOW I'll be around and don't have any real life things scheduled that placing that vote isn't so important. But I'll be in the thread. I would NEVER have 2 posts in 3 hours prior to deadline if I was there the entire time. Anyway, I'm going to dive Stutters deeper. I probably shouldn't scum him because he thinks 2 of my top towns are scum. | ||
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On April 12 2015 05:13 prplhz wrote: it's just like stutters has not exactly been noticable this game. then he comes in here, sees people are looking at plot, says "gonna look at plot and write something" and then he just votes him for claiming scum. seems exceedingly lazy and uninterested. no i don't think that looks natural, it looks like he's thinking "guess i'll vote for the current bandwagon for whatever reason i can find in his latest post". some people are all "he's martyring, lynch him!" but that's just bad play. dunno if it's how stutters play and i'm not going to check his database entry for any fervent anti-martyrism. Can you explain the bolded. I'm not seeing any martyism from Stutters. For the thread: What does Scum!Prplhz have to gain from shenanying off a town? Or starting a shenany? Even a useless one? | ||
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On April 13 2015 03:21 rsoultin wrote: mmm if that's true tube (i haven't double-checked yet) then yeah...last-minute votes on the counter-train would make sense from a bussing standpoint...though i'd argue that a town stutters makes that less likely just 'cause late voting draws attention, and it's not really any better than a wasted vote xP that said, i'm home! lol and yeah kinda tired honestly, so i'll stick around to talk until EoN then prob take a nap I'm missing the bussing thing everyone is so focused on. I'm saying that Dwarf could safely bus Stutters in that situation, or switch to town stutters to gain not killing town cred, or fucking with my mind so I ended up voting with my top scumreads "scum" read. | ||
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On April 13 2015 03:27 Holyflare wrote: I've not read a single thing in this game. Someone tell me some key points. Hmm. So far a lot of weird and scummy play. Plotspot basically claimed scum and was acting super weird. Had 7ish people on him. Prplhz got queasy as did I and we voted Stutters695 with 30-60minutes ish of EoD. TheBloodyDwarf hasn't done a single towny thing, yet I'm basically the only one wanting to lynch him. But, in everyones defense he's acting so scummy and useless that it is possible it's too scummy to be scum. Bleh. That's basically it. | ||
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On April 13 2015 03:49 rsoultin wrote: -sits on tube's tinfoil hat- there was something about bussing when everyone thought plot was scum? and then i think some players are talking about bussing not realizing what it is...i'm not really following completely, either honestly this speculation is cool and all but it's not gonna really get us anywhere since stutters' alignment isn't known. prob best to just stick to what makes people scummy xP that isn't reliant on stutters' alignment Ahhh that's why I'm missing it. People, you can't bus a town...mafia onto Plotspots is NOT bussing. That's called a miss lynch. Assuming you're talking to me about my speculation, my thoughts don't have anything related to what Stutters alignment is. It actually doesn't matter what his alignment is. It still makes me think Dwarf is even scummier than I did yesterday. What do you think about Stutters695? | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:00 prplhz wrote: no i'm not saying stutters is martyring. i'm saying he is voting for plotspot for martyring and that's bad play. i think i explained why somewhere. i'm saying "voting for martyrs because they martyr is bad play. maybe stutters is just a player who votes for people who martyrs even though voting for people who martyr is a bad thing to do. i could go into his database entry and check out if stutters is a player who votes for martyrs for martyring but i'm not going to." ah ok. Yeah I totally agree. I don't particularly like martyrdom. | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:02 rsoultin wrote: eh, tiny filter, like some of the analysis and the 4 scumreads test thing lol...i don't really think that the vote 15 hours after saying he'd look into plot after plot claimed scum is actually significant? like it could be opportunistic or just stutters' voting a scumread who claimed scum -shrugs- i dunnae i think there's more likely mafia than him, dwarf included. you still think dwarf is godfather trying to be cop-checked? I do think that stutters saw the scumclaim and was like, why bother wasting any more effort. I can't help it I do kinda think that Dwarf is Godfather. While instead of a huge likelyhood of it, now it's fairly a minor possibility. Prp and Bresh's points were solid. It's insanity. But I can't shake he's mafia. | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:07 prplhz wrote: what? that's not what i'm saying at all. Uh I thought you said Stutters voted Plot for martying. I dont' think that's the entire reason but I'm sure it's part of it. Although I think it's more he scum claimed. You're saying voting someone for martying is bad play right? I agree. I also don't like martyrdoming. I think it's bad play to vote someone for it and to do it. It's a less asshole thing to do than modkilling yourself. | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:16 prplhz wrote: hmm okay then. claiming scum and martyring is the same though. and stutters voted plot because plot claimed scum. even if claiming scum and martyring isn't the same then it's the same for the purpose of the argument i'm making (that voting some for martyring/claiming scum is bad play) I think we are on the same page here. I followed you to Stutters. I wanted Plot to stay alive to figure out what he was doing. It didn't look like a scum play to me from him. It looked like him trying to get peoples attention to have them look deeper into him and talk with him. His whole ^^ stuff that was a breadcrumb thing he tried to explain with that post saying ^^ is a lie but no ^^ means it's truth or whatever. This isn't remotely saying I thought he was town. I just wanted more time on him. He was basically doing exactly what I did in Carol when I was town and first time mafia player. | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:29 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Btw, what bussing means? and EoD? Bussing is like safe vote that doesn't change anymore who is going to get lynched? or? Bussing is when a mafia team mate cases and/or votes another teammate. Typically it's when mafia thinks one mafia is crap and uses it to show they are towny since they caught mafia. It's so prevalent now that it's turned into WIFOM from me. I've read a game where Vivax actually shot his mafiamate and claimed vig to get confirmed. Sicklucker in Guardians orbed his mafia mate to death and was confirmed town for it. EoD is End of Day. WIFOM is wine in front of me. Princess Bride movie scene. Google it it's great. | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:31 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I saw something else EoR, Eo(x) something. Im not able to find that anymore. Is that just typo or is there something else that starts with Eo? End of Night | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:34 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Yes, I just though that when I was in WC :D Yes im stupid haha no no you are not. I have to say I really like playing with you. I think no matter what you flip, I'm going to learn a lot from this game because of you. So, I have to thank you. | ||
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Town Soren / Holyflare Breshke Prplhz Rsoultin Half the Sky Jarjarbinks The Shining - I was thinking of having him in the nulls but it would essentially be a policy null. Ace was useless. I like Shining. Plus he likes my thoughts on Dwarf so there's that. Nulls Onegu - hasn't done a lot. Waiting on his Rsoultin case Stutters695 - I see posts in his filter I like. Some I'm eh ok. I have a hard time towning him when he scums Breshke and Prplhz. I plan on rereading Breshke and Prplhz more to see if I think Stutters points are reasonable. Anyway, focusing on him Day 2. Also thinking about Prplhz's assessment of him. Bourneq - Got a lot of flack from Prplhz at the very beginning. I gave him a couple slight townpoints for something but that was basically it. Don't remember anything else about him. Mafia TheBloodyDwarf - duh! | ||
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On April 13 2015 04:55 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: 1 hour to day. Hype!?!?       Tubesock, can you read to meaning of this post? haha, I'm sure I can find something. Other than you are in fact hilarious. You still haven't done a single thing to help town...When does arcade mafia start gaining information? Like when do those games really start? | ||
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On April 13 2015 05:16 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: But everyone was liking Stutters before I found him suspicious. I dont get any points for that?Arcade mafia is not based to chat so much as this one. If there is 15 players, usually max 2-3 are citizens (town vanilla), others have some kind of cool job :D D2 is when game starts but D3 is where really starts happening so much. If Stutters695 is mafia then yes you'd get points. I don't think you would bus him like that. You were probably one of the first to scum him. I scummed you for it too! haha. Somehow, I think that my theory is more likely than a mafia dwarf would bus Stutters. You're not stupid, you wouldn't bring this much attention to yourself AND point out one of your mafia mates for no reason. That's tinfoil lined shoes insane. | ||
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On April 13 2015 05:27 Holyflare wrote: Oh am I universally town read? No. I think Prphlz and someone else scum you. Some of the other question marks haven't weighed in on Soren/you yet. | ||
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Then we get this. On April 12 2015 02:22 Tubesock wrote: Town, don't do any stupid shinanny shit. Vote Dwarf or vote Plotspot. He's not looking good either. Now wait a minute - here's the kicker - this comes RIGHT after prplhz calls attention to lynching Soren or Stutters On April 12 2015 05:13 Tubesock wrote: Stutters. Well, he has like 5 posts but they seem to have content and I read them and think he's at least thinking about the game. I think he's WAY more towny and useful than Dwarf or even Plotspot considering his weirdness. So this tells me that Tube is townreading Stutters. So HTS, you are trying to sell that nothing happened in the 3 hours that transpired in between my two posts? And that my posts that followed I wasn't thinking about the game to figure it out? Also, that I'm going to totally marry myself to a read based on "5 posts but they seem to have content and I read them and think he's at least thinking about the game." You're suggesting that I would use sheeping as a reason to go onto your scumread to gain towncred. That essentially I would bus a mafiamate to gain the cred of SHEEPING a townread. How long would that towncred last? The I'm not seeing the risk reward for this if I were mafia. If you are really hung up on the rosetta stone thing I will find the specific quotes I was talking about. | ||
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On April 10 2015 09:43 plotspot wrote: So If I say I like the people I like to win regardless whether they are mafia or town, what would you guys be able to read? On April 10 2015 09:20 plotspot wrote: This is kinda like a bondage game. Certain sure-fires signs have to be make to appeal to reality. Arghh help I knocked on the bed 3 times. haha These. Why didn't I ask him to explain? Well, I don't think the explanation would really help me either way. I think he says he likes competitive people. Is that alignment indicative? Do I really care? How does knowing these sentences make any difference? What is clear, is that neither post is trying to solve the game nor visibly scumhunt. Why bother when I have plenty of other posts to look at? I just reread his filter again and I don't see any scumhunting. I thought his behavior was interesting enough to keep around another day. Was he town? Not while he was alive. | ||
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On April 13 2015 13:51 jarjarbinks wrote: I started it, im super behind on my reads sheet so I tried to go with whoever it appeared were each persons top 3 scum. It has a lot of issues with is but in general there were some people who weren't being scummed much and some people who were being towned a ton. People who weren't on top town or top scum the most: Onegu HTS JJB Tube People who were top 3 town most: Prp Tube Bresh JJB Granted, this analysis has flaws. And note I AM ON BOTH, so if anything it I'm showing that I am not altering the analysis AT ALL. I think if I had my reads stuff updated this would be better, and there was a few people that it was hard to tell who their top scum/town were while others it was easier to ascertain. You are leaving out percentages! Am I at 89% or 90%? Haha sorry I thought I was really funny and didn't realize I was being a dick during that game. Sorry I murdered you. How do I use this information? | ||
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On April 13 2015 14:07 rsoultin wrote: uhhh i meant...maybe i got the options mixed up? we can both be idiots lol >< i don't know what your lists mean or what conclusion you've drawn from them, is what i'm trying to say yo tube what about my case on hts? I'm going to need some time to digest that. I read it, but I'm also kinda irritated she's trying to fling scum on me for doing the same thing she did. I think I was very clear on why I switched. I need to make sure I'm not just OMGUSing her. | ||
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On April 12 2015 04:55 Half the Sky wrote: One read from Dwarf, and this is pretty much it. Then again all I remember from Stutters IS questions. Hmmm. Talks a couple times about Stutters. Then: On April 12 2015 05:35 Half the Sky wrote: Oh shit....just read Stutters' filter now, and I see where both Dwarf and prplhz are coming from. His posts aren't exactly driving discussion. Also I looked at the timestamps of when Stutters said he'll look into plotspot and when he voted him. 15 hours and change. So my previous possibility of "being in the middle of analysis" is off the table. 2 minutes after that Prplhz vovtes Stutters says he's going for a run. Later he says he thought HTS was going to take up the banner. "Oh shit..." implies surprise and epiphany type emotion doesn't it? HTS says something about Dwarf's point on Stutters and she disagrees with the Stutter's Breshke read. I also vote Stutters. It's all in the same minute; 22 minutes from deadline. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/480171-newbie-student-mafia-vii?page=45#894 Continuing reading from that link, it can't be possible that she gave Stutters695 any deep real analysis. She did continue to case Postplot. She was still asking me stuff about Dwarf. I think it looks like she's contemplating him. She does make another big case post on Postplot that lands at 7 minutes prior to deadline. She's really thinking about Stutters AND building a fairly big post on Postplot??? Then she "pushes" Stutters in 3 posts all within 5 minutes of deadline. Can someone tell me how this makes sense as town? My problems is why would mafiaHTS basically start a wagon off town? But then she still pushed the original wagon? I read her cases and I think some of them are contrived. In the JoaT game she was ninja. I scummed and cased her HARD for her actions prior to the town lynch of Sicklucker. I kind of caught her? She was 3P (third party) and NotTown. I'm feeling the same thing here (nottown). She was caught up on why Dwarf said something 3 times like it makes him scummy but not the other half billion things he was doing that was scummy. She has mentioned how "not having new" ideas is scummy. I think in that bringing up past 3 times thing is her way of bringing "new" information. Trying to look towny. Her other stuff is just nitpicky. It's not the motivation behind her targets actions it's the inconsistencies of it. Well, town can be inconsistent. It happens. It's all about motivation. Add in Rsoultin's case and interactions. Prplhz's arguments. Yeaaaaaah. She's mafia. ##Vote: Half the Sky | ||
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On April 13 2015 09:15 rsoultin wrote: like, if she honestly doesn't care which gets lynched and thinks they're both scum, yet alone is questioning whether or not stutters is bussing, i don't see why she doesn't just stay on plot. from a townie perspective it doesn't make much sense says she doesn't like both, wonders aloud if stutters is bussing, concludes he isn't cause he's a vet, then switches to him too late? lol >< Add in where she talks about how bussing has been popular lately too... On April 10 2015 09:48 Half the Sky wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 10 2015 09:40 Bourneq wrote: Whats with the scumread on me? And prplhz is trying to lynch me so why do you think we are both scum? Before I AFKed, I didn't like your paralysis. I know you are extremely new to mafia (and I took this into account) so I tried to work with you on why you didn't think prp's comment drew no emotion. The "forum context" response I could not tell whether it was sarcasm or intentional evasion so I further questioned you and I get this: On April 10 2015 06:33 Bourneq wrote: It did not make me think anything. Now that you ask it seems he is at least trying to start a discussion. The problem I have with this is you are telling me what he is doing and not so much how it makes you feel as far his alignment is concerned. I realise maybe I'm hard to understand at times - not a native speaker here either - so I'm trying to spell things out as much as I can. Bussing has been a thing in D1 amongst scumteams lately. It's possible you both are scum. So, she earlier says bussing is popular lately. and the next time she mentions bus is to justify switching. Uuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh | ||
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After spending several hours casing the other partner. | ||
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On April 14 2015 01:03 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: My top town pick would be Tubesock. He is going way over the top hunting me so he is not likely to be mafia. Am I some kind of threat to mafia? I haven't done almost anything. Except... Tinfoil hat mode online He is doing this on purpose. He makes himself look like town with this but in reality he is part of the mafia. That's thing to remember. Also, I think HtS said she has played before with Tubesock and saw his tinfoil hat theories. If Tubesock was town that time and now he is mafia, its great way to do again that to act like town My top scum/(most likely to be) is Stutters695. My earlier post is still valid. I just find him suspicious. This is your first (maybe 2nd) towny post of the game. He's showing paranoia and that he's at least thinking about one person. Albeit his accuser. It does make me think why he hasn't attacked me with personal insults like usually what happens to me. See my filter in Carol and JoaT for reactions. Although, it was a day and a half ago or so and it might just have taken him this long to generate a reason to point suspicion. And of course mindfucking. Dwarf responded with golf claps and another post where I thought he was trolling and mocking me . Now he submits a tinfoil on me. First glance I just laughed. Like he's hilarious I really like him. tinfoiling the tinfoiler is hilarious! Now is he trolling or teasing? Both? Are they the same? I still don't see scumhunting or solving the game but he's at least making me laugh.As far as the tinfoil theory. If I rolled mafia I think I could try that. I would have to keep up the pace. I don't think I could fabricate enough tinfoils to maintain activity levels. I would think tinfoiling marries you to putting in lots of effort and if you drop off it's very visible. Much easier to just do pushes or something enough to avoid being lynched and/or a couple townreads. Safer too. | ||
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Why did you vote Plotspot? I am not seeing it in your filter. I'm only really seeing your case on Prplhz and a fairly big listpost I already responded to. There was some confusion though in one of your answers talking about OMGUS. I said I thought you were OMGUSing Prplhz a bit and why I wasn't really considering your case on him. (Plus, I think I was townleaning on him at the time). Can you elaborate? Where are you? You haven't posted since the Plot lynch. | ||
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Do you still have 4 (now 3 I suppose) people you would like to see hang? I assume Prp, but do you still want to hang Breshke? I'm not finding the last one in your filter. | ||
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On April 14 2015 05:03 Stutters695 wrote: I would disagree with that being an answer. Anyways, until I think of a better way to word that what do you think about prpl? Are you being serious about asking Trfel why he changed his "scum read" on his slot he replaced into? I'm missing something. | ||
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Prplhz, what's your current read on Dwarf? | ||
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He set his vote shortly after that. He forgot to change it (drugs presumably) | ||
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On April 14 2015 08:41 prplhz wrote: dwarf is probably town and there's a ton of people i'll lynch before him. i didn't drop you stutters? lol? So no change? We're halfway through Day 2. Has he done anything towny? Who are the ton you'd lynch before him? aside from what Bourneq and Stutters? | ||
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On April 14 2015 08:59 prplhz wrote: i am giving you pause to actually play the game. if you're town you had a 1 page lazy disinterested filter on d1. come d2 i say "i might not be right so i'll give you pause to actually start playing". there's nothing to interact with you about as i don't believe you've actually done anything yet. the interaction you want is "tell me the things you saw in my filter that you expect me to do if i'm scum and the things you expect me to do if i'm town" and that's not happening for obvious reasons. Prp, when are you going to reevaluate Dwarf? When does he need to actually start playing this game if he's town? | ||
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Trfel said he still wasn't caught up. I think he's only to the end of the Day 1? He's looking pretty towny though. Course, he could be doing this as scum to solidify his entrance but that seems like a lot of work. | ||
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I'm sorry I voted you. I'm agreeing more and more with your case. I'm starting to think he was setting up some chaos for the next day on anyone who shenanied with him. At first I thought it was HtS making the play, but she's looking towny for that deep analysis she's been doing (and presumeably continuing to do) | ||
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On April 14 2015 12:32 Breshke wrote: Yeah i thought i was misreading I agree i like trefels analysis (maybe partly because he kind of agrees with me on HTS). Who do you want to lynch currently tube is it still HTS? ##Unvote Well, I can still lynch Dwarf. I'm thinking about Prplhz. I don't understand why he's so hard defending him. Well, I mean I see his reasons. But why were Plot and Bourneq any different? Or Stutters prior to his Prp case? My tinfoil is saying that he set up the shenany to set up a mlynch the next day. It's pretty easy to see that EoD weirdness will get a lot of talk. We've done nothing but scum random people all for the same reasons. | ||
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I assume Dwarf isn't your top town anymore right? Who is? Who are the ton you'd lynch? | ||
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On April 14 2015 12:53 Trfel wrote: I'm pretty confident that prplhz is town here. I've read Stutters695's arguments (or at least, the posts that I believe he is referring to) and I don't find them to be all that convincing. He's being forceful, active, and his reads have generally been good. I don't normally see all three of these traits at once from a town prplhz, so I doubt even more that he would play like this as mafia. I can demonstrate this if necessary, but at this time I don't think that it is necessary. And prplhz can speak for himself. I can see those three things being true enough. What exactly is he being forceful about aside from protecting Dwarf though? I don't think you can say he was that forceful on Plotspot since it didn't take much of any force for people to attack him. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:06 Trfel wrote: Prplhz has been an active participant in the town throughout Day 1. He started out by voting Bourneq and townreading Soren333. Also, prplhz was one of the main people trying to get off of the plotspot wagon, which certainly wasn't a mainstream idea when he started suggesting it. I realize that the way he did so can be considered sheeping, and isn't being particularly independent, but if you look at how he does it, he is consistent between his play and his words. Uh, I think he was first to mention getting off Plot and it was a bad lynch. It was around 2 hoursish before lynch. I know, we talked about Plot for a little bit when I arrived after I had breakfast. I don't think he would have switched unless HtS or I went with him. I think he was visibly getting support. I think you can do that as town just as likely as mafia. He wasn't sheeping though. No way. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:10 Trfel wrote: I agree that The Shining/Ace1312's slot doesn't look very good, but that's mostly for activity. I'm ignoring it for now. At the same time, I almost wonder if he could have an easier time jumping into the thread if he is scum? Scum replacements don't really have to read the thread, they can sort of make stuff up and hope to get by. Especially in a newbie game. Obviously that isn't a very effective way to play, but many people claim to play scum without reading the thread. I don't think I agree with this at all. People are asking you stuff since you're here. If he showed up people will be asking him stuff too. In my 2nd game a newbie (I don't remember the name of it, but you were nightkilled N1 trfel in it) There was a replacement scum Scott1313371234123541235 for Gumdrops. Gum made 2 posts and was replaced. Scott's entrance was a thread sentiment list post with nice little links to the post for each player that expressed his read. He HAD to show us he read the thread and was eventually caught up. He would have died right then. Same with you, you HAVE to show you've read town or mafia. Like, you get leeway but not a pardon. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:15 rsoultin wrote: lol >< true i know i don't cause i'd get caught in a new york minute but lol he replaced in before EoD though so i mean, at some point that excuse stops being valid i brought it up less because of the afk bit and more because while bourne is being discussed, shining isn't, which i find odd. plus lol you can't really argue that his post today was...i mean, what's even the point of posting? I'm queasy on Prplhz right now. Do you really think that he can't act like he is this game as scum? | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:21 rsoultin wrote: xP that doesn't tell me what you think about shining lol and whether you agree or not, some players don't read the thread as scum, or at least claim they don't. whether it's good play or not doesn't really matter? unless this argument has any bearing on shining's alignment i don't see why we're discussing it again -_- ha forgot that part. I liked the little content he had, but yeah why hasn't he produced like he said he would? How long do we give these lurker players to be town? Why does it feel like town is just eating town right now? If we are going to lynch a lurker type player, I want to kill Dwarf. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:23 Trfel wrote: I mean, everyone makes errors. And no one can remember every detail, most players forget most of the details. My point is that, you know who scum is, and you have scum teammates in the scum QT who can help you. They can tell you the thread sentiment, who the main town players are, who they are currently pushing, etc. Like, I imagine that they could basically tell you where your reads should be at the start of the game with basic reasons for each one, and then that could be posted without having carefully read the thread at all. Clearly he can't admit to not have read the thread (or tried to) here, but I do think he could fake it (this doesn't work if someone analyzes him really well, but good analysis is hard to do). A town replacement is under pressure to produce content just as much as a scum replacement is. The Shining's inactivity is definitely scummy, but I would still expect the scum team to give him some kind of ground to stand on (unless they're giving him up for dead, or they aren't very competent, or my analysis of how scum teams should work is completely wrong). That makes sense. He can be spoonfed the answers. Should have thought of that. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:26 rsoultin wrote: lol tbh i've seen him play scum once, so if he was just exceptionally bad that game my opinion is completely skewed, however he looks townie separate of the meta, too. i've already mentioned how he took the lead on the thread, his questions were pointed, his reads have been fluid throughout the game... like i see the arguments but i don't see why they make him scum? so he decided not to lynch plot for acting "weird" and he's always maintained that he doesn't want to lynch dwarf for acting weird...at least he's consistent? what's making you queasy? It's dumb. I have trouble with hypocriticalness sometimes but theres times I'll be hypocritical. I don't see what's so different from Dwarfs play and Plots. Prp towned Dwarf right away, but was on Plot hard from the git go and didn't start questioning it till about 4 hours or so prior to end of day when he had 7 votes or so. but they were in many ways playing the same. Same with Bourneq, scummed him hard fro mthe get go and floated it out there earlier today to lynch Bourneq. Prp also essentially said that even if Dwarf does nothing new he will still be towned. I understand a day or 2 pass even but uh the game? | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:28 jarjarbinks wrote: + Show Spoiler + Ugh this day got away from me xD taxes are evil. Also, HTS might not be that evil, questions for HTS: 1. Who is your top scum target? Bourneq? Onegu? Tube? Stutters? If you say Onegu we have a problem. Granted, I think #2 on your case might be viable, but I think you blew that case out of proportion. If you don't mind putting out a top 2 or something that would help me understand where you stand? Since EOD happens before I return from work I'm going to put up a tier list and a vote right now. List: lower you are the scummier I think you are even in categories IF I had to say you were town: Breshke- not most vocal but reads are pretty good and I liked D2 play. Townleans Stutters- Still think he's town. If HTS clears her name and PRP gets more towny I'm completely wrong... Trf/Onegu- Onegu was on drugs + funny. HTS's case on him was good, but it didn't convince me he's scum. Trf seems like superTrf like my last game with him. Rso- Didn't dominate D1. Did more D2. Interactions with her didn't draw red flags, but she could fool me in a heartbeat Unlynchables Shining- Ace was questionable. Shining's gone. Excuse? Idk. Literal null for me prob. We shall see. Tube- On Stutter wagon (lolz) and seemed to be TR or not read much. And he dissed the list. Tinfoil tunnel seemed genuine though. And HTS's case on him was weakest by far. + Show Spoiler + Bourneq- I didn't get much chance to go through him, but HTS's case on him I thought was her strongest. Especially the policy over the hard scumread. Plus he's the guy I keep forgetting is playing. HTS- unless her top two scumreads strikes a nerve I don't want to lynch. Some pretty good analysis and I liked the D1 analysis more as I went through it. I could see how her EOD story is believable, just not sure to believe it or not... Lynchables Dwarf- Scummy D1 play + on Stutter train + earlier case I posted + 0 scumhunting + policy + no real danger of lynched? Prp- I wish I got to this. If I magically have free time tomorrow I will make a case. If not pretend I did and check him. Red flag + worse filter than HTS + earlier case I posted + on my list for most TR ##vote: Prp I dissed the list? | ||
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I just have weird bad feelings. I just think with like 5 lurkers about how angry I'm going to be if we have 3 lurker mafias who thought Soren was the towniest player so NK his slot but HF enters and the rest of us are like "holy shit obviously a vet is on the mafia team!" I missed it, you voting Shining? | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:45 jarjarbinks wrote: First line: HILARIOUS. I literally laughed. It was great. "How do i use this information?" ITS A TOOL! USE IT! you might as well have said, this list serves no point to nobody lol Ahhh well I didn't mean that I just didn't know how I was going to apply that. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:47 Trfel wrote: Yeah, sorry, the night kill doesn't really suggest this at all. Remember, this is a newbie game. Uh that was my point. sometime in the thread multiple people said that HF was NK'd which meant there's a vet on the scum team. I will admit I also think there's a vet on the mafia team but that has just as much to do with RNG probablilites as it does HF dying. It's just as easy that there are 3 vets on the mafia team too but we do have a bunch of lurkers. Anyway, what do you think about Dwarf? If you said something about it I missed it. | ||
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On April 14 2015 13:51 rsoultin wrote: nah, ise being mysterious! (see prp now you have to townread me xP) if you put a gun to my head and said pick your lurker lynch, though, i think shining has a higher probability of flipping scum than bourneq (based mostly on the townie posts i posted earlier) and dwarf (i don't get the hard townread really, but i do still get that floundering newbie feel from him lol ><) shining just...okay it always bugs me when people promise things then don't deliver, plus i know for a fact being lurkery is part of how he plays scum. like the difference between the newbie games i played with him (i can look up the numbers if you want them) and student V where he was scum was pretty much night and day lol >< outside the lurkers, still weighing half-the-sky and bresh honestly...his day 1 was pretty damn good and maybe it's just cause he kept disagreeing with me lol >< but it just seems like he hasn't brought much to day 2 at all beyond that, stutters' close-to-the-vest play is getting less interesting and more aggravating (in b4 this becomes about the potential blue soft), again probably because the one thing he's really pushing (prp) i don't agree with >< I really like Breshke. I do have a soft spot for people who are nice to me and tell me I'm wrong. And I think when he does tell me I'm wrong, he explains it in ways that I think he's considering what I said. But that being said, I've never read/obs/played in a game where there wasn't at least 1 mafia who I knew was town. I really like Shinings entrance and had flashbacks of our game with him in it. He started really slow but by the end of the game he was shining! haha, but ugh it is irritating he promised and hasn't delivered anything. | ||
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##Unvote ##Vote: TheBloodyDwarf I can't vote for Prplhz or Stutters695. Not today anyway. | ||
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On April 14 2015 21:48 Bourneq wrote: Good afternoon! Ill start with me "jumping to reads". My feelings on dwarf day 1 "I really like TBD's explenation of his behaviour but not reading the OP is really reckless and I would like fellow towns to know the rules and the pace of the game. But tbd seems as new as me at this so I will tread carefully here." Basicly I thought I should give TBD some time to give reads and get into the game before I jumped to a conclusion. Next up was Ace because he had not said a word all game. Since I did not have much to go on so early in the game I was concidering making a policy lynch. So when asked if I had to cast my vote right now who would I cast it on I said Ace. There was still plenty of time left of d1 so I was almost certain I would never acctualy cast that vote. As d1 went on and I got to read the cases against plotspot and my own personal reads of him I felt plotspot was the correct lynch. I had been keeping "my options open" because I did not feel I had very strong reads but that my strongest read was on plot. That was my first ever day of mafia so I would be a fool to trust my very first reads to much. So to answer "2 Was queried multiple times on the read switches from plotspot to TBD to Ace (who would be policy) to plotspot. Gives an answer to prplhz saying that TBD was most likely scum. " I am not sure what you meant by "read switches". Early on in the day I was getting bad vibes from tbd who was acting pretty suspicious to me. But it was early on in the day so I was going to give him time to redeem himself. He did not do much of anything for the rest of the day while plotspot was making a very bad case for himself and I thought that my reads on him were stronger than thoose I had on tbd. Somewhere in the middle of d1 I am asked who I would vote on if I had to vote that very second. I answered Ace because I did not feel enough information had surfaced on anybody so a policy lynch would be in good order. First, I'm glad you're voting Dwarf. Second, the way I read your list post you basically scummed everysingle person on that list except for Breshke. Later you said you only have 2 scums...Can you update please? | ||
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At least Shining has done something. | ||
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On April 15 2015 01:33 Trfel wrote: TheBloodyDwarf + Show Spoiler + On April 10 2015 16:15 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: I feel that this is a key post from TheBloodyDwarf. After a long series of rules misunderstandings and not really adjusting to the game properly, TheBloodyDwarf states (in bold) that this is a different game than SC2 arcade mafia. Because of this post, I am willing to forgive him his previous errors. And from this point out, I expect to see him attempting to play the game in the forum mafia style, instead of the SC2 arcade mafia style. But I don't see him following through with this.Looks like I have to bit explain myself. After reading this I think my posts make more sense. This is not sc2 arcade mafia. I thought day 1 is just day for chat. Nothing happens before somebody brings evidency to table. Also I didnt know its insta lynch who gets most votes. So pretty much my day1 posts mean nothing. I felt like everybody is chatting (felt for me) and then suddenly Soren333 starts replying to those chatty posts. I thought it looked really funny and he even asked questions that I answered later but before he asked again. Also I didnt know that scum means mafia. I realized scum means mafia way way later. "Everybody has little scum inside them" Isn't that just like some IRC chat? like talking to friends? Nobody trying to be serious kind of answer. Why I voted somebody? Looks like you have to vote everyday or you get kicked out of the game. (again this is not sc2 mafia..). I just voted fearing maybe I forget or don't have time to vote and admins kick me out. Why fear of death some ask? Well, I want to play this game and not to die? "I hope our cop or vigi is good". Again, I was expecting cop to give some "evidence" to table and then people discuss is that person trustful and can his claims even be possible. But that's all wrong. Looks like you make your presumption based on chat. With feels quite weird to me now but I am noob playing this mafia for the first time and some here are experts. So I have to see how this works out. So I think I have time to rethink who to vote so, ##UNVOTE On April 10 2015 16:20 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: This is one read that he provides, he says that he liked prplhz the least by the time he voted for him.^^^And I voted for guy who I least liked so far^^^ On April 11 2015 20:12 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Back to the point. Call my blind but I just don't see anything really suspicious. I was going to vote for Ace but now he is gone. Soren is bit weird tho. He comes to thread with fireguns bangging and then goes silent for moment. But nothing special. Also Stutters is really quiet. On April 11 2015 23:45 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: TheBloodyDwarf also provides these two posts before End of Day, which actually provide sufficient explanation for his late vote on Stutters695.I dont find anybody really suspicious.. Stutters695. Checking his filter and I mostly see questions. Looks like he doesn't really have own opinion but is asking others what do they think. btw, I dont like you Tubesock, you have been chasing me from the beginning There's really no reason to go either way on him. Since the post I first mentioned, his play has changed. I can see him as a new player who simply is having trouble finding suspicious things. However, outside of a possible toneread, I see no reason to townread him either, as he hasn't done anything amazing. I can easily see TheBloodyDwarf being either alignment, so I don't really want to lynch him today. The most suspicious thing about him is really his inactivity, he hasn't shared any reads at all since Day 1. But that isn't really alignment indicative. He might need to be policy lynched eventually, but I see more reason to lynch The Shining, at least (if not others as well). You won't policy him now? When is a good time for that? MYLO????? | ||
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On April 15 2015 02:11 Half the Sky wrote: If I recall right, you're townreading Tube. Now focus on the bolded. Tube had discussed a theory where if a scum prp knew that Stutters was town and Stutters has the potential to be town given his conviction on prp, what is the likelihood of a scum prp wanting to counterwagon on Stutters to set up a possible mislynch? Now I'll admit I'm a little biased here because following this he tried to pin blame on me for switching off plotspot, but it was he who led that charge. If you think Stutters' case is valid (or at least the presentation is a town trait) do you think there's credence to the possibility that prp is doing what Tube thinks he's trying to do by counterwagoning? Does the bolded look at all opportunistic? That's what I'm driving at. If you think I've missed something, quote it. I'm rescinding my theory. First, I don't think you're mafia now. Secondly, though I'm having troubles with Prp leading the charge off because there really isn't a good enough risk/reward (Trfel's point). Same goes for you. It's too risky and for basically no reason. Prp can be scum but I don't think he can be scum for this anymore. | ||
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On April 15 2015 02:38 Stutters695 wrote: + Show Spoiler [about Prplhz] + On April 15 2015 01:15 Trfel wrote: It's relative.... Someone like Holyflare is probably the most aggressive. He'll see one post and hard push that player with apparent 100% confidence. Prplhz isn't a player like that. From reading the thread, the impression that I got was that prplhz was leading and driving things along for most of Day 1. His exact tone and wording isn't always very forceful, but when you look at the ideas that he presents, you can see it. For example, here is the way he treated the vote switch to Stutters695 on Day 1. Most people consider this progression suspicious. Here is the first post he makes. I believe that he is the first player to suggest leaving the plotspot lynch (I'm not going to go back tons of pages to double check, but he is at least one of the first). At this point, the vote count was very heavily in favor of lynching plotspot (7 on plotspot, 0 on Stutters695). I know that the way he phrases it is a request, but this also makes some sense, since without the support of others he can't actually change the lynch. At this time, Half the Sky is the only person in the thread, and she refuses to switch, so prplhz drops it. Prplhz also posts his explanation for why he would prefer to lynch Stutters695 over plotspot, and the way he arrived at this read feels towny enough (though that's an issue for another day). At this point, I would be suspicious of prplhz. Asking one person to switch and then not doing anything when they don't switch isn't very impressive (still something town does all the time, but isn't a very good play). But then Tubesock comes back, and says that he doesn't want to lynch plotspot. Prplhz immediately jumps and asks him who he wants to lynch.Prplhz seems to be more interested in not lynching plotspot than lynching a specific player, and that's fine. Still, despite asking who Tubesock wanted to lynch (Tubesock initially said TheBloodyDwarf), prplhz still argues for a Stutters695 lynch. Then Tubesock shows desire to talk about plotspot and Stutters695, as well as a lack of confidence in lynching plotspot, so it can be assumed that he is willing to lynch Stutters695. And Half the Sky rereads Stutters695's filter, and said that she understands why he is scummy (implying willingness to lynch him). Prplhz immediately switches his vote, the first one to do so. Prplhz isn't posting huge walls of text or screaming with all caps, but he clearly made a decision and put effort into getting people's attention and making them listen to him. In some of his posts, his tone felt very wishy-washy, however if you look at the consistency of his play, and the context for when he said what he said, he's actually very solid in his decision. Despite the way he asked players to switch votes and seemed willing to follow them wherever, that isn't what he did, and it's obvious that prplhz was leading the thread through this period. Were plotspot scum, I could see an argument being made for prplhz being scum because of these actions. However, with a flipped plotspot, these actions aren't inherently scummy, and I feel that they are consistent with the rest of prplhz's play in this game. This is one example, but I feel that prplhz played a leading role throughout Day 1. I'm used to prplhz playing a more reserved role; while he always participates in the thread, this is the first time I have seen him consistently leading. And that's why he is a confident townread. While I understand where you're coming from, the part in green I absolutely disagree about. It can be fine, but again prpl didn't care about it being me getting lynched. He ignored my reasoning for voting plot, which was a direct response to his question. If you're going to try and honestly lynch scum, you'd think he'd respond to that in sone fashion. You'd also think he would try to stick around for the deadline but he wasn't really concerned with who got lynched. If plot dies, he's gets credit for the town read and switching before and if I die, it's a simple "well he posted so little I thought he was a good lynch" You don't start a counter wagon so close to the deadline then go afk if he really believed plot was town. He didn't really care about saving him, he didn't really care who got lynched d1 and he certainly doesn't care who gets lynched today. That's not town. I can see it both ways. That's pretty damning. But then I think about how I thought about Plotspot. He reminded me of my first game and how I acted before I was mlynched. My reasoning to leaving Plot was simply to get another day with him. He certainly wasn't being very towny. And I think town!Prplhz could have felt it wasn't going to be a big enough loss to justify more effort. My level of town protecting is directly proportionate to how towny I think that person is. Isn't yours? | ||
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On April 15 2015 03:57 Stutters695 wrote: Anyone? I don't like the Shining lynch as he comes off being overwhelmed by replacing in. What he has posted looks pretty solid to me and I think if we give him another day we'll be able to decide his alignment. Agreed. It's basically a policy lynch. If you're going to policy lynch, why not Dwarf??? He comes back and makes an excuse? I get homework/life gets in the way but... | ||
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On April 15 2015 04:24 rsoultin wrote: shining, talk to me about bresh? there's not a ton to say about tbd...he's a policy lynch through and through unless y'all are seeing codes in his posts somewhere Don't get me started. | ||
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Anyway, after you talk to Shining and get what you need, I'd like to of course talk to you about not voting shining. | ||
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On April 15 2015 05:20 The Shining wrote: Yeah wow mind meld moment. I'm actually interested in what Tube and Stutters have to say about Bresh D2. Im still on Dwarf but I could move to Bresh. Kind of disappointed that Prpl and JJB aren't here, either. They are still question marks for me and not in a good way. Don't move to Breshke. He hasn't been leading town at all but I've liked all the interactions I've had with him and with others. He's been a useful sounding board. Definitely worth more to keep around that Dwarf. | ||
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Have you not considered his mates are waiting for his wagon to really start before they vote him? How about since he's new AND under heavy scrutiny his mates adviced him to clam up and not say anything to AVOID OUTING THEM???? | ||
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On April 15 2015 05:54 Breshke wrote: tube i really think you are tunneld in on TBD because of your early reasoning's. Yes your reasons are much less out there now but i still think it comes from a place where you want your earlier arguments to be right. The problem though is that my tinfoils generally turn out true. Not 100% but in like 5 games (obs/played/read), they found at least 2 games in every single one. Shining is basically a policy for people. Mines a policy AND WITH VALID REASONS!!!!!! | ||
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On April 15 2015 06:05 Trfel wrote: Because Breshke is town, and prplhz is town? I'm fairly confident that The Shining is scum here. I expect that scum defended him pretty hard here. I don't want to go too far down that road though, it's unflipped associations. It just frustrates me to lynch a complete shot in the dark over someone being inconsistent and unimpressive, when I know that The Shining is capable of quite a lot. The problem with lynching Shining is that it's perfectly reasonable that he still wasn't caught up and not ready to put in the work. That newbie game (the one HTS said LX??) he was in that and he didn't turn on until like Day 3 or 4. He didn't replace in either. Here he kinda posted a read or whatever but didn't really go for it. Scott131337 replaced in as mafia and made this pretty list post with links. In that he said he used a post of mine that was a long essentially town read of 2 wagon'd towns the previous day. I asked him why that was my shining example of towniness and he said "You said you couldn't sleep, so I thought that was towny." I immediately knew he was scum (didn't case him though). As mafia you absolutely have to show you have read the thread. As town, well what's the hurry? While you will eventually, since people will think you are not solving the game unless you read, but it's not an imperative. So no. Shining probaly is town. Or at least just as easily as not. This isn't to say that you are mafia for putting in all that work, it's just that mafia has a far far more motivation to show reading the thread. WIFOM cause some vets know this and will use it as a town tell too. | ||
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I think I have this game solved. I need time to double check. Prp, Rso, Shining all town. I absolutely believe Shining. Who thinks Rsoultin was a NK risk? I didn't and I have a huge mafia skill crush on her. I didn't think HTS would be either I thought Stutters, Trfel, or Breshke. I didn't do a legacy either as I'd think scum would be dumb to shoot me over those three. HTS died cause she was on to something or the biggest risk. | ||
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On April 16 2015 10:07 Breshke wrote: I dont do wills either. Im not saying its scummy to do wills. I was saying its scummy for rso not to do wills. Why are you so believing of shining? Have you seen his reason for shooting stutters. Tell me how it makes sense? Ok, I may eat my words later if Shining gets CC'd but I think the scenario where he doesn't shoot D1 can be explained by lack of confidence in D1 reads. I think that too he thought D3 he was up for a mlynch or that town had high risk for it. If he waited till N3 it would be too late. I'll look back on his read. There are some other things that I'm considering that fit the world I'm seeing. I was confused with your Prp hammer but was giving you excuses. And this fakeclaim play is so bad. I think you see that you can sweep town and are going for the big play now. I understand Prplhz's reasons for foregoing the no lynch. He thinks he has it solved (he's wrong). But you don't have the game solved so I don't like your reasons to skip no lynch at all. No fucking way. It's such bad play. But you want to end this because you are mafia. | ||
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On April 16 2015 10:15 Breshke wrote: It i actually worrying because i was hoping trefel or tube were the vigi because then people wouldnt try to push the world where i got a partner to CC. I dont get how tube believes shining so quick without adressing the fact of why he shot stutters. Also youd think that fact that the shining wants to lynch one of his town reads you would think he would take pause and talk to him about that before believing him straight away You'll find out why soon enough. | ||
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On April 16 2015 10:21 Breshke wrote: I wont argue the fake claim play could be total shit. I will argue this. What do we get from a no lynch. Someone who most people agree is town dies. Probably you or trefel. That gets us nowhere and we still HAVE TO lynch mafia tomorrow. Instead we lynch today. We lynch mafia today and if we lynch the roleblocker then there is every chance mafia tries to shoot the vet and we gain a misslynch. Lynching today gives us a chance to get a misslynch back. No lynching gets us nothing but one dead townie. We gain 5 days before we lynch. Mafia are in a race against time. No lynch provides a great resource for town. Another night kill and time to sort out the rest. | ||
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On April 16 2015 10:54 The Shining wrote: No lynch post: Why the Fuck would I come out and explain that logic in a post where I decided not to claim? Read the bolded. How would I know how the vigi is feeling? It was an attempt at bread crumbling before I decided to claim. I was torn on claiming after EoN. There is something else important about this post. | ||
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On April 16 2015 12:21 Breshke wrote: to make it clear the original plan was. Claim vigi. Get shot during the night and unclaim vigi right before day post. Shining claimed vigi and i was so sure he was scum claiming to try and win the game. It seems that i am wrong So your plan was to make a big play, hope we not only lynch mafia but also 33% chance hit the roleblocker? Not to mention the risk of how much chaos this causes talking about if the CC is real or scum? Your plan is that scum would automatically see your claim and decide to CC or bank on them CCing the real vigi? And then how long did you wait for this play to develop? Now you claim Vet. So, more chaos. You're saying you're playing weird because you are vet. What was your strategy prior to the last night actions? | ||
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On April 16 2015 12:42 Trfel wrote: Can everyone agree on this? If Breshke is not actually the veteran, he absolutely gets lynched here. No possibility whatsoever for him to rescind his claim. If The Shining is not actually the vigilante, he absolutely gets lynched here. No possibility whatsoever for him to rescind his claim. Therefore, it is imperative that if Breshke is not the real veteran and/or The Shining is not the real vigilante, that the real power role(s) must claim as soon as possible. Just to make it absolutely clear. This is just opening it up for mafia to fakeclaim and then we fight it out on who is scummier Breshke or whoever claims. Is this any better of a position? | ||
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On April 16 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote: im all for mafia cc'ing me I wont be rolling over after i fuck up bad If you are mafia you also have every reason to tryhard here too. This is wifom at best. ##Unvote ##No Lynch | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:00 Breshke wrote: Yeah i didn't say that. Im saying that if there is another person who wants to claim vet they should. Which i thought you were disagreeing with. I'm not sure about this. We already have to talk about your claim(s)/play vs shinings counter. Now you want us to add a Vet CC on you? So what you're fakeclaiming Vet here too? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:03 The Shining wrote: Trfel, you've been flip floppy a lot today. You offered no lynch, then back tracked. Your eon reaction seemed a little fake. You let off some anger then rescinded it. Now you're back to no lynch. Could this be because you know who the blues are now? What is your current read on me? My recent actions. My vig claim. I need you to stop posting flip flops and find scum/start poe. HTS defended you when I called you out on your vote to hammer Dwarf mislynch over prpl. This could explain HTS nk. If she's dead, she never revisits Trfel. If Breshke is in fact vet, then that's 3 town on Prpl. Stutters, hts, breshke. The other is jjb, who I'm not convinced is town but this is partially due to bias from our last game together. RSo, I'd actually like to see your current thoughts on JJB. This, coupled with the fact that Trfel hammered Dwarf, shows me Prpl is scum. Whether it was Breshke panicking and setting up to bus Prl, or Trfel hammering to save scummate Prpl, the conclusion is still that Prpl is scum in this world. I think I'm voting Prpl, provided Bresh isn't cc'd. Note: I'm on the subway typing this post. No phone service. The last post when I started was Breshke's unvote post. Anything after that, I haven't seen or read yet so I apologize if the timing of this post seems awkward. Did you notice the other person who immediately noticed that Half the Sky was vigi shot? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:21 The Shining wrote: Do you mean the fact that Trfels reaction that I called fake had already assumed Stutters was vigi shot? And was that you trying to get me to slip? I shot Stutters, not HTS. Gah I typed that wrong. I fully believe you are vigi. I meant that yes Trfel also immediately knew HtS was mafia shot. No need to consider. No time to either. I'm rereading and it's possible that in his filter he was scumming Stutters so thought it was a vigi shot. But I need to find it. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:25 Trfel wrote: Is it not obvious who was vigilante shot and who was nightkilled? Half the Sky was the obvious night kill, clear as day. The only other possibility was Breshke, for his various mentions of power roles and setup speculation. No vigilante would shoot Half the Sky, and no mafia team would shoot Stutters695 instead of Half the Sky here. Are you really suspicious of me for this? I am! But I could be wrong. I thought Stutters was blue hinting pretty good. Plus, he was showing signs of turning on his towniness. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
You can totally disagree, but this shows you are not thinking about the game as much as you are letting on. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:31 Breshke wrote: Um so I also was one who "knew" stutters was vigi shot and not HTS if you look at my vigi claim i said i shot stutters. It was trefels psot that amde me actually think about it and when you do its obvious. Like anyone who was going to shoot HTS wouldn't have waited this long. So if your going to start pushing scum on people for saying stutters was vigi shot you should include me. Right there. You still had to "think" about it. Plus, I'm still heavily considering you to be mafia, so yeah of course I'm going to push it on you too. But you're not as immediate either. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
Anyway, I have a hockey game. Be back in a couple hours. | ||
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United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 13:37 Trfel wrote: Stutters695 was playing fairly well towards the end. But THAT DOES NOT MATTER WHATSOEVER FOR THE NIGHT KILL. Half the Sky is a proven player, townread by everyone, already survived pressure from rsoultin (arguably the hardest hitting player in the game, regardless of her alignment), and has been consistently playing at a high level and driving town. And Half the Sky was extremely vocal about lynching prplhz, so you can't argue that Stutters695 was killed for this reason. Instead, you suggest that mafia would kill someone who is still (at least somewhat) suspected by several people (myself included), and who only recently started playing at a truly high level? For that one sentence that some people decided to (in my opinion, stupidly) interpret as a blue claim? It's quite possible that by the end of Day 3, Stutters695 would have been a universal townread. But why would mafia take a gamble when they have a sure thing? There is no reason to assume that Stutters695 would become more townread or more influential than Half the Sky. Mafia doesn't take chances, mafia goes for the solid plays, especially in a newbie game with two straight mislynches. Point isn't that Stutters was a good nightkill or not. Point is that you immediately knew it was HtS. I agree she's better. You didn't pause to consider it or anything. you immediately was like "No lynch" then how many posts later "bah we can lynch". I think this is all an act man. Anyway I have to leave for reals. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
I'll say again. Rsoultin, Prplhz, and The Shining are all town. I'm going to prove this. I'll ask you some questions but these all have a point. Just bear with me. When mafia decide their nightkills what is the generally accepted strategy? Seems simple right? Keep It Simple Stupid. Seems like the most logical thing to do is shoot the towniest people or the most dangerous. Ones who are on the right track or most townread. Even a mixture of the two and averaged out or something. Or confirmed towns too. We don't have any of those just yet. Sort of now though. With all our dead towns there is a distinct pattern. It adds up to a story. Yeah, some of the points don't stand alone, but added up it's shows scum motivation. Voting analysis is useless. HA! It's not a strong a truth as dying, but it tells the story of intention. Which leads to the truth. | ||
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Tubesock
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Anyway, what I'm thinking. Soren333 was widely towned. Others too probably but I think he was the most towned. In his filter he scummed TheBloodyDwarf, Onegu, Prplhz, Slotspot, and Bourneq. Holyflare subs in. So, doubly obvious night kill. Half the Sky was also widely towned. Trfel and many others of you already agreed she was the obvious night kill. What were her big things? Big case on Onegu. Who was under suspicion? Breshke. Who was scumread? Bourneq. Plotspot. On April 12 2015 06:01 LoneMeow wrote: plotspot the Vanilla Townie is lynched! Final vote count: TheBloodyDwarf (1): Breshke (0): The Shining (1): plotspot Bourneq (0): plotspot (7): prplhz (0): Stutters695 (4): prplhz, Tubesock, TheBloodyDwarf, Half the Sky Here's Half the Sky's assessment of Onegu's vote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/480171-newbie-student-mafia-vii?page=61#1220 I also think that Onegu's vote on Breshke was a joke. He didn't say hardly anything about it (typical Onegu behavior though) and then came in calling us idiots for not being on the "scumclaim". I asked him where his vote was and then "oh "forgot" ##Vote: lotspot. I think he was obviously looking to change his vote, that vote wasn't serious at all.Patterns.... TheBloodyDwarf On April 15 2015 06:01 LoneMeow wrote: TheBloodyDwarf the Vanilla Townie is lynched! Final vote count: TheBloodyDwarf (5): Bourneq, The Shining, Tubesock, rsoultin, Trfel Breshke (0): The Shining (1): Bourneq (1): prplhz Half the Sky (0): prplhz (4): Stutters695, jarjarbinks, Half the Sky, Breshke Stutters695 (0): Stutters695 while vigi shot, there is still information. It's not as solid or anything, but things of note. He scummed Breshke. Trfel also said Stuters695 was on his most suspicious list before Stutters died. Breshke last words about Stutters while alive were "I can't vote him now but I hope I don't regret it." then votes The Shining. I'll have individual cases on the three as well tomorrow. We have time to talk about it. | ||
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Tubesock
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You can say what you want, but this post had nothing but facts. It's all actions YOU did. I will admit, it is entirely possible you are town or Trfel or Bourneq is. I'm going to have the rest of my thoughts out in the morning to have as much time as possible to talk about it. MYLO is the time for town to stop and think. Then post. THINK. | ||
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On April 16 2015 18:21 Breshke wrote: I also don't understand why you added the vote counts into your posts they dont seem to ass anything nor do you seem to draw information from them. To me this is scummy because it is just to make your post longer and prettier. Patterns. Town will read this and figure out what I'm trying to say. Go ahead and dismiss it. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 18:29 Breshke wrote: Yeah i get im dumb and made a bad play so i need to think but have you read trefels post explaining why the vet would 100% claim. I dont see why you would pursue something that literally is a waste of your time. Also that post is not about actions i did the only thing you mention i did is say i wouldnt vote stutters without explaining how that is scummy. The rest you seem to scumread me for what the fact that onegu voted me? Also that iw as in HTS "look into list" which you were also in. If you are saying that is motivation for me to NK her wouldnt you have the same exact motivation? I did read his post about the vet and I disagree. I already said that. I don't see why you would tell someone who is trying to figure out the game that they are wasting their time. I'm one person. Town will decide. I'm going to push my thoughts and reasonings. I think the others will either disagree or not and we will talk about it. It's pretty simple. I said you could be town. Not a lot else to talk about here. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 16 2015 18:31 Breshke wrote: But i am town? Is this you CC'ing me? im really fucking confused. I am not CCing. If I were there would be no question and it would be at my choosing. Not my scumreads. | ||
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Tubesock
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is mafia. I think his actions so far in the game show mafia intent. I want you guys to reread Breshke again. 1. Vote progression Day 1. I already linked the Day 1 final vote. Note he voted TBD, says well maybe he's lynchbait, then parks his vote on Plotspot who was also lynchbait. This could be towny. Add this up to the rest of his actions though. While town!Breshke is capable of this so is Breshke. 2. Vote Progression Day 2. Removed votes on The Shining and Stutters695 and ends up on Prplhz because that's + Show Spoiler [what he would have wanted] + On April 15 2015 10:33 Breshke wrote: So i want to explain my EoD actions because not many people seem to be understanding. There was three wagons. Shining, who i think is scum Prp, who i was null town leanish/hadn't looked into much since D1 TBD who I had no diea about. It was obvious to me that the shining misslynch was not going to go through. The only person whow anted it in the thread as much as i did was trefel. After realising i would not get the lynch i wanted i assessed the other two wagons. Rso and shining were both voting on TBD. If shining is scum RSo is most likely his partner because the way is ee it she stopped im from getting lynched EoD. That coupled with the fact with how fast she flipped her read on me while seemingly calling me town all game leads me to think they are both scum. This lead me to the conclusion that i would rather lynch Prp than dwarf because if shining and rso are scum they would not BOTH be voting their scum partner TBD therefore it would be more likely that prp was scum than TBD I honestly don't know where the bolded part has come from but I want you to know whatever your alignment and whatever my allighnment this is not how i was trying to come across to you. I hoenstly did not think you would get enough votes on me and i was having a hard enough time actually finding someone i thought was scum after i flipped on bourne so i wasn't interested in trying to defend myself with like half an hour left when i felt it wasnt necessary and there was more important things to do. Interesting post. He has demonstrated that he was scumming Shining for reasons. The weird thing though is he was also "scumming" Rsoultin for basically for: On April 15 2015 05:28 Breshke wrote: RSO could easily be scum here for thinking i was town enough to vote shining straight after i do.basically cheerleadering.me then trying to wagon me with shining when she thinks i.womt rock up(won't wake up??). But later Rso posts quite a few quotes where she says she's scumming him. So, uh it's not like he's reading the thread that well. Or misrepresenting it. So is this a reason to scum her AND also vote to kill a townlean over a "I have no idea on"? He knows both Prplhz and TheBloodyDwarf are town. How careful does Breshke have to be? This looks like scum keeping his excuses open and his miss lynches available. This is also a great example to show that he isn't really trying to solve the game. 3. Bluehunting Stutters695 + Show Spoiler [Bluehunting] + On April 12 2015 11:28 Stutters695 wrote: Assume I'm town for a second(you'll see why d2). Prpl tries to switch the wagon onto me. From a scum perspective: He mislynches me (I get harder to mislynch as the game goes on generally) On April 13 2015 08:48 Breshke wrote: I am really interested what stutters means by the bolded.. On April 13 2015 14:25 Breshke wrote: Also i kind of want to vote stutters until he explains why we would all understand he was town on D2 because there's no point pretending he didn't say that. Bluehunting again. Apparently, Breshke expected Stutters695 to respond "I'm totes DOC/VET/MEDIC/WHATEVER" but instead got: On April 14 2015 10:33 Stutters695 wrote: Sure have. WIFOM son. Am I blue, am I VT? Who knows, but my posting should make it pretty obvious I'm town. On April 14 2015 11:03 Breshke wrote: I was voting him because of some comment he made in which he basically softed power role. He seemed to ignore the question when he first came back yesterday so that made me even more intrigued but i like his recent answer and am willing to let it slide until next day phase. ##Unvote What exactly did town!Breshke get from this exchange? What did Breshke get? 4. Setup Speculation + Show Spoiler [RB claim etc] + On April 14 2015 12:25 Breshke wrote: There is no setup with both doc and vet? Idk if im misreading what you mean but there is 1 of vigi/cop and one of vet/medic Im saying because of mafias roleblock im like 85% sure we have a vet. I could go further and say there is probably a vigi aswell but that logic comes down to personal preference and how much they thought HF would be a threat. On April 13 2015 08:36 Breshke wrote: The strangest thing to me is reading sorens filter i don't really get any indication that he might be a role so mafia kind of doesn't care about role hunting? Could mean we have a weaker setup? This further strengthens your points one and kind of three i think that mafia were most worried about HF's possible future reads more than they were worried about anything anyone has been pushing so far. This being said night kill WIFOM is a real thing. Also if you were roleblocked you should 100% tell the thread straight away. Does Town!Breshke gain anything from this? What does Breshke gain? Does this look like someone playing VET? Mafia knows if there is a vet or not. If he's the vet why would town!Breshke bother to see if people are roleblocked? He would KNOW there is no Medic. He thinks mafia will fakeclaim a roleblock and not send it on a town? If they are dumb enough to fakeclaim an RB they are dumb enough to send it on a town. He's doing this to create chaos and disrupt scumhunting. 5. I haven't played much mafia. I'm no expert who can immediately pick out future nightkills or anything but I do have an opinion on how a VET probably wants to play. How you might ask? Being super town so that mafia shoots you. You also have motive to play town enough so VIGI doesn't shoot you. Is Breshke's actions from the mindset of a vet? 6. Breshke is not stupid. There is no question that his fakeclaim vig to vet claim is a hail mary. Town, investigate a bit more please to see if this is a hail mary as town or mafia. Reread Breshke's actions. Do not accept "oh I'm dumb" as an excuse. That's the easiest mafia cop out ever. Do you think his bluehunting lines up with him being Vet? Is he doing that breadcrumbing for a town purpose or mafia purpose. Why wouldn't vet just play super town? He really would think that the other blue would be the only one to catch his hint and not one of the three mafia?? I also think that Breshke was excited this phase because he's been bluehunting all game and now he can finally use whatever his bluehunting scheme was from before. I think he decided that he was going to possibly fakeclaim from early on. This hail mary of his is to seal the deal. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 17 2015 02:45 prplhz wrote: why do you say this while talking to a guy who is calling you town Interesting isn't it? Have you reread him? Like looked at the stuff he's analyzed? Does any of it seem "off"? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 17 2015 02:57 prplhz wrote: no tube no I'm not finished. I have more coming. Prplhz I just want you to reconsider and read up. Breshke's vet claim could be absolutely true. But don't just discard it. Or at least look into Trfel (and my upcoming thoughts on him) and Bourneq. | ||
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Tubesock
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Fine lynch Bourneq he's your third right? We can agree on him. That buys us time to reach a consensus and do more investigating. I don't care about the order. ##Unvote ##Vote: Bourneq | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
What are our options? Breshke does some hail mary play. Trfel mentions no lynch, oh scratch that let's lynch we can have all the blues out themselves. Why the hurry on knowing the blues? Maybe it's just bad play on my part but I think that making Mafia guess for another day could be a good idea. But this argument isn't important. Prplhz is at least looking in different areas (albeit wrong on Rsoultin). I can see he's reevaluating and thinking about things. And not bluehunting or centering around policy talk. He's pushing a lynch. I was first suspicious of Trfel when Stutters695 posted this: Followed by this: On April 14 2015 14:37 Stutters695 wrote: Is this guy scum? I really want to lynch him. I didn't understand why Stutters695 would say what he did. I didn't really say anything in my post. I was defending The Shining on the weak premise that I didn't think town necessarily had to prove that they read the thread as fast as possible. It wasn't even a real defense, it was simply give the guy some time. Trfel was all up in his ass. I then realized I haven't read Onegu's filter in awhile. I basically dropped it once Trfel started doing his summaries in spoilers. That definitely looked like a ton of work. A little later I noticed something kinda funny. Prplhz and Stutters695 were going at each other for the same reasons. TheBloodyDwarf tinfoils me. The replacements are going at it. It was ironic. I was just getting a nagging feeling that Prplhz and Stutters695 were both town. Trfel I didn't see anything scummy in. He was putting in a lot of work and showing that he was thinking about the game. He was super town. I started to reread Onegu. Half the Sky has a good case on him. I already posted it, it was big I doubt any of you missed it when she posted it. Onegu's "big" contribution is his suspicion of Rsoultin. Which is if you guys bother to look into his filter is because she didn't town him, and Rsoultin can read him better than anyone. She must be mafia. But uh, what happens if HE is mafia? I thought his actions on Breshke, and his eod vote was weird. I attributed it to the drugs. He replaced out, so it's obviously legit. But it also seemed like he wasn't particularly serious about his Breshke vote, and knew that by the time he got back in thread there would be another wagon that will look good to jump on to. Sure enough a "scumclaim". Onegu towned Bourneq for scumming TheBloodyDwarf. On April 10 2015 23:33 Onegu wrote: Prplhz I actually like this post, wouldn't lynch him today for this post Before this Onegu does give Bourneq heat. I think it's safe to "bus" him in this case as Onegu isn't exactly known to be forceful with his lynch targets. Alone this reaction means nothing. But in context.... But you know, he did claim town and not VT so we shouldn't be worried. On April 10 2015 08:20 Onegu wrote: It's my meta if I claimed VT that's when you should look out for me. So, Onegu's play is what Trfel is stuck with. He's smart, he knows he can't explain any of it. The best strategy by far is to compensate for it. He knows that he has a reputation for solid case building and analysis. As town he knows he will get some heat if he doesn't perform. He did a little, but it didn't last very long and he quickly became massively townread for his massive effort. Still. Up to Day 3 there's really nothing. His play looks really towny. HtS and Stutters die. 3 minutes after Day post: On April 16 2015 06:03 Trfel wrote: I figured that Half the Sky would die. But why would the vigilante possibly save their shot? And why would they ever shoot Stutters695? Newbie games are loaded with vigilante targets. Bourneq was far and away the best candidate. Well, we're now at MYLO. I don't even know if we're allowed to mislynch(corrects this to No Lynch)? Pushes No Lynch. Thirty minutes later: On April 16 2015 06:32 Trfel wrote: I guess, part of me is tempted to just go ahead and lynch today now. Don't get me wrong, no lynch is definitely the best play. But lynching feels like it will just speed things up, and I'm not sure how much of a difference it will make. We're kind of dead either way. I can go with whatever people want to do. I also retract my super strong townread on Breshke now. Reread the thread from Day 3 post on. To me I think mafia Trfel has every incentive to post exactly like he is. There is a light at the end of the tunnel for him if we lynch today. This could be a town Trfel too. I read Breshke's and Trfel's interactions together and I can't help to think it looks like a play. Like teamwork. Then I have the revelation. MAFIA CAN ALL WORK ON THE THREAD ANALYSIS THAT TRFEL DID. He's not necessarily the only one doing it. I have played team sports all my life. I can't imagine the mafia team in their own private QT wouldn't coordinate and execute plays. I get many don't, they stay fluid and whatnot but it seems silly to discard that. Trfel could be town. All I ask is reread the guy and think about how a scumTrfel replacement would have to act. How is Day 3 play so far can easily be mafia motivated. He's fully capable of playing this way as mafia and he wants the lynch today. He doesn't think we are going to lynch mafia. | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
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On April 17 2015 03:34 Trfel wrote: Just read over the first page of Tubesock's filter. He actually could be scum here. His early posts seem to be more white knighting, and he's providing fewer useful scumreads than I expected. Perhaps it's just confirmation bias, though. When I get out of class, I'll take a look at the rest of it. How much thought have you put into me before this post? | ||
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Tubesock
United States2726 Posts
On April 17 2015 05:30 Trfel wrote: Only what I collected on you in my four catch-up posts, and what came up in discussion. I had five minutes. You and prplhz are bigger tasks. I posted what I did because I wanted to see what people said, and in hopes that others would look into the things that I mentioned. On April 16 2015 07:07 Trfel wrote: I don't know, to be honest I've sort of been assuming that rsoultin is town all game long. The reason being that it would take a lot of time and effort to try and lynch rsoultin, and I feel that her being mafia isn't terribly likely. And I'd only lynch her if I could be darn sure that I'm right. Basically, I'm just putting it off. I'm a procrastinator. I agree with you that rsoultin is capable of playing at a noticeably higher level than this. But I'm not convinced that this makes her scum. On April 17 2015 03:02 Trfel wrote: Tubesock.... Sorry, but I can't lynch an non-cc'd blue. Breshke is absolutely town unless someone counterclaims. Everything else simply doesn't matter. So, Trfel accuses me of being lazy. Yet, only just now got to my filter. He's procrastinating on Rsoultin even though "she is capable of playing at a noticeably higher level". He's digging into me because my scumread quote ratio is too low. He also won't entertain at all the possibility that Breshke is faking again. He is making excuses not to scumhunt. Reread his Day 3 beginning actions. He's acting. He isn't talking about scumhunting. He's wanting to talk about how we should no lynch/lynch, if the blues should claim. Let the fucking blues decide. Where does he do any scumhunting? Oh after I put his name in red on my vote post. I'll get to his rebuttal in a few minutes. He's arguing that both him and Breshke are town. I'm mafia. He's saying that first time ever mafia!Tubesock would see 2 towns doing weird claiming/role/lynch speculation and not let them go for it. He's saying that I would go in there and effectively stop the conversation and steer it back to scumhunting. To make people reconsider the game. To make town look at myself, and he's also saying I would take one of the biggest townreads in the game. That I would go against someone who has a good reputation for case building. That I'm telling town to THINK. Why would I EVER want to lead town to a scumhunting centric position if I were mafia? I stopped Breshke from continuing focus on his play. I refocused town. Yeah. Really scummy there. You think I'm going to let Trfel derail this by talking about if Breshke is vet or not? No, we are going to talk about scum motivations. | ||
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I'm hoping someone comes to me and asks "what did you mean about this paragraph" etc. Then I'll explain it. You guys are playing to whomever is the best arguer. Not doing independent research. | ||
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On April 17 2015 05:51 Trfel wrote: There are two points here. The first point you make is that I went back and forth between lynching and no-lynching. I've already explained that there is value in no-lynching, because we get time to investigate things and make the best decision. However, there is no value in no-lynching if people want to lynch, or if people don't want to use the extra time to actually work. If you took a closer look at your scumread of me, you would notice that I have said this multiple times, and rsoultin (who you are townreading) has expressed the same sentiments. Furthermore, if you look at my past games, you will see that when I (and the rest of town) is feeling tired and in a bad spot in the game, I'm willing to take a riskier lynch to speed things along (see Down Under 2, where I lynched someone who might be scum over someone who was guaranteed to be scum under the assumption that town wouldn't care enough to investigate properly such that the additional time would make a difference).
Second point, the entire mafia team worked on the analysis that I did. This I find rather interesting. Realize that I pointed out to everyone that mafia could work together to feed people analysis/reads. Yet you don't mention at all that it was me who first suggested this. Realize that my posting style is rather unique. I use capitalization, periods, and tend to be semi-formal at all times. I would definitely have to retype and revisit everything that people would tell me to say. It's possible that mafia guided me in the general reads that I should arrive at, but I definitely did the majority of the work myself. You conclude by arguing that I am scum because I want to lynch today. You realize that my vote is currently on no-lynch?
Basically, you haven't presented any reasons why I am scum. You presented a ton of fluff, a ton of clear misinterpretations. You presented a few arguments on Onegu (maybe they have some validity, but I don't care). And you've claimed that I could do everything I have done as scum. But you haven't shown anything whatsoever that actually suggests that I am scum from my own play.
To everyone else: I think that Tubesock is better than this. Look at the length of his post and compare it to the amount of substance. Contrast this with his earlier theory on TheBloodyDwarf. Tubesock here is feeling more lazy, and less interested, where Tubesock would be extremely motivated due to having caught the scum team and needing to make everyone else see his point. I wonder if Tubesock is mafia and making a token effort on a read he knows isn't true, and is less motivated because he knows that he is in trouble. [list][*][B] Town will evalutate if I'm motivated or not. Are you motivated? How's that Prplhz, Rsoultin cases coming along? | ||
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On April 17 2015 09:39 Breshke wrote: Within the spoiler are times before this phase where tube gives a read on me. They are all town but that is not necessarily important. Look at the logic. Look at his reasons for the read. In every case it shows logic which you i think most people would agree with or at least come to an understanding of how he could see it that way. He also makes clear conclusions from every point he brings up. So, uh this is scummy? Moving onto this phase we have this post.+ Show Spoiler [Vote Analysis Post] + On April 16 2015 18:01 Tubesock wrote: I think I know what's going on. While I think I'm right, I will acknowledge I was wrong on TheBloodyDwarf. I don't always get all the scum, but I at least get two. Anyway, what I'm thinking. Soren333 was widely towned. Others too probably but I think he was the most towned. In his filter he scummed TheBloodyDwarf, Onegu, Prplhz, Slotspot, and Bourneq. Holyflare subs in. So, doubly obvious night kill. Half the Sky was also widely towned. Trfel and many others of you already agreed she was the obvious night kill. What were her big things? Big case on Onegu. Who was under suspicion? Breshke. Who was scumread? Bourneq. Plotspot. Here's Half the Sky's assessment of Onegu's vote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/480171-newbie-student-mafia-vii?page=61#1220 I also think that Onegu's vote on Breshke was a joke. He didn't say hardly anything about it (typical Onegu behavior though) and then came in calling us idiots for not being on the "scumclaim". I asked him where his vote was and then "oh "forgot" ##Vote: lotspot. I think he was obviously looking to change his vote, that vote wasn't serious at all.Patterns.... TheBloodyDwarf Stutters695 while vigi shot, there is still information. It's not as solid or anything, but things of note. He scummed Breshke. Trfel also said Stuters695 was on his most suspicious list before Stutters died. Breshke last words about Stutters while alive were "I can't vote him now but I hope I don't regret it." then votes The Shining. I'll have individual cases on the three as well tomorrow. We have time to talk about it. First reason for cumming me in this post is that HTS had me in her suspicious section. + Show Spoiler + Under review: Breshke - D1 activity okay, D2 activity illogical, need to check town meta Tubesock - Trace all read progression. Did town him for tinfoil/GF theories, but needed to see how he drove the Dwarf lynch. Need to review why he dropped prplhz as a scumread. Shining - Super low activity from him and Ace. Meta-ed him post-lynch and didn't look good but need to check latest posts. I do not see how he finds this a reason to scum me when he himself and the other UN COUNTER CLAIMED pr are also in this list. This is not a logical conclusion that someone would make. My points are all an overall picture. I think it's silly to think that you can find scum for 1 or 2 things. I think you and Trfel are the ones who benefits the most from how the night kills were conducted and how the mlynches went down. No one else has those same patterns. I think your play overall is scum motivated or bad. I want people to reconsider you. If others disregard this then that's fine I guess. Me responding to your posts is not for your benefit. I'm not interested in trying to convince you you are mafia or town. There is value in exchanges with you, but the trap is it comes down to who is the best arguer. I want town to read this and at least consider as many things as possible to make a good decision. Im skipping the joke vote from onegu on me because I doubt that was a joke vote more likely onegu just lost interest and it is so so so unlikely if i was mafia id be mafia with onegu/trefel. Last in this post he refers to me saying I could not vote stutters yet fails to explain how this would make me scum. He doesn't even draw the conclusion that this would make me scum he simply states that it was something i said. How does this add to his case? Why did he bring it up if he then didn't further refer to it in his later case on me? This obviously was not a very important point to him so why did he point it out. You spent a lot of time bluehunting him and trying to bait him. I expanded but didn't directly link the two but it's the same point. You feel dirty for not voting Stutters because you were hoping he would out himself as blue. Which you later admitted (hope for out not feel dirty about it). I think the way you went about it is scummy. It's exactly what I put in my Bluehunting section of my case. 1.Tube actually admits in this point that what I did WAS NOT allighnment indicitive. I am an unclaimed PR. This being said if tube is town he must feel really fucking strongly about me being scum. So his first point in a case on me would not end in "yeah he could do this as town or mafia". There is no way. Nor do i think the argument that I just parked my vote on plot is necessarily true. You being an UnCC'd blue is the ONLY thing I think that you are town for. I'm am not sold on the idea that Vet would 100% would out himself here. I've said this before. I'm not going to argue it. I do believe Shinings claim.[/quote] 2.In this point tube completely ignores my explanation for why I switched my vote from theshining to prp. I am not going to explain it again but once again this is tube ignoring some of my posts so he can once again grasp at things to call me scum with. I don't believe your explanations. I quoted the post with the most in it about your explanation. I think it was the best representative. 3. No conclusions are made from this point. He asks what scum/town breshke would get from bluehunting yet doesnt answer this question himself. Obviously no one is going to respond to this question so why not explain that he thinks I was obviously bluehunting in the thread on stutters then decided that I would not kill him? I want town to think about it. I want to see who thinks about it. On April 14 2015 13:58 Breshke wrote: Stutters if you had one read you were most sure of who would it be and what do you think their alignment is? I don't need a reason. He also missed this post which could be seen as the biggest blue hunting post. I knew im the evt so if stutters was a pr he was the cop or vigi and this was me basically trying to get him to soft his checks a obvious as it might've been. I didn't think this was a bluehunting post. What would that have added to my argument? I already had several examples. How many are enough? 4? 5? 35? The point was made with the posts I used. 4.This point is absolutly wrong and shows he isn't thinking about what he is even writing. The setup could have been cop/vet in which case mafia probably try and roleblock the cop. Also there is still a possibility in vigi/vet that mafia try and claim a roleblock (after they rb the person they kill) for town cred. Tube asks what i get as town from this, it is clear that in one scenario it was that i should be wary of the eprson who claimed rb and in the other that the person who claimed RB is most likely town. It also was a way of letting the other power role know there was a vet. And I also said this is bullshit. Mafia could as easily RB a town for shits and giggles, or fakeclaim an RB. At best it's WIFOM and distracts town from actually scumhunting. The blues would eventually out themselves when they want to. Not on your timeline. 5. I think I was fairly townie in the first few days (tube apparently also thought this???) so i don't think i can be criticized for not trying that. Also my comment that it would have been better for the shining to shoot me is 100% justified because we then become basically confirmed to eachother and town doesn't go into mylo. He also asks if my actions are from the mindset of a vet yet fails to show anywhere where he thinks im not coming from the mindset of a vet. You didn't read it very well then. There's a big paragraph about it. 6.The other three mafia wouldnt have exactly caught my play as rso was the only one who pinged out the paragraph where i was trying to make it clear to the vigi not to claim. If it was anyone but shining I think it would have gone better (not because i think he is bad but because he was scum reading me) I also don't understand how my bluehinting from ebfore ties into that play but w/e. You can reference it as breadcrumbing. Anyway this has become really long so tl dr this shows a clear disconnect in tube's reads where he logically calls me town with reasons to where he starts calling me scum for far far weaker reasons which he constantly fails to draw conclusions from. Making a case on someone who is an unclaimed PR probably means one of two things. You feel really strongly that that person is mafia which tube clearly doesn't as a lot of his points end in questions not conclusions or you plan on CC'ing that person which would be absurd at this point Already addressed. | ||
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On April 17 2015 10:32 Breshke wrote: Is it really the time for this? You want to be convincing people that your very different point of view is the right one. This simply isnt true. You have no faith in your arguments so you dont try and push them instead you pose them as questions so when you are wrong it doesn't come back to look bad on you. You don't draw conclusions on the things you bring up because you say you need to see people ask questions about it when no instead you need to be showing proper analysis to PROVE someone is mafia and to help see people if you are town but no you are not town you are scum. Also rso do you agree that if me and truffle were scum together e would have just claimed vigi and we probably could have just won. I assume thats why you think we couldnt be together. I've already addressed why I am not spoonfeeding. Every interaction I'm gaining more information. I can also figure out the intentions of the people reading my posts. You want to nitpick and show that you are not really working at reading my posts or what? | ||
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His sole "scumhunting" is in direct response to me scumming him. Otherwise he's trying to lead town to talk about claims and lynch's and whatever but when it comes to actual investigative work he comes up with excuses. And that swap off me to Bourneq is a joke. ##Unvote ##Vote: Trfel | ||
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On April 17 2015 11:06 Breshke wrote: This is really really frustrating because you say me claiming vet is the only thing you could read me town for yet you have said a lot of the things i have done all game are town until you flipped on me this phase. If you want to talk about someone being destructive how is you making a team which involves an un cc'd powerrole in it helpful to town. You arn't even assessing this as an option you are pushing as the world you are living in. Who is scum because im clearly not. I can't see how you could be town here because yes you should look at all the options but is it really realistic to think im scum here? I'm getting my thoughts out as soon as possible. I thought you were town. As you did things I kept going back to my first read on you where I towned you. The waffle on TBD I really liked. You got heat for it but I thought you were town for it. But then you did this play, and I was like what and reread you. I saw little weird stuff. Then I was looking at who you voted. In JoaT I felt like we shared a brain. Definitely not this game though, not after Day 1 or so. | ||
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On April 17 2015 11:12 Breshke wrote: Isn't bourne you're scumread? I actually think it is a good point that if bourne was town at least one mafia would be focusing their push on him today as it would be one of the easier miss lynches. He is. And I'll happily vote him later but there is far less information than if everyone goes on Bourneq. We won't be in any better situation next cycle. | ||
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On April 17 2015 11:27 Trfel wrote: Actually hm, maybe I should argue with Tubesock. It would be fun Let's do that. I think that everyone in the thread is keeping up okay. Hello, Tubesock. How are you doing? I'm great you? | ||
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On April 17 2015 11:50 Trfel wrote: Doing fairly well. What's it like being scum for the first time? Fantastic, you going to bus Bourneq with me? | ||
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On April 17 2015 11:54 Trfel wrote: That would require me to be scum. I'm sorry, I'm just not as special as you. Nice try. You going to do any scumhunting yet? | ||
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On April 17 2015 12:05 Trfel wrote: No need. Two scum down. You guys are obvious enough that I don't need to make a case. Convincing. So, you pretty proud of the chaos you created today? You mad because I ruined your play? | ||
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On April 17 2015 12:16 Trfel wrote: What play am I supposedly making again? Remind me? You had a fine performance of trying to appear like concerned town leader. Get us to talk about everything but who scum are. | ||
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On April 17 2015 12:23 Trfel wrote: Would you prefer that I lynched you instead? And jarjarbinks, I'd greatly prefer to lynch Tubesock over prplhz here. I could see prplhz being town without too much effort, I have much more trouble seeing Tubesock as town. Funnyiest thing is you are acting like a polite Geript or Holyflare in my last games. You're pure OMGUS. I don't get why people town you. | ||
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Fucking Trfel is Half the Sky from that game. Breshke could be Celestial who fakeclaimed to save his life. I think Trfel actions D3 were staged. How he went let's no lynch. Oh no let's lynch. Then talked about claims. It felt dirty. Look at how Prplhz entered. He went straight to solving the game thinking it was Rsoultin. We had so much more information from dead towns and Trfel didn't take any time to evaluate the game. Prplhz came in, saw the kills and probably saw his notes or whatever and then bam POE or whatever he knew who the scum team was. Breshke could be town in this. He was just used. I have to think about it. I just think he was in it with Trfel like Geript and Sandroba. Then this claim play of his after Trfel brought it up, just looked really really bad. He's unCC'd vet so until that changes he's town. But I do not trust Trfel's "advice" or certainty of the other should CC there. While Breshke could have been innocent town, it looked like they were doing the same play to end the game for town. So, you guys really think I would as a first time mafia go after Trfel here? Thank you, that's ballsy as fuck. Like I would need a wheelchair they're big. Why not Prplhz? He's scummy as either alignment. Seems dumb to go after the biggest caser here. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:03 rsoultin wrote: okay, yeah i can see this lol >< i thought it strange too that he talked about you, truffle and bourneq but isn't willing to consider something else...like he was pretty stubborn in carol, but he was certain on his hf read (which was actually right lol >< just most of his others weren't) but saying y'all may be town isn't demonstrating the same certainty at all I was right on 2 of that team in Carol. I was wrong on Sick and Lightningstrike. Here I'm right on Trfel and Bourneq most likely. Breshke I've already said he's town till he's CC'd. And no I am not setting up a claim. | ||
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For his massive synapsis posts? He MUST DO THAT! Don't town him because he makes big posts. None of you have asked anything about my case except for the 2 guys in it. Why? | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:18 rsoultin wrote: shining and i also thought a no lynch would be best? i'd have to reread his filter or whatever, but i also talked about claiming so...why him and not me? like i kinda sorta get the breshke/truffle association if you're already scumreading truffle but how realistic do you think this is, honestly? i don't have an eden-lvl toneread here but i'm pretty damn good at reading truffle -_- You were not first. He as there immediately, knew immediately who the NK was (don't care if it was obvious that's not the point) and immediately was like No lynch! .... welllllll let's lynch! I don't think it was in the mindset of town doing it. Then he went straight into claim stuff. You were different because you were immediately voted on by Prp. Different circumstance. And you were just responding to him. You didn't look like you had an agenda. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:21 Breshke wrote: because 100% im mafia so if YOU WERE town mafia doesn't care because you are just wasting your time I want people to think about the big possibility our reads were wrong. I think Trfel at the very least needs to be reconsidered. He's been towned too easily. He's the snake in the grass. He thinks my case is lazy. That my push is lazy. Do you guys agree? If so why? | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:29 Trfel wrote: Yes, I do think you would do this. I'm not terribly hard to pressure. And the argument of "he wouldn't go after a high profile player, he's town" has been used this game already. That doesn't work after the first time. I have the right to be lazy. I've caught a scum, almost guaranteed (Bourneq). There is literally no other pressure to lynch him here, which means that scum is not interested in him dying (which if Bourneq is town, would result in an easy victory). Any other lynch is prematurely advancing the schedule, taking a more risky lynch before it's necessary. But especially without any scum meta to compare to, I doubt much will change with regards to reading Tubesock. See you guys tomorrow, I'll be relaxing. Prplhz found him Day 1. You're just bussing. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:32 Trfel wrote: I like how you now insist that Breshke is town due to his claim, while you were suspicious of me for saying very similar things earlier. I also like how you say that Breshke is town until counterclaimed, while saying that it's scummy that I asked any potential power roles to counterclaim. I guess you like taking mafia as confirmed town? What are you talking about? I've pushed that he could very well be fakeclaiming and just because Trfel says the real vet would 100% counter claim here doesn't make it true at all. You didn't even consider it. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:36 rsoultin wrote: eh honestly i don't see what's so scummy about the claim talks? like yeah i could see this world you have where breshke is scum with truffle and they just claim, encourage a cc, and both blues are outed but lol >< that world falls apart the moment you say breshke is scum like if truffle and breshke are scum they have to be scum for more than just that >< that's like paranoid fear, tube Possible. But the paranoid fear is what got me to recheck him. I didn't like all the Bluehunting centric talk while he pressured Stutters. His play made me realize I was making excuses for his play based on my earlier read. My biggest point is I think you guys are biased from your first reads. I don't think you are looking at the game objectively. I mean Prp and Stutters fight for a full cycle for doing the exact same thing. Both are town. Same thing here. Trfel got towned for doing big posts with nothing that anyone really talked about. He pushed the Shining lynch basically on the sale that he can't read pages 7 - 23 in 30 minutes. Those pages are nothing but one liners essentially. It's not hard to read it that fast. I think Trfel was scumming Shining and basically making it look like he was the standard of effort that should apply. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:38 Breshke wrote: Tube im just really like idk how toe xplain it. So you now realize that i am most deffinetly town. Then who is the third scum other than trefel or bourne. I would also like to see you case bourne i know you stopped because people werent interacting with you about your casiesother than the people you cased but id like to see a bourne case. Why? No one thinks Bourneq is town. I have said I'd vote you three, I did rescind my intention to vote Breshke. So, Trfel or Bourneq I don't care. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:39 Trfel wrote: Yes. I'm scum because I did something that looks towny. Tubesock, this simply isn't how to scumhunt. To scumhunt, you want to look for mafia motivation. However, this doesn't mean look for "why would they do this as mafia", it means to look for the reasons that mafia would do this that town wouldn't have. Me making my four analysis posts is something I would definitely do as town, and would probably do as scum. In and of itself, it's not alignment indicative. Read what I said, that's what is alignment indicative. Nothing that you have posted suggests that I am scum. You've only showed that you disagree with several of the reasons that I have been townread. The one real potentially scummy thing in my filter, my hammer on TheBloodyDwarf over prplhz, isn't a reason you are scumreading me. Apparently I killed Half the Sky because she was the biggest threat to me. So what? She was the biggest threat to most everyone. Just because Trfel would have killed Half the Sky here doesn't mean that any other mafia team would not. And it doesn't mean that I am scum. Even as scum, you need to keep these things in mind. You can do crazy things and hope to get townread anyway, and often it will work, but normally your support dries up. Eventually you need some actual reasons behind your pushes. What's alignment indicative is things of what you do. You agree that your extra effort is something that you would do as either alignment. I'm trying to get town to see that they shouldn't town you for it. I also think you had to overcompensate for Onegu's scumminess. I don't think it is nearly as easy as "oh this post is alignment indicative." Or this one, it's too easy to fake. It's more about intentions of what they are doing. I don't want town to just pass you as town. I think that's a very dangerous mistake. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:49 Trfel wrote: Yeah, you definitely don't care who gets lynched. And me voting Bourneq is a joke. If you are actually town here, you need to take some more time between posts to make sure that what you're saying makes sense. Your posting is loaded with inconsistencies. You're either scum or not thinking things through fully before posting. It's a joke because you vote me, then are like, bah Bourneq instead. I don't think you will stay on him at all. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:56 Breshke wrote: So do you still think im scum? if not who is out of the remaining players? Also because clearly i think your current analysis is lacking so i want to see what makes you think bourne is scum so i can then use that to rethink your alignment and if we should lynch you today. He's folded everytime anyone talks to him. He's very conscious of how he looks. Even his last post is "uh I'm feeling better so can have stronger reads now!" yeah yeah | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:56 Breshke wrote: So do you still think im scum? if not who is out of the remaining players? Also because clearly i think your current analysis is lacking so i want to see what makes you think bourne is scum so i can then use that to rethink your alignment and if we should lynch you today. If it were up to me I'd vote Trfel/Bourneq and then you. It'll give a lot of time to figure out. You'll be CC'd or NK'd soon enough anyway I think. | ||
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On April 17 2015 14:56 rsoultin wrote: tube, is truffle your most sure scumread right now? -prods- this is more important than the argument back and forth Yes by far. I think he was faking being town this last day to get us to lynch today. I think he was trying to get credit for "leading town" and I don't think it's a towny direction. | ||
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On April 17 2015 02:03 Bourneq wrote: Scum: Prplhz, jarjar, and maybe tube? I am not scum, I have done nothing but tell the truth the entire game, sometimes I get it wrong but that is simply because this is my first game and I am having a hard time keeping up. I have been doing my best but sometimes my lack of posting has simply been down to not being familiar enough with the game to feel confident in my suspicions. Now that there are so few people left I feel I can say with some certianty who the scums are. That's all about wanting to look good. JJB or Prp/Rso. But I think they are town, so would have to rerethink. | ||
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On April 17 2015 15:07 Trfel wrote: Onegu wasn't scummy? And I'm not getting townread for effort, I'm getting townread for tone, read progression/explanation, and the fact that my mafia game is a disgrace to the site. Both of my non-town games, rsoultin caught me in a handful of posts. So you've gone from "here's why Trfel is scum" to "don't townread Trfel for these reasons". Why? You're attacking me with defense, not offense. You have no actual attack. You haven't even read my case then. I saw the game Rso caught you. You picked a bad game to try to change your meta. That wasn't because you are not capable of looking towny as mafia. How am I only defensing you. I've been repeating myself about how you haven't scumhunted in the first parts of Day 3. You only even noticed me because I came after you. | ||
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On April 17 2015 15:28 Trfel wrote: Yeah, I thought that I could still look towny as scum. I couldn't even pull it off as third party in Aperture 4. Holyflare straight up humiliated me Night 1. Rsoultin identified that I was third party and forced it out of me at the very start of Night 1. I can't prove it, as these conversations occurred over PM, but I'm sure rsoultin can vouch for it. You haven't been defending me, no. You misread what I said. What I mean is that, instead of sharing reasons why I am scum, you're sharing reasons why things that I could be considered town for are null (in your opinion). You're not sticking any scum on me, you're just trying to remove my townie points. I meant it the way you did. I'm telling town not to just townread you for your effort. So, yeah that removes defense and I'm saying you are scummy for your D3 actions. I don't see how me saying you came in and IMMEDIATELY knew things that I think should have taken some time to at least think about. I'm accusing you of not reading the game because you don't have to. You also go straight for the no lynch/lynch and claim business which I think is not scumhunting. That's scummy behavior not town. | ||
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On April 17 2015 15:33 Trfel wrote: Your posts have become less frequent. Running to the scum QT for advice? Didn't know I should be spamming F5. I'm losing interest in you since everyone seemed to have left. | ||
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On April 17 2015 15:38 Trfel wrote: So now you accuse me of not reading the game. You have no good reason for this at all. Spending time thinking about the night kill before End of Night isn't a good reason. Wanting to no lynch at MYLO when I'm busy isn't a good reason. I've said the same thing over and over. This really boils down to I don't think you considered that Breshke could be fakeclaiming. I don't think you have been trying to read what I'm saying about non you subjects. I guess it makes sense, why would you I'm scumreading you. Then why would you read anything else I say about anything else really. | ||
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What's there to say? I already answered this. Did you see anything about his read list? It literally had scum on every single person. Trfel was like "Ooooh I like this post" because whatever "even if he scumreads inactivity". He didn't notice at all that there were literally 11 scumreads in it. I ask Bourn about it later he says he didn't know what null was. Which whatever he's knew, then later he only has 2 scum reads. Does a massive post on Prplhz but on TBD and Plot. I excused him because I thought he was learning. I don't know why. I think he was more useful that TBD. I'm grabbing a bite to eat so forgive me if I don't keep up the proper post per minute quota. | ||
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Also due to time constraints I've OBS which is good too but reading a game while it is happen is good too. You can practice your reads a little bit. Obs tends to have spoilers in them. | ||
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I was planning on casing Bourneq too but ran out of energy. Rso said something about not needing defending then I realized maybe I shouldn't say anything about Bourneq. Later Trfel said its weird no ones pushing Bourn, so I didn't. | ||
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On April 18 2015 08:52 Trfel wrote: Hi, Tubesock. I'm sorry for arguing like that with you. It was not called for. My apologies, you didn't deserve it in the slightest. Until those pushes on Breshke and me, you were playing a very good scum game. I didn't take it personal. I didn't think you said anything mean or degrading. personally, you at least talked about how my case was bad with reasons. In the past scum just called me stupid to and tried discrediting me on dumb newbness. You Breshke, and Prphlz used reasons. I had to town Breshke and Prplhz earlier. Town tube would have backed down and pushed no lynch. Hard no lynch. It made it easier to keep distracting but also I was planning on doing more today on you. I didn't want my cases too good because before when I did my tin foils I had more and more rational and easier to read posts. I knew I couldn't organically come up with anything. I had some posts in mind of yours that I thought I could argue you were just nitpicking. Like shining couldn't read 16 pages in 30 minute. You didn't seem to consider he read X amount before replacing or that they were mostly one liners. My goal was to get town to consider you. I got word I'm working all weekend 12-16 hour days so knew I was going to die even if I didn't case you and breshke. | ||
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