Newbie Mini Mafia XXIX - Page 2

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 15:52 GMT

#326

I admit that my question may not have been as useful as it sounded in my head at the time. If you don't want to answer it, don't. I think that it's not completely useless, I found the information you gave me interesting, because I don't know you as a player but this isn't your first game.

You're tunneling me pretty hard when you don't look particularly clean, yourself, Djo. How bout responding to some of the criticisms against yourself?

You even asked a more useless question than mine "Are you mafia?" is the classical question to which the entire game responds in chorus, "No."

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 16:00 GMT

#331

And Djo, you claim "no i asked him two questions" when both questions are basically the same.

debears case against Rad is developing interestingly, but Rad has a point - why are you trying so hard to save the lurkers?

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 16:01 GMT

#332

Get the lurkers to respond to suspicions. If they fail that, THEN you lynch them. Nobody's advocating a blind lurker lynch without trying to talk to them first.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 16:50 GMT

#364

On October 26 2012 01:36 debears wrote:
@Rad

Ah alright.

One more question.

Are 1,2 and 3 necessarily only mafia motivated? I don't see it.

1) Town - Create an ideal town atmosphere
Mafia - Appear to be a town doing so
2) Town - Try to lead the town by being a figure who knows what he's doing
Mafia - Try to be town doing that
3) Town - Confirmation Bias
Mafia - Mafia Bias???? (lol idk what to call it)

I'm going to reread the thread tonight. I do feel that it my case has confirmation bias at this point. No one has tried to actually break up the argument or put any real input into it. Mafia tend to love letting two townies go at it and not interfering. I'll reconsider my judgment

There HAS been interference, though... I kinda OMGUS FOS'd you when you came out swinging hard and made you explain yourself, and I haven't been the only one raising eyebrows at you.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 17:43 GMT

#375

Really wanna see some of the quiet ones post more (Thanks Clarity, for speaking up! Figured it was just a matter of 'haven't been on yet' in the case of 0posters.) especially Ini and Roco, who posted a little (Ini dodged my question, which I don't fault him for because the question was kindof a shitty one anyway - but not a lot of meaty content and in Roco's case, some rather confusing/questioanble tactics which I already stated I consider anti-town.

If/when 24 hours pass since Roco's last comment and he hasn't put any meat into his stance, I'm going to vote him.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 17:45 GMT

#376

EBWOP: ##FOS: Roco69

Additionally:
I'm a little worried about whether or not I'll be online at deadline time (9:00 servertime - 30 hours from now) because I might be on the road at the time.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 18:01 GMT

#377

I'd rather chill on the policy discussion until such time as it looks like we may invoke it tomorrow (there are still 4 people who haven't posted much content.) The policy is not law, but it's something. If you disagree that the policy can be helpful, I would ask that you take it up with your coach or look it up.

At that point tomorrow, if you're going against policy, it means you have a reason that you can present to people for doing so.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 25 2012 20:20 GMT

#389

On October 26 2012 05:04 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
So you're saying thats simply his meta? I'll take a look at his other games. Seemed suspicious though, as it stood out a ton from the other players.

Well, it certainly is NOW, that post was before this game even started.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 04:45 GMT

#458

Still waiting on some content from our lurkers...

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 12:35 GMT

#495

Running under the assumption that imcasey and Roco get modkilled if they don't show up, I'd lynch Djo. You say Inig has a lack of scumhunting but scrutinizing people and saying that you can only read town out of them is not a lack of scumhunting.

For now, I'm going with lynching the confusing lurker. If he either becomes A) not confusing, B) makes no action at all and makes me believe a modkill is incoming, or C) is replaced and the replacement can make some contribution.

Vote Roco69

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 12:35 GMT

#496

EBWOP
##Vote Roco69

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 12:43 GMT

#498

EBWOP - incomplete sentence. If he becomes A B or C, I may retract my vote. If I do, I'm probably going to vote for Djodref. Going to reread the accusations against Inig, but it seems to me that he's posting a lot of useful content and hasn't been as wishy washy as Dandel is trying to paint him.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:05 GMT

#512

Early on, Djo, I felt a contradiction from you based on a combination of you criticizing the lurker policy + calling out a lurker. More recently, you've switched gears a lot and been unsatisfied in defenses mounted against your case.

Finally just now claiming "not needing to consolidate" is fishy to me too. If we don't consolidate, we're going to have someone get lynched with like 3 votes, reducing scum's need to assist in the lynchwagon as well as improving scum ability to make sure one of their own cannot be lynched - so we're less likely to find scum today, but equally importantly, we would have less information later in the game (and could cause town to go rabid on itself) We want to consolidate.

I dunno if mods have more replacements lined up, I sure hope so. Having 3 playerdrops happen on day 1 is really depressing to me.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:15 GMT

#518

On October 26 2012 23:07 da0ud wrote:
One thing worries me and seems to have caught no ones attention.
Clarity has been modkilled!! We are already one less town!! And he was posting actual content.

I just noticed this too... I don't know how. I didn't notice that until I saw it on the front page. I then checked Clarity's filter and saw nothing. Had to check mod's filter to find it. Sigh...

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:26 GMT

#520

How can you possibly ask what accusations you're answering insufficiently? You're straight up ignoring them!

On October 26 2012 02:40 Alsn wrote:
My reasons for thinking Djodref is slightly scummy so far is that he is asking a lot of questions. That in itself isn't particularly scummy(in fact, done right it's pro-town as it pressures people into sharing their opinions and such).

The problem I have with it so far is that you keep asking people to answer you, yet your own statements so far amount to picking on the people who are being lurky(Ini, Roco) while at the same time criticising Rad for supporting lurker policy lynch?! This makes no sense to me. This in combination with the slip leads me to believe that you are trying to make yourself look good by being active. I can definitely see the possibility of there being town motivations for your actions so far, but I'd just like to point out that I have my eye on you.

So, with that in mind, FoS Djodref.

I'll see if I can't take a look at some of the other things said so far before I go to bed but if not, I'll do it first thing tomorrow as I will have a lot more time then.

On October 26 2012 10:15 Djodref wrote:

Show nested quote +

On October 26 2012 10:08 Clarity_nl wrote:
So.... you're trying to get a strong response by asking what Alsn thinks Inig, which he has done to two other people before him. So what's the reason you brushed off his FoS?

On October 26 2012 01:21 Djodref wrote:

On October 26 2012 01:10 Clarity_nl wrote:
@debears

You've used the word confidence an excessive amount of times. When someone mentioned day 1 policy lynches you immediately dismissed the idea. In fact, whenever anyone suggested something you turned it down, pushing your idea of "if you have a read, push it hard"

Policy lynching on day 1 exists for a reason. Lurkers hurt the town, whether they are mafia or town. If no one takes action mafia will win. Town needs to be organized and decisive, yet you are suggesting to basically follow your gut and push hard.
You follow that up by voting for Rad WAAAAAAY too early in the day.

You are advocating chaos.

If something is fishy, or a comment seems off, make a read or ask a question about it, but big bold statements like "be confident guys!!!" don't actually mean anything.

##FoS debears

@Clarity

I don't think that debears is advocating chaos. In my point of view, he is certainly promoting discussion. We could as well being still discussing policy lynches if he wasn't here. And please remind that it's quite easy for mafia to avoid a policy lynch.

By the way, do you believe that we can lynch a scum on D1 ?
What do you think of Inig ?

On October 26 2012 02:04 Djodref wrote:

On October 26 2012 01:45 Dandel Ion wrote:

On October 26 2012 01:42 Djodref wrote:
@Rad

My comments in red in your quoted post.

On October 26 2012 01:28 Rad wrote:

On October 26 2012 01:21 debears wrote:
Ok. But what individually makes us stand out as scum?

I'm going to reread the thread a couple of times tonight and figure this all out.

##Unvote

This is some of what I've got from you and/or djo

1. Pushed the confidence theme hard, as if to make it seem like we NEED to have a scum lynch d1 rather than a policy lurker lynch.
FUUUUUuuu. You are doing it again. Policy lynching is just an option and it is a bad option in my opinion because mafia can avoid it easily, especially when town decides to apply this strategy from the beginning. Lynching a suspicious player get us more chances to lynch mafia. We should start to scumhunt in order to do so, not throwing FoS at each other for disagreeing over policy.
2. Acted overconfident as if it was easy to make a scum read on d1 (is it? doesn't seem like it, and that's not due to lack of confidence, it's due to lack of information).
I'm not saying it is easy, I'm saying it is totally possible and you should have this mentality rather than the policy lynch solution mentality. Would you like to comment about Inig by the way ?
3. Twisted people's statements, either responding with something that had nothing to do with the original statement, or focusing heavily on a particular statement as if to give it more importance than it really should have.
Please be more specific
All of these things feel scummy to me.

You don't get it.

You establish a lurker-lynch policy early.
Potential lurkers see it and go all "oh shit if I lurk I'm gonna die"
So they don't lurk.

If you say "nah I'm completely against lynching lurkers" or "We should lynch the most active people"
What do lurkers do when they see that?
They'll tell themselves "cool, I'm set"
And then they lurk.

I'm not against a policy lynch but I think it would be better to bring it up when the right time comes (like 6 hours before the lynch ? anyway at a time we can finally identify some serious lurker).

Taking an early decision against or for policy lynches is just going to help mafia to use this decision on their favor.
Anyway, a lot of people seem to favor a policy lynch for today. I'm not going to go against it but I would appreciate these people to get into super scumhunting mode right now. I'm not going to forgive laziness at all, especially if you are supporting a policy lynch.

By the way, what do you think about Inig ?

On October 26 2012 08:25 Djodref wrote:

@Alsn

I would expect more from you than an half-assed FoS on me

What do you think about Inig ?

Honestly, I don't really care if Alsn has a FoS on me if it is for the reasons he has stated in his post. I know he is totally able to come at me with something more consistent if he really thinks I'm scum. Right now, I think his reasons are poor and I'm more interested in his opinion about Ini.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:29 GMT

#521

On October 26 2012 23:22 Djodref wrote:

Show nested quote +

Who are the three players who are going to drop, according to you ?

Are you even reading this thread ?

What kind of condescension is this?

1 - Clarity, who has already been modkilled
2 - Roco69, who has not posted since posting some pretty questionable stuff. He was immediately asked questions about it, and never responded.
3 - imcasey, who hasn't posted at all. (Likely player to get replaced, though.)

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:33 GMT

#523

Day one but you want someone, who is ostensibly town, to have a better reason than "well his post seems kinda fishy" for an FOS?

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:44 GMT

#528

On October 26 2012 23:35 Djodref wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'm sorry but I wouldn't call Clarity modkill a player drop. Clarity has made a mistake and has been punished for it. I thought you were referring to Oatsmaster instead of Clarity. I'm very curious how you could have missed that Clarity has been modkilled.
It has been very clear on the filters list for a long time.

I missed it initially (I was asleep at the time of his modkill) and didn't notice it immediately upon waking up, especially cause nobody had mentioned it. I had just noticed it when I made the "3 drops" comment, and agreed when daoud posted "wow, nobody is talking about this? and my reply to daoud amounted to an "i know right?"

Furthermore, it's not so much me being frustrated at 3 players lurking out of the game, but 3 players vanishing from the game before the end of day 1 is pretty depressing and could easily cause this game to suffer infant mortality.
And your condescending tone towards me and other accusers ("half-assed FOS") is bothering me.

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:45 GMT

#529

On October 26 2012 23:43 kushm4sta wrote:
When is lynch? Tonight in like 9 hours right?

Yup. 9 hours 15 mins from now (9:00 27 Oct server time. 8PM 26 Oct EDT.)

sylverfyre

United States8298 Posts

October 26 2012 14:49 GMT

#532

On October 26 2012 23:42 Djodref wrote:
@sylver

So do you have even your own reasons for possibly voting me today ?
Or were you just sheeping like a boss ?

Uh, I've said my reasons. I don't find your defenses/ignorance of accusations adequate, I don't like how you're like BLIND LURKER POLICY IS BAD when NOBODY was advocating blind lurker policy (last resort lurker policy) which pretty much was turning the discussion into a very useless one, then you turn around and start aggressively attacking Ini for lurking. Finally I don't like how you accuse Ini of "not scumhunting" when he makes some well-thought-out town-aligned reads (and some null-reads)

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