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ShiaoPi
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
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ShiaoPi
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
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ShiaoPi
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
First of all we should definetly go for a lynch, no-lynch is (at least in my opinion) utter nonsense. Regarding Lurkers, I believe that they should be put under suspicion especially in a 9 player setup. I was in the same game as mufaa and lurking screwed us over pretty badly in a 13 player game. I must say I really like release's approach until now, we won't get anything worthwhile from just being nice to each other. Pressuring is a great way to get some more information and should be utilizied. The only slightly suspicious thing until now was sciberbia's long post and his absence since then, but until he responds there is nothing to make of it. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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I was not that much concerned about your absence but just on the amount of seemingly "useless" things within the post. Don't see anything wrong with your elaborations on it now. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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On May 23 2012 00:15 s0Lstice wrote: ---snipped--- ShiaoPi has a small filter as well. You just like that back off your suspicions on sciberbia? Scum post fluffy quasi-useful posts all the time. They want to appear to be contributing without actually saying anything incriminating. If you reread my first post on sciberbia I would have assumed that it was easily visible that I had a bit of concern regarding him but not really a suspicion. Regarding my small filter, yes I did not post much until now, but how come that you with the exact same amount of posts (since the daypost) can claim that my filter is small. This strikes me as odd. Why complain about my filter if yours is not that much as well? | ||
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ShiaoPi
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Maybe I am also biased as he was one of the lurking scum in Newbie Mafia XIII, but he really reminds me of his play in the last game right now... | ||
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ShiaoPi
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ShiaoPi
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Since it is Day1 pretty much everyone's postcount is relatively low (although Mufaa really stands out here), your second argument on piling suspicion on you, while being wishy washy about it seems like a typical day 1 accusation/FOS to me. There simply is not enough material for solid cases against others. I believe solid ones will only appear well into the 2nd half of day 1 when there is more information. Not sticking someone's neck out is in my opinion understandable. Although it may be a scum trait it could also be a blue role. In terms of getting people's attention, nobody besides you, has really done something to get everyone on it. So in regards to that everyone would be suspicious. All in all I think that your case is just not "solid" enough without further information. Let's just wait for Milton's response, as that is something that will give us more info. | ||
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ShiaoPi
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
So you see me as scummy/suspicious? Let's take a look at your reasoning: I'll follow the chronological order of your post. So first off you scrutinize my first post and come to the conclusion that I am just repeating stuff, which has been said by others already. I actually see nothing wrong in joining a discussion that has already started. To me it seemed as they were asking for everyone's opinion, so I gave my opinion. If stating somebody's stance on something is scummy, well cannot help you then. In your 2nd snippet you take a closer look on my suspicions of Mufaa. I really do not think an issue of semantics is scummy. I also do not phrase it as "What others said" I posted "since we all agree..." If you really want to go into semantics please take note that I am using the plural with myself included, so it is just another way of saying since I and others agree on...." Going on to the 3rd excerpt: You state the following: + Show Spoiler + This post is practically without any new content but a defense. You could have said "I had no time/Wanted to see how things go", whatever... But you chose to say "You're not better than me". This seems like only searching for an excuse once other people target you. I was being put under suspicion so I defended myself, sounds pretty reasonable? You can interpret text in many ways, if we assume that I said "had no time/wanted to see how things go", you can also claim that it looks scummy, it really is a matter of interpretation. I see nothing wrong with my defense, firstly I clarified my stance on sciberbia, then I point out a flaw in his 2nd argument. Next snippet is me repsonding to sciberbia regarding my stance on him and as you take it out of context it looks useless. I believe it to have served it's purpose of further clarifying my opinion. Your suspicions regarding the time I came online and the time I posted "something original" are not understandable to me. I am simply not playing as aggressive as Release is and therefore I naturally lack "original" content, as you already pointed out my playstyle might seem as you phrased it: "maybe there is something, maybe not, who knows... there is not enough information... let's wait" Seems to me like a not too shabby way to play on Day 1. Not much yet you can base reads off and still quite some time to the deadline, whose approach always brings out the more mattering posts (at least in my opinion). I do not see it contradicting with the usage of pressure to gain information, which you seem to see. I pressured sciberbia very lightly, before now focusing on Mufaa, as he strikes me as most scummiest right now. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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I am going for hegeo's throat? Where? I merely defended myself. I am still intent on getting something out off Mufaa for now, as his lurkiness is just intolerable. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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What stands out from his posts is the analytical part. It seems to be lacking solidity to make the longer posts which he does not really support (see: + Show Spoiler + I kind of agree on the fact that activity creates information, but walls of text (I take it you exaggerated to make your point) don't help automatically. But this was already said earlier, so I wont elaborate on that. Basing from this statement he must himself believe to have solid cases going with his "wall of texts", but in my opinion they are not solid at all. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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On May 23 2012 06:40 s0Lstice wrote: ---snipped---- ShiaoPi, hegeo has made a case against you and I want to add to it. I called you out, and you said this: Discrediting your accuser instead of addressing the accusation smacks of fear. What's with the knee-jerk? You could have easily just said something like 'my small filter will be a short lived problem as I plan to contribute more soon.' What's more, I even put the spotlight on the two of us after our exchange, and before leaving the thread for a few hours: ...and your contributions since then are what? Mainly defense, and a half-baked (see:one game) meta argument on Mufaa, where you yourself admit that you may be biased. Regarding my "knee-jerk": I'll just quote my answer to hegeo: + Show Spoiler + I was being put under suspicion so I defended myself, sounds pretty reasonable? You can interpret text in many ways, if we assume that I said "had no time/wanted to see how things go", you can also claim that it looks scummy, it really is a matter of interpretation. I see nothing wrong with my defense, firstly I clarified my stance on sciberbia, then I point out a flaw in his 2nd argument. I believe it to be a good defense. It is Day 1, nobody is confirmed town until he flips, so why should I not throw the ball at you for a bit, while I answered your main question, which was "how come that you drop your suspicions on sciberba that easily?" That it came over slightly discrediting against you is part of it. As it seemed like you checked the filters of everyone in terms of length. I see no logic behind building a case on a small filter size, when first of your own filter is not that big and secondly there are people with even smaller filters (see Mufaa). Contributionwise I admit that there was not much from me yet. I gave my opinion on the cases others have posted and pointed out that we have a hardcore-lurker (which is more than just a "half-baked metacomment") right now. Really contributing as in lots of activity and some cases, are Release, sciberbia, hegeo and Mordanis. That makes 3 other people besides yourself, whose list of contributions is just as "meager" as mine and still you do not tunnel them. Why? Because of my small filter? But what about Mufaa's? Your argument of small filter = scum/should be pressured seems to go haywire with your case against me, so I naturally suspect you. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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If you are not buying my explaination I cannot help you. To me your main argument seemed to be me dropping my suspicions on scriberbia, I answered it and went on to attack you, simply because taking filter size as an argument in beforementioned circumstances seems like a feeble attempt to give a random accusation/suspicion more weight. Therefore you are suspicious in my opinion. On another note you have not answered my other question, regarding you tunneling me all the time when your argumentation which you base it on (contribution, filter size) also fits others. Let's take a look at your post: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 00:15 s0Lstice wrote: We lynch day 1, period. Debating about whether or not to lynch only happens if we have no reads to go off of, which to me makes the debate a non-factor.. We've heard from everyone now I believe, solid reads will come with a little time. Can we stop discussion about policy now please? It creates an environment where scum can comfortably post and be 'CREDIT TO TEAM.' Scumhunting must begin now. I'm looking first to sciberbia. I'm not sure if Release reads you as green, but I currently do. More fluff and I'll change my mind though. Your stated purpose was to generate discussion...mission accomplished. I'll be looking for you to make something out of it. ShiaoPi has a small filter as well. You just like that back off your suspicions on sciberbia? Scum post fluffy quasi-useful posts all the time. They want to appear to be contributing without actually saying anything incriminating. Miltonkram confuses me. You say you don't want people to share town reads because it's giving information to the mafia. What? Scum know who is town and who is not. Scumhunting is ALL ABOUT posting your reads on people. They are accused, and must defend. You smell fishy to me Milton. ##FOS: Miltonkram I am one of the several people you call out. As you share them in the thread I would believe it safe to assume that these were (or maybe still are) your main suspects. The one thing that you combined with calling me out was filter size and my opinion on sciberbia. After I explained my stance on sciberbia all you had to work with was filtersize and my reaction. My reaction was explaining my opinion on sciberbia and an attack on you. You continue to ignore my explaination and just go on about my attack on you. Conclusively, you seem to base your pressure on me by randomness of grabbing the name of the first person who did not post much until then and could be an easy way to seemingly contribute. I quote you now: + Show Spoiler + Scum post fluffy quasi-useful posts all the time. They want to appear to be contributing without actually saying anything incriminating. Keep that in mind as I quote your latest post: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 07:59 s0Lstice wrote: ShiaoPi Notice that all I've done is apply pressure. I've never claimed that a small filter is a scum guarantee. Being relatively quiet is plenty of reason to pressure you, just as it is plenty of reason to pressure me. You've responded with gusto, and that's good for everybody, as we have more to go on. I still don't buy your explanation for why you didn't address my accusation. The fact remains that you attacked instead of explained. You wanting to throw the ball my way is fine, but doing so in lieu of a defense to pretty weak pressure (based on filter size, which I agree with you is weak) is scummy. As such I still suspect you. You wonder why I don't focus on him (Mufaa). Everybody is suspicious of him, me saying so serves no purpose. We know already his name will probably come up for lynch tomorrow because lurkers are at best useless and at worst dangerous. This raises the following question: Why do you call out somebody, if you are not convinced by your own argumentation? To me it seems like you are trying to appear town as you try to build a case on somebody. ##FOS: s0lstice | ||
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ShiaoPi
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ShiaoPi
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On May 23 2012 08:16 Miltonkram wrote: I already had suspicions of ShiaoPi, but his latest "defense" just makes him feel more scummy in my eyes. -snipped- At this point ShiaoPi seems like he is just treading water. I think he's either bad town or panicking mafia. Please note the sections that I have bolded in his quote. He never addresses the fact that he's being attacked because his posts lack content. He keeps trying to focus attention on other players as a means of defending himself, rather than actually defending himself with content. If you do quote parts of my defense please make sure that you quote the entire picture. Take a look at my post in response to hegeo: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 05:25 ShiaoPi wrote: -snipped- Your suspicions regarding the time I came online and the time I posted "something original" are not understandable to me. I am simply not playing as aggressive as Release is and therefore I naturally lack "original" content, as you already pointed out my playstyle might seem as you phrased it: "maybe there is something, maybe not, who knows... there is not enough information... let's wait" Seems to me like a not too shabby way to play on Day 1. Not much yet you can base reads off and still quite some time to the deadline, whose approach always brings out the more mattering posts (at least in my opinion). I do not see it contradicting with the usage of pressure to gain information, which you seem to see. I pressured sciberbia very lightly, before now focusing on Mufaa, as he strikes me as most scummiest right now. I bolded my explainations regarding content etc. Furthermore I would have assumed that it is content that I am explaining why and how I posted the things, so please point out my defense, which "lacks content". Furthermore I focused my defense on the "knee-jerk" as most people seem to be much more concerned with that than what you perceive as lack of content. I am also calling out people in my posts since that is in fact content. Maybe it is not as nicely formatted and phrased as it would be if I did not have to permanently defend myself, but do take your time to read my posts thoroughly. There is content. On May 23 2012 08:16 Miltonkram wrote: Then he makes a list of active players, in order to make himself look like he's accomplishing something. How much does that list actually accomplish? That "list" was not supposed to accomplish something. Take a look at it in the context I have put it into. It simply serves as a way to reveal the contradiction that I have already pointed out in solstice's posts. I have not made that list with the caption: HERE IS MY CONTRIBUTION! If you want to point out weird spots in my posts make sure you do it within their context and not just out of the blue. On May 23 2012 08:16 Miltonkram wrote: If you look over his filter, how many people has he actually put real pressure on? He put some very weak pressure on hegeo, only after Mordanis pressured him first. He's been gunning for Mufaa, a very easy player to gun for since he's lurking like crazy. Again I have already given my reasoning on day 1 play reread my filter and you should be able to see it. I am currently gunning for Mufaa and s0lstice. Mufaa for hardcorelurking and bad experience in newbie mafia XIII, while I have elaborated on s0lstice in my post before. On May 23 2012 08:16 Miltonkram wrote: @ s0Lstice- Thank you for clearing up why you were suspicious of me. I'm still not sure you're town, but at the very least that clears up some of my suspicions. For now I'm lessening my focus on you and shifting it to ShiaoPi. ##unFOS: s0Lstice ##FOS: ShiaoPi Hopefully that should have been enough to convince you. I am going to bed now, so don't fret over my sudden lack of activity. | ||
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ShiaoPi
TAIWAN NUMBAH WAN5956 Posts
Let's get some of my thoughts out: First of regarding my suspcions on s0lstice: In my opinion he is constantly trying to overemphasize my attack on him instead of clearing the accusation. If you go to that particular post, I do in fact answer his main argument, which was concerning my stance on sciberbia, then I went on to attack him. Reading through his response I came to the conclusion that either he can not understand my point of view or does not want to. Both of these attributes are not really helpful to us. Either it's bad townie play or it is scummy play to get a bandwagon starting on me. For now I will stop responding to you, s0lstice since our quarrel has degenerated to something close to OMGUS and does not give us any more information, you refuse to budge from your stance I refuse to move from mine. As Golden wants a clearer list on my suspicions on him here goes: -His first post without fluff is sharing a list of reads. There is nothing wrong with that but I feel that his seemingly random choice to call me out appears as an attempt to seemingly contribute without doing much. -I agree with him that my play until now has not been flawless, but him increasing the pressure without more "evidence" strikes me as suspicious. -His argumentation against me started with lack of content and filter size. I pointed out the flaws in it and just get tunneled harder. If you go through his filter you will see that he lacks content as well (besides tunneling me). This is a contradiction of his own logic --> fishy. -He continually pressures me without reacting to parts of my counter-pressure on him. Hopefully that helps others as well. Concerning Milton: Golden brings up some good points on him and Milton has promised for a while now to deliver something more in detail regarding his stance on me. To me him switching his FOS appeared as bandwagoning on someone already under pressure, while voting for Mufaa. This is a move I do not understand. If he wants to increase the pressure on me he should just vote me instead of going after our well known lurker, who has already been called out multiple times. Notable is alos that he ignored my responses to his FOS on me. Seems like a lot of inconsistent play, adding weight on to Golden's post. The above two paragraphs should be enough to clarify my opinions on Milton and solstice. Regarding the case on hegeo: I'll probably just repeat myself but nothing of his posts screams scum to me. It could very well be bad townie play. In addition to my critique on him earlier I also want to point out that his vote on Mufaa is outright not helpful. Several people have already called him out and by his lack of responses we can dedcut that he will either get modkilled come the nightpost or we will lynch him day 2. No reason to vote him off, if there are other more informative targets around. Still I won't vote for him now, because I believe it to be possible that we got a case of bad townie. If push comes to shove and we lack a vote on him and would have a no-lynch he will have my vote, as I already stated that in my opinion no-lynches are utterly stupid for town. I will probably wait with my vote until I see more from Milton/solstice. Something more from hegeo would not be wrong either. Lastly regarding Mufaa: I already said, lynch him tomorrow if he is still not modkilled by then. | ||
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ShiaoPi
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On May 24 2012 02:54 Miltonkram wrote: -snipped- My top scumread is still ShiaoPi. Essentially, he plays scum exactly how I would. His entire D1 posts have been pretty wishy-washy and noncommittal, allowing him freedom later in the game because he hasn't actually tied himself strongly to the information or accusations in any of his posts. With that in mind let's look at his first post. Is there any reason why you have conveniently ignored my posts about my playstyle? I explained the reasons of it here: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 05:25 ShiaoPi wrote: I am simply not playing as aggressive as Release is and therefore I naturally lack "original" content, as you already pointed out my playstyle might seem as you phrased it: Seems to me like a not too shabby way to play on Day 1. Not much yet you can base reads off and still quite some time to the deadline, whose approach always brings out the more mattering posts (at least in my opinion). I elaborated further on it here: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 07:12 ShiaoPi wrote: It is Day 1, nobody is confirmed town until he flips, so why should I not throw the ball at you for a bit, while I answered your main question, which was "how come that you drop your suspicions on sciberba that easily?" That it came over slightly discrediting against you is part of it. I guess you just accidentally left those out of your analysis. But nevermind let's carry on. On May 24 2012 02:54 Miltonkram wrote: Here's what he does, he compliments the most active player early on (Release) and talks about playstyle. Then he adds some weak suspicions toward sciberbia. Suspicion that he can easily back down from, and that certainly isn't breaking any new ground. Wait, doesn't this sound a lot like another early post? + Show Spoiler + Release- I like the way you're starting out this game. If we are going to catch scum we need to be aggressive about it. Don't worry too much about the tone of your posts. sciberbia's post does seem a bit suspicious. He repeats his ideas several times in different ways to make it look like he's putting out more info than he actually is. It seems quite scummy to me. Mordanis- Don't get too offended by aggressive behavior. If mafia doesn't actually think that a little pressure will lead to a lynch, then why should they answer any questions at all? We need to make sure that people are held accountable to what they say. sciberbia- What do you have to say about the accusations pointed at you? There's quite a bit of fluffy information in your post. Let's try to keep the conversation more focused on who might be scum, everything else is secondary. That's right, his entire first post is a rehash of one of my first posts. A post I made before him. If my first post wasn't breaking any new ground, his certainly wasn't. It seems a good way to blend in with the crowd without sticking his neck out there. If you claim that I was just repeating your words, where are my thoughts on Mordanis in that post? I can't find them, furthermore have stated my reasoning behind my first post already, feel free to reread:+ Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 05:25 ShiaoPi wrote: So first off you scrutinize my first post and come to the conclusion that I am just repeating stuff, which has been said by others already. I actually see nothing wrong in joining a discussion that has already started. To me it seemed as they were asking for everyone's opinion, so I gave my opinion. If stating somebody's stance on something is scummy, well cannot help you then. What a surprise, you seem to have overread my stance on the first post. If it does not convince you, can't help you I made my point on it clear enough. On May 24 2012 02:54 Miltonkram wrote: He goes on to immediately back down from his pressure with this post. + Show Spoiler + Maybe I should have rephrased my post on the suspicions towards you Sciberbia: I was not that much concerned about your absence but just on the amount of seemingly "useless" things within the post. Don't see anything wrong with your elaborations on it now. Here we get the first taste of ShiaoPi's tactic. He pressures someone and then states, "Oh, I wasn't actually pressuring you." It seems like a good way to blend in while also "contributing" as scum. This is just the first instance of his noncommittal aggression.[/quote] Can you show me other instances of so called noncomittal aggression? First of all reread my posts towards sciberbia, I used the words, I never put any serious pressure on him. I just acknowledged the fact that there was a slight wonderment, but I have not acted upon it. Just for the record again, I am not really comittal on day 1 for reasons above. On May 24 2012 02:54 Miltonkram wrote: Let's look at his suspicions of hegeo. + Show Spoiler + I am unsure what to make of hegeo. The one thing which seems suspicious to me is his timing after being called out, the other stuff could easily be bad townie or careful day 1 play. Seeing that I am getting flak for my style it is easy to see why he gets thoroughly investigated now. What stands out from his posts is the analytical part. It seems to be lacking solidity to make the longer posts which he does not really support (see: + Show Spoiler +) Basing from this statement he must himself believe to have solid cases going with his "wall of texts", but in my opinion they are not solid at all. Once again this is "suspicion" that he doesn't actually have to commit to, and he hopes he won't be held accountable for. How is that suspicion to you? The general vibe of the post is a more defensive one regarding hegeo. I have stated more than once already that I believe him to be a bad townie, I point out the flaw in his play, but I do not throw a FOS in his direction, nor do I pressure him directly. If you put that post back into the context, it was just me answering to the question of sciberbia. Please do not extract things out of context to make them seem "evidence". I was asked on my opinion therefore I answered. I do not see anything wrong with that. On May 24 2012 02:54 Miltonkram wrote: I would ask you all this, who would be more damaging as scum? The actions I've taken in the game have all been actions that I've committed to. (barring the mistake I made with s0Lstice, but that was just me being dumb.) You can actually tie me to what I've written and hold me accountable later in the game, whereas ShiaoPi seems to have some sort of "escape clause" in almost every single one of his posts. The only thing he's been adamant about has been his FOS of s0Lstice, and that pressure has a built in escape to it, seeing as he can excuse himself by saying that s0Lstice had pressured him first. Anyway, what are people's thoughts on this? Seeing as I'll be away for an hour or two I'm going to go ahead and vote. ##unVote: Mufaa ##Vote: ShiaoPi Conclusivly I have the feeling that you simply ignored my posts which did not fit into your logic. If you take a look at this post of mine: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 09:06 ShiaoPi wrote: If you do quote parts of my defense please make sure that you quote the entire picture. Take a look at my post in response to hegeo: + Show Spoiler + On May 23 2012 05:25 ShiaoPi wrote: -snipped- Your suspicions regarding the time I came online and the time I posted "something original" are not understandable to me. I am simply not playing as aggressive as Release is and therefore I naturally lack "original" content, as you already pointed out my playstyle might seem as you phrased it: "maybe there is something, maybe not, who knows... there is not enough information... let's wait" Seems to me like a not too shabby way to play on Day 1. Not much yet you can base reads off and still quite some time to the deadline, whose approach always brings out the more mattering posts (at least in my opinion). I do not see it contradicting with the usage of pressure to gain information, which you seem to see. I pressured sciberbia very lightly, before now focusing on Mufaa, as he strikes me as most scummiest right now. I bolded my explainations regarding content etc. Furthermore I would have assumed that it is content that I am explaining why and how I posted the things, so please point out my defense, which "lacks content". Furthermore I focused my defense on the "knee-jerk" as most people seem to be much more concerned with that than what you perceive as lack of content. I am also calling out people in my posts since that is in fact content. Maybe it is not as nicely formatted and phrased as it would be if I did not have to permanently defend myself, but do take your time to read my posts thoroughly. There is content. That "list" was not supposed to accomplish something. Take a look at it in the context I have put it into. It simply serves as a way to reveal the contradiction that I have already pointed out in solstice's posts. I have not made that list with the caption: HERE IS MY CONTRIBUTION! If you want to point out weird spots in my posts make sure you do it within their context and not just out of the blue. Again I have already given my reasoning on day 1 play reread my filter and you should be able to see it. I am currently gunning for Mufaa and s0lstice. Mufaa for hardcorelurking and bad experience in newbie mafia XIII, while I have elaborated on s0lstice in my post before. Hopefully that should have been enough to convince you. I am going to bed now, so don't fret over my sudden lack of activity. I had already answered to you yesterday, but weirdly enough it had little to no influence on your renewed case against me. I really cannot understand that you take almost 7 hours for your case today but still managed to miss all my later posts in which I explained my actions in detail. It smells of scumwagoning. ##Vote: Miltonkram | ||
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ShiaoPi
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I was asking for the reasons why you still see me as scummy. I believe to have answered all your proddings to some satisfaction. You acknowledged my stance on sciberbia, then went on to ask about me attacking rather than defending. I answered that question as well. You even said it yourself: My filter is full of my feelings on ShiaoPi for others to consider for themselves, and our recent exchanges have reinforced my initial suspicions, but nothing really new has been added. I simply do not understand the continued pressure besides it being a case of OMGUS (I am not entirely innocent of that either) | ||
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On May 24 2012 06:32 O.Golden_ne wrote: thank god i didn't miss the deadline. I went to sleep and forgot to vote. I'm going to stand by my earlier posts about miltonkram. but before i vote i want to say that i will change to Hegeo in the case that we dont get enough votes for a lynch, i like Mordanis and Releases argument on him. In the case the miltonkram flips town, i'm going seriously question ShiaoPi however. @Hegeo can you please swap your vote of Mufaa, he is most likely modkilled. ##Vote: Miltonkram Golden, this post of you is highly confusing to me. You point out that you stand by your posts about miltonkram and your suspicions therefore. But then you actually consider swapping votes on hegeo, if a no-lynch is looming. Can you explain your logic behind that? With your vote we are at 4 votes on Milton, which makes a switch to hegeo to ensure a lynch highly unlikely. With your vote the only missing ones are solstice and mufaa. As I doubt that mufaa will show up for the deadline it is much more likely that solstice will go with the milton vote to ensure a lynch as he has stated. The other confusing thing about it is your conclusion that if milton flips town I am to be pointed at. Can you enlighten me on that thought process? I did pressure him but only after he started pressuring me and as response to his poorly written cases. | ||
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