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On July 09 2013 20:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 19:55 Xatalos wrote:
Maybe this is some elaborate ploy to lure out scum or something... That might be easier to understand than him really launching it as either scum or town.  ing ding* We have a winner. I'll explain everything tonight. People who come out incedibly townie from this: Oats, Xatalos, Alaskaslam, Meapak, WoS People who come out scummy: Austin, Ace People who i need to think about more: Jampidampi, Maju
LOL
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I am the champion.
![[image loading]](http://www.esfiworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/live-blog-battlenet-world-championships-day_a-ge-_1.jpg)
I'm willing to believe that rayn speaks the truth since 1) him actually launching the nuke makes extremely little sense as either alignment 2) I've never seen scum make "big plays" like this but I've seen some townies do a bit similar stuff
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On July 09 2013 10:59 Ace wrote:
I was actually going to suggest rayne for lynch tomorrow since he was instrumental in turning the DI lynch around. ON was here defending himself and still kept getting votes, while DI disappeared.
Now rayne admits to nuking MZ. I think this is actually a far worse offense than the DI thing since I didn't see him with any prior suspicions on MZ. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
Hahhah and this looks suspiciously much like scum "eating the bait" to mislynch a previously townish townie.
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On July 09 2013 20:58 Ace wrote:
what???
No prior suspicions, suddenly jumping on him when the general sentiment no longer trusts him that much.
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On July 09 2013 21:01 Ace wrote:
what general sentiment? the only person that called rayne out with a case was MZ.
If I was last here before the lynch, and I come back to see DI is saved and ON lynched, where else would you expect my suspicions to go? Think about this.
It's just very convenient that you picked out rayn to start piling **** on once he became "vulnerable". Especially since most thought of him as town before that moment. And you didn't even mention austinmcc, me or several other people who were probably more or equally instrumental in the ON lynch compared to rayn.
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On July 09 2013 21:10 Ace wrote:
So what if rayne was hought to be Town before the lynch by a few people? Shit changed with that ON lynch.
Again, this is the same thing I said to geript: just because I singled out rayne doesn't mean I did not think about other people that turned the wagon around. MZ making a case on rayne just added fuel to the fire and made my read on him stronger. If you read my games and my advice in games I host I always advocate to do one thing at a time. Why would I make a case on a bunch of people at night? What exactly would I accomplish doing so?
That's just wrong. People didn't start doubting rayn with the lynch, they started doubting him with the claim (most notably Meapak). What even makes rayn special regarding the lynch? I'm willing to bet that I was more effective in changing it around than him. What's your opinion of rayn at the moment?
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Btw rayn, how was austinmcc's reaction scummy? I'm not sure if I can see that.
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On July 09 2013 21:16 geript wrote:
To be honest, I'd much rather see a full reads list from him. He's done little and less all game.
Indeed. I expect much more of a veteran like him (unless he's scum of course).
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On July 09 2013 21:19 Ace wrote:
How is it wrong? Be objective here.
There was a concerted effort to turn around the DI lynch. austincc posts a case on ON. Immediately a band wagon forms. DI defends himself and disappears from the thread. ON defends himself, role claims, and still gets lynched. There are no votes moving off of ON at this time. He flips Town.
MZ figures that rayne must be lying after rayne claims to have nuked him. This is where the doubt on rayne comes from.
I show up and I'm already looking at how the lynch played out. I already note how its going down. I get to MZ's post about rayne, who was instrumental to turning around the DI lynch.
Why would I call out anyone else but rayne? Logically, think about this. I think you seriously are lost because if you can't tell what my opinion on rayne is right now this is pointless.
So you believe rayn is lying about his "big play"? Do you mean he's scum and launched the nuke after all? If you believe him on that point (which seems a pretty obvious thing to do IMO), you have no other decent reason to continue. He was just one of many who helped changing the lynch around, and unless DI flips red, it doesn't even prove anything at all.
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On July 09 2013 21:20 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:16 geript wrote:
To be honest, I'd much rather see a full reads list from him. He's done little and less all game. you know I dont do this. I've addressed this in THIS game and in every game I've ever played on this site. Stop it.
Maybe you prefer to have a hard-to-read meta instead of helping town if you play town, but that's just stupid and only helps when you roll scum. "I never play pro-town" is no justification.
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On July 09 2013 21:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:15 Xatalos wrote:
Btw rayn, how was austinmcc's reaction scummy? I'm not sure if I can see that. When i claimed the nuke he didn't say anything about it but talked about other stuff, i even asked him about it (indirectly). Think about it. You are scum and some townie claimed a nuke that your team in fact launced. WTF? What would you do? Because i would not know what to say when that person starts questioning me about that.
Hmm it makes some sense. If Ace and austinmcc were scum together, Ace would go for the opportunity to fling **** at a previous general townread (chaos and mistrust among town) while austinmcc would basically ignore it (wait and see -approach). I can see that being possible. It really is suspicious that he pretty much ignored the whole deal.
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On July 09 2013 21:29 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:25 Xatalos wrote:On July 09 2013 21:19 Ace wrote:
How is it wrong? Be objective here.
There was a concerted effort to turn around the DI lynch. austincc posts a case on ON. Immediately a band wagon forms. DI defends himself and disappears from the thread. ON defends himself, role claims, and still gets lynched. There are no votes moving off of ON at this time. He flips Town.
MZ figures that rayne must be lying after rayne claims to have nuked him. This is where the doubt on rayne comes from.
I show up and I'm already looking at how the lynch played out. I already note how its going down. I get to MZ's post about rayne, who was instrumental to turning around the DI lynch.
Why would I call out anyone else but rayne? Logically, think about this. I think you seriously are lost because if you can't tell what my opinion on rayne is right now this is pointless. So you believe rayn is lying about his "big play"? Do you mean he's scum and launched the nuke after all? If you believe him on that point (which seems a pretty obvious thing to do IMO), you have no other decent reason to continue. He was just one of many who helped changing the lynch around, and unless DI flips red, it doesn't even prove anything at all. Yes. I believe rayne is scum not only for nuking MZ, but the DI lynch. I'm taking them both together. When geript asked me earlier about why I didn't include him as a suspect this was the same reasoning. Don't think I'm ignoring the entire wagon, I'm just only speaking on rayne right now because it makes no sense to put suspicion on everyone. It won't accomplish anything right now.
Explain why:
1) scum rayn would stealth nuke Meapak (instead of his eternal enemy Chezinu), base his townread on Meapak (at least partly) on his own lie, then be happy to redirect the nuke to NG
2) reveal all this quite a bit later with absolutely zero reason to do that and put himself under pressure
3) gather reactions without caring for his own safety and then reveal this plan
No matter how I look at it, I see no reason for scum rayn to do all this.
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On July 09 2013 21:39 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:35 Xatalos wrote:On July 09 2013 21:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 09 2013 21:15 Xatalos wrote:
Btw rayn, how was austinmcc's reaction scummy? I'm not sure if I can see that. When i claimed the nuke he didn't say anything about it but talked about other stuff, i even asked him about it (indirectly). Think about it. You are scum and some townie claimed a nuke that your team in fact launced. WTF? What would you do? Because i would not know what to say when that person starts questioning me about that. Hmm it makes some sense. If Ace and austinmcc were scum together, Ace would go for the opportunity to fling **** at a previous general townread (chaos and mistrust among town) while austinmcc would basically ignore it (wait and see -approach). I can see that being possible. It really is suspicious that he pretty much ignored the whole deal. You seriously can not be this stupid.
Less stupid than you for still believing in rayn's nuke-claim.
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On July 09 2013 21:48 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:38 jampidampi wrote:On July 09 2013 21:29 Ace wrote:On July 09 2013 21:25 Xatalos wrote:On July 09 2013 21:19 Ace wrote:
How is it wrong? Be objective here.
There was a concerted effort to turn around the DI lynch. austincc posts a case on ON. Immediately a band wagon forms. DI defends himself and disappears from the thread. ON defends himself, role claims, and still gets lynched. There are no votes moving off of ON at this time. He flips Town.
MZ figures that rayne must be lying after rayne claims to have nuked him. This is where the doubt on rayne comes from.
I show up and I'm already looking at how the lynch played out. I already note how its going down. I get to MZ's post about rayne, who was instrumental to turning around the DI lynch.
Why would I call out anyone else but rayne? Logically, think about this. I think you seriously are lost because if you can't tell what my opinion on rayne is right now this is pointless. So you believe rayn is lying about his "big play"? Do you mean he's scum and launched the nuke after all? If you believe him on that point (which seems a pretty obvious thing to do IMO), you have no other decent reason to continue. He was just one of many who helped changing the lynch around, and unless DI flips red, it doesn't even prove anything at all. Yes. I believe rayne is scum not only for nuking MZ, but the DI lynch. I'm taking them both together. When geript asked me earlier about why I didn't include him as a suspect this was the same reasoning. Don't think I'm ignoring the entire wagon, I'm just only speaking on rayne right now because it makes no sense to put suspicion on everyone. It won't accomplish anything right now. Can you then point out what makes you think Rayn nuked? I wrote a big post explaining why I think Rayn didn't nuke, what makes my analysis wrong? I think he nuked because I dont think he is dumb enough to nuke MZ just like that as Town. MZ was the one who called him out for lying and I don't think he expected that to happen. All of a sudden it is some big plan he had all along? regarding your post, I don't think he would have launched a nuke at Xata. He had no good reason for doing so. The first person he really went hard on was Chezinu, which would have made the most sense to nuke. Not sending a nuke at the guy he is calling for to be nuked makes no sense here. If he is fake claiming the nuke on MZ it does not add up. It still does not explain why he would just not have nuked Chezinu, and why he would even own up to that nuke in the first place. We don't know who the nuke came from and once MZ caught him in a lie he was stuck.
So you don't know who the nuke came from after all? Wasn't it just coming from rayn a second ago?
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Currently...
Dandel Ion
Ghost_403 (hardcore lurker, kill with fire please)
Oatsmaster
Stutters695 (hardcore lurker, kill with fire please)
Z-BosoN
Abenson
Meapak_Ziphh
Ace
MajuGarzett
Johnnywup
Onegu
Geript
VayneAuthority
Strongandbig
Gumshoe
CaucasianAsian
Alakasam
WaveofShadow
jampidampi
raynpelikoneet
FirmTofu
Chezinu
austinmcc
Thoughts?
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On July 09 2013 21:55 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 21:43 Xatalos wrote:On July 09 2013 21:29 Ace wrote:On July 09 2013 21:25 Xatalos wrote:On July 09 2013 21:19 Ace wrote:
How is it wrong? Be objective here.
There was a concerted effort to turn around the DI lynch. austincc posts a case on ON. Immediately a band wagon forms. DI defends himself and disappears from the thread. ON defends himself, role claims, and still gets lynched. There are no votes moving off of ON at this time. He flips Town.
MZ figures that rayne must be lying after rayne claims to have nuked him. This is where the doubt on rayne comes from.
I show up and I'm already looking at how the lynch played out. I already note how its going down. I get to MZ's post about rayne, who was instrumental to turning around the DI lynch.
Why would I call out anyone else but rayne? Logically, think about this. I think you seriously are lost because if you can't tell what my opinion on rayne is right now this is pointless. So you believe rayn is lying about his "big play"? Do you mean he's scum and launched the nuke after all? If you believe him on that point (which seems a pretty obvious thing to do IMO), you have no other decent reason to continue. He was just one of many who helped changing the lynch around, and unless DI flips red, it doesn't even prove anything at all. Yes. I believe rayne is scum not only for nuking MZ, but the DI lynch. I'm taking them both together. When geript asked me earlier about why I didn't include him as a suspect this was the same reasoning. Don't think I'm ignoring the entire wagon, I'm just only speaking on rayne right now because it makes no sense to put suspicion on everyone. It won't accomplish anything right now. Explain why: 1) scum rayn would stealth nuke Meapak (instead of his eternal enemy Chezinu), base his townread on Meapak (at least partly) on his own lie, then be happy to redirect the nuke to NG 2) reveal all this quite a bit later with absolutely zero reason to do that and put himself under pressure 3) gather reactions without caring for his own safety and then reveal this plan No matter how I look at it, I see no reason for scum rayn to do all this. 1.) why wouldn't he stealth nuke someone that is probably Town? durr? If he and Chezinu are scum buddies together then doesn't it make sense for him not to nuke him? If rayne's nukes can only be activated by stealth then this is moot as he would never even do so. If you honestly believe rayne has the capability to nuke another player and is Town - then why not nuke Chezinu? 2.) I don't think he actually thought it through well enough or he really believed he could get away with it. Again, MZ was the one who called him out on this. Unless you have a problem with MZ's post, then I don't see why you are over thinking this. Notice that even after he claimed he wasn't under any pressure. So he could very well have been correct in thinking he was safe on it. 3.) I don't understand where this is going. If you are assuming that only Town players will act bold you are acting under a false premise. Here's my thing: Why is the DI/ON lynch not a major deal to you? That was a last minute wagon flip that resulted in a townie lynch. The guy who was going to be lynched got away with a scant post in his defense and disappeared. ON put up a defense and votes weren't moved off of him. You don't see a problem here?
I agree with geript's reasoning that the DI wagon went too smoothly without disagreement (only geript opposed it until austinmcc finally made his case, and DI had like 10+ votes at that point?). That means DI is probably town. If that is true, then there's literally zero reason for scum rayn to change the lynch from town to town. Even if DI were scum, you have zero reason to pursue rayn until 1) DI has flipped red and 2) you explain why rayn is more scummy for that than me or austin who were more strongly pursuing ON. It's just senseless all around.
1) I do not believe rayn has the capacity to launch a nuke. In that case, he would have surely launched it at Chezinu regardless of his alignnment (even as scum it would be stupid to launch at someone else and then claim a bit later).
2) Scum do not act rashly or carelessly, they are careful and serious. This is everything but careful and very risky for little if any gain (as scum). See the point?
3) See above.
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On July 09 2013 22:03 geript wrote:
@Xatalos. I wouldn't be so hasty to paint Rayn green and Ace red. I think it's possible that it's the other way around and still quite possible that they're both green.
Anything is possible. I colored what's likely.
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On July 09 2013 22:15 Oatsmaster wrote:
Because once he claimed, and there was no counterclaim, then obviously it came from scum. Ace how are you not seeing this??
This is true as well.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk/i/keep-calm-and-once-a-belieber-always-a-belieber-2.png)
