BC and RoL: Salem Mafia
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I also don't understand why Doc even said anything about knowing a medic in the first place. It's made him a prime target for the mafia and also raises the possibility of accidentally revealing the medic some way or another. All it has really done is made him seem more "legit" as the town circle coordinator -- I don't feel that town has actually gained anything from this knowledge.
I feel that if town is interested in forming a circle (which I highly discourage for the time being), we let the detectives take initiative after some rolechecks have gone through.
Look at the bandwagoning of Pandain that nearly happened on day 1. Look at some of the names on that list, and look at who initiated it: our friend ghrur. I'd say at this point that I'm 90% positive Pandain is town.
On November 28 2010 10:07 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Pandain - 1
And hey, look at who else was on the list of people who voted Pandain. And look who was conveniently spared yesterday due to a last-minute switch by ghrur himself.
Come on guys, don't let kenpachi get away with this crap.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if mafia is just sitting back and letting town kill itself. Because, if Kenpachi dies and flips town, where else do we have to go?
Something I have been wondering about:
On November 29 2010 14:54 DarthThienAn wrote:
My (and deconduo's) experiment succeeded. Why would I not heed the results? O_O. I already thought day 1's voting was strange. ghrur flipping red only made it even more suspicious. I'd be a fool to NOT vote for you, unless you have a valid reason?
What the hell "experiment" are you talking about? You're implying that you were in PMs with deconduo before he died. If you were scum, you got him targeted. If you're town, you've held back information. What's going on, DTA?
On December 01 2010 06:37 Glasse wrote:
I'll start defending myself once i have the majority of votes on me
All right, switching to you, then.
On November 29 2010 07:46 Radfield wrote:
Since the dawn is fast approaching, it's time for me post before i die(62.5%).
As always though, things don't really get cooking until Day 2. If a medic saw it in his heart to pay me a visit tonight, I would not object.
...he had done very little to actually earn it. He hadn't thrown out any accusations except for hounding a selection of lurkers. Unless he was promoting himself as a blue in PMs (in which case, I'd like to see them), he'd done virtually nothing that would make him a prime mafia target in my eyes. This screams drawing medics to me.
On December 03 2010 02:51 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
I'm also willing to look at Node (who has surprisingly not roleclaimed yet)
For the record, I did claim to DH earlier. He confirmed it here:
On December 01 2010 16:24 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Node has RC'd as well.
On November 26 2010 20:31 youngminii wrote:
wifom can be so much simpler than that
think about this statement:
i am not a witch
On November 28 2010 08:50 youngminii wrote:
lol DrH, role fishing like that in a learning game, not a very cool move.
Out of Kenpachi and BB who seem to be the lynch candidates (besides me kinda) I'd have to go for Kenpachi. I don't really want to vote for any of them but Kenpachi's cluelessness/reluctance to defend himself is more worrying than the reasons against BB.
He's one of the first people to say that DrH is role fishing, which could be construed as scummy, but personally I don't think it's really an indication one way or the other. He debates between Kenpachi and BrownBear, both of which we assume mafia thought of as townies at that point in the game.
On November 29 2010 03:31 youngminii wrote:
It wouldn't be possible to pass on the DT role to someone else, would it? I don't feel right, knowing that our DT was a jackass and how we lost the role just like that.
I'm with Pandain on the whole Kenpachi/BB thing. I don't believe that scum would let the votes get that close without any drastic/obvious last minute changes. Also, while I agree that Kenpachi is probably not a green, I don't see anything pointing towards him being a CE. Innocent until proven guilty, right?
First paragraph is inconclusive. It's a pro-town sentiment, but something the mafia could easily say without risk.
It's the second paragraph I find interesting. Let's fast-forward a post...
On November 30 2010 18:50 youngminii wrote:
Just so everyone knows in case DrH turns up as scum or something and tries to do something sneaky (which I doubt will happen anyway), I roleclaimed to him. Obviously I'm not going to say what my role is but chyeah there you go. I believe that being transparent about most things is better than keeping everything in secret PM networks and all that crap.
Right now I get the feeling that Kenpachi is indeed scum, and given BB's death last night and all the suspicion around Kenpachi, some/most of the scum have gone and decided to bus him. I mean, hell, he has a LOT of votes on him without any counter target, which means the mafia have given up on him. I don't like the abstain votes so I guess we'll have to keep an eye on them in the future.
So much weird stuff going on here. Lots of flip-flopping on youngminii's part. About a day back he accused DrH of role-fishing, now he seems to be on-board with the circle. Later, he says that the "easiest way to win is to roleclaim to DrH". After DrH dies, youngminii says that Doc "played horribly".
More importantly, he seems to have completely changed his mind about Kenpachi. He talks about the mafia having bussed him and generally acts like his death is set in stone, which I find a very scummy action. Don't bother trying to find another target, clearly mafia have given up on him, just don't question the vote and move on, am I right? He also mentions keeping an eye on abstaining voters, which I never saw him bring up again.
Note that not long after this, people switched en masse from Kenpachi (medic) to DTA (townie) due to Kenpachi's claim. Notable people staying on Kenpachi include JimboSilvers, Radfield, and youngminii, all of which are either scum or highly suspicious people. Kenpachi died that night. In itself it isn't conclusive evidence, but combined with youngminii's opinion-swapping I find it practically damning.
On December 01 2010 10:58 youngminii wrote:
This is exactly why PM games are fucking retarded. Wouldn't have joined if I had known.
With that aside, I understand why it was 'necessary' to move votes from Kenpachi but seriously, DTA? There was nothing scummy at all about him. If you're gonna make a last minute switch, do it wisely enough so that you don't let mafia dictate who you get to switch to. Oh well, town's in the lead anyway.
Honestly, the easiest way to win this game is for everyone to just roleclaim to DrH. I'm not even kidding, PM games are so retarded that if you do this it's an insta-win.
What a convenient thing to say after the fact. He gets why Kenpachi couldn't die, but it's not like he changed his vote. His commentary on the actions add absolutely nothing to the game -- just giving advice to the town without backing it up with action.
On December 02 2010 17:37 youngminii wrote:
drh knows 2 healers
2 healers die
drh does not have an appropriate excuse
why is this not happening
Puts suspicion on DrH. We all know now that Doc was town, but a lot of people were suspicious of him at the time and I can't in good conscience say that this is a scummy sentiment.
It's worth noting that he never moves his vote off Doc.
On December 02 2010 23:07 youngminii wrote:
I honestly think everyone that's going against Radfield should read the above post, twice, and reconsider your decision.
Defends Radfield pretty hard. If either of these two turn up scum it's going to be pretty obvious what color the other is.
On December 04 2010 23:30 youngminii wrote:
This game is fucking horrible, DrH has the entire town on his leash.
Show nested quote +
Because YM is "the vet" I asked him to claim DT and announce the result of the DT check but he ignored me completely and instead tried to turn a bandwagon around on me. Good one eh?
When the flying fuck did you ask me to claim DT. I go and claim in the thread that I roleclaimed to you, which is MORE than enough to cast suspicious light on me for preparation of the late game. Then you go on like a chimpanzee and say to the entire thread "GUYS, MEDICS, YOU NEED TO PROTECT YOUNGMINII"
Are you serious? For one thing, that's wasting a medic save. For another, that's making scum veer away from me, I'm protected so why would they hit me? This thinly veiled crap of yours makes no sense whatsoever. In fact, it might have made the tiniest bit of sense if you had planned that for the late game but then you go and reveal my roleclaim to the entire town. Can you guys seriously not see how corrupt this 'town leader' is?
What's wrong with 2 bodyguards in a THIRTY person game? I'm sure there are fishier roleclaims, but the mafia can handle all the other blue roles, the bodyguards must be dealt with via town to maximise mafia KP. Don't tell me you guys can't see this. I urge you, vig, kill this scum.
No hard feelings DrH.
I love how he goes from "best way to win is to roleclaim to DrH" to "This game is fucking horrible, DrH has the entire town on his leash" as soon as Doc starts putting suspicion on him.
On December 04 2010 23:41 youngminii wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 04 2010 14:46 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
ym is the kind of mafia player active behind the scenes in irc directing others and not active in the thread. this makes me even more suspicious.
1. no i'm not, i never play behind the scenes as scum
2. i don't direct anyone to do anything AS YOU SHOULD KNOW by modding that game where i was scum
3. are you using the metagame to accuse me? didn't i try the same thing last time against you and epically fail?
Kinda funny how he goes from using the metagame to defend himself to saying that using the metagame as an accusation is a bad idea.
On December 05 2010 12:33 youngminii wrote:
DrH played so horribly I don't even..
In any case, I'm the vet. Think about it seriously, what the fuck is wrong with having 2 vets in a 30 person game?
His only real defense is that his role is one that might exist. How about how you played? The way you voted? Who you talked to, and why?
On December 05 2010 13:04 youngminii wrote:
In any case, I'd like the hear from KtheZ.
Not a direct accusation (yet) but I haven't heard much from you this game, as I'm sure most people haven't heard from me. What I'm wondering is why am I being spotlighted and you aren't? Is it because I roleclaimed to DrH and he decided to reveal me after I already gained some initial suspicion? Then why aren't you gaining any of this 'initial' suspicion, are you allied with a certain group? Is it safe to say you didn't roleclaim to DrH, why would that be? Perhaps it's because you're a green, or some important blue like a DT, or a red.
Eagerly awaiting your response
And now he attempts to move suspicion on to another player, still without a proper defense of himself. He says it's not a direct accusation, but what better way to get himself and Radfield out of the spotlight than to drag in somebody completely unrelated to the goings-on so far?
Yeah, I'ma vote youngminii.
I'm fine with sharing thoughts via PM, I'm just very worried about a town that comes to rely on a circle of "confirmed" people for direction instead of good scumhunting and discussion within the thread itself.
I realize that that could be construed as a scummy sentiment -- of course mafia doesn't want people conspiring against them in private -- but I think it's too easy for town to put themselves in a position where they're controlled by the circle instead of the other way around.
I'm all for getting discussion going in PM land, though.
I really wish I had pushed that more in-thread at the beginning, but it just grew too far too fast, and I made a few too many poor choices to be considered trustworthy. Hindsight, 20/20, etc.
I just felt incredibly discouraged after the fiasco that was Kenpachi, and even more so after youngminii turned up veteran. I thought I had actually posted a decent analysis for once, even though at that point it didn't make much of a difference. *sigh* Just gotta keep at it.