EPTCephiro, do you know how your parity checks work in relation to the traitor? e.g. say you check the traitor night 1 and a town night 2, do you get a different result? Does it depend on if the traitor's been recruited (and if so when)?
You Only Shoot Once Mafia - Page 58
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
Cephiro, do you know how your parity checks work in relation to the traitor? e.g. say you check the traitor night 1 and a town night 2, do you get a different result? Does it depend on if the traitor's been recruited (and if so when)? | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On May 03 2014 09:19 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Can you expound on Slam's posting in general making you townie/not-scummy on him?We have a parity cop saying either Alakaslam or BH are scum. Alakaslam is a day vigi who killed Yamato day 1. I don't believe he is scum based off that action and his posting in general. I don't think scum would of been happy with him going rambo and firing off a shot needlessly on D1. We also saw one scum vigi die so far. It is incredibly unlikely that Alakaslam is scum. BH on the other hand looks like absolute shit. His filter is spammy, negative, unhelpful, and cocky as shit. He's also trashing Cephiro's claim, ignoring how stupid the claim would be from scum. it would basically turn into a 1-1 trade if he was scum, which obviously isn't beneficial to him. This reaction is typical of scum, try to argue the claimer into the ground even though you have literally no ground to stand on. Foolishness, answer what I said before. What is the deal with your mason QT. Explain how it works, who is in it, what has been discussed please. Also, if you want to play the game, you're welcome to (1) We should lynch BH or slam today (2) We should lynch neither, Cephiro keeps checking people, blah blah | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
I personally think that Alakaslam is scum over Blazinghand. There's someone else I'd rather lynch though. Maybe even two. | ||
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justanothertownie
16318 Posts
On May 03 2014 09:48 prplhz wrote: Two scum vigilantes isn't all that strong, apparently scum only have 1 KP after 1 scum lynch and and day vigilantes have to explain their shots and are also restricted by the vote leader thing which means that they're can't just yoloshoot townies when they're getting lynched. I personally think that Alakaslam is scum over Blazinghand. There's someone else I'd rather lynch though. Maybe even two. You are assuming yamato and Koshi were town and there was no successful medic/jailkeeper action regarding the KP. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On May 03 2014 09:54 justanothertownie wrote: You are assuming yamato and Koshi were town and there was no successful medic/jailkeeper action regarding the KP. Which is a terrible assumption. Well, the no successful medic/JK action part imo, but on the whole yeah. What up with that prplhz? | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
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Hapahauli
United States9305 Posts
Vote Count: RebirthOfLegend (0) - Foolishness (1) - prplhz Palmar (1) - vayneauthority Cephiro (0) - Blazinghand (7) - Palmar, Rebirthoflegend, alakaslam, justanothertownie, Cephiro, WaveofShadow, Foolishness Alakaslam (1) - Blazinghand Not Voting (6) - Ace, Caller, VisceraEyes, tehpoofter, gumshoe, austinmcc Day ends in . There are 16 players alive, and it takes 9 to lynch. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/414884-sicilian-mafia-style 24 players, 6 mafia + 1 traitor. Makes the likeliest number 5-6 mafia + 1 traitor here. Thinking that mafia would only have 1 KP once they lose a single scummer is...highly unlikely imo Role list - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuWjFph9GbVwdDIweUpJSnpnU01UT2VTTUFIWWwwaWc#gid=0 Mafia had 3 power roles in their 6. Town had 7 power roles. Game had an SK. We don't KNOW mafia numbers, we don't KNOW KP formulae, we don't KNOW power role numbers, but we've got a pretty good source in another Ver game, with similar numbers of players and a traitor. Shot mechanics will change, lack of SK changes some, any balance concerns from that game may change, not having a bunch of masonry like in sicilian will change things. But overall, it's SOMETHING of a rough template, and I think if you're thinking about this game in terms that are rather inconsistent with the terms of that game, then you're probably not working from correct assumptions. As a side note, the parity cop in Sicilian received paired checks, rather than a stream of comparisons. I found Cephiro's comment about that odd, but it appears that's how Ver runs parity cops. (Seriously though, I don't see this game having less than 5 mafia to start with. No way do they only get 1 night KP after they lose a single member. So I'm working off of telling someone "nice save") | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
Even IF prplhz were not to know all of that stuff you just listed and/or didn't bother looking it up, which is pretty likely, why would he assume that after one (or even MAYBE 2) scumkills we'd be down to 1 scum KP? It's a horrible assumption this early and it's extremely suspicious imo. Also I don't think you commented on the stuff I mentioned re: JAT earlier. Also what do you make of Foolishness now seemingly ok with lynching BH all of a sudden? Genuine or distancing attempt considering how linked he has been to BH by stuff BH himself has said, and as well through (maybe not necessarily good) assumptions JAT and I have made? And on a third note Palmar/Caller. Where you at with them? Come on Austin, let's chat. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On May 03 2014 11:03 WaveofShadow wrote: It's poopy assumptioning, but I was townie on him before the start of the day and him ignoring the cop check while continuing to push Foolishness touches me in a very happy and townie place. Something happens in the thread, possibly outing a scum (ish), scum probably comment and deal with that. I don't see them ignoring it to continue pushing their lynch of choice.Austin you're ignoring some important stuff with all that setup speculation. Even IF prplhz were not to know all of that stuff you just listed and/or didn't bother looking it up, which is pretty likely, why would he assume that after one (or even MAYBE 2) scumkills we'd be down to 1 scum KP? It's a horrible assumption this early and it's extremely suspicious imo. Also I don't think you commented on the stuff I mentioned re: JAT earlier. Also what do you make of Foolishness now seemingly ok with lynching BH all of a sudden? Genuine or distancing attempt considering how linked he has been to BH by stuff BH himself has said, and as well through (maybe not necessarily good) assumptions JAT and I have made? And on a third note Palmar/Caller. Where you at with them? Come on Austin, let's chat. JAT I'll look at a little later? I don't think he's the lynch for today, or a possible lynch probably. Will read closer, but I didn't personally read as much into the little apology as you did. What was it you wanted to hash out? Neither Foolishness nor BH are sterling right now. I think that IF both were scum, I'd expect Foolishness not to push BH? If Cephiro's claim is true, and if BH is mafia, then mafia (imo) SHOULD be pushing Slam, at least a chunk of them. Better to lynch town than mafia today. Furthermore, I don't think Foolishness has boatloads to gain from pushing scumbuddies. It's unlikely that if he's alive at LYLO we all go "boy howdy what a townie Foolishness." It's far more likely he gets NKed/cop checked/lynched at LYLO. So to me, a scum strategy of "Cephiro says either BH or slam is mafia, BH and Foolishness are scumbuddies" should NOT yield "Foolishness pushes for BH lynch." He could just as easily push town, and the normal benefits of lynching a scumbuddy (town cred) aren't as valuable to scumFool, because he can't really carry a scumteam lategame, town will be curious why he's alive (Whether he a mythical mafia unicorn is up for debate, but some players can bus a teammate or two and ride the cred to lategame, some players will look SUSPICIOUS if they're alive in lategame, and so the benefit of lynching scumbuddies just isn't there for them). All of the above roughly says "I am worried about Foolishness/BH as well, but when I play it out in my mind, I think there are too many things that make it unlikely they are scumbuddies." Palmar/Caller aren't folks I'm worried about right atm. Hopefully there's a clearer picture of Caller as he keeps Callering aboot. Palmar unknown for me right now. | ||
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Tehpoofter
United States2911 Posts
BH: I read as town because of the Foolishness supposed QT thing looks like he has hard claimed now. Slam: Slam has shot someone who was threatening to shoot someone on the day 1 town wagon lynch in the claim that he was protecting them. Slam did look a bit better in day 2 he actually made some coherent posts: + Show Spoiler + On April 30 2014 00:29 Alakaslam wrote: That is actually a good point for me being shot. As for my shot people really want me to fabricate reasons where there were none, lol Like I panicked and did not read his clarification, I even understand now that was a mistake. What is funny is that recognizing this fact now makes me badass scum powerful, the all knowing scum genie. It actually makes me a recovered former retard- but hey if I must be lynched DOIT now. On May 01 2014 06:13 Alakaslam wrote: K here is something. IF foolishness is scum, so also is Koshi most likely even though that makes very little sense. If foolishness is town Koshi could still be scum but most likely he is t. That show he actually might be thinking about the game in a townie sense most of his others are 1 liners or vote hoping or incoherent to me. I honestly have no clue what to make of him from his posts cause I disagree with a lot of the reads he makes The only thing I find weird about the claim is the part about N1 N2 compare and no correlation to N3 N4 compare (tbh seems like a shitty cop to me but w.e.) Austin did the leg work and found that another Ver game had a parody cop like this so that would be really weird for scum to make up (although it does avoid him having to make up a check for tomorrow before we lynched his other check this is in a scum!Ceph world which I don't believe in) I'm going to read BH filter ignoring the QT bit and see where I end up. | ||
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Alakaslam
United States17336 Posts
Why did you shoot Koshi again? I legitimately forgot but I also want to hear it from you tehpoofter | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
 Give me an update on what I need to know, I'll be back tonight | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
On May 04 2014 02:41 Ace wrote: I told Ver I'd have activity problems Give me an update on what I need to know, I'll be back tonight Cephiro claimed parity cop. He checked Blazinghand night 1 and Alakaslam night 2. They have different alignment. The parity cop works in "pairs", like he will need two more nights to get another "pair" check. | ||
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Cephiro
Finland1934 Posts
Got the answer for the traitor thing, traitors are always considered "red/guilty" in my checks. So if I check a townie and a traitor = Different. A Scum and traitor = Same. Effectively the traitor is scum and needs to be killed so it doesn't really make a difference working like this. @Ace: I'm parity cop, one of Blazinghand & Alakaslam is scum. Work. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On May 03 2014 09:39 Foolishness wrote: I'm definitely not giving away anything about the mason QT unless it's necessary to confirm someone's alignment/behavior or until the traitor is dead. Mechanics about it only helps mafia/traitor who may have extra information regarding peoples' roles. Cephiro, do you know how your parity checks work in relation to the traitor? e.g. say you check the traitor night 1 and a town night 2, do you get a different result? Does it depend on if the traitor's been recruited (and if so when)? Why would this matter if BH is scum? He already has full access to it. I guess I can understand waiting until he flips if you want to but ultimately, the mafia knowing something and the town not knowing it doesn't benefit us. So if he flips red I expect you to start telling us more about this mason thing. And Austin, what more would you like me to say about slam? I felt what I wrote previously was concise enough. I don't think mafia would have the balls to do what he did day 1, particularly given how slam seems to play. I also don't think if he had a scum team they would want him to just randomly shoot someone day 1. Also we already had one mafia day vig flip, yes there could be more than one but I guess I'm willing to play the odds on this one when combining it with the other things I mentioned. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On May 03 2014 07:53 Blazinghand wrote: So, the wait a day strategy is substantially worse if we have to wait 2 days. Game might be effectively over by then. This also explains why Ceph claimed today instead of tomorrow, since he'd have only one comparison. His reasoning is internally consistent. Without a constant chain-link between checks an "anchor" check doesn't make sense either. This basically means that there's no longer a reason to think ceph is scum. We should not lynch him today. If I end up getting lynched before slam, my wish is now that slam be lynched next, not cephiro. Claim is believable. ##unvote ##vote alakaslam I am the OG Mason. Woo! someone changed tunes quick before. OG sounds like Original Gangster, so you just claimed scum. Man, I'm so good at this game. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
(1) Thoughts on prplhz responding to Cephiro's claim by wanting to lynch Foolishness. Do his thoughts read townie or scummy to you and WHY? (2) Who were your preliminary scum reads early on? Even if they have changed, who was it and why? I have a few preliminary scum reads but I need to get completely intimate with das thread first : P not going to throw myself into another retarded tunnel again if I can help it. (3) Does poofter's scumread on Koshi yesterday read as legit to you? If you think it's a legit scumread, do you agree/disagree with what he THOUGHT, and does your read update based on Koshi's conduct after the shot? As far as the lynch today goes, I THINK I'm in favor of lynching into slam/BH. In favor of lynching slam: Normally, when slam gets scumread a bunch, or just gets scumread and hounded by someone like rayn, he has a similar reaction to what he's done this game. Game not fun, don't want to play any/much, generally not participating in terms of scumhunting. His posts read like the wind has been taken out of his mafia fun sails. Best example I can think of here is ... whatever that game was with like Grack/BC/HF/thrawn/people scumteam. I was a vet, rayn got lynched as part of a double lynch D3, risen martyred as town, blah blah, scum won. Rayn was on slam's nuts for a bit, and slam just never seemed to get into the game. I KNOW in that game that I could keep talking with slam. He responded to questions, he had some comments of his own, interspersed with saying rayn made him want to quit the game. He was frustrated/did not want to play, but he was willing to communicate. He was frustrated TOWNIE. His response this game FEELS different. I've asked some questions - + Show Spoiler + On April 29 2014 07:57 austinmcc wrote: Slam, did you follow people's reactions to your shot well at all? Regardless of whether that's a yes or no, you know your own alignment, you know you shot someone and maybeprobablydefinitely should not have, especially if you actually hadn't read his recent posting, so I would <3<3<3 you looking through REACTIONS to your shot for what you find scummiest/towniest? On April 30 2014 06:55 austinmcc wrote: Slam, you were willing to vote oats, but never really said anything else about it. Is oats scummy/scum? Why? On May 01 2014 02:22 austinmcc wrote: Hey slam. I read your filter. I donated you posts yesterday so you could explain yoseff a little more. I see your OOP scumread, and I don't share your thoughts because while you say he's getting outside info or something, it reads to me like he's just flailing around and making stuff up ---> Ace shot people, etc. etc. If someone outside the thread is telling him that things happened when they didn't...well then the scumteam is already going down in flames. Are you willing to consolidate? Our of the 4 dudes above, anyone in PARTICULAR you want to lynch/don't want to lynch? p.s. seriously, you know I'm interested in oats. Plox to answer question? On May 01 2014 02:45 austinmcc wrote: How many times have I called you scum this game or put you on any kind of list I've made for shooting yamato? You shot yamato. That happened, it's over. I'm trying to move things forward here. You need to move things forward as well, imo, because people are more likely to find you townie for ... finding neat stuff, lynching scum, etc, than for talking about shooting yamato. You can  me or anyone else or everyone else or any chickens of any level of intoxication you'd like, but we had kind of a poopy end of D1, and we're on track for a poopy end of D2, and we gotta stop that.On May 02 2014 22:29 austinmcc wrote: Gone for a few hours, back this afternoon EST to look at this and other stuff. Slam, you trust Cephiro's claim? But when I donated him posts D1, including one for a silly post, he didn't want to silly post. His responses to my prodding are things like - + Show Spoiler + On May 01 2014 02:26 Alakaslam wrote: Nothing on OOP. Nothing specific on the 4 candidates D2. Well Oats b lurkin so yeah. I would say this I can do. Or On May 01 2014 02:34 Alakaslam wrote: When I'm not AT ALL asking about the shot, I don't care about the shot, I just want to get Slam in threadI havebeen kusplaining why it b really pretty hard to be arsed for this, it is often like if I put out an opinion folks will actually use that as an auxiliary to why someone who agrees should be lynched. So in reply town gets " o well then "And even then I post a huge dblue bold caps saying LOOK GUYS THIS IS WHY I IS THIS WHAT YOU WANT OF ME?And I hear " , Besides lynch foolishness no don't lynch foolishness wait what? !" So I "ok but I don't quit"BEYOND that, there's some meh stuff between him and Oats ---> + Show Spoiler [Not good but not damning] + On April 28 2014 12:20 Alakaslam wrote: Why is it always like this? BH I am saving a post to switch to oats at deadline if SNB isn't gonna be it. Will you be here? Anyone else on SNB gonna be here? 3 left On April 28 2014 12:23 Alakaslam wrote: IN THE MEANTIME MAYBE SOME FOLKS OVER THERE WANT TO SAY IF THEY WILL OR WILL NOT GO FOR THE REVERSE? WHO ON OATS IS WILLING TO SWITCH TO SNB? On May 01 2014 02:35 Alakaslam wrote: That's really scummy, scummy enough to vote for Also, some meh stuff between Oats and Slam (going the other way) ---> After slam's shot, oats decided slam was scum, we should vote him. Calls slam scum D1. Calls slam scum D2. We know now that he was a vigi, COULD have shot slam, and SOME townies would have been happy with him (b.c scumreads on slam). But he never shot his scumread, even though it MIGHT have bought him points with some townies. Not ... too much. But not wonderful. There are reasons to think BH is scum but I'm typed out for a moment. Mainly he just seems to do jack all and have strange trains of thought. People like...I dunno. VA, RoL, WoS, Poofter does Oats calling Slam scum but never shooting him seem at all relevant to you? | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On May 04 2014 03:11 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: There was just a bit you said, And Austin, what more would you like me to say about slam? I felt what I wrote previously was concise enough. I don't think mafia would have the balls to do what he did day 1, particularly given how slam seems to play. I also don't think if he had a scum team they would want him to just randomly shoot someone day 1. Also we already had one mafia day vig flip, yes there could be more than one but I guess I'm willing to play the odds on this one when combining it with the other things I mentioned. I don't believe he is scum based off that action and his posting in general. I got the actions, and I get the scumteam telling him not to take that shot thing, but I was wondering if there was any posting in particular that you liked. If he's town, he's trying to solve the game, and maybe there's something helpful there. | ||
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