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I'm a cop you idiot mafia 2 - Page 2

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 21:59 GMT
#84
First!
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 21:59 GMT
#86
Or not
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:03 GMT
#90
There's also a high chance that Mafia might hit Cop or Doctor at the deadline. But if not, it seems like Cop should claim D1. I don't really see downside to that.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:06 GMT
#95
On February 27 2014 07:05 JarJarDrinks wrote:
If VT dies N0:

- Cop should claim

elseif Doc dies N0:

- Cop should claim ONLY if he has a redcheck

elseif Cop dies N0:

- Maybe Doc should claim. Gonna give this some more thought


Why should Doc claim in any situation...?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:10 GMT
#99
Also it's probably best for Cop not to claim right away. There could be some juicy information to be had before Mafia can safely take a green/redcheck into account in their plans.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:13 GMT
#100
On February 27 2014 07:08 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:06 Xatalos wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:05 JarJarDrinks wrote:
If VT dies N0:

- Cop should claim

elseif Doc dies N0:

- Cop should claim ONLY if he has a redcheck

elseif Cop dies N0:

- Maybe Doc should claim. Gonna give this some more thought


Why should Doc claim in any situation...?


JJD actually probably isn't scum, because scum would know that Doc wouldn't ever claim cause that wouldn't really do anything to hurt scum. Scum would be aware of what tactics blues can use on them because scum has been hanging out chatting for a day now about the setup and claims. Unless JJD is doing a really good job of playing dumb, or he actually is dumb (he isn't), he's town. He clearly hasn't thought this true which is, (sigh), a townie trait.


Yeah, I have a hard time seeing such a blunder from scum. Too stupid to be scum prevails.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:25 GMT
#106
On February 27 2014 07:18 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:13 Xatalos wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:08 Blazinghand wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:06 Xatalos wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:05 JarJarDrinks wrote:
If VT dies N0:

- Cop should claim

elseif Doc dies N0:

- Cop should claim ONLY if he has a redcheck

elseif Cop dies N0:

- Maybe Doc should claim. Gonna give this some more thought


Why should Doc claim in any situation...?


JJD actually probably isn't scum, because scum would know that Doc wouldn't ever claim cause that wouldn't really do anything to hurt scum. Scum would be aware of what tactics blues can use on them because scum has been hanging out chatting for a day now about the setup and claims. Unless JJD is doing a really good job of playing dumb, or he actually is dumb (he isn't), he's town. He clearly hasn't thought this true which is, (sigh), a townie trait.


Yeah, I have a hard time seeing such a blunder from scum. Too stupid to be scum prevails.


Really what it comes down to is that even if JJD were the kind of guy to not think of this thing as scum, he also has a partner and he's been discussing with his partner for almost 24 hours. Scum NEEDS to fakeclaim in this setup. Whoever our 2 scummers are, they've been thinking about fakeclaiming for almost a day now; how to claim, when to claim, who will counterclaim, and what to claim. They know that Doctor shouldn't just claim willy-nilly. The only situations where that makes sense (ie doctor saves someone N1 and it's D2 and he wants to claim it or something) don't apply during D1 when the claims happen. JJD as scum would have thought this through. He would be trying to amass towncred by making good suggestions, and talking about "maybe the doc should claim if the cop dies n0" really makes no sense. Scum wouldn't even consider it as a threat to deal with.

It's mostly not about "too stupid to be scum" which is false (since a stupid player can of course roll scum) but that scum in this setup almost necessarily already know everything about claiming, and JJD clearly does not. He couldn't have known I'd latch onto this and call him town for it; in fact, an ineffective statement like that is more likely to draw fire than praise, so as scum he'd try to only make true statements rather than things that don't make sense.


I was referring to the fact that it would be too stupid to make a suggestion like that as scum after discussing strategy for 24 hours.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:31 GMT
#107
JJD's plan makes a certain amount of sense. It'll depend a lot on the situation though (it might be a useful idea if Mafia hit a VT and it's hard to tell which of the claimers is lying).
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:38 GMT
#110
Btw Sn0_Man, you think BH's early tryhard makes him scum or that was just a joke?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:41 GMT
#112
On February 27 2014 07:38 JarJarDrinks wrote:
Here's the other thing w/ the cop dying N0.

If we are about to lynch scum, there WILL be a doc claim. Then the real doc counters and we end up w/ the claim anyway. @ least if we force the claim early, we're making scum commit to their lie before the fact.


There's merit in forcing scum to act without knowledge of the power roles though. If Cop/Doc just claim right away, scum can plan accordingly and keep their stories straight more easily.

Not to mention that it's wasteful to get a Doc killed for no clear reason.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:45 GMT
#117
I don't really think there is any good situation for a Doc to claim unless it's to clearly save himself or another townie (that was NK'd earlier, for example).
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:46 GMT
#121
On February 27 2014 07:44 Sn0_Man wrote:
oke jjd is actively promoting ways for town to lose tho wtf


Thus arriving at the conclusion that he wouldn't propose plans like this as scum after 24 hours of planning...
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:48 GMT
#127
On February 27 2014 07:45 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:02 Blazinghand wrote:
actually yeah let me add to this: don't fakeclaim doctor or cop if you are not the doctor or cop. This will only go poorly.

Aww I kinda thought about this


ALSO DON'T CLAIM VT CAUSE IT MAKES IT EASIER FOR SCUM TO SHOOT THE COP/DOC.



It's all a big WIFOM anyways. He could as well be saying this as non-VT.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:51 GMT
#133
On February 27 2014 07:47 Sn0_Man wrote:
how many levels deep of "they know that we know that they know that we know..." did you go?


Anything is possible, but JJD seems sincere enough to me. It'd be a risky WIFOM-play to do that and I doubt it's some master plan they prepared for N0........
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:52 GMT
#134
We couldn't roll scum together again Artanis
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:53 GMT
#137
On February 27 2014 07:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Basically no one should vote until town collectively decided on a lynch.


Maybe we should pseudo-vote before executing the actual vote?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:54 GMT
#138
On February 27 2014 07:53 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:52 Xatalos wrote:
We couldn't roll scum together again Artanis

What do you mean? My role pm clearly sta-
oh shit.


Damn, now you ruined it!
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:55 GMT
#141
On February 27 2014 07:54 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:53 Xatalos wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Basically no one should vote until town collectively decided on a lynch.


Maybe we should pseudo-vote before executing the actual vote?

That wouldn't apply pressure appropriately. We should just be aware that putting someone at Hammer-2 is the same as hammering them basically if they are town and all the voters are scum.


Yeah, true. I don't think I'll be voting until I'm very confident that I want to lynch.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:56 GMT
#142
On February 27 2014 07:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 27 2014 07:53 Xatalos wrote:
On February 27 2014 07:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Basically no one should vote until town collectively decided on a lynch.


Maybe we should pseudo-vote before executing the actual vote?

yeah, we should. Something like
##HazingBland Xatalos
would be neat. Then when someone reaches a majority of HazingBlands they should claim. Clearly you need to be hesitant with the use of HazingBlands.


BH does have a point though. It's not nearly as much pressure as having 2-3 actual votes.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
February 26 2014 22:58 GMT
#146
Hmmm. Maybe we could try that. It would at least make it easier to see where everyone stands (without risking scum hammer).
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
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