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On October 03 2013 22:39 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 22:22 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Hey Holyflare where did you go?
Why do you feel like i am talking about Oats when i am clearly not?
Also do you think your case on him was good or not? Was making lunch. Talking about me talking about oats is what I'm implying. If only me, bh, risen and oats were talking at the start of the game and a person says that you are scum no matter what you say then they are stifling the discussion so yes, the points I made make sense and that is why I kept my vote on him further. He later dropped it and pursued other avenues of thought and thus, like I said, i removed my vote on him.
Okay so you basically OMGUSed Oats based on his vote on you, and when he dropped it, you dropped your vote on him right?
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Can you just directly answer my question Holyflare, instead of flip-flopping around it?
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Okay so, here is what i am trying to say. This is what Holyflare says about his unvoting Oats:
On October 03 2013 21:38 Holyflare wrote:.... OatsHe starts out with his vote on me, convinced I am scum etc etc. He has the whole debacle with BH in which nothing really happens, he defend the fact that his vote is still on me, however, does not try and question it or contemplate that anyone else could be scum. I attribute this to the fact that it was early on in the game and there was no total alternative but it still seemed a bit tunnely to me (Which he actually addressed later on when he unvoted). + Show Spoiler +On October 02 2013 14:01 Oatsmaster wrote:All those words. That dont mean anything. Show nested quote +it's the top scum play to stifle discussion. With his sure stance on me being scum and despite me resonding why I posted what I did is it not he who is in fact stifling the discussion?
I meant saying that someone is stifling discussion is what scum always like to do. Show nested quote +The fact that you say everyone else agrees with you in this thread is just testament to the fact that you have put no effort or thought into your stance and are just going with the flow to follow up for an 'easy' lynch. Everyone else thinks that you are scummy. Therefore I cant do anything more to convince people at this point of time. COME ON HOLYFLARE. STOP POSTING LONG POSTS. NOT GOOD. You and BH are probably not on the same scumteam but I have a way more sure read on you than on BH. BH, is Holyflare a noob or not? He tells me to stop posting long posts, and that the points had no merit but then unvoted me after he re-read the next day. Which I also like about him. He's not afraid to admit that he was wrong and tunnel visioned. He's posted a lot of bs about how people can be scum if someone else is scum which seemed a bit like he was foreshadowing future events ie. + Show Spoiler +On October 02 2013 23:59 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 23:50 Clarity_nl wrote:On October 02 2013 23:19 Oatsmaster wrote:Cause its hard to see tiny little Vote FOR DUDES.  Marv you scum? Do you think he is? Hmm. Ok so another reason why I think HF is town. If marv is scum with him, then Marv wont call him town. If marv is town, marv is probably right. So both ways, HF is town I think. I think that marv is null, he hasnt shown much of anything either way. I think Oats is making points about people that were original (ie. risen, although they work both ways) and he has stuck to Dirkzor, which I think was good seeing as people seemingly dismissed everything about him. I honestly think a lynch on oats would be a bad thing at this current point in time. I know my vote was/is on him but that was because I had been called out urgently yesterday and I apologise.
Later on he says he unvoted Oats because of his detunnel and because it is reasonable. Okay, this is cool and everything, except for:
On October 02 2013 22:56 Oatsmaster wrote:
I read/detunneled.
##vote Dirkzor
also sheeping marv is cool.
On October 03 2013 01:18 Holyflare wrote:.... As for oats, Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 23:59 Oatsmaster wrote:On October 02 2013 23:50 Clarity_nl wrote:On October 02 2013 23:19 Oatsmaster wrote:Cause its hard to see tiny little Vote FOR DUDES. Marv you scum? Do you think he is? Hmm. Ok so another reason why I think HF is town. If marv is scum with him, then Marv wont call him town. If marv is town, marv is probably right. So both ways, HF is town I think. I think that marv is null, he hasnt shown much of anything either way. That's ridiculous wifom and adds nothing to the entire topic. I don't like it one bit. Especially coupled with, Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 22:56 Oatsmaster wrote:
I read/detunneled.
##vote Dirkzor
also sheeping marv is cool.
+ Show Spoiler +On October 02 2013 13:35 Oatsmaster wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2013 13:33 Blazinghand wrote:On October 02 2013 13:29 Oatsmaster wrote:On October 02 2013 13:28 Blazinghand wrote:On October 02 2013 13:26 Oatsmaster wrote:On October 02 2013 13:23 Blazinghand wrote:On October 02 2013 13:20 Oatsmaster wrote:On October 02 2013 13:17 Blazinghand wrote:On October 02 2013 13:16 Oatsmaster wrote:On October 02 2013 13:15 Blazinghand wrote:
[quote]
What's your read on Risen? null ~~ town Why? Cause he doesnt hop on the RNG lynch wagon. And cause he called Holyflare scum. I personally do not find either of these reasons compelling. A decision to hop or not hop on the RNG lynch wagon is dependent on personal ideas about how useful RNG is, and whether or not it paints someone as scummy depends on their reasoning and history, not the simple fact that they did or did not hop on. Calling holyflare scum, likewise, is not in and of itself a good strat. I too don't like holyflare's play, but you think I am scum, and it is almost certainly because of my interactions with holyflare. Instead of calling him a newb card player and voting him, as risen did, without serious explanation and an attempt to help him, I actually interacted with him seriously. playing the newb card is also something newbies do. the optimal response is mine, not risen's. Mine determines holyflare's alignment. Risen did not attempt to suss out what was up with holyflare. he laid some smackdown, but hasn't seriously followed it up. Where is he in convincing me to vote holyflare as I interact with holyflare? After all, he thinks holyflare is scum, no? I find risen scummy for that reason. I think you're scum for pulling the RNG bullshit again. I didnt attempt to find out what was up with holyflare, I laid some smackdown! So am I scum for that too? Holyflare is scum because he instantly jumps on a policy and then writes a whole bunch of stuff saying he is a noob. Without actually saying those words. Yes, that's a scummy thing you did. Are you claiming it's not scummy? Your goal, especially in a small newbie like this, should be to interact and find out more about him, unless you're so clearly sure he's scum that you're done with him. Im very clearly sure he's scum. Also, you know there are pressure votes? And I can change my vote at any time? So its not like once I vote for him, I cant change my mind. So yeah, I dunno why you are calling me and Risen scum because we have scumreads we are willing to vote on. Why isnt Holyflare interacting with me if he called me scum then? I don't see how your vote being a pressure vote means that you can't write a case, try to convince people, or hell, try to interact with the guy you're supposedly pressuring. Of course you can change your mind! The fact that you and Risen are scummy (and i'm not 100% sure that either of you are scum, of course) isn't that you vote, it's HOW you vote. Do you understand this? On October 02 2013 13:31 Oatsmaster wrote:
Since when does BH play self righteous dick?
As any alignment?
So you thing this is... null? or are you just whining. I dont understand how you equate having a extreme stance on someone from their first post = scummy. Both me and Risen explained reasons to think that Holyflare is scum and you seem to think that Holyflare is scummy too. WHAT THE FUCK IS THERE TO CONVINCE YOU ABOUT ?? ? ? ?? ? I dont know if you are bad or if you are scum BH. Dirkzor had "an extreme stance on a first post" but it's ok to vote him now for it? Especially as you now say: Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 00:23 Oatsmaster wrote:
Man both Marv and Clarity are saying the exact same things. If you agree with Marv on his vote, why is it such a factor to you that someone else agrees with it so openly? At least he has put forth reasoning into his voting, even if it is similar to marvs. Yours just straight up changed until you were pressured to post why you switched and even then you haven't told us why you are voting dirk?
This can't be a reason for his unvote, because he does not unvote before now. He even quotes Oats' post where Oats "detunnels", and does not say it's good or anything. He only says it later on, when the thread sentiment is not in favor of lynching Oats anymore! Also his reasons for voting for Oats are bad in the first place.
##Unvote:
##Vote: Holyflare
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On October 03 2013 22:50 Clarity_nl wrote:
Why does it feel like this cycle has been so unproductive?
I don't understand this whole rayn/holyflare thing.
rayn, hasn't holyflare voted for sloosh, who you described as scummy?
What does Holyflare voting for Sloosh have to do with anything?
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On October 03 2013 23:16 marvellosity wrote:
rayn, just to clarify - you think Holyflare is mafia because
1) at the time that Oats unvoted, Holyflare thought it was a crock of shit
2) later on, Holyflare said he liked the fact that Oats unvoted?
That's the meat of it, right?
Yes.
+ the fact that his reasons for voting for Oats in the first place do not add up. He voted for Oats because of rng, then started finding reasons for Oats being scum. The reasons are bad and do not make Oats scum.
+ the fact that "hey this is how we find D1 lynch" is bullshit.
+ the fact that when i questioned him, he was trying to paint the discussion stupid "because why discuss Oats" when i am cleraly not discussing Oats.
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Like: "shus.. why do you want to discuss Oats, i have already unvoted him, see".
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On October 03 2013 23:20 Dirkzor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 23:07 marvellosity wrote:On October 03 2013 22:54 Dirkzor wrote:
Ok I read everything. Need to get back to work.
At first glance HF big post is just that. Big. He talks about 5 people.
Oats: who he was voting for, but now find him less scummy for reason I really didn't understand. Oats pulling the case on me back can be a good move for both scum and town.
Then there is me and Risen. Both of whom are scummy but not lynch worthy.
Sloosh and Rayn however are is top lynch choices. Other then that he really just recaps what have been happening during day 1.
This post appears to be missing a conclusion. Yeah it does... Was in a hurry :D The point was that the post was big when it wasn't supposed to be. Why not write why he think sloosh is scummy and vote him. Maybe add tidbits of other things he think is worth noticing. Instead he makes recaps and adds bits about 5 people he finds scummy. Thats a bit much. Maybe I have it stuck in my head now to read everything he writes as if he was scum but it just seems like a posting style that scum prefer because it makes them seem productive.
What's different about Holyflare's post in comparsion to mine?
Do you find him more scummy than me?
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On October 03 2013 23:35 Dirkzor wrote:
Yours is equally bad for the same reasons but you don't have the history of making your posting get that towny feel. Also your post include no recaps. They just state.
There is nothing in your post that make me believe you are more town now then before the post. I'm interested in your beef with HF, because somehow I think it is a reach.
So my post is equally bad for same reasons but the reasons are different? How does that make sense?
And how is my case reaching?
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On October 03 2013 23:48 Dirkzor wrote:Actually the more I think about it the scummier your post gets. You get called out for inactivity and not producing. Of course you claim this is not alignment indicative but then you start producing like a maniac. First of after spending some 24 hours in the RNG BH thing your conclusion is rather weak. You then proceed to jump on a minor (imo) thing about HF. Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 23:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 03 2013 23:16 marvellosity wrote:
rayn, just to clarify - you think Holyflare is mafia because
1) at the time that Oats unvoted, Holyflare thought it was a crock of shit
2) later on, Holyflare said he liked the fact that Oats unvoted?
That's the meat of it, right? Yes. + the fact that his reasons for voting for Oats in the first place do not add up. He voted for Oats because of rng, then started finding reasons for Oats being scum. The reasons are bad and do not make Oats scum. + the fact that "hey this is how we find D1 lynch" is bullshit. + the fact that when i questioned him, he was trying to paint the discussion stupid "because why discuss Oats" when i am cleraly not discussing Oats. Of those 3 bullets I only really think number 1 is worth noting.
What's minor about HF giving a reason for his Oats unvote that holds no water?
What's wrong with the point #3?
I can see that #2 can come from a townie aswell, but leaning mafia, because more likely.
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On October 03 2013 23:52 Clarity_nl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 23:16 marvellosity wrote:
rayn, just to clarify - you think Holyflare is mafia because
1) at the time that Oats unvoted, Holyflare thought it was a crock of shit
2) later on, Holyflare said he liked the fact that Oats unvoted?
That's the meat of it, right? He never calls oats' detunnel bad though. He quoted that post because it showed that oats was sheeping you, which he thought was a crock of shit because he called you null. @rayn Yes, he ignores oats unvoting him. Then later he says he liked it. Please explain what is scummy
Because if he likes it he should have unvoted at that time? He said later on, that it was the main reason for him to keep his vote on Oats (Oats voting for him), and he said it was one of the main reasons for him to unvote him. That didn't look like it when he first brought Oats' unvote up.
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Holyflare, incorrect.
Why do people try to incorrectly meta me lately?
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On October 04 2013 00:07 Holyflare wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2013 00:03 Clarity_nl wrote:On October 04 2013 00:02 Holyflare wrote:
Now, if you can't get your head around that I'd REALLY like to discuss actual people who may be scum!? Do you have a read on rayn after this push on you? Yes, he's wasted 7 pages on me discussing a vote on oats instead of addressing what other people have been talking about. I make a post and he deviates to asking me about the early game. Why? I'm not sure. He starts off by not saying anything and then contrary to his previous game cases he has made a post that lists his thoughts on people rather than actual cases. His case he made on me was indicative of someone who did not read around the posts he was making a case on and has deflected from discussion that I think would have been more appropriate especially concerning the thread sentiment at the moment. Scummy? I'm not sure. Confirmation biased. Yes.
Let's debunk a lie here. My one of the first posts in Titanic:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 29 2013 04:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:Oatsmaster - Has about 25% of the posts in this game. When Oats posts shitton he is town. Is also making sense. Vivax - Has good posts and trying to figre out stuff. On the other hand i feel like something is not right here. I have no idea what it is but i think Vivax is worth looking more closely into. Clarity_nl - Definitely yown. I like his thought process on like everything. Is pushing his reads and doing that hard. IMCaptainJackSparrow - Town, pretty sure of it. His exchange with exarezee was interesting and he came out of it much better looking. I think he should let Oats go and find a mafia target instead. It's not so hard to see Oats is town. Paperscraps - Posting feel genuine and he had good points until his last post. This one: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=422720¤tpage=26#501 , where he says he should not explain why his read on Oats is what it is. That to me seems like he has a read on Oats that he is not able to explain. Bad. Malongo - Purely based on his first post and my experience with him in other games. VayneAuthority - I think Vayne's posting implies he is town. I don't like him not giving out his reads if he thinks someone is mafia, but that's how he rolls on D1 as town. Definitely not worth lynching. Stutters695 - I really liked Stutters' post about Vivax early on. I dunno what makes him think CJS is mafia, and i'm waiting on his case on paperscraps. hzflank - I had a big big red read on hzflank before this: "I did start to prepare a case on Oats yesterday but I cancelled it shortly after starting. As I was writing it I became less sure that Oats was scum and I did not want to post a case that I did not believe in myself. That is fairly normal for me as I seem to be good at convincing myself that someone is not scum." That basically proves that hzflank is town, that is so incredibly genuine. Koshi - Says people should not pressure FT, wrong. People who are scummy should be pressured. His vote on hzflank is horrible, it's clear that he doesn't even think the dude is scum. Other than that he has not done anything that can be considered scumhunting. FirmTofu - Early on says that "we should talk about the game instead of general bullshit", which he has been talking about in his every post before that. Later on he corrects himself that he was talking about RPing, gifs etc. That's as useless as lurker-lynch talk. tsk tsk. CJS posts btw are totally not fluff, they were at time amongst the best in the game. His stance on JAT is fucking weird and his exarezee case accuses him for same things he says about JAT. He is throwing shit left and right but not trying to figure out who are scum with exarezee, who is he voting at. He is not questioning him at all but soft-accusing other people. justanothertownie - I don't think he has said anything useful. His vote on Paper is pretty shitty because paper has at least expressed some reads, which JAT has not done at all. Only thing he has done is to get into a shitfest with Oats, which is not useful thing to do for a townie. exarezee - He has posted a fuckton and he is new. I don't think there is a chance that he is mafia based purely on that. The cases / votes on him are shit, none of those reasons make him mafia.
Vivax, who do you actually think is mafia? Where is your head at. I was assuming you to take a town leading status and drive the discussion into important matters. You are staying in the sidelines and not doing much. Why is that? Koshi, all you have done is posted useless lists. Who do you think is scum and why? What is your stance on FirmTofu? Do you still think he is town? FirmTofu, wanna lynch Koshi? Or can you give me reasons to not lynch him? Stutters, you wanna make that case on Paper?
##Vote: FirmTofuDefinitely scummiest person so far. His case on exarezee is bad. All the points on him are assumptions that cannot be defended against other than "no, you are wrong". There is no concrete evidence. Then he calls him wishy-washy as exarezee does not have a clear stance on someone. Look at what he says about JAT after that. "I can move my vote on him if you make a good enough case". Right...
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EBWOP: When i am unable to -- for whatever reason -- play properly at the start of the game i sum up where i am when caught and understood everything.
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On October 04 2013 00:21 Oatsmaster wrote:
Rayn tunnels really stupidly as town probably more often than as scum or he doesnt do it as scum at all.
That's not true btw.
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On October 04 2013 00:22 Holyflare wrote:
I can't read past 10 pages of your posts so I can't read it all so I just went on posts by BH who seemed to know. Either way, it's impossible for us to know whether you are capable of posting or not unless you specifically state that?? Also, my points still stand, we're not on the topic of finding actual scum STILL.
What? If BH says something about me you straight up believe it? Why is that?
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So hey guys. I gotta go in appoximately 1,5 hours and i can't be sure if i am back before the deadline so could we just decide the lynch to some extent so i can be a part of it?
Holyflare: For what i said.
Dirkzor: To me it seems like he is really wishy-washy about everything everytime he posts. Only when he is "pushed into some direction" he makes some conclusions.
I dunno which is worse?
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BH if you are still thinking i am scum ask me what do you want to know now please.
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On October 04 2013 00:29 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2013 00:28 raynpelikoneet wrote:
BH if you are still thinking i am scum ask me what do you want to know now please. I'm still catching up on the thread, i haven't read everything yet. HOW CONVENIENT that you're leaving now! So. Why the sudden activity burst? Is your only excuse for posting tons of crappy oneliners that you somehow couldn't post? How were you planning to help town for the first 3/4 of D1 with your level of activity? Why shouldn't I lynch you?
I am fucking sorry i have some other things to do than be here.
I was planning on trying to figure out what the fuck is going on and why. It was hard because of you.
Because i am town.
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On October 04 2013 00:33 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 03 2013 22:03 raynpelikoneet wrote:On October 03 2013 22:01 marvellosity wrote:
rayn, why are you going after Holy now when you've shown no incliniation to go after him before he came back to the thread?
I don't understand. Because i tend to interact with people who are in thread. I'm impatient to wait for answers for hours, i have a train of thought and i want to disclose it with quick back and forth discussion. That's what i always do. this is like kinda literally not true given that I've posted and quoted a game (link) (link) in which although you do some back and forth, you're writing big cases as well. Big posts. serious reads. strong plays up front. Plays like this: + Show Spoiler +On July 16 2013 20:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 13:48 slOosh wrote:
Hey guys.
If people are unsure about how to mason, they should just avoid using it. Worst thing we can do is have all the discussion going on in PM land and nothing to go off of someone's alignment other than their mason's read on them.
While Vayne made a personal choice not to mason, you seem to be directing people to avoid using it. Do you have an inherent motivation to discourage people from masoning? A discussion in "PM land" doesn't prevent discussions from happening in thread. I can't see why you would recommend people not to mason at all. I actually second this. Sloosh answer. This is really stupid, everyone should mason. There is no reason not to. Why do you think there is? ##Vote: slOoshAs for Hapa's questions: + Show Spoiler +On July 16 2013 13:17 Hapahauli wrote:
Hey all!
Regarding PM usage, I think a very good early use of PM's is to try and establish the alignment of someone you know very well. For instance, I already used my first mason on Yamato77, who I'm very adept at reading and is a pretty good town player. Through these efforts I will slowly build a scum-hunting circle of awesomeness.
I'll admit I'm a tad worried about the post-count restriction and our ability to jumpstart Day 1 reliably, especially if spammy players are concerned about the post-limit. As a result, perhaps a good 'ol fashioned questionnaire might be best to kick things off!
1) What are your views on PM usage? How and when should they be used?
2) Are there any policy lynches around the posting-limit we should consider? (i.e. if someone doesn't use all their posts, they get lynched, etc)
3) Who are players you feel you can read very well and reliably in this game? 1) To find scum. Not going to be more specific, but i want to know why are you so eager to know this from all the players? 2) No, lurkers should be vigged asap. If someone wastes their posts on bullshit we lynch them. 3) Oats. Vayne. Both town. DrH, please if you are town. Do not waste your posts arguing with Vayne. His argument is more likely to come from a townie than from mafia, and you are just wasting posts into that. Vayne will prove his alignment later for sure, but he is probably town. FirmTofu, What was the purpose of your first post? You yourself said "it should not be considered alignment indicative", and basically everything you said i disagree with, or the statements / "advice" is obvious. Why would you make a post that does not help us finding scum or figuring out your alignment? VE, explain your vote on DrH, how does that make him scum? Do you think he is intentionally wasting his posts? Malongo, yes i'm a Finn. Now do something that finds us mafia? On July 17 2013 03:09 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 16 2013 14:05 FirmTofu wrote:On July 16 2013 13:48 slOosh wrote:
Hey guys.
If people are unsure about how to mason, they should just avoid using it. Worst thing we can do is have all the discussion going on in PM land and nothing to go off of someone's alignment other than their mason's read on them.
While Vayne made a personal choice not to mason, you seem to be directing people to avoid using it. Do you have an inherent motivation to discourage people from masoning? A discussion in "PM land" doesn't prevent discussions from happening in thread. I can't see why you would recommend people not to mason at all. I actually second this. Sloosh answer. This is really stupid, everyone should mason. There is no reason not to. Why do you think there is? ##Vote: slOosh Show me where I said no one should mason. I meant you are discouraging people to mason if they are unsure of what to do with PM's. That's dumb. Why are you telling people they don't need to mason anyone if they do not want to? Of course they do, because it helps town. If you are unsure of what to do with your PM's and therefore do not mason, don't listen to slOosh, he should know better.
Mason me and i'll tell you what to do. FFS you can ask your mason partner how you should use your PM's, and tell the thread what he said. Be creative and not fall into this dumb "i'm so bad in off-thread comm, i ignore it" bullshit.I will lynch you if you ignore it, because off thread comm helps town more than it helps mafia. It gives the town opportunity to make plans and catch scum in different ways. And don't give that bullshit "what if you mason mafia or are wrong about your read". That'll come clear eventually, or you out your logs and someone else might be able to see it. TLDR;Everyone needs to mason 2 people, not necessarily at the start of the game. If you dont know what to do with PM's, mason me.
gumshoe explain to me how you reached your conclusion in the DrH/FirmTofu exchange? On July 17 2013 03:09 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:24 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 16 2013 14:05 FirmTofu wrote:On July 16 2013 13:48 slOosh wrote:
Hey guys.
If people are unsure about how to mason, they should just avoid using it. Worst thing we can do is have all the discussion going on in PM land and nothing to go off of someone's alignment other than their mason's read on them.
While Vayne made a personal choice not to mason, you seem to be directing people to avoid using it. Do you have an inherent motivation to discourage people from masoning? A discussion in "PM land" doesn't prevent discussions from happening in thread. I can't see why you would recommend people not to mason at all. I actually second this. Sloosh answer. This is really stupid, everyone should mason. There is no reason not to. Why do you think there is? ##Vote: slOosh Show me where I said no one should mason.
I meant you are discouraging people to mason if they are unsure of what to do with PM's. That's dumb. Why are you telling people they don't need to mason anyone if they do not want to? Of course they do, because it helps town.
If you are unsure of what to do with your PM's and therefore do not mason, don't listen to slOosh, he should know better.
Mason me and i'll tell you what to do. FFS you can ask your mason partner how you should use your PM's, and tell the thread what he said. Be creative and not fall into this dumb "i'm so bad in off-thread comm, i ignore it" bullshit.
I will lynch you if you ignore it, because off thread comm helps town more than it helps mafia. It gives the town opportunity to make plans and catch scum in different ways. And don't give that bullshit "what if you mason mafia or are wrong about your read". That'll come clear eventually, or you out your logs and someone else might be able to see it.
TLDR;
Everyone needs to mason 2 people, not necessarily at the start of the game. If you dont know what to do with PM's, mason me.
gumshoe explain to me how you reached your conclusion in the DrH/FirmTofu exchange?[/QUOTE]
With back-and-forth, serious on-topic pushes, clarification, and a clear delineation of reads. That's not what you've been doing until now, as the deadline approaches, after I laid smackdown on you. How is this not scum rayne? How can anyone look at your town play, and look at this game, and say "oh this is some not seen before variation on town rayne"[/QUOTE]
BECAUSE I HAVE NOT BEEN HERE½!!!
If me not being here is a fucking scumtell for you then i can't help you. I can't post if i am not here, do you understand this simple fact?
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EPT
