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lol.
LOL.
You stuck to your read when you sheep voted him with no fucking reason??
Wow, glurio.
Not to mention switched a vote onto him from Sandroba whom you ALSO had barely any reason to vote in the first place. 'Pressure.....right.'
As for my defense, this is I'll I'm going to give you because you honestly aren't even worth my time.
My meta reads are very weak as I have stated earlier. I'm more likely to be able to pick up on something zarepath does that seems wrong later on in the day than anything GM would have done first of all. Secondly, you say I don't give the vet a chance to improve his game but I want to give the relative newbie a chance? Doesn't that make sense? If a vet is playing a bad game or not performing the way other vets expect him to, it seems a solid sheep vote to me. The difference here is I at least added a little rational and reasoning behind my decision to switch votes.
You haven't posted anything useful at all yet, you're sheeping just as much as you accuse me of doing but you haven't posted any real reads with proper backup or pushed anything (aside from me right now because it's the new cool thing to do).
But please, by all means keep it coming and tunnel me instead of hunting for real scum. It's not like this is a distraction or anything from the real point of the game.
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On March 18 2013 23:26 zarepath wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2013 16:22 ThePeashooter wrote:
I have no idea how the quoting got messed up, but Devil and Nightmare should both be red. I imagine Devil would be some type of Godfather-ish role. I am re-reading through the thread right now, but this makes me think that TPS is town.
What?
Why? Zare you REALLY have to start giving more than that to alleviate suspicion. I don't see how mis-speculating on roles is anything but null.
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On March 19 2013 01:48 Mocsta wrote:
/HELLO and fear me for I .. I have channeled the power of SANDROBA
moology = mocsta
Oh god it's YOU again. 
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On March 19 2013 01:24 cosmicomics wrote:
WaveofShadow, where are you getting your townish read on glurio?
This is essentially how glurio has played every game. His reads are bad and he doesn't add much to a scumhunt. Every once in a while he'll actually attempt to put pressure on something but it doesn't amount to anything. He's a little lurkier than he was in LX and isn't putting as MUCH effort in so ima paint him null leaning town right now purely based on meta, but we'll see how the night/day pans out.
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On that note, Vivax are you really sure glurio is scum? You should know what his game is like from LX; you don't think he was just sheeping badly?
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Yeah Vivax I don't see how you're so certain you're getting lynched tomorrow. It's all WIFOM.
If your reads are accurate then if they lynch you they risk exposing your reads as accurate. If they're not accurate they can lynch and try to make people think your reads are accurate. It's null.
As for you asking absolutely everyone about all your 5 people, I really think you should be focusing; it's too much this early. One at a time. Like, which of the five do YOU feel we should be focused on today and why?
Zarepath?
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On March 19 2013 03:19 layabout wrote:
Wos they were talking about nightkills...
lolol I meant NK
Welp I guess it's time for the whole thread to assume scumslip for some reason.
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On March 19 2013 03:23 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 03:16 WaveofShadow wrote:
Yeah Vivax I don't see how you're so certain you're getting lynched tomorrow. It's all WIFOM.
If your reads are accurate then if they lynch you they risk exposing your reads as accurate. If they're not accurate they can lynch and try to make people think your reads are accurate. It's null.
As for you asking absolutely everyone about all your 5 people, I really think you should be focusing; it's too much this early. One at a time. Like, which of the five do YOU feel we should be focused on today and why?
Zarepath? Wowwy Wow Wow. WOS just revealed he knows Vivax is town.
Wat.
GL with that.
And as for responding to post-flip pressure, it just pisses me off that I don't get listened to at all on certain days; people only tend to pay attention to me when they think I'm scummy which has been...let's see....NEVER.
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Haha wow I guess I really do have to be more careful what I post in these games...I make mistakes wayy too often that get seen as scummy. I guess it's good that people are pointing this shit out 'cause I didn't notice, and eventually I'll stop fucking myself over with these mistakes.
I dunno, not much to say about that. I'll blame it on lack of sleep due to 3 month old baby.
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I don't find it odd at all. If I was smurfing to hide my identity so I could play a different game than I'm used to so that people don't filter dive me and call me out for meta, why would I give up my identity on the first day and ruin the point?
Obviously the question is what specifically is he trying to hide...
In the end I'm sure he will be found out; I learned from LX that smurfing is hard apparently.
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On March 19 2013 08:09 Vivax wrote:
Medic goes to sciberbia or me, sciberbia if he's unsure cause the guy has wits.
I've decided to extend my case with the other guys, rejoice!
Also, in case of my death (and other guys) PLEASE, please look at my posts. Too many times people don't do that. Look at who I read as town, who I read as scum, who read me as what. People disregard it as WIFOM but it's all valuable information in getting behind scum's thought process.
Anyway, working on another massive dump. Brb yo.
I hear there's medication you can take for that.
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On March 19 2013 10:44 zarepath wrote:
So after looking through Wiggle's filter, he starts off not liking GreyMist or goodkarma, both of which were already under suspicion by other players. After that, everything else he says is defending a player -- he defends Coag's meta, he suggests that people's arguments against TPS aren't good enough (while also stating that he doesn't know how he feels about the guy himself -- wait and see), when asked specifically to talk about Coag he makes a super long post that ends up with a tl;dr of "wait and see", says he's going to take some time to digest goodkarma's defense, defends Vivax against the suggestion of a scumslip, says that VE's case on DP isn't that strong, then criticizes a DYH lynch.
His final vote/read that he actually sticks to is one he only makes after sciberbia specifically asks him what he thinks about GM and GK, and he ends up picking GM, and his first reason why is "as I stated earlier in the thread;" ie, I was totally thinking he was scum the whole time even while I was voting for GK, the guy I no longer thing is scum. BTW, he really likes Ryu's case on him, and uses that in his argument.
Then you have the post that Trance brought up. It looks a lot like he spent most of D1 criticizing arguments and not actually going after scum, and when he finally had to pick, he was apologetic for it and seems to be prepping himself for a town flip.
I read him as scum until he provides some cases or reads, because so far he has only suspected two people, one of which he unvoted and the other one he was almost apologetic about voting for.
Strike 100 zare.
Mr. Wiggles is probably one of my strongest townreads at the moment.
His analysis is actually quite strong and he is not afraid to go against popular opinion (he shut down VE's read on DP just as it was gaining traction amongst the town), risking being seen as soft defending a scumbuddy.
He stuck with his reads on GK and GM throughout the day, if you read his posts, with his opinions changing slightly as more information cropped up.
This post of yours on the other hand is just a summary of Mr. Wriggle's filter with a weak case against him at the end; which you assume to be scummy when in fact he read correctly into GreYMist's lack of caring. He did call him scummy in the end but I would argue is unapologetic about it; much like my tunneling of geript last game he points out the GM put us in a bad position essentially looking really scummy during the day and his lack of attendance and giving up with regards to his lynch forced the town's hand.
Looking mroe into your recent posts:
On March 19 2013 10:08 zarepath wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 09:06 Vivax wrote:On March 19 2013 09:01 zarepath wrote:
Vivax I stop reading your posts as soon as you make reads on others based on the fact that I am scum.
Like, you are wasting tons and tons of time and energy based off of my poor play. Please do yourself and everyone else a favor and make cases on people without me being scum as the prime argument.
Back to work now. What should I do, you guys defended each other so obviously it becomes evident to those who start by looking at your voting. FYI though, my case on you, GK and cosmicomics isn't centered on the connection to you, that is just what links you together in the bigger picture and actually gave away TPS and glurio to me. Why do you refer to your play as poor though? Because I'm town and too many people think that I'm not. I didn't have much time to play over the weekend and wasted it by saying noncommittal things and then bouncing, making it look worse.
This is what makes me really think you're scum. In NMM 37 this was not your style of play at all even when you weren't around. You would pop in from time to time and take strong stances and PUSH your reads rather than sit back (aside from the fake case on me at the start). You've played in enough games to know better than this; hell it would have been better for you to lurk than to do what you're doing, you'd draw less attention to yourself.
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On March 19 2013 11:00 goodkarma wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 10:13 zarepath wrote:On March 19 2013 09:28 goodkarma wrote:
Okay I'm back in thread now. I'm slowly going through other people's filters. But the first one I'd like to bring up is Zarepath, since it seems Vivax is eager to see what I have to say about him.
First off, before anything else, I would like to say (and I believe others have said it too) to Vivax that an association based case on multiple unflipped players is flat-out bad. Putting that aside though, Zarepath is a player I put in the category of newer, less experienced player. When such a player is town he tends to be easier to mislynch, as he has not adopted his own solid playstyle yet. Looking into Zarepath's filter, he's been quite lazy about sharing his reads. His excuses have been "I'm new to this format," and "I'll be far more active during the week." Well, he should have at least gotten orientated to the format by now, and it is now a weekday. As such, I expect to see an explosion of activity from him. I believe the concerns about him are valid, and that he indeed is acting very scummy. It's also worth noting he does seem to be much more involved in his past town games, and as such I'd say I'm leaning scum on him. Certainly, he needs to be sharing his reads much better than he is right now so we can get better insight into his thought process. What did you think of my case on Hopeless1der? Nobody has responded to it yet. In other news, I like Trance's point on Wiggles -- his post could be scum prepping for a Greymist town flip. Will be looking into that more. One reason for that might be that you spoilered the entire thing... Looking at it, as best I can tell you point out that Hopeless hasn't really provided much substantive content, and that his complete flip on his stance on Darth is odd. I could see some potential scum motivation for these actions, but honestly your case is pretty thin. You can't just go through a guy's post history and say "this and that are odd..." What we're interested in is scum motivation. As in: Why is it that this particular post is more likely for scum Hopeless to make than town Hopeless? As it stands your recent case posts sometimes read like summaries of the guy's actions. Which is just fluff that makes it ten times harder to read, and doesn't add any value... The Hopeless case was not that substantial imo, which is part of the reason people probably didn't say much about it. With a rather sparse filter and a replacement coming in, we'll have a better read on him after Ace subs in.
You read his most recent cases, then read this:
On February 14 2013 12:20 zarepath wrote:
I don't know, so many holes here. Conveniently not believing in bread crumbs, not claiming in the hour that he himself said that the vigilante should have claimed, only killing WaveofShadow so that he could get INFORMATION on Corazon, wanting to stay "null" so scum don't have a target for tomorrow night... I mean, giving town a confirmed townie on Day 2 is HUGE, and getting picked of N2 isn't so awful because that means any active blue roles we may have get a full nother night of actions in.
Really dubious claim.
##Vote ObviousOne
The rest of his filter that game is constant questioning of other with regards to his reads, and some list posts yes, but without fluff; he actually takes a stand in many of these.
+ Show Spoiler +On February 14 2013 04:10 zarepath wrote:Zarepath's Readsby Zarepath9-Bit + Show Spoiler +
Nothing to see. Looking forward to a modkill or replacement.
Sevryn + Show Spoiler +
I had a null read on him at the lynch -- he jumped on my fake case, added a little to it, tunneled glurio. But post-flip, he went very proactively defensive for it, saying that everybody was too focused on glurio/himself as the dichotomy. But HE was focused on glurio. Now that glurio's flipped, I want to see what his reads are on EVERYONE. If he was so certain about glurio, who does he think is scum now?
Slight scum read on Sevryn.
WaveofShadow + Show Spoiler +
I see him as being mostly proactive with a variety of reads. I don't understand what his big controversial post quoting Mocsta and Sn0_Man was about, other than the fact they wanted to go after lurkers and their plan failed. I read him as genuinely trying to help town.
Sn0_Man + Show Spoiler +
His filter's filled with a lot of theory, policy, and meta talk. He interacts directly with a lot of other posters, and is very active. But towards the end of Day 1, he was practically begging other people to make cases he could bandwagon onto, finally settling on Sevryn. He is active enough that I don't consider him scummy, but trudging through his filter doesn't make me think he's absolutely pro-town. Leaning town, but not as sure as I used to be.
ObviousOne + Show Spoiler +
His assessment of Day 1 was pretty useful. I agree with Mocsta that we need to see his reads. Null, slightly to town based on his opening, but only slightly.
Warbaby + Show Spoiler +
Starts with general policy talk, his third post is a list, needlessly antagonistic to WoS, bunch of meta, insults everybody's mafia skills, tells people to mislynch him, prefers voting lurkers over scum, constantly asserts that he has no idea who the scum are, his final top 3 are sylencia, sevryn, then glurio. Is now focused on sevryn. I don't think he's as scummy as I've thought of him now that I've read thorugh the whole filter; I have a null read on him now, depending on how his case on Sevryn develops.
geript + Show Spoiler +
Geript was one of the only ones who really dug into my fake WoS case. He bought it, but only after he went through it and actually criticized a few of the points. He now has a case on Corazon that is at least original, and it's labeled Case 1, suggesting he has another case coming. I read him as leaning town.
Mocsta + Show Spoiler +
Super active first half of Day 1, went to "actively lurking" since after pouting about knowing when he's not wanted, and has done a lot of things that I see as pro-town -- encouraging two names so we can have clear bandwagons, picking apart bad logic, etc. I read him as town. The only other thing I'll note is that it's odd how little he's contributed (although he still has tons of filter). I think he's legit going for a different strat, but will keep an eye on him, obviously.
Corazon + Show Spoiler +
His Day 1 seemed pretty typical of his town meta, but he really pushed on his WB vote but didn't actively try to persuade anyone else; he just kept re-quoting his case, and then when the lynch was getting confusing, instead of asking for consolidation onto his TOP READ that he's had all day, instead he bandwagons onto Glurio. It's hard to judge any voting motivations from the Day 1 lynch, but this is suspicious to me. He gave a pretty town response to my WoS case, though. Null, leaning town.
Mandalor + Show Spoiler +
Mandalor's filter looks very scummy. Every other post is a list, the main thrust of his case on Sylencia has to do with blue talk, and the case for his final vote is not compelling at all. He just drops a random vote and checks out, doesn't even wish town luck. (To be fair, I did something similar because of time and RL constraints.) People's reactions to my vote on Mandalor were that they had town reads on him, but I'd like to ask you all what specifically makes him look town to you, because I don't see much. Reads SCUM
Sylencia + Show Spoiler +Pretty vocal opponent of RNG there at the beginning, then his activity fades from there. He speculates HARD on warbaby's possible blue roles, not necessarily a very pro-town thing to do in public on Day 1, and that is the biggest contribution he made at all. He said he hadn't read very many filters, admitted to tunneling warbaby, then voted for him. In the end, he posted this gem: On February 13 2013 09:54 Sylencia wrote:
.. What lol, I gave my reasons before and I'm voting for him to consolidate my thoughts on him. I will have to change my vote to glurio if required to stay alive though. Town don't change their votes in order to stay alive; town believe in their scum reads or are willing to work with other people's scum reads. THey certianly don't do so just to stay alive; lynching scum is more important than a town's individual life. This quote makes it sound as though his number one concern is not being lynched. It's worth going through all the filters, apparently, because this was the last post in the final filter, and I think it's the biggest, latest scum tell. In conclusion, people I think are suspicious and would like other's thoughts on: Sevryn Warbaby Mandalor Sylencia Obv and 9-Bit's replacement also deserve scrutiny. But right now my two biggest reads are Sylencia and Mandalor. I think people should look at my brief reads on them, read their filters, and I want to hear your own conclusions.
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On March 19 2013 11:12 zarepath wrote:
Can you explain how your super strong town read only had two people he suspected, one of which flipped blue, and has said nothing post-flip?
I don't think that shutting down cases is that necessarily pro-town when you have no other real suspects of your own. It is easy and risk-free to shut down rogue cases that threaten to gain traction when the main suspects aren't scum.
Except that GM DID look scummy, and I have yet to read into GK and see what the thoughts are regarding him.
How exactly did he have no suspects of his own?
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Vivax isn't doing this enough
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On March 19 2013 11:48 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 11:46 Mocsta wrote:On March 19 2013 11:45 VisceraEyes wrote:
No I thought I made it clear that it's the MANNER in which you're calling them out that I'm taking issue with. So wats ya point of "taking this issue" publicly. What is your purpose? TO MAKE YOU FUCKING SOTP ITONAGOAWINBA EORBINA OBNAQ AIOENB Q BQNPNTIO ABNW ANIRJBR aBUBN
Yeah I could swear you just said something along the lines of you wanting to stop this...?
But yeah Mocsta, this is shit play reminiscent of your end of day Hydra mafia scum shenanigans.
I never thought I'd ask this, but where's the 26-page-filter Mocsta we've all come to know and love?
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On March 19 2013 13:28 Wade Fell wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 12:37 geript wrote:
Did you see my last post VE? Do you think BH would make that night post after a town flip? You know what geript? I'm tired of you flinging shit like a monkey in a zoo from the sidelines. If you had something to say, you'd have said it during D1. Everything you've done this game has been with the purpose of hurting town, and you're just mad I've attacked you and other people who didn't like VE's idea for forming a town circle. Your so-called evidence regarding how I began this night is bullshit, like everything else you spew. of COURSE I look into the filters of dead townies. of COURSE I'll take his reads into account. we were literally talking about this over the course of the mafia podcast, but you didn't absorb any of that because you're just another grush, just another player who is worthless as a townie, so worthless scum keeps him alive until lylo because he never does anything remotely useful, the perfect scum player. VE told me to hold back on attacking you tonight, he said that he'd try to coax something useful out of you, but what's this? You're flinging shit at everything useful town has tried to do this game, because the very idea of veterans, of skilled players, trying to hunt scum is offensive to you. You're just a fly, geript, a fly on the wall that I will crush like all the other players who stand against me this game. I'm tired of listening to your garbage. tomorrow try to start a wagon on me, I fucking dare you. I'll lynch you first.
Uh...wow.
Tell us how you really feel BH.
(I'm guessing he didn't get to the part where he got possibly-outed by VE...)
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On March 19 2013 13:31 sciberbia wrote:
@BH
Can you explain why you chose to mason GK and then VE?
Also, I think you might as well claim your role in full and tell us if you are allowed to post the mason logs or not. Probably wait until the daypost to do this though.
This: I'm actually pretty curious (I know people hate role speculation but fuck it, it interests me) because I'm pretty sure most people thought Nightmare would have been a scum-aligned role. Figuring out what your role is may help us get a handle of what else there might be in the game.
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On March 19 2013 14:00 Mocsta wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2013 13:57 Wade Fell wrote:On March 19 2013 13:52 VisceraEyes wrote:On March 19 2013 13:45 Mocsta wrote:On March 19 2013 13:39 Wade Fell wrote:
As an aside, another reason I masoned GK is that I've interacted with him in QTs before when I coached him, and I knew I'd be able to get a perfect read on him from doing so, as well as help his scumhunting.
Coming in as a replacement. I noticed you keep trying to reenforce you know GK well cos you coached him I find, a one time admission of this is usually what a town player does. But you have done it repeatedly, leading to two conclusions (1) You hope you have town cred, and trying to make an appeal to popularity for GK to be town (2) You are establishing a minor "newbie" shroud over GK, essentially an additional appeal Considering I dont have a town read at all from GK... and factoring your coach comments above AND CONSIDERING AS WELL you're a much more meek and timid personality (comp. Mafia LX). I would bank you are both scum Sandroba said it best...Let me remind you. On March 16 2013 22:24 sandroba wrote:
BH is trying to emulate his previous behavior. Respond to this post BH, because it contains no ad hom attacks and raises points I'd like you to address. Why were you so bent on emulating your previous, confident play earlier on while your play since suggests a more cautious, reserved approach? I'm not emulating my confident play-- my play, if you don't count my blue actions, is utterly confident. Yes, my choice of mason targets was cautious, but I was unable to post as much as I'd like during D1 because TPS and sandro's cycles lined up. The fact of the matter is, I had more to gain and far less to lose from masoning GK than from masoning one of my scumreads, especially when those scumreads are TPS and Testsubject, both of whose intransigence would likely not translate well to a mason QT. Was GK a newbie, and probably easily impressioned by me? Sure, of course. But on the other hand, he's also a newbie who has been coached by me. He knows how I think and how I hunt scum. Of all the various newbies in this game to mason, GK is the most likely to figure me out if I am scum. Of all the various vets in this game to mason, Ve is the most ly likely to figure me out if I am scum. My blue actions are for discussion scumreads, and cautious, but if I were scum they'd be hideously risky. I'd really feel better if GK were here to talk also *nudge nudge* Course u do, it would be coordinated if GK was here. I dont like this BH.. this reads as a politician trying to sway me around "I had more to gain and far less to lose." Blah Blah Blah Town BH is Motherfucker.. i did this, its the right choice, dont question me Keep up those meek and timid speeches scumIf u want me to start pulling Mafia LX quotes and providing contrast I shall oblige... if u havnt forgotten (MilkSuckler- me) and you had epeen battles in LX.. and this is going radically different. Now that game I am town... this game im town That game you were town.. this game.. (well surely u can spot the difference)
It wouldn't be coordinated though would it? I thought the mason 'connection' ends with each phase, meaning his connection now is with VE?
If you look at his earlier posts defending GK he is trying to coordinate a defense there and sounds pretty confident aside from when GK basically leaves him in the lurch and doesn't show up. Which posts specifically lead you to believe he is acting rather than actually going through with 'motherfucker' BH, Mocsta?
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EPT
