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On March 04 2013 18:57 ObviousOne wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2013 18:46 Aquanim wrote:On March 04 2013 18:40 ObviousOne wrote:@Aqua: On March 01 2013 11:42 randombum wrote:On March 01 2013 11:36 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:29 randombum wrote:Alright 22, Restraining order, Overall, another really short one, but the conclusion is different though. I don't like his posting. Mostly lurkerish and minimal analysis (focused on JJ). His tone also really bugs me like: On February 27 2013 01:09 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 00:35 The Milkman wrote:
Why are people of low thread presence trying to defend Promethelax and swing the lynch somewhere else? This is the dumbest thing I have read all game, and let me tell you, there are plenty dumb things around. I hate comments like that which really shouldn't be a part of team liquid. His most redeeming post is: On February 27 2013 11:34 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 11:12 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Prom layabout jj geript testsubject vivax Yes Maybe Yes Yes No Yes Which is basically a scum list with no justification. In other words, it's pretty pointless/bad. And that's his most redeeming. So he's super suspicious to me. Not quite as strong as jcarl because jcarls filter just as shitty, but as I posted earlier jcarl backtracked his reads with almost no explanation which to me is worse than lurking. Randombum.. thanks for going through the filters. you have identified two people you are suspicious of. What do you intend to do with them? I already stated I'm going to lynch jcarl unless I get convinced by somebody else. If for some reason nobody wants jcarl and they want RO instead I'd be willing to lynch him too. On March 03 2013 04:41 randombum wrote:On March 03 2013 00:02 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 02 2013 19:31 randombum wrote:
Chez is looking very scummy looking at this point. Although the set-up speculation is giving me doubts. Still, I would be happy to see him lynched. vote chez RandomBumOn March 01 2013 13:46 randombum wrote:
Going to wait on the aftermath of the day vig before really committing to anything though. ?Chezinu?What happened to Jcarlsoniv? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=399294¤tpage=120#2388 I still don't like him. In fact I've felt worse about him after he responded. I pointed out some thing I dislike as a scum behavior and his response was to get over it. However, there's like 8 lurkers on chez and I don't think I'll be swaying the town over from a very scummy looking chez that everybody already agrees on. On March 04 2013 13:40 randombum wrote:
Also, anybody want to discuss somebody not geript? Like jcarl, let's lynch that guy. Interestingly enough he wanted to do a vote switch from Chez based on Chez not being shot by a town day-vig. But he is interested in lynching Jcarl and I think that's bonus points for him right now. Still not interested in a randombum lynch. He looks like he's trying to figure stuff out. Well there's only two scum left and unless randombum and jcarlsoniv are the last two scum I don't see why scum randombum wouldn't attack a suspicious-looking jcarlsoniv. After all, randombum has to do something... Have you checked Geript's meta as mentioned before? Show nested quote +On March 03 2013 02:21 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
If anyone wants proof Geript is scum/3rd party go look at his town filter from the last newbie mafia. It couldn't be more different, I usually hate meta reads but this one is nothing but net Did you give it a look? It's night and day. Something is off about Geript this game and he's overplaying the martyr right now. I've done the martyring thing too, I martyred HARD in my second or third newbie game and I finally picked myself up and at least tried to do what any town player should do in his position: try to organize thoughts into cases and push them regardless of how terrible I looked.
Yeah I looked at Geript's meta from the newbie and I agree it's different. The game itself is a lot different though. IIRC he died night one in the newbie and never came under much pressure. A newbie mini has a much, much different dynamic from a normal, larger-sized game too.
I can't imagine my play looks anything like the last newbie I played either, it certainly doesn't feel like it. The frusuration I feel in geript's posts with this game pretty much mirrors my own.
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I also can't picture scum geript being, well, angry for this long. He reads as being really tilted to me, and IMO scum would be more resigned given how the game's gone so far.
Also, scum's first instinct is to survive and OMGUSing Wade at this point was basically suicide.
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On March 04 2013 19:55 Wade Fell wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2013 19:44 Aquanim wrote:
I also can't picture scum geript being, well, angry for this long. He reads as being really tilted to me, and IMO scum would be more resigned given how the game's gone so far.
Also, scum's first instinct is to survive and OMGUSing Wade at this point was basically suicide. I understand why you think that-- and in fact, there is a not-entirely-small part of me that agrees with your sentiment here. After all, would scum really keep up such a facade, be so angry, lash out so desperately and helplessly at me in a way that could only hurt himself? It certainly feels like it could be the hissyfit of a hopeless townie, fueled by anger and fear-- and it falls in line with geript's crazed ravings from earlier. However, that small part of me must be silenced, because it is the part of me that is not rational, but rather, attempts to rationalize. It sees anger and emotion and it feels rather than thinks. It imagines itself cornered and hopeless and lashing out at its attackers desperately and self-destructively. It is seductive. It has a logic all its own, doesn't it? It is wrong. Geript is lashing out, yes, and he is doing so in a profoundly unhelpful way-- abandoning his reads for an omgus rather than writing cases on the scumreads he hashed out the previous night. This is probably the perfect act for scum who finds himself utterly cornered, on par with Prom's disappearance or Chezinu's shenannies. Geript has no tools, no day vigilante shot to wave around, and unlike Prom he is the 4th of 5 scum and cannot afford to go quietly into the night. On the other hand, he must plan for the contingency of his defense, whatever it is, failing, and his final teammate attempting to win alone in the darkness. Whatever he does between now and his flip, he cannot give up associative tells, not when there is only one scum left besides himself. So he feigns anger, but he does it carefully-- no additional information or cases given out, just lashing at the two strongest townies remaining in the game. And geript is no ordinary anger-feigner, he is a skilled technician who works with mental patients-- he can feign anger like no other. This seed of doubt in your heart, it isn't based on geript hunting scum, giving out reads, or being useful or townlike in any fashion, even in mindset. A frustrated townie, even as he dies, tries to push his reads. Even when he OMGUSes, he is still OMGUSing for town. Even when he rages, he rages for the town. Geript is clever, but he must not give anything away with fake scumhunting, not when his teammate has to win the game alone. Don't let emotions cloud your logical judgement.
A nice story you weave there. And I admit, quite reasonable. I'm by no means certain that Geript is town. On the grounds that we have a million billion mislynches and the game is so broken at the moment I am not desperate to not lynch him.
My feeling is still that he's absolutely tilted town though. If I'm wrong - so be it. One way or another, we'll find out. It's hardly like you need my vote to lynch him, anyway.
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On March 04 2013 20:12 Wade Fell wrote:
Like, this level of "not remembering who your scumreads are" would be kind of understandable if he were going after someone who had been antagonizing him, like me. But Vivax? Come on, geript. So scummy.
jeez you had to wait until now to make an actual point.
That's a problem. To be honest I had his original suspicions of me as a point in his favour since my play has been frankly pretty shitty and everyone else who thought I was scum I have as probably town. The vote for Vivax is actually really really awful though. A scum Geript would know that though...
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On March 04 2013 20:39 MilkSuckler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2013 18:46 Aquanim wrote:On March 04 2013 18:40 ObviousOne wrote:@Aqua: On March 01 2013 11:42 randombum wrote:On March 01 2013 11:36 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 01 2013 11:29 randombum wrote:Alright 22, Restraining order, Overall, another really short one, but the conclusion is different though. I don't like his posting. Mostly lurkerish and minimal analysis (focused on JJ). His tone also really bugs me like: On February 27 2013 01:09 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 00:35 The Milkman wrote:
Why are people of low thread presence trying to defend Promethelax and swing the lynch somewhere else? This is the dumbest thing I have read all game, and let me tell you, there are plenty dumb things around. I hate comments like that which really shouldn't be a part of team liquid. His most redeeming post is: On February 27 2013 11:34 Restraining Order wrote:On February 27 2013 11:12 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Prom layabout jj geript testsubject vivax Yes Maybe Yes Yes No Yes Which is basically a scum list with no justification. In other words, it's pretty pointless/bad. And that's his most redeeming. So he's super suspicious to me. Not quite as strong as jcarl because jcarls filter just as shitty, but as I posted earlier jcarl backtracked his reads with almost no explanation which to me is worse than lurking. Randombum.. thanks for going through the filters. you have identified two people you are suspicious of. What do you intend to do with them? I already stated I'm going to lynch jcarl unless I get convinced by somebody else. If for some reason nobody wants jcarl and they want RO instead I'd be willing to lynch him too. On March 03 2013 04:41 randombum wrote:On March 03 2013 00:02 MilkSuckler wrote:On March 02 2013 19:31 randombum wrote:
Chez is looking very scummy looking at this point. Although the set-up speculation is giving me doubts. Still, I would be happy to see him lynched. vote chez RandomBumOn March 01 2013 13:46 randombum wrote:
Going to wait on the aftermath of the day vig before really committing to anything though. ?Chezinu?What happened to Jcarlsoniv? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=399294¤tpage=120#2388 I still don't like him. In fact I've felt worse about him after he responded. I pointed out some thing I dislike as a scum behavior and his response was to get over it. However, there's like 8 lurkers on chez and I don't think I'll be swaying the town over from a very scummy looking chez that everybody already agrees on. On March 04 2013 13:40 randombum wrote:
Also, anybody want to discuss somebody not geript? Like jcarl, let's lynch that guy. Interestingly enough he wanted to do a vote switch from Chez based on Chez not being shot by a town day-vig. But he is interested in lynching Jcarl and I think that's bonus points for him right now. Still not interested in a randombum lynch. He looks like he's trying to figure stuff out. Well there's only two scum left and unless randombum and jcarlsoniv are the last two scum I don't see why scum randombum wouldn't attack a suspicious-looking jcarlsoniv. After all, randombum has to do something... Association, Association, Association.
Assuming randombum is town simply because he's attacking the scummy-looking jcarlsoniv is indeed a pointless association case and that was was in fact the point of my post.
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On March 04 2013 20:56 Wade Fell wrote:
His odd words about lynching for information during D2 are also troubling, as well as his slowness to vote Chez (though he did verbally commit to such a vote early in the day).
Well, now day 2's over I may as well explain what I was doing there.
The Chezinu wagon was all well and good but I thought that committing to it in the first few hours of d2 and then not having anything else to discuss for the rest of the day wouldn't be as useful as discussing other stuff for the first half of the day or so and then consolidating.
I never had any intention of *lynching* for information, only *voting* for information. Trouble is, once you call something a pressure vote it immediately ceases to exert any actual pressure... so I danced around the point of gathering information and hoped you'd take the hint.
Obviously Hassybaby never showed up to be pressured and my vote on him was about as useful as iceskates for a parrot. The only thing that came of it was that Macho Man voted for Hassy too and strongly endorsed his lynch. Still not sure exactly what I make of that, though.
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On March 05 2013 01:00 Vivax wrote:
I won't focus much any more on this game tbh lessons restarted today and I've got a few other games starting soon. Most of the work here has been done so I feel free to drop my attention on this game.
On March 05 2013 06:25 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
I hate to say it but my interest level in this game has dropped to basically 0. Has nothing to do with lack of effort from the moderators, but when town goes 3 in a row and no one is really taking hard stances I don't know what to contribute. We've already won so anything I do now just feels like going through the motions.
QFT
On March 05 2013 02:41 geript wrote:
So WF a few questions, how does Aqua look when I flip town?
Even worse :/
Bah... look, with a new day I've reexamined my actual read of Geript (as opposed to the position of defending him which I got backed into by my own stupidity) and found it is mostly doubts, either way. That vote on Vivax is truly awful and has shaken what remains of my townread rather a lot.
Given his play for the last day or two and the number of mislynches we have I think we all need to see a flip here, for better or for worse. I haven't been able to find a case that convinces me any more than this anywhere else and so:
##Vote: Geript
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I am fully aware of how terrible that makes me look and fully aware that you'll probably be obliged to lynch me at some point - if nothing else, to know that the roleblock today actually happened.
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On March 05 2013 08:40 MilkSuckler wrote:
The thing is he has been consistent in this approach all game. Suggesting a player tilted from the when his mayor campaign was insta-rejected.
I don't think he tilted then, I think he tilted when it became clear he was going to be lynched regardless of anything he did from that point onwards. I have no idea why you think I think he tilted then.
Again look at aquanim and his approach to entering all lynches. This guy loves being the critical thinker when town and putting down all others who are impulsive and obnoxious, if he thinks you`re not contributing... He tells y.
There is none of that this game except for an rb which has no basis.
Lynch aquanim
Yeah my play is a lot different this game. What I've learned this game is that I straight-up can't play Mafia (the game) unless I have some power to affect the lynch, and some authority to in fact tell people they are being shit.
It became clear to me between night one and mid day two that the quality of my reads and of my play would not be in any way responsible for the town win this game, we were just going to sheep vets to victory and as such I ceased to play properly at all. At this rate that will quite possibly get me lynched, but between increased external demands on my time and my opinion that that will only prolong the game rather than change the outcome I'm struggling to make myself care.
I'ma stop angsting now and try to contribute in some way.
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On March 05 2013 11:51 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
oh actually scratch that
RB Aquanim, wait for him to claim it then jump all over him saying there's no reason scum wouldn't rb vivax and he's a liar = a pretty good scum plan to force a mislynch
so it's ultimately WIFOM
Personally I have more trouble seeing why they wouldn't roleblock JJ. Vivax was probably just as likely to hit town as scum, as far as they knew.
Also has anyone considered that scum RB may have been saved by a town JOAT?
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EBWOP:
scum KP may have been saved by a town JOAT
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Well on topic, does anyone actually want to discuss randombum?
On March 04 2013 17:58 Aquanim wrote:
Anyone here? I just read randombum's filter and it contains:
- his weird "elect scum for mayor" plan
- scumreads on OO and jcarlsoniv he never followed up
- late sheeps onto Prom and Chezinu wagons
- that's pretty much it
Does anyone have any reason to think this guy's town? because I can't find one
I haven't found anything hugely scum-indicative but he hasn't contributed much at all. I don't think he's followed up or committed to anything really, which is never a good sign. His meta as town in Themed and Parallel seems to me to be slightly more spontaneous than his play here - he interacts more with other players, and even though he died night one in Themed his filter is already nearly as long as in this game.
Focusing on the geript lynch isn't accomplishing anything at this point.
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I'm bringing this up despite the lack of a clear-cut case because a) I think the thread could do with something else to discuss and b) I'm not comfortable with the complete lack of scrutiny randombum's play has received so far.
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Is this one of those memetic virus thingamies? As soon as anything refers to randombum it becomes invisible and nobody notices it?
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On March 06 2013 03:46 layabout wrote:
Off for the night, might as well say that i approve of the geript lynch but prefer aqua, and that hassy is probably scum/3rd party else he would have been modkilled already
I thought that about Chaos Bear... but nope, so I wouldn't count on it. We can dream though.
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On March 06 2013 06:26 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
If I had to guess based on my gut who that would be it would be WoS or BlazingHand.
You think scum BH would have hard-bussed Chezinu day 2 like he did, reducing scum KP to ONE?
0.o
0.o
0.o
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<throws five internet points on Geript's grave>
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On March 06 2013 09:17 JungleJorge wrote:
I'll order every geript voter in order of terribleness: Everyone is terrible.
I'd agree with you but voting Vivax was even worse.
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On March 06 2013 09:31 JungleJorge wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2013 09:20 Aquanim wrote:On March 06 2013 09:17 JungleJorge wrote:
I'll order every geript voter in order of terribleness: Everyone is terrible. I'd agree with you but voting Vivax was even worse. Aren't you the guy who was roleblocked? How do you explain the night actions? Shouldn't you be even more suspicious that vivax is SK, since the alternative is that you are scum?
1) There are other reasons why scum KP might not have been effective. Town JOAT is probably most plausible.
2) If Vivax is SK it should be blindingly obvious tomorrow or the day after and we can vote him then. There's no point in lynching him before then.
3) Pretty sure Vivax is town, have been since before he claimed vigilante.
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On March 06 2013 09:42 MilkSuckler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2013 09:36 Aquanim wrote:On March 06 2013 09:31 JungleJorge wrote:On March 06 2013 09:20 Aquanim wrote:On March 06 2013 09:17 JungleJorge wrote:
I'll order every geript voter in order of terribleness: Everyone is terrible. I'd agree with you but voting Vivax was even worse. Aren't you the guy who was roleblocked? How do you explain the night actions? Shouldn't you be even more suspicious that vivax is SK, since the alternative is that you are scum? 1) There are other reasons why scum KP might not have been effective. Town JOAT is probably most plausible. 2) If Vivax is SK it should be blindingly obvious tomorrow or the day after and we can vote him then. There's no point in lynching him before then. 3) Pretty sure Vivax is town, have been since before he claimed vigilante. Sorry, why is it more plausible for JOAT > SK (whether Vivax or not)
Barring an extremely unlikely scenario, if there is an SK it must be Vivax and he must have really badly not thought through his vigilante claim.
JOAT is not hugely likely but SK is even more unlikely and, I repeat, if Vivax is SK he MUST out himself by shooting every night and until then there is no point in worrying about it. If and when we conclude there is no SK, JOAT is the next reasonable hypothesis.
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EPT
