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TL Mafia XLII
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I've played a bit on EpicMafia but this is my first time playing the forum game. I'll try to do my best! | ||
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On June 07 2011 02:18 flamewheel wrote: Non-Stereotypical Unabomber They call you the Unabomber because you only have one bomb. Even with the lowered costs of materials these days, the economy is tough, so you haven't found the money to be able to construct a second bomb. But your one bomb is pretty potent. At night, you can choose to place your bomb at somebody's house. If you are killed, the bomb detonates, (hopefully) killing the inhabitant. The bomb is equivalent to one hit. You may choose at night to suicide in order to detonate your bomb. You may place and detonate (by suicide) in the same night.. Does the bomb kill only the inhabitant, or does it kill the people that are visiting the person as well? | ||
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Oh, right. I should've read more carefully. ._. | ||
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On June 14 2011 22:35 youngminii wrote: Quelling any form of discussion is terrible, if not scummy. The best way to analyse people is if said people are making discussion, it's very tough to analyse something that's not there. In any case, RoL's plan makes absolutely no sense to me. Who knows, maybe you'll find a scum or two, good luck with whatever you're trying to do. aidnai, you can have my spot on the list if you wish, I don't wish to be there at all. I agree with you in that BC shouldn't have told the medics not to save people on the list, leaving that opportunity open (and unspoken) gives scum wifom as to whether or not they should kill us. Instead, BC's taken this away and is hoping that they won't kill us in case they look suspicious(??). I don't even understand why it's suspicious to kill us, if I was scum I'd kill the vets straight away knowing they wouldn't be protected. Quelling discussion during N0 isn't necessarily a bad thing. In fact, there is nothing we can accomplish with discussion now that we can't do during D1. With this in mind, we should refrain from posting so that we don't accidentally give away any blue roles to the Mafia. Anyway, I had my graduation today and I am going out with some friends. I will be back to read the thread tomorrow evening. | ||
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At first I felt that youngminii's case against ILJ was a bit weak. The "ifs" and "unless of course" could just be an effect of N0. Since we didn't have anything to go on, I can understand him not wanting to make any hard statements. Now, what really makes him seem scummy to me is this defense: + Show Spoiler + On June 15 2011 14:52 ilovejonn wrote: hokay there buddy. First off, I'm not going to make a rebuttal out of every point you made because clearly with your PbPA you're stretching a lot of points to justify a conclusion you already had in mind beforehand with posts that don't actually add anything. Also, don't try to do a meta-read on me, I might be playing different because I want to, I may be playing different because I've learned a few things, I might like to use "I think" or "unless of course" because I deemed it necessary to show that I am unsure (it was n0 after all). When you meta read someone, you're heavily biased to see what you wanted to see in the first place anyways. Let's read one of those points: What makes you say a townie wouldn't do that? Wait a minute, I read my post again and what? You take those words out of context and shape them into something that you deem scummy. I lol'd. It also seems to be a recurring theme in your analysis. I'm done here because I don't want to waste time defending myself when I could possibly find scum, but I like the direction you're going for generating discussion since there aren't any posts since Day 1 started, so thanks. + Show Spoiler + On June 15 2011 15:31 ilovejonn wrote: Tell me again why a townie would not say those things. Everything I said was to include an extra option to show that you should not do something straight forward and instead be flexible based on what might happen in the future. And you're telling me a townie wouldn't say it out, biased much. Going to sleep see you in a few hours. During my games in EpicMafia the "Why wouldn't I have done that?"-defense is the one that I've seen the most times. Some of you might say that EM is a totally different game, but I believe that the behaviour of scum is quite similar in both games. I don't like the use of this defense at all. It just makes him seem altogether more scummy to me. | ||
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ilovejonn - The most suspicious one in my eyes. I think that the meta-read by YM together with the poor defense put up by him makes him look scummy. Furthermore, after reading mig's observation concerning him, I am even more convinced that he is indeed scum. sinani206 - I don't like his hypocrisy and his contentless posting, but I still feel that ILJ is a better lynch. For now, I am placing my vote on ILJ. I will read through the thread once again when I come back from work and see if I can find anything that will convince me to change my vote, but for now: ##Vote ilovejonn | ||
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On June 16 2011 20:23 VisceraEyes wrote: @Shraft I find it interesting that in the reasoning behind voting for ilovejohn, you mention both youngminii AND Mig as influences, yet they're both voting for sinani206. Why do you feel ilovejohn is the better lynch? I feel that ILJ is the better lynch because of this: + Show Spoiler + On June 15 2011 14:52 ilovejonn wrote:. Also, don't try to do a meta-read on me, I might be playing different because I want to, I may be playing different because I've learned a few things, I might like to use "I think" or "unless of course" because I deemed it necessary to show that I am unsure (it was n0 after all). When you meta read someone, you're heavily biased to see what you wanted to see in the first place anyways. When YM pointed out that ILJ's play in this game looks similar to what his Mafia play has looked like in previous games he responds with the quote in the spoiler above, basically saying "I might be attempting to play different in this game, don't metagame me". Now, if this is true, that he is in fact playing differently, then he has to be town now, but chosing to play more cautiously and making more contentless posts, being very afraid of sticking his neck out. This would be a very bad way for him to change his playstyle, which in why I believe that his statement about him changing his play was just an outright lie that he told to get away easily from the accusation. I believe that he is the best lynch candidate and I am going to keep my vote on him. | ||
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On June 18 2011 07:24 sandroba wrote: Man, can people actually start contributing to this? You are making it pretty easy for mafia by not sharing your opinions on anything. Please comment on the lists, add your thoughts etc ffs. I actually believe that it's very easy for scum to blend in by commenting on this list. All of this is really basic stuff really. | ||
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On June 18 2011 08:07 sandroba wrote: LOL are you for real man? giving your OPINION on people that should be vig/dt/medic targets is basic and easy for mafia to do? Are you insane? Yes, because it's very easy to just provide a few names and comment on the list. "I think yadddayaddayadda blablabla" and it looks like they have contributed. Instead of this, I urge blue roles to read posts like this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=232671 (I believe this was linked previously) and take use of that knowledge when they chose their night actions. | ||
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On June 18 2011 08:12 VisceraEyes wrote: Speaking as a noob, NONE of this stuff is basic, brah. I notice that you didn't give YOUR opinion on it, aside from saying it's basic. I am speaking as a noob as well, yet I still think that choosing your night actions isn't that difficult when you've got tons of post by forums vets to help you. If you so desperately want me to comment on it, then sure, I can do it, but I still don't think that 3 pages of people making lists are very useful. | ||
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On June 18 2011 08:23 sandroba wrote: Let me state this. From now on everyone is only allowed to shut down discussion if you present a better discussion to be had. Otherwise just give your goddamned opinion. Some discussion is clearly better than no discussion at all. I kind of see your point now. The thread is highly inactive so if commenting on this will make people start talking then I guess it can be useful after all. I will post my thoughts on it shortly. | ||
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On June 18 2011 05:21 sandroba wrote: Alright people here comes my lists: VIGs: -Giraffe -LandenC Both extremelly inactive and based on voting thread alone Giraffe has a high chance of being mafia. His flip is also very informative regarding Hiro's aligment and revealing some info on the players that voted for him. LandenC is likely mafia if giraffe is not (he voted for him for the exact same behaviour he was presenting) so pick your target wisely. If RoL shows up and actually confirms kenpachi being mafia he's also an obvious target. Also his huge post attacking RoL is completely out of character from the townie kenpachi I know. Medics: -RoL -Aidnai -Wiggles -Varpulis -BC That's actually going to be hard to argue, but this is my gut feeling. I actually also don't see the point of arguing hard why I feel those players are town and helpful when no one of them are actually in danger. Do not protect: -Hiro -GGQ -LandenC -Grassgiraffe -Youngminii -kenpachi -Mig mostly useless lurkers and suspicious people. GGQ is there for (hopefully) obvious reasons and youngminii is there not only because he spearheaded jonn's lynch, but also because his voting paterns are suspicious as hell. Mig is not being helpfull the way he normally is when town. DTs: -Hiro -GGQ -Young This should be fairly obvious aswell. Vigs Is it really worth killing off inactives with vigs? I believe vigs are too useful to waste on this. As far as I know, we got zero read on them both, so they might very well be inactive townies or blues. I don't really like the mindset that "If they are not helping the town we might as well kill them off." DTs I agree with the list made. Those people are all kind of fishy. Medics I think medics should simply protect the forum vets (basically the people on the zodiac list) since they will be very helpful with analysing everything later on. I don't know if RoL is worth protecting though, he seems like he doesn't take this game seriously at all. He just posts a few troll posts and says that he'd rather watch 24. I don't like his attitude a single bit. | ||
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Anyway, I am glad that RoL is back. @hiro protagonist I don't find lynching inactives scummy. However, it is very anti-town and pretty fucking stupid. If we decide on lynching an inactive just by virtue of his inactiveness, it is easy for Mafia to just bandwagon without providing much more reasoning than "X is inactive, I agree on lynching him." This is why inactives should be left to vigilantes. We get much more information out of our lynches if we present cases on active members and force people to take a stance. As for the two current cases (RoL's case on syllogism and aidnai's on hiro), I think that aidnai's case on hiro is stronger, but hiro's defense seems genuine and I don't think that he is Mafia. I don't know if I will be awake the last hours before the lynch, but I'll try to. I am not convinced by any of the cases at the moment so I'll put a placeholder vote just in case. | ||
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Looking solely on the cases, I think that hiro protagonist should be the better lynch. However, I feel that hiro's defense has been really solid, and looking at the last few pages, he seems to be town. That is what makes this decision for me. ##Vote syllogism. | ||
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Mataza's case is not shit. Enough of your god damn bullshit. Even though I thought you were town at first, I've had it with your pissy attitude and my vote is on you. The chance of those hits being carried out by someone other than you is so microscopic that you're as good as confirmed red at this point. @Varpulis & VisceraEyes Decent analyses. There is a fair chance that one or both of them are scum, but RoL is a safer lynch target. They might be good vig targets, but that talk can wait until night falls. | ||
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Can't you get the message where Sandroba told RoL that you're blue from Sandroba? Or would that be considered cheating now that he's dead? I am taking my vote off of RoL for now. If his claim is true then it would be very detrimental for us to kill him. | ||
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Call me gullible or stupid, but I'm starting to lean more and more toward not lynching RoL. I have had this feeling all game long that he was blue or green. | ||
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##Vote youngminii | ||
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If you check out my posts, you can see that I've had the feeling that RoL was town for the entire game. I didn't like his attitude, but he seemed to be town nonetheless. At first I voted him because I thought that mataza's plan was bulletproof, and I thought RoL couldn't be other than scum. I then learned that it wasn't. As for YM I don't really have an opinion on YM, I am not voting him because I am particulary suspicious of him, but because I think he is more likely to be scum than RoL. | ||
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On June 24 2011 02:38 VisceraEyes wrote: That's because that's as far as the plan went. There was no bigger picture. Yes, it's true, -1 Medic would mean it's LIKELY that a double-stack of Mafia hits COULD have killed him. But let's assume there's 1 medic. Aside from Mataza's claim, have any other Vets come forward? No? Then it's possible that RoL would live. Not to mention how much protection he ASSURED for himself the whole game. The ultimate plan was to LYNCH RoL, because that's the only way to kill him for certain. No PRs interfering, nothing to stop them. Only a bunch of noobs who do what they're told. Would YOU pass up an opportunity like that? I still find it very unlikely that mafia went through with an intricate plan like this for the sole purpose of getting RoL killed. The only way that he'd survive the night if mafia stacked 2 KP on him is if he is either a vet with one medic protecting him, or a regular townie with two medics protecting him (assuming this setup contains 3 medics) and I don't think there's a high probability of either of these being true. I mean, after D2's townie lynch that RoL pushed plus his bad attitude during D1, I don't see why there would be medics protecting him over the other vets/more contributing people. I actually think that the chance of getting RoL killed by carrying out this plan is drastically lower than the chances of killing him by stacking 2 KP on him. Also, I think GGQ touched on a quite good point: why would Mataza not fabricate Sandroba's blueslip to RoL if he wanted him killed so badly? No one except RoL and Mataza could know for sure what Sandroba said to him (RoL). If RoL called his bluff then Mataza could simply say that he was lying because he was being accused. To be frank, I also think that you're being a bit too paranoid. | ||
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On June 24 2011 04:09 VisceraEyes wrote: Whether or not it's true does not discount its possibility, the possibility I'm postulating Mafia were trying to avoid. The fact that it's possible lends to PROVE the credibility of my statement, not disprove it. I don't really get what you're saying. Maybe I am misunderstanding something (English is not my native tongue), can you reiterate it in other words? Of course the scenario that you presented is possible, I just said that I don't think it's plausible. | ||
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Is there any way to view the entire thread in one page when it has grown this large? If there is, I can write up something about one of the lurkers. If not... the hell with it. | ||
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DISCLAIMER: I won't back up the accusations I made yesterday. Perhaps I'll do it later if I'm in the right mood. FudgeMunkey - Tons of posts during N0 semi-agreeing with people but at the same time pointing out some flaws in their strategies. Useless posts. - More useless posts during D1: + Show Spoiler + On June 15 2011 15:59 FudgeMunkey wrote: Yes, I agree with 'youngminii'... It seems as if the 'scum' never seem to support a strategy and instead find ways to make it look like its incorrect/false or just plain stupid... They hope to make it look like the person there arguing with is obviously Scum rather than townie or Blue. - His infamous KP-posts, although I don't find them very scummy. (He could just be stupid and not understand that kenpachi wasn't being serious with his question.) - Lurks but responds very quickly to pressure: + Show Spoiler + On June 18 2011 13:03 FudgeMunkey wrote: To Varpulis Well I shall answer your questions. 1. I felt it was necessary to explain the mechanics of KP, because Kenpachi asked wether KP mean't KenPachi or KillPower. Yes you are right now one asked anyone to explain the mechanics of KP, but i thought it would be nice to get it out of the way for anyone who didn't quite know what it meant. 2/3. To be completely honest I voted for Sinani because I hadn't had time to read all the posts, so yes i was 'stealth voting'. I was however going to change my vote to Grassgiraffe because he has not contributed to the town at all. I agreed with Youngminii about voting for Sinani becuase he proved a point, Also i never actually voted for Ilovejohn... + Show Spoiler + On June 18 2011 16:38 FudgeMunkey wrote: To DeMorcef I understand your anger with me for not reading through the whole thread before posting, I have been busy with School work and so forth and I didn't want to get mod killed. I have read through the pages I have missed out on and I am pritty sure I'm up to date with the rest of you. On another note, I agree with Youngminii and VisceraEyes, RoL hasn't been putting the most useful information into this thread and the posts he ends up posting end up with him taunting the town as Youngminii stated. + Show Spoiler + I had a much busier day then I thought, and I ended up going to a party 2.5 hours away last night on an hours notice. But tomorrow I will try to be much more active until I head back into new jersey for a couple of days. Just some FYI, every day when I wake up and F5 this thread I am given a choice. I can A. Do some analysis and make sure you guys don't fuck up too bad, or B. Watch a marathon of 24. So far 24 has won the last 2 days. Maybe, just maybe if a vigi shoots Kenpachi tonight, 24 will lose the mental coin toss tomorrow. Just some advice. Obviously he'd rather do something else than be in this game and he is a Waste of Space... He is obviously taunting the town to see how long he will last and so far it seems to be working, NO ONE IS VOTING FOR HIM. Before I cast my vote into his/her basket I shall read more of the thread to make my decision final (just to make sure DeMorcef will be happy!)  - Filler: + Show Spoiler + On June 20 2011 16:47 FudgeMunkey wrote: WOW! Three Townie dead... These two really shouldn't of been mod killed... Aidnai and Grassgiraffe although Grassgiraffe did a whole lot of nothing... So... guys what now? - He then continues to lurk but responds very quickly again when pressure is applied to him: + Show Spoiler + On June 21 2011 14:51 FudgeMunkey wrote: To Varpulis I may be have been lurking for most of the game, but at least I'm reading through most the posts and at least half contributing! Unlike other lurkers who just watch, post something so they don't get mod killed and then go back into lurking mode... - Strange post, even stranger way to decide on the lynch: + Show Spoiler + On June 22 2011 19:17 FudgeMunkey wrote: To Varpulis Well... you do know that most of my posts on day 1 (?) were within an hour of each other so if you think about it its not that much activity... Well of course you'd respond to any criticism/accusation quickly its not like you just want to LURK properly by saying just about nothing at all. Just take RoL for instance, he reply's to almost everything said to him withing the hour... Voting Vote: RoL Oh and RoL who else do you think is scum other than me? Now, does this mean that FM is scum? Perhaps, perhaps not. You could make an analysis on me, or probably any of the lurkers, and we'd end up looking scummy too. This is a stupid way to decide on today's lynch. I'm out. | ||
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@RoL Not sure about any of them. As someone said Wiggles could be GF. | ||
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