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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
I've consulted with a few people and I'm going to make everyone vote, regardless of their status of mission leader. As I have changed this rule on the fly, it will not take effect until after Day 1 ends. However, in the interest of documentation, I would like to request Adam to formally vote on the team thread. You have already "voted yes" so why the sudden hesitation? | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 29 2013 09:39 Adam4167 wrote: Sentinel, if you could change your vote, would you switch it? Rayn, same question to you No i wouldn't. I don't trust you, especially after your comment on the top of the current page. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 29 2013 09:08 Grackaroni wrote: well, Rayn is on the team. so that vote isn't indicative of scum wanting to down vote an all town team. I'd guess VE is probably more interested in making his own team. Basically this. This is a good post. Me nay-voting is definitely not a "+" for saying "i think this is an all-town team". | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 28 2013 12:13 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Hopeless is talking with more sense and clarity that I can conjure up, and his posts do seem a lot more complete than what I saw in my quick browse of his LXIII filter. I like Adam calling out Koshi as well instead of just hopping on board with everyone else (including me). In some way this makes me think he carefully thought out his team. I trust him and I trust his view on Hopeless. Rayn's been stepping up as our chief discussion leader so I trust him too. I'm okay with this mission. Voting yay I like what Sentinel says about Hopeless, and i like what he says about Adam calling out Koshi. The problem is earlier on Koshi was a strong candidate for Sentinel's pick if was to pick a team. Why did you change your mind on Koshi? Another problem with the post is what Sentinel did - he yay-voted amongst the first people for Adam's team. Now he is "holding judgement" on VE's team, when in fact it should be easier to vote in a way or another, as he is one of the teammembers, he has to judge only 2 people, not 3. Explain that Sentinel. Also again, here he says Koshi and VE are shaky, why? VisceraEyes - VE seems to be thinking i am town but at some point i am not any more of his top picks, and somehow me + Hopeless are swapped with Sentinel + Cora. Why? I also get the feeling VE is laid back and playing more with a reactionary playstyle rather than being pro-active. Is there any reason for that VE? You yourself said this game is more about town hunting than scum hunting, which is true, i don't get the feeling you are trying to find out if people are town or not, and it bothers me. On the other hand his posts are clear and the point comes across easily for me, nothing too suspicious about VE besides his lack of pro-activiness and him picking the team almost immediately when he had 24h. Adam4167 - I really do not like the fact Adam down-voted his own team, which in his opinion should be all town as he picked it. I would like him to fully explain the thoguht process behind doing so. To me it makes no sense he first says "ofc ima vote yay", then argues that the team is all town when it meets resistance and proceeds on down-voting it. Corazon - He looks fairly town to me. I do not think he has played Resistance before and still he was fearless giving his opinions on how people should act in certain situations. While i think his opinions were wrong i think it strongly points towards him being town. He is also being pro-active in sharing his reads and asking people's opinions on things. I still would love to hear more on his reasoning behind his reads. Chairman Ray - I really really did not like him discussing spy strategies. Like he told "there is something need to talk about after missions", then when people asked him why, it seemed to me he went defensive and gave people what they wanted. While the information he gave out was correct, it was something that should not be given out imo. Spies can't communicate outside the thread and if CR is a spy he just told his scummates how to play. That's fishy. He's been more talking about strategy than actual reads, does anyone know who CR thinks is town/scum? Because i don't. I also did not like his "it doesn't matter who we send on the first mission so let's just get over with it". That's entirely incorrect. Grackaroni - Grack has had some good points on things, mainly on the nay-votes on Adam's team proposal. I can't really tell his alignment in a way or another as he has only commented on things i find to be quite small and i can't figure out what agenda he is trying to push. Need to hear more from him. Koshi - I don't like Koshi's heuristics. At all. To me it seems like he wants to sit behind some principles like "let's send the most active players" to not having to contribute on people's alignments with real arguments. That's definitely a wrong way to play this game. Especially D1 in Resistance is not much different from Mafia, besides that town-hunting is more beneficial than scumhunting. Not doing either of them is really bad. I would like to hear his reasoning for his reads, not like he does it now ("if these people are town then good - we should send them to find out"), but rather like ("i think these people are town for XYZ, that's why we should send them"). Right now Koshi seems to be working backwards and that's really worrying. Hopeless1der - Hopeless seems really pro-active in comparsion to other games i have played with him. I like Hopeless' posts, he seems to be thinking alike me. Hopeless one question, why did you yay-vote Adam's team as he was null for you? That's pretty much all i have to say atm. I would like people to answer my concerns so i can tell you how we win this game after that.  I am not voting yet and i advice others to do so aswell, we have time, there is no need to rush as it costs as valuable discussion time. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 30 2013 06:05 Koshi wrote: Koshi has already commented on people their alignments with real arguments. Why do you suggest I am trying to play without doing that? I clearly am giving reads and probably am within the top 3 of people giving reads on everything. VisceraEyes/Corazon is my scumteam atm. Can't shake the feeling and I had it for a long time now. I said why already. + now there is a scumslip. Koshi, Not VE, Not Cora No Koshi, you havn't given any reads. Only things that could be considered as reads are in this post of yours: + Show Spoiler + On December 29 2013 07:19 Koshi wrote: Cora going after me so soon was cute, but now he is too invested in it for no reason. I was not getting elected or was elected and Cora is already making plans to not let me go on mission 2 & 3. There is no townie reason for that. He kept blackening my name with his joke "pulling a Koshi". VE was playing it cool. Staying in the back, I thought he was gathering reads and not letting the scummers feel his presence at first. VE even made the comment "even when I am not elected I can still give good reads", but after adam made his team. VE came into the picture and instantly undermined Adam without touching the team, no townie reason for that. The follow up reads VE gave was null on adam. Nothing at all on rayn and Hopeless. Town on Cora and Sentinel. Which doesnt make sense, if Adam is nullish and the biggest problem in that team. Then VE has already townreads on rayn, Hopeless, Cora and Sentinel. Pretty strong stuff. But VE is not that confident at all in his post, he should be pushing a nay vote from everybody and be captain himself, pick his reads and own this game for town. But he isn't, he is still unsure about what to do when his team gets through and he will have to pick sabotage or not. VE is scum. Pretty sure about him. CR is town for spilling all the information. I am a guy that hasnt played resistance yet and I feel CR his information is helping me. Unless CR is teamed with 2 noobies there is no reason for him to be noobfriendly. Sadly people are thinking I am scum so this is looking like exactly the thing CR as scum would do to help me but nope. I am not scum. CR is being neutral atm. Neutral is good. VE pretended to be neutral at start but wasnt after first team got out. Cora is pushing me (town) out of mission 1-3. Read on VE is somewhat understandable, reads on Cora and CR are not. Cora trying to figure out your alignment is a scumtell? Why? Read on CR is crap for what i have stated already. "Spilling the beans" is a scumtell in Resistance because of no out thread comm for spies. Does it make CR scum? Not necessarily, but it definitely does not make him town. All other reads you have given are some arbitary teams you suggest and then you tell what me might learn if the mission with those people will fail/succeed. That's not giving reads, that's working backwards. I can point out ~10 exmples from your filter if you want to argue about this. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
However i disagree with you on Koshi, the way he is working is not correct and does not make him town. He constantly uses reasoning like "if these people are town then good", "if the mission fails then.." when discussing teams. That's not how you should play. You give reads, pick townies, and then re-evaluate if the mission fails. Picking someone / not picking someone because "if the mission fails then what?" is a wrong way to work, that's not reasoning that makes someone town/scum. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 30 2013 06:26 Hopeless1der wrote: I didn't actually state my read of Cora: I'd call him a spy at the moment. This felt way too easy of a +1 without any critical thought behind it. I didn't like this post. Combined with associative I think Koshi is town -> Therefore Cora scum. And then you make this terrible post.. Ugh.. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
So you think me, Hopeless, Cora and Sent are town right? What abbout the rest of the people, who are scum and who would you say is the last townie? | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
Please other people, come in and play as well. D1 is a crucial part of this game and i really do want an all town team to go. This is dumb atm because noone is playing ffs. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
If your scum team is correct, then why did both Koshi and Chairman Ray vote yay yesterday? ...is exactly the kind of behavior you should bee looking & questioning in Resistance games if you are town. That's probably one of the best posts in thread. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
If he was town he should have made conclusions right after the team got nay-voted. Also if Adam is scum, and VE's reads are otherwise correct, why would Adam nay-vote his own team, there would be scum in it? | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
About the discussion point. I think that's the most WIFOM'y thing discussed on D1 and all the people who discussed it should be under scrutiny. Nay-voting a team especially on D1 because "you want more discussion" is an easy way for scum to hide behind if the proposed team is all town. If the team is all town and you think so, you should be yay-voting it because the point is to pass teams that are all town. If people nay-vote because they "want more discussion" that actually kills the discussion because the votes are not because of reads but something else, you can't tell the real motivation or mkae conclusions about people's reasons. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=439135¤tpage=16#311 Doesn't really answer my question. He's doing what Koshi is doing, working backwards. At least based on this. | ||
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