EPTThe Game [N] - Page 29
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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Vivax
21959 Posts
Hopeless do you think a scum Zarepath would dare to oppose VE's super scumhunting team idea like that? I've been trying to get a read on the dude and I don't get the feeling he's scum. He posts a lot, explains his thoughts, looks spontaneous, series of addenda (that's the plural for addendum), and overall seems to make sense. He doesn't play aggressively at all, but I don't think that is relevant for him. As counter-example I see cosmicomics who replies to a question about DP with a short argument and a quick vote and leaves after asking me scummy questions. I see that as a way to look like he's scumhunting, has a target, a few arguments but doesn't try to do anything else or find out if it's the right target. Then, could you and Wiggles give me an impression of DYH? I suspect the dude is scum. If you're at it and want to, comment on sandro and cosmicomics but doesn't look like they will be lynched today  | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
Vivax's defense of me notwithstanding, I'm not so sure this was a slip. Meta reads are going to be something I will not be very good at until I play quite a few more games with all of you guys, so I can't look back at Yamato and try to find out if Vivax's claim is legitimate. I'm not sure why he would be so confident as to flat out call him Yamato in one sentence and the back off a little saying 'I think' in another, it's a very odd way of doing it rather than flat out asking 'Are you Yamato' or simply saying 'I think TPS is Yamato.' Either way the 'slip' itself seems null, as is Vivax's defense on me; his points ring true (and I'm happy people actually notice me for once) but obviously there are both scum and town motivations for doing what he did. As for TPS, I'm having a hard time because I actually enjoyed his setup speculation (even though I know that's something that is generally frowned upon) and his early pressure on Coag is something that I would have gotten behind if I weren't fucking terrified of having the wrath of every vet in existence on top of me for 'not knowing how Coag usually plays.' I said it in an earlier post, Coag doesn't look great to me, but I'll trust the townies who seem to know him. Now TPS's pressure in my eyes really depends on whether he is a smurf or not imo. If he is, I would think that he would know exactly how Coag usually plays and so this would seem like an agenda to me. If he's not, he is legitimately pressuring and pushing a read on a player who looked (at least up until he started posting more frequently and usefully) scummy. So null on TPS for now until the smurf idea is resolved. I CAN, however get behind a vote on DP. I support VE's case though I do not necessarily support his town circle; call that scummy if you wish but having never seen one in a game before I have no idea of their risks or benefits and it just seems manipulative to me. Vote: Darthpunk | ||
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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GreYMisT
United States6736 Posts
On March 18 2013 03:54 kitaman27 wrote: Hmm I didn't notice the "I think" part that was mentioned later after he references yamato directly. Without the scumslip, I think I'd rather go back to GoodKarma. GreYMisT, you mentioned it was the response, not the scumslip that you found suspicious. Does this change your views at all? It makes him seem less be overall, though its still weird that he didn't refrence that before now. With that pointed out I'm not as willing to lynch him. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
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Vivax
21959 Posts
On March 18 2013 02:54 VisceraEyes wrote: Ugh I like Vivax lynch too. Nothing he's said has made me feel townie on him. I'ma go filter him again. Kita why you hatin on GM? I think he's fine for now, and I certainly don't like him for lynch today. Where's the beef? Given that most of the people I find suspicious try to hop onto DP I don't trust the bandwagon. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:21 VisceraEyes wrote: For the record, my town circle idea was a conversation starter, and it worked wonders. I have no intention of attempting to hold people to voting with me or their peers in The Team, I simply wanted to gauge peoples reactions to it and see if it inspired people to start scumhunting. Some it did, others it didn't. But the fact is I think it has spawned useful discussion for everyone. So long as it's not a conversation starter for the sake of being a conversation starter; we know how well that went for Prom last game. I assume this is something that will be followed through on, and I will judge its usefulness and learn accordingly, though I have no desire to participate. | ||
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RyuSuzaku
Japan139 Posts
There are several major reasons; hopefully my quoting will help here. 1. Greymist excuses his lurking by saying that he was "setting a trap." I seriously doubt there was any sort of trap or intention behind the lurking, seeing as his entry post into the thread mentioned how busy he was. 2. When he was around, greymist didn't do anything other than respond to the host. Surely as a townie, if you know you are going to only be active for certain time periods, you will put effort into pushing your reads, or at least trying to make them. Lurking away your active periods sounds pretty antitown. I know at least for me personally, I do my best to read and post in order to solidify my reads during my active periods. 3. Greymist's posts come off as opportunistic. He accuses goodkarma of attacking "easy targets", yet he himself is guilty of attacking GK, someone I would classify as an easy target. GK also chose DarthPunk and sandroba as two of his four targets, both of which I would firmly classify as "not easy to lynch." GK gave fairly decent reasons for both, and those reasons are understandable from a GK-town perspective. For one, he acknowledges the differences in DP's play between this game and others in which he has played; this type of observation is characteristically rare for mafia players. The fact that greymist is not able to see these reasons is indicative of him being scum. 4. Greymist seems to be overly aware both of his own image and what the town in general thinks. There are a lot of questions to the effect of "what do people think of ____?" and also moments where he calls out players (knowingly) for things he himself is doing. To this end, I give you the following: On March 17 2013 14:38 GreYMisT wrote: Perfect, I was waiting for this! Does anyone else but me find this post odd? let me tell you why you should. First off. I have contributed about 0 things this game. Zilch. Nada. So much so that it honestly should be a null/leaning scum tell on me. Especially considering I have not been around for the last few hours or so. Its not like im spamming or trolling, I have been a non presence. Now normally this would be an OK pressure vote, if thats what this was. HOWEVER, he says that I am his number 1 scumread (he's willing to put a vote on me), saying that I have had ample opportunity to contribute, and am MORE than a lurker. What makes this an accusation post rather than just a defense post by me, however, is when we look at the rest of his reads. Instead of just pushing me and trying to convince town to get behind my lynch (something you can see every other town player doing, after all the goal of this game is to reach a majority on players), he goes on to make sure the town knows he MIGHT be swapping to another person, thereby setting himself up for a future vote swap. This is not only to mention the content of his reads here. Notice that he really doesn't have anything to say, and picks on the easy targets. More notably, is that he picks on targets with the same sins as me this game, yet not mentioning why he is voting me over them. I can tell you why, Its because my lack of thread presence, to a scum player, would basically have them salivating for a day 1 miss lynch. I am an easy, low risk lynch with almost no thread presence to back myself up. I find this post suspicious because it is a cookie cutter, "here are a few reads" post that has no interaction with other players, no real pushing, no new information, and in my eyes makes more sense from a scum perspective than a town one. I will be voting goodkarma until I can be convinced otherwise. Note that his response to GK is nothing more than OMGUS. I seriously doubt greymist was setting a trap, given that he himself said how busy he was. He also does exactly the same thing he accuses GK of doing. GK, to me, simply seemed to be stating his reads and his rationale. His rationale appears to be backed up by actual effort-from my independent efforts, I can confirm that much of what he wrote about these players' metas is, on the whole, true. On the other hand, greymist has put no such effort into verifying GK's assertions, nor does he do anything but dismiss GK's reads. In addition, he calls out GK for listing reads so he can allegedly later swap them, yet he basically does the same here: On March 18 2013 02:28 GreYMisT wrote: I'm still voting for goodkarma for the moment, but what do people think of WaveofShadow? I just went through his posts and noticed that literally the only thing he has done this game is discuss meta, and not in the good way. To me it seems as though he is yet another player promising an opinion and saying he will look into things, but preparing excuses for a later sheep. I'd like to see a vote from him soon. and here: On March 18 2013 02:42 GreYMisT wrote: layabout I did just look at DP's filter again, and noticied that he commented on the same post that I did of goodkarma's. Something strikes me as odd about that post, with him seemingly calling him out on it, but then giving a fairly weak reason why he doesnt want gk lynched. I am wary of such stances. and here: On March 18 2013 03:01 GreYMisT wrote: Kita I think its possible that vivax slipped up. I can definitely see that scenario happening in this game. I am not sure I am confident enough in the risk of lynching him based off only that though. Let me look over him for anything else. every time greymist posts a read, it's with very minimal effort-not something I would expect a townie to put forth. In addition, his posts are very opportunistic. He only does things under pressure, whether it be direct or indirect. He only attacked GK under the obvious pressure of a vote. Sandro had already claimed suspicion of greymist, but greymist brushed it off-it was only when others agreed with sandro did greymist take the opportunity to attack GK. When kita requested an opinion of greymist on vivax, he did nothing more than regurgitate kita's suspicions and dig up superficialities in how vivax responded. On March 18 2013 03:17 GreYMisT wrote: Alright kitaman, I'm willing to lynch vivax or gk today. I think vivax might be scum not only because of the slip, but because of his 2 posts where he responds to your pressure. One thing that strikes me is Vivax's explination of being sure.. He says he was "so sure it was yamato" but in his followup post he gives an extremely weak reason of being so certain. Also another small thing in addition to what kita pointed out, is this line "I think it's a stupid reason to lynch me although I would probably think something similar in your position. But if you do it, won't be my fault you lose something valuable." Its subtle, but Vivax is essentially blaming his slip on us, even though he says that he would think the same thing in our position. He says that it wouldnt be his fault, when it very clearly would be. I'm not going to mention why I find greymist to be incredibly suspicious after this last post, since I expect anyone reading thoroughly to be able to discern why. ##vote greymist | ||
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glurio
Germany597 Posts
Because i have to go out now, and i'm not sure if i'll be back before the lynch. I'll put my vote on DP. If i happen to be back before lynch-time i'll read everything before going to sleep. | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:23 Vivax wrote: Tbh I don't trust VE at all currently. His stupid fluff squad had only the potential to create discussion about something useless, and when the slip matter arose, he went all casual with this, I still don't see a conclusion: Given that most of the people I find suspicious try to hop onto DP I don't trust the bandwagon. I filtered you and decided I didn't want to lynch you. So I filtered someone else that layabout suggested. I don't see what the problem is. Could you maybe address my case instead of give bullshit association reasoning for not voting for DP? | ||
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Vivax
21959 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:23 RyuSuzaku wrote: I've just finished reading what I missed while I was gone. If sandroba is indeed inactive because of drinking or whatever, I don't think he's a good lynch at all. However, I think greymist is a great choice for lynch today. I so far am not at all convinced that GK or DP or any of the other current names being thrown around are scummier than greymist. I think our best chance to lynch scum today is this guy. There are several major reasons; hopefully my quoting will help here. 1. Greymist excuses his lurking by saying that he was "setting a trap." I seriously doubt there was any sort of trap or intention behind the lurking, seeing as his entry post into the thread mentioned how busy he was. 2. When he was around, greymist didn't do anything other than respond to the host. Surely as a townie, if you know you are going to only be active for certain time periods, you will put effort into pushing your reads, or at least trying to make them. Lurking away your active periods sounds pretty antitown. I know at least for me personally, I do my best to read and post in order to solidify my reads during my active periods. 3. Greymist's posts come off as opportunistic. He accuses goodkarma of attacking "easy targets", yet he himself is guilty of attacking GK, someone I would classify as an easy target. GK also chose DarthPunk and sandroba as two of his four targets, both of which I would firmly classify as "not easy to lynch." GK gave fairly decent reasons for both, and those reasons are understandable from a GK-town perspective. For one, he acknowledges the differences in DP's play between this game and others in which he has played; this type of observation is characteristically rare for mafia players. The fact that greymist is not able to see these reasons is indicative of him being scum. 4. Greymist seems to be overly aware both of his own image and what the town in general thinks. There are a lot of questions to the effect of "what do people think of ____?" and also moments where he calls out players (knowingly) for things he himself is doing. To this end, I give you the following: Note that his response to GK is nothing more than OMGUS. I seriously doubt greymist was setting a trap, given that he himself said how busy he was. He also does exactly the same thing he accuses GK of doing. GK, to me, simply seemed to be stating his reads and his rationale. His rationale appears to be backed up by actual effort-from my independent efforts, I can confirm that much of what he wrote about these players' metas is, on the whole, true. On the other hand, greymist has put no such effort into verifying GK's assertions, nor does he do anything but dismiss GK's reads. In addition, he calls out GK for listing reads so he can allegedly later swap them, yet he basically does the same here: and here: and here: every time greymist posts a read, it's with very minimal effort-not something I would expect a townie to put forth. In addition, his posts are very opportunistic. He only does things under pressure, whether it be direct or indirect. He only attacked GK under the obvious pressure of a vote. Sandro had already claimed suspicion of greymist, but greymist brushed it off-it was only when others agreed with sandro did greymist take the opportunity to attack GK. When kita requested an opinion of greymist on vivax, he did nothing more than regurgitate kita's suspicions and dig up superficialities in how vivax responded. I'm not going to mention why I find greymist to be incredibly suspicious after this last post, since I expect anyone reading thoroughly to be able to discern why. ##vote greymist I'm with this guy ^ He knows what's up. Not to mention the way greymist handled my sandro case (saying activity doesn't matter when my case isn't about activity) and the points previously mentioned by Ryu. I think scum is trying to push a DP wagon. Let's go for Grey, sandro, cosmic or DYH instead.For justice. | ||
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RyuSuzaku
Japan139 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:31 VisceraEyes wrote: I filtered you and decided I didn't want to lynch you. So I filtered someone else that layabout suggested. I don't see what the problem is. Could you maybe address my case instead of give bullshit association reasoning for not voting for DP? you should read my recently posted case on greymist. I'm probably not going to be back until maybe an hour before deadline, if at all, so I suggest that you all consider voting greymist. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:33 Vivax wrote: + Show Spoiler + On March 18 2013 04:23 RyuSuzaku wrote: I've just finished reading what I missed while I was gone. If sandroba is indeed inactive because of drinking or whatever, I don't think he's a good lynch at all. However, I think greymist is a great choice for lynch today. I so far am not at all convinced that GK or DP or any of the other current names being thrown around are scummier than greymist. I think our best chance to lynch scum today is this guy. There are several major reasons; hopefully my quoting will help here. 1. Greymist excuses his lurking by saying that he was "setting a trap." I seriously doubt there was any sort of trap or intention behind the lurking, seeing as his entry post into the thread mentioned how busy he was. 2. When he was around, greymist didn't do anything other than respond to the host. Surely as a townie, if you know you are going to only be active for certain time periods, you will put effort into pushing your reads, or at least trying to make them. Lurking away your active periods sounds pretty antitown. I know at least for me personally, I do my best to read and post in order to solidify my reads during my active periods. 3. Greymist's posts come off as opportunistic. He accuses goodkarma of attacking "easy targets", yet he himself is guilty of attacking GK, someone I would classify as an easy target. GK also chose DarthPunk and sandroba as two of his four targets, both of which I would firmly classify as "not easy to lynch." GK gave fairly decent reasons for both, and those reasons are understandable from a GK-town perspective. For one, he acknowledges the differences in DP's play between this game and others in which he has played; this type of observation is characteristically rare for mafia players. The fact that greymist is not able to see these reasons is indicative of him being scum. 4. Greymist seems to be overly aware both of his own image and what the town in general thinks. There are a lot of questions to the effect of "what do people think of ____?" and also moments where he calls out players (knowingly) for things he himself is doing. To this end, I give you the following: Note that his response to GK is nothing more than OMGUS. I seriously doubt greymist was setting a trap, given that he himself said how busy he was. He also does exactly the same thing he accuses GK of doing. GK, to me, simply seemed to be stating his reads and his rationale. His rationale appears to be backed up by actual effort-from my independent efforts, I can confirm that much of what he wrote about these players' metas is, on the whole, true. On the other hand, greymist has put no such effort into verifying GK's assertions, nor does he do anything but dismiss GK's reads. In addition, he calls out GK for listing reads so he can allegedly later swap them, yet he basically does the same here: and here: and here: every time greymist posts a read, it's with very minimal effort-not something I would expect a townie to put forth. In addition, his posts are very opportunistic. He only does things under pressure, whether it be direct or indirect. He only attacked GK under the obvious pressure of a vote. Sandro had already claimed suspicion of greymist, but greymist brushed it off-it was only when others agreed with sandro did greymist take the opportunity to attack GK. When kita requested an opinion of greymist on vivax, he did nothing more than regurgitate kita's suspicions and dig up superficialities in how vivax responded. I'm not going to mention why I find greymist to be incredibly suspicious after this last post, since I expect anyone reading thoroughly to be able to discern why. ##vote greymist I'm with this guy ^ He knows what's up. Not to mention the way greymist handled my sandro case (saying activity doesn't matter when my case isn't about activity) and the points previously mentioned by Ryu. I think scum is trying to push a DP wagon. Let's go for Grey, sandro, cosmic or DYH instead.For justice. 'Scum' is trying to push a DP wagon? Which of the people whom have gotten on board said wagon are you calling scum? | ||
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VisceraEyes
United States21170 Posts
On March 18 2013 04:33 Vivax wrote: + Show Spoiler + On March 18 2013 04:23 RyuSuzaku wrote: I've just finished reading what I missed while I was gone. If sandroba is indeed inactive because of drinking or whatever, I don't think he's a good lynch at all. However, I think greymist is a great choice for lynch today. I so far am not at all convinced that GK or DP or any of the other current names being thrown around are scummier than greymist. I think our best chance to lynch scum today is this guy. There are several major reasons; hopefully my quoting will help here. 1. Greymist excuses his lurking by saying that he was "setting a trap." I seriously doubt there was any sort of trap or intention behind the lurking, seeing as his entry post into the thread mentioned how busy he was. 2. When he was around, greymist didn't do anything other than respond to the host. Surely as a townie, if you know you are going to only be active for certain time periods, you will put effort into pushing your reads, or at least trying to make them. Lurking away your active periods sounds pretty antitown. I know at least for me personally, I do my best to read and post in order to solidify my reads during my active periods. 3. Greymist's posts come off as opportunistic. He accuses goodkarma of attacking "easy targets", yet he himself is guilty of attacking GK, someone I would classify as an easy target. GK also chose DarthPunk and sandroba as two of his four targets, both of which I would firmly classify as "not easy to lynch." GK gave fairly decent reasons for both, and those reasons are understandable from a GK-town perspective. For one, he acknowledges the differences in DP's play between this game and others in which he has played; this type of observation is characteristically rare for mafia players. The fact that greymist is not able to see these reasons is indicative of him being scum. 4. Greymist seems to be overly aware both of his own image and what the town in general thinks. There are a lot of questions to the effect of "what do people think of ____?" and also moments where he calls out players (knowingly) for things he himself is doing. To this end, I give you the following: Note that his response to GK is nothing more than OMGUS. I seriously doubt greymist was setting a trap, given that he himself said how busy he was. He also does exactly the same thing he accuses GK of doing. GK, to me, simply seemed to be stating his reads and his rationale. His rationale appears to be backed up by actual effort-from my independent efforts, I can confirm that much of what he wrote about these players' metas is, on the whole, true. On the other hand, greymist has put no such effort into verifying GK's assertions, nor does he do anything but dismiss GK's reads. In addition, he calls out GK for listing reads so he can allegedly later swap them, yet he basically does the same here: and here: and here: every time greymist posts a read, it's with very minimal effort-not something I would expect a townie to put forth. In addition, his posts are very opportunistic. He only does things under pressure, whether it be direct or indirect. He only attacked GK under the obvious pressure of a vote. Sandro had already claimed suspicion of greymist, but greymist brushed it off-it was only when others agreed with sandro did greymist take the opportunity to attack GK. When kita requested an opinion of greymist on vivax, he did nothing more than regurgitate kita's suspicions and dig up superficialities in how vivax responded. I'm not going to mention why I find greymist to be incredibly suspicious after this last post, since I expect anyone reading thoroughly to be able to discern why. ##vote greymist I'm with this guy ^ He knows what's up. Not to mention the way greymist handled my sandro case (saying activity doesn't matter when my case isn't about activity) and the points previously mentioned by Ryu. I think scum is trying to push a DP wagon. Let's go for Grey, sandro, cosmic or DYH instead.For justice. So he wants to lynch Grey, sandro, cosmic or DYH, but thinks SCUM are pushing the DP wagon. Presently on the DP wagon: layabout, VE, WoS, glurio. Soooo....several of those things are not like the others.... | ||
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sciberbia
United States1359 Posts
zarepath is still an option and I still think there is a good chance he is scum. Several other people also think this so zarepath is a legitimate lynch candidate for today. Please thoroughly read what I, geript, DYH, hopeless1der have said about him if you haven't already. I will probably look through his meta referenced by geript. GreyMist is a lynch I think I could get behind. I agree with what somebody (ryu?) said about GreyMist not 'setting a trap' which is what I was getting at in my earlier post about him. sandroba seems like a terrible lynch. He is like the definition of 'keep this player around and try to get a read D2'. He stopped into the thread, made some reasonable but short posts, and then lurked. From what I've heard he lurks as both mafia and town. On top of that, he has a mod-confirmed somewhat legitimate reason for being afk and is getting replaced. We have every reason to expect to be able to get a read from his replacement. I don't think sandroba should be a lynch candidate. vivax clearly did not "slip" as explained by a few others already. I don't think Vivax's guess at TPS's identity says anything about his alignment. I haven't looked too much into vivax besides this. DYH is one of my stronger townreads. He has made several good analytical points, he has been willing to do meta research on GK, and he supported the SAST in the face of several people who said it was dumb. He also showed that he cares about town by 'trying not to split focus' which is definitely a problem right now. I don't see the case against him. DP I was leaning town on after his original bout of posting because he was willing to draw attention to himself early in the game. He seems like a lynch candidate now so I'll look over the case against him. GK seems to still be on the table. My thoughts on him haven't changed. cosmicomics is definitely concerning but he's hardcore lurking right now. I'm not too keen on lynching a hardcore lurker today. | ||
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Mr. Wiggles
Canada5894 Posts
For the points you bring up against him, I don't think they necessarily point to him being scum. We had a couple people voting for others because of them doing things they perceived as being anti-town. I don't think it's good play, but I don't think it necessarily points to the people doing it as scum, since it's something people tend to do commonly. Then, I don't see him being that inconsistent. He says that he doesn't like the post GK had just made, but that he isn't ready to lynch him yet. He then says that he disagrees with BH's meta case. The reason I don't see this as inconsistent, is because in contrast to BH, he doesn't call GK as being town. DP has a more moderate read of GK, saying that he isn't ready to lynch him, in contrast to BH, who asserts that "This is town GK.". So, he's not questioning it because of meta, he's questioning that BH sounds almost 100% sure that GK is town in that post based only on meta. With reference to the above, I don't really see him as attacking and defending GK in a scummy way. He says he doesn't like his posting, but that he doesn't want to lynch him. He's actually taking a stance on the lynch, which I don't think scum would do if they were playing the middle like you're implying. If he wanted to attack and defend GK, he wouldn't give a definite answer on whether to lynch him, because that means he can't set himself up to pick a side later depending on how popular opinion goes. So overall, I don't think the case is strong enough to lynch DP. | ||
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sciberbia
United States1359 Posts
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