EPTyes, you would be correct.
TL Mafia XLVII - Page 75
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annul
United States2841 Posts
yes, you would be correct. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:09 annul wrote: he proclaimed to have more information than i do ("what he meant was ____"). how can he possibly know this? he can claim "he probably meant ____ instead" or "i think he meant ____" but that is not what he claimed. note that when YOU said "i saw wherebugsgo as saying _______" i never attacked you in the same way. nonono easy example from my last game: I was a townie in a noob game. There was some people who did not talk at all, not even lurking with just one post. So I went ahead and posted this + Show Spoiler + On October 30 2011 20:12 Toadesstern wrote: oh and just a hint since this is a beginners game: If you are a dt or medic don't just hide or something. First of all, that really gives you away for mafia and secondly we might end up killing our very own dt or medic because we went for a lurker who turned out to be a blue playing "let's not get any attention or I'm going to get killed by mafia". Unless your coach told you otherwise. In that case just tell him he sucks. Your awesome special powers are not going to safe the day if noones talking at all. To sum it up: post bitches Instantly some people appeared and criticized me for telling blues to make themselves reveal theirselves. That's not what I meant and therefore some people came along and said it's (probably) not what I meant. I think the same thing's happening here. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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Jackal58
United States4264 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:28 annul wrote: understand this as well: there is only a ((64/80)*(16/79)) = 16.2% chance to get a mafia day 1 with mayor kill, with random chance alone. thats nothing at all. so speak up because if everyone is scared then we lose ~5 out of every 6 times. we need to improve upon random chance. so contribute. When I first started playing here town raped scum I'd say 8 out of 10 games. Consistently. Of course we weren't wading through 20 pages at a time of people attacking each others intelligence and abilities. How the fuck do I analyze 20 pages of "NO YOU". This is why town loses now. I have already stated twice my thoughts on a DT plan. After some more consideration I have gone from simply believing it will never work due to the inability to control a random unknown quantity of unknown people to thinking that this plan is actually down right scummy. It does a few things quite well for the scum team. 1 - Any list of players generated (Whether 3 or 10 doesn't matter) is simply going to generate that number of people screaming "I'm not scum!" "Why am I on that list!" etc. It doesn't foster conversation. It creates confrontation. Scum Agenda 2 - Any list put forth is easily manipulated by scum to keep their members off of it. Or to at least minimize the number of scum on it. Scum Agenda. 3 - Verification of those players alignments on the list is only accomplished by having our Vigs shoot into the list. Again Scum Agenda. This entire plan is a scum fantasy come true. Hey guys we are getting to control DTs and Vigs this game. Woo hoo! Just my thoughts on it at the moment. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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hyshes
Belgium428 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:47 syllogism wrote: A bunch of new BC votes from some rather lurky newbies. I'd rather not see him in an elected office and anyone who does should reconsider. Vote for sandroba instead. why? | ||
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annul
United States2841 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:43 Toadesstern wrote: nonono easy example from my last game: I was a townie in a noob game. There was some people who did not talk at all, not even lurking with just one post. So I went ahead and posted this + Show Spoiler + On October 30 2011 20:12 Toadesstern wrote: oh and just a hint since this is a beginners game: If you are a dt or medic don't just hide or something. First of all, that really gives you away for mafia and secondly we might end up killing our very own dt or medic because we went for a lurker who turned out to be a blue playing "let's not get any attention or I'm going to get killed by mafia". Unless your coach told you otherwise. In that case just tell him he sucks. Your awesome special powers are not going to safe the day if noones talking at all. To sum it up: post bitches Instantly some people appeared and criticized me for telling blues to make themselves reveal theirselves. That's not what I meant and therefore some people came along and said it's (probably) not what I meant. I think the same thing's happening here. thats not whats happening here, because in your example, you didnt actually tell the blues to reveal themselves. | ||
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deconduo
Ireland4122 Posts
WBG and Sandro are scum bussing each other. BC and Palmar probably scum too. Looks like we're gonna have 2 scum in office. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:52 annul wrote: thats not whats happening here, because in your example, you didnt actually tell the blues to reveal themselves. will you interpreted in a way noone else interpreted it ( "if we have no read on him easy lynch target" that's your words from 2 pages ago) and that just was not what he was saying. Therefore I thought that you thought that there's something in there that's not-existing. But since it's cleared now I guess it's fine | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
I don't have a good read on him and he tends to push scum objectives quite liberally and convincingly as scum. Sandroba on the other hand appears towny so far and wouldn't be as damaging even if he somehow happens to be scum. | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:55 deconduo wrote: Annul, kita, syllo, Jackal are all town. Kurumi and Kenpachi are probably town. WBG and Sandro are scum bussing each other. BC and Palmar probably scum too. Looks like we're gonna have 2 scum in office. On that matter: Why do you think WBG and Sandra are scum bussing each other? For what reason? As far as I remember they pretty much started the talk about each other. Why should WBG start bussing sandro if everyone was thinking sandro's town before he started talking and vice verca? | ||
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Hassybaby
United Kingdom10823 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:22 sandroba wrote: Attention Rereading this thread I noticed a serious problem with this game. The way things are going right now, it seems like it is okay for the new players in this game to simply sheep the opinion of the "veterans" and provide no real content themselves. We have gone on about how this player is good and that player is bad and not to be listened too. I fear this is making all new people scared of posting their opinions on other players, out of fear to be judged on it. As a result the mafia amongst the new players has a safe place to hide and no real incentive to voice their opinions and thus get caught on scum behaviiour paterns. So listen: If you are town, no matter how bad you think you suck at this game right now, you need to step up and voice your opinion on other players, not only those who are running for mayor. By producing content you help everyone get a good grasp at your alignment and force mafia to post in similar fashion, by reducing the pool in which to hide. Do not fear being lynched or being wrong. No matter what people might tell you, the "veterans" cannot win this game by themselves and it's very hard to pin scum out of a pool of 50 players behaving in similar fashion. Put in the effort and post. The town's fate depends on you much more than anyone else. Well...I'll give it a try. Forgive me if it sounds convoluted. Firstly, I really want to emphasize how overwhelmed with the amount if information being thrown at me so far, and the fact that at this moment I'm not comfortable with my abilities to analyse it fully, is why I've been trying to ask questions instead of straight up give my opinion. The logical aspect of my brain says that the best course of action for me is to see what all the vets say about the major points that have come up, and then have a look at THOSE to make a conclusion. In essence, use their experience to see if its logical in my eyes. Secondly...a lot of discussion, to me, feels like people taken revenge/ having arguments about history. They're fighting over what happened in the past as opposed to what is happening in this game, and it feels really off-topic and pointless to me, and is just causing chaos. And that's a major reason a lot of the newbies are straight up backing off. As for the mayoral candidates, I was at first behind Palmar, because he had a plan. It may have been risky and given the mafia an advantage by highlighting our DT targets, but it was a form of organisation in this game. And the fact that the town has no organisation right now, while the Mafia will always have the vets looking after the newbies, had me very concerned. That's why I voted for him. But after seeing the responses, and the counter-responses, I think I may have re-think my vote (again...sorry) because it feels like a smear and a counter-smear campaign, with factions just battling it out. And in anyway I look at it, that feels very anti-town. If one of the sides does get into the mayor spot, there's going to be a divide in the town, as the other sides would declare us idiots and be slightly opposed. I know that the townies will put that aside, but that will be in the back of their minds. For that reason, I feel like we need a neutral in the mayor office. One that has not really shown a side yet, but has tried to point out positives, and has been generally encouraging. Right, that's Greymist for me. He's kept pretty neutral, he's been encouraging the newer players to contribute (like a few other for the record) and he's been quite active. Not as much as the other veterans, but then that's because he hasn't engaged in the "faction" discussions as much. That is not to say I feel like a number of the other vets are scum right now, but if they are townies, then they will still be powerful players. But if they are scum, they don't have that voting power, or the ability to waste our double lynches Hope that made sense. | ||
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Hassybaby
United Kingdom10823 Posts
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:55 deconduo wrote: Annul, kita, syllo, Jackal are all town. Kurumi and Kenpachi are probably town. WBG and Sandro are scum bussing each other. BC and Palmar probably scum too. Looks like we're gonna have 2 scum in office. whether these reads are correct or not we should surely aim to elect two town so do you mind backing up these claims, so that we can vote for candidates that are "more likely" to be town? rather than just saying i think we are making a mistake and not trying to convince people that we need to take a different course of action | ||
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minus_human
4784 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:55 deconduo wrote: Annul, kita, syllo, Jackal are all town. Kurumi and Kenpachi are probably town. WBG and Sandro are scum bussing each other. BC and Palmar probably scum too. Looks like we're gonna have 2 scum in office. That seems a bit of a stretch, did you know that saying 'x' is town is one of the biggest scumtells of them all? Please try to explain your reads on your proposed townlist, as well as on BC and Palmar. | ||
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
On November 26 2011 23:55 deconduo wrote: Annul, kita, syllo, Jackal are all town. Kurumi and Kenpachi are probably town. WBG and Sandro are scum bussing each other. BC and Palmar probably scum too. Looks like we're gonna have 2 scum in office. I have a bad feeling about that, too... You got some keyposts that back up this feeling? I agree on jackal and syllo. Kita is lurking and because of that frustrating expectations... The others 50/50 Kurumi probably town, too. | ||
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annul
United States2841 Posts
On November 27 2011 01:05 supersoft wrote: I agree on jackal and syllo. Kita is lurking and because of that frustrating expectations... The others 50/50 Kurumi probably town, too. so, uh... On November 27 2011 01:05 supersoft wrote: You got some keyposts that back up this feeling? see how easy it is | ||
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vaderseven
United States2556 Posts
On November 26 2011 22:14 sandroba wrote: @vaderseven I partially read day 1 of one of your games ass town on another forum. On that game you had no problem pushing for info day 1 and making an "educated guess" as you yourself sugested to try and hit scum. What makes this game any different that you choose to abstain? Ok which game? Depending on the game and who I pushed for I could offer you pages of unspoken information that back what I was doing. You see, on that forum I have literally played with at least 90% of the players in a given game many times before. The amount of metagame that gets built up in a smaller community like that is beyond huge. As it is right now I personally would vote to lynch Palmer based on what I have read but since I can't vote to lynch I am instead required to vote for someone to be mayor and to choose the lynch... I do not see a correct logical move in front of me that is beyond don't let the mod kill rules apply to you because of your lack of logical grasp. On November 26 2011 21:32 prplhz wrote: You rated people 52 on a scale from 0 to 100 where 50 is "No fucking clue", and then you wrote a huge post explaining a concept that has already been explained several times thus far. Jesus christ, are you trying to say that you're not reading the thread at all and that you have nothing to add or what? This is useless, and not in the sinani206 way where you try to contribute but do it in a terrible way, you're trying not to contribute and you're doing it in a carefully constructed way. There is absolutely nothing in mafia called a terrible contribution just because it has been said before. I was not here (holidays) till last night. I started on page 73 and read the filtered posts of the vote leaders. I then posted and someone asked me to talk about 3 specific people so I gave all my thoughts on them. I think you don't like what I had to say because it was partially about you and you are therefor doing a classic defense of, "You said what about me???? You are bad at mafia and the only thing that post does is make you scummy!" The reason I included those numbers was to express how unsure I am. With that out of the way I mass dumped my notes on the players I was requested to look into. If I had a history with the players I was talking about that post would look totally different but as it is that is what I can gather when looking at these 3 specific players that I have never played with in an 80 person game on day 1. To be clear, I would TOTALLY vote Palmer right now if my vote was to lynch him. A 2-5% feeling that a player is more likely to be scum than the rest is actually a huge amount of certainty on a day 1. I thought and assumed that was beyond basic info. | ||
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vaderseven
United States2556 Posts
Jesus christ, are you trying to say that you're not reading the thread at all and that you have nothing to add or what? Nope. Not at all. If you think that is what I was doing last night as I spent around 3 hours reading things and taking notes and then reading a new thing and comparing notes then you really should re-read my post and take it in from a non-hostile point. I think you might want to put your glasses on first this time. You seem to assume that I am ignoring the thread and hating on people for no reason. You also call me scummy. You say I am doing things in a carefully constructed way but I am not reading the thread. One or the other big boy, I cant ignore the game and have a masterful plot carefully prepared. PROTIP: I jest! Part of mafia is being able to be aggressive and take aggression without getting pissed of IRL. This is a SERIOUS tip to any newer player. | ||
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ey215
United States546 Posts
Therefore: ##Vote Greymist | ||
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