|
On June 03 2010 17:52 LunarDestiny wrote:
Finished my term project. Now people are running elections... I will give my support to you Darth because you are pretty knowledgeable and was screwed pretty bad last game.
I'll admit it was pretty funny. lol.
LD <3 I appreciate the support. You're cute. hahaha.
On June 03 2010 22:17 zeks wrote:
Hi Town,
I’m running for office! I’ve played mafia a couple of times on TL, 2 years ago and just getting back into it. I’ve been chosen town for all of the times I’ve played – actually for those who remember I always got medic. I will be extremely active for this game thus I would love to have a “role” and be involved in the major conversations of this game.
I acknowledge the fact that people have drawn clues to me – and that my misreading on the DT role makes me somewhat suspicious. I implore you that everything I do is for the greater benefit of the town.
PRELIMINARY PLAN:
The plan that I have is pretty much a rip-off of plans used in past mafia games. With all the finger-pointing going on already, I want to stress that we shouldn’t look too deep into day 1 clues. It provides us with leads and brings people into the spotlight, but what is happening now is that we’re having animosity and confusion in the town. We need trust.
Detectives: Now that I’ve understood that you can use consecutive role checks, I still think you should use them as quickly (or wisely) as possible. In fact, all our DTs should be role checking someone tonight. Assuming we have 2 DTs:
Detective #1 (if you’re numbered somewhere between #1 - #15): do a role-check on someone from #1-#15
Detective #2 (if you’re numbered somewhere between #16-#30): do a role-check on someone from #16-#30
If you check a red, awesome! Keep that in your list, and if he posts keep track of his behavior as well.
If you check a green/blue, you can make the decision whether to start the inner circle with that person. The reason I say that is the green/blue could be the Miller or the Godfather – assuming 2 millers and 1 Godfather, there is a small chance you could be checking one of them. Again, track that person’s behavior and see if there are any strong clues pointing to them…then you can decide whether to engage that person or not to start the inner circle.
Medics: Honestly I don’t have a good plan with them, I’d say protect our best clue analyzers for now until we start verifying everyone.
The detectives are the key to winning this game quickly and safely, so we want to make sure they at least use up all their rolechecks – thus they’d have to be alive by night 4 (if I’m not mistaken).
Also I previous mentioned that we should have someone compile all the clues / accusations…if someone would love to step up that’d be great.
FIRST LYNCH
If elected mayor, I will lynch whoever the town sees fit; I know there’s no formal voting for tonight since the mayor gets the lynch call – but I will do a tally myself and everyone can vote for who they think should be lynched tonight.
If elected pardoner, I would hope that the new mayor will also do a vote for the first lynch. In that case I promise not to pardon the first lynch. I will also make sure in the future to stop nonsense bandwagons.
Well that’s all I have to say for now, I probably missed a couple things and there’s probably a couple flaws in my plan, but I am happy to answer all your questions the best I can. The important thing is more discussion so we can try to close these loopholes and come up with a very good strategy.
Millers come back as RED to DTs.. but you are absolutely right about the GF. Up to the DTs whether they take that 1 in 10 or however many risk though.
On June 04 2010 00:34 Zyrre wrote:So much to read, I like it  bumatlarge's list of potentially implicated mafias looks good, couldnt find any more suspects. So far its zeks, Darth and YellowInk for mayor right? And the voting takes place and the end of day1?
Yup. Voting takes place during day 1, and ends at the end of day 1. ^^
On June 04 2010 04:41 sputnik.theory wrote:
A question to people with more experience with the whole election dynamic: is it common for mafia to run for office?
If so, I'd really like to see more candidates as even if we don't elect a mafia mayor it'd be easy for us to get a scum pardoner and that almost seems worse.
I definitely agree with this - I've never played with the mayor+election system so I don't know if it's common but we definitely need more than 3 candidates -_-.
On June 04 2010 04:41 LunarDestiny wrote:
Also, I oppose the DT linking scheme and I don't encourage Dts to purposing target the same townie to form a link. The reason is dts only get a grand total of 3 rolecheck in the entire game. You are wasting 2 out of the 6 available rolecheck just to form a link between themselves which is not worth it.
Also, information sharing has limited usage and it's most important usage is to avoid overlapping in rolechecks in the future (which is you purposing form a link together, you already waste 2 rolecheck) so using 2 role checks to avoid future overlapping in role check is stupid.
Then there is overlapping in clue checks. As the game progress on, there would be SO many clues available, and the probability of overlapping in clue check is so small that you don't need to take much consideration out of it.
If dts happened to target the same person, then do it.
Agreed -
From being a DT in the past, it is relatively easy to form a circle as the only DT. There is no reason for the DTs to be linked together - if they are at some point, then great, but there's no reason to orchestrate it. Each of the town circles that they create can be equally effective.
Here's my mindset as a DT - check night 1. pro town read + pro town poster = PM, etc.
last game, I added a pro-town poster without even checking him, and it went a long way for me and Radfield. BrownBear was (every night) vigilante, so in our circle, we had a DT, half of the game's KP, and a random power (Radfield) every night. Maybe I was just lucky, but to honestly, DTs are very powerful/instrumental in forming town circles.
On June 04 2010 04:46 LunarDestiny wrote:
Yellow Ink, if you are pro town, then you are doing the absolute wrong thing. You had cause so much confusion which kind of hint you are mafia. If you are pro town, then calm down.
For the first election of mayor, I want the mayor to target the inactive but I don't want Yellow Ink since he is acting so suspicious and IF he happens to be a mafia, he would target an pro town inactive.
I think the point that a lot of people are making, YellowInk, is that you're talking way too much to seem innocent. I'm not sure I agree with this judgment, since the line is very thin between "too much as mafia" and "too much as town."
A lot of people find YellowInk suspicious, but his logic, again, isn't bad. The DT check can happen / be revealed later in the game.
On June 04 2010 04:56 Thegilaboy wrote:
Holy cow this game is a lot more intensive than I imagined! Exciting none the less though. As it stands, I feel uncomfortable with voting in YellowInk not because of the clue that links to him, but his overeager attitude of getting in office. Just seems a bit off to me right now, only time will tell. Like Lunar said, mayor should take out inactives. But you cast for Darth so quickly, and that seems strange to me. Maybe it's because this is my first time playing mafia and I don't understand all the subtle things going on, but it seems too early on to be casting votes when we haven't heard from everyone, as well as given candidates enough time to say their piece.
People haven't really been casting votes, last time I checked =p. It was only LD who's voted (not for himself).
On June 04 2010 05:08 YellowInk wrote:LunarDestiny, I'm not looking for a mud slinging contest here. Everyone is suspect. I am. You are. Darth is. Zeks is. Noone is clear. This being said, your contributions to the thread are left wanting. There is some good information, but both here and in your previous posts, I wonder how much you really understand what's going on. To preface, I'm not so suspicious of LunarDestiny as I am of Zeks because his false information appears to be constant misunderstanding of how the game is played rather than supplying information that is inaccurate. Show nested quote +On June 04 2010 04:23 LunarDestiny wrote:
Okay, I caught up on the progress:
Reason I voted for Darth is I played a total of two games with Darth in it (Caller and Ace's). In both game, Darth had decent knowledge of the game and didn't make newbie mistake. He also supported lynching inactive in the early game where not much information is available. This does not make him a good candidate for mayor. This just means he plays a decent game. He could be just as red as the next guy - and since we have no good way to figure out if he is, this is a bad thing. This is also the very platform on which I am running for mayor. Show nested quote +Also, my advise to detective:
Do not do what YellowInk is telling you. His action is very suspicious and those who are suspicious should not run for mayor before they are cleared. You can't run for mayor after being cleaned since the mayoral elections are on day 1. This game would be VERY different if DTs were able to do investigating before the elections. I invite everyone to read through my posts and think about if you would do that if you were mafia aligned and see if it fits. Then read through my posts and think about if you would do that if you were town aligned and see if it fits. The truth should become clear. Show nested quote +Also, use role check as early as possible (night 1 and every other night. Reason is that you don't want your rolechecks to be wasted if you somehow gets killed. Find someone whom you believe is totally innocent. This can be achieved by rolechecking on night 1. If you detect a anti-town, stay quiet and don't tell anyone about result. If you detect a pro-town then use him as your spoke person (not Likely you role checked the godfather). Using people as your mouthpiece is a strategy to protect the person who is actually speaking. However, I would warn each and every townie here that just because someone is telling you that they are the DT does not mean that they are! Perhaps on day 3 Mafia player A PMs Townie player B and tells them they know player B is townie and found that player C is mafia on night 1. Then when player B speaks up and says player C is mafia, player C gets hung, then player B gets hit by the mafia that night (3KP can still beat 2 medics) so that the mafia is never revealed. This is just one of many examples possible - the point is that using a mouthpiece like this is challenging and unreliable. It's important that people understand the whole story with respect to risks and rewards in these situations. Show nested quote + Another reason why you want to use those rolecheck as soon as possible because there is not much clues to pick from in the early game as oppose to the mid to late game. In the late game, there would be so many juicy clues that you want to check that it is almost as important as a rolecheck. Alternatively, you can choose use 2 rolechecks early while saving 1 rolecheck for later when you really need it. Remember, role check works almost always and gives much more information than a clue check which might not give you any result (fail clue check). This is all a fine way of thinking about it. I agree with using rolechecks in the early game. I just didn't want people to follow Zeks' advice to necessarily blow through all your rolechecks ASAP. Show nested quote +For medic:
I advise you to protect those who are active and shown intelligence in the game but not suspicious to be a mafia. Mafia wants to create as much confusion in the thread as possible. They also don't want the town to have a good plan to finding them which means those who have a good plan tend to be the target. Good mafia players often are active and present intelligent thought in the game as well. It's not the end of the world if you do cover a mafia. I would tend towards protecting those who you tend to believe are town over those who are merely active and intelligent. Use your own judgement - and adding in a bit of a random factor (between various people you are thinking about protecting) can help make it difficult for mafia to predict who medics might protect. Show nested quote +For Vigilante:
Stay calm man. We will need you after a few day (3 or 4) when the town would be in confusion at that point and need your one time kill to clarify things.
That is my advise to the blue roles. Remember, you don't have to follow what I am telling you but use this as a reference. If you are new to the game, you want to listen to everyone's advise to you and decide who's advise is the best follow it or incorporate these advises into a good plan. Good advice. I encourage research into your role outside this thread as well.
Honestly, I have a pro-town read on YellowInk. I agree with him on zeks - "misreading" rules and "poor" logic are exactly the kinds of things that mafia do. They present arguments that sound all fine and dandy, make you think they are pro-town, when they're really just spouting crap. Think before you post guys, so that you don't mislead us >_>. Mafia are already doing that - mafia are always on guard about what they say. The same is true for most blue roles, and the ones most likely to spout nonsense are either reckless townies or conniving mafia.
HOWEVER. Yellow, I'm not sure why you disagree with crate's whole medic analysis. It made sense to me. There shouldn't be a situation where a mafia gets hit AND the medic saves the mafia - after all, the vigi should be following what the thread says.
And actually, I find that activity doesn't vary with role. I've been about the same amount of active in every game that I've been in except the first one where i was just like "O_O what is going on". If you look at that game, Incognito had the town under his thumb because they were so desperate for leadership. When he turned up as mafia at the end of the game I was just like "... :o"
So active =/= town. The reason why I push for lynching inactives early is that, if you won't contribute later, you won't contribute now. Something new (for me) in this game is clues however. I urge you guys, DON'T STOP LOOKING AT CLUES. Don't spend all your time on it, but look at them, and point out a list of suspects. The Mayor should combine that with an inactivity list and lynch an overlap-er. So for whoever is Mayor, clue analysis will help a lot.
MAN. this posting makes me happy because you're all active while I'm asleep but it sure is tiring haha.
My mayor thing: I'm running because I know I'm town (like all the other candidates "know" they are town I guess haha). My plan for day 1 is simple, I kinda described it above: lynch an inactive linked to clues. In a normal game, it would just be lynch an inactive. But we have clues! :D (forgive me, I've never played with clues before) which means our first lynch doesn't have to be random.
Other than that, I just have a general plan of activity and I'd basically be playing as I normally do, analyzing the things I find important. lol. I honestly don't know what more you expect from me.
I'd like to add something: I wouldn't mind "stepping down" in favor of YellowInk. A lot of you don't buy his plan, but it makes sense to me. It's just something extra, to be honest, though. The whole clue thing is not the main reason why I like him as mayor. I just get a pro-town read on him, which is why I would support him. Mafia typically don't offer sound advice to the town, simply because they want to confuse the town. He's been doing quite the opposite, and I urge some of you to reconsider.
GOTTA GO BE POPULAR NOW GUYS.
|
On June 04 2010 04:41 sputnik.theory wrote:
A question to people with more experience with the whole election dynamic: is it common for mafia to run for office?.
It is common enough. In the last game I played, three out of nine people running for Mayor were Mafia.
+ Show Spoiler [Section of Crate's post] +On June 03 2010 20:55 crate wrote:
Medic saves and veteran hits will be told to all involved parties(well, not whoever did the hitting, but they'll know the hit was blocked when the day post doesn't have the target dead). If you get medic protected, congratulations--you've just 100% confirmed for yourself that someone is town-aligned. Medic, if you protect someone, let them know it was you who saved them.
It's possible that a mafia could try to play the medic in this situation, but there are dangers for them: firstly, if it was a veteran night life instead of a medic save, the mafia claiming medic is immediately outed. Secondly, the person who was saved will get two PMs (assuming the actual medic does his job) from people claiming to have saved him. We then just lynch the people who PM'd the saved person. If we get the mafioso, great, we're done and the other guy is legit and confirmed. If we get the medic, tough luck, but we snag a red the next day.
If you take a hit, either from medic protection OR from being a veteran and living, speak up. The mafia knows they hit you anyway, so you're not giving them any information. Telling the town is good. Don't tell the town how you were protected, just say "I took a hit last night."
Agreed. However, I'm not so sure we should jump the gun on the bolded portion, excepting when it is a Veteran hit (who lost a life). It would be wiser, I feel, to spare the coinflip, keep the medic alive for sure, and wait until something comes up to help incriminate one of the parties. Of course, this would all be up to the individual who is PM'ed given their inability to share information, so the efficiency of either method may lie solely in said person's aptitude to use what they are given.
YellowInk, I feel I have to address something regarding your campaign. You know the problems I have with your main selling point, the clue, already. However, assume for the sake of argument that I believe all of those assumptions. There are still some problems with using it as your platform:
1. Having no communication between DT's, there is no guarantee that any will check you, as well as no guarantee that they won't all check you, wasting opportunities.
2. The stance that having a Mafia member in office is not so bad for town just because of an increased likelihood of being discovered is a faulty one. The Mayor has three votes, protection from Mafia hits, and the ability to become a mouthpiece for town. Eliminating that for town (as well as silencing an outspoken townie upon election, if one were that ballsy) for one Mafioso, who doesn't even reduce KP from their death, isn't too bad of an idea. Not a brilliant idea, mind. But, also certainly not a terrible one.
There needs to be more of a reason to vote for you. So far you have shown yourself to be intelligent and reasonable, which is good, but pushing hard for the vote simply based off of self-implied innocence is not going to work.
|
On June 04 2010 06:22 DarthThienAn wrote:HOWEVER. Yellow, I'm not sure why you disagree with crate's whole medic analysis. It made sense to me. There shouldn't be a situation where a mafia gets hit AND the medic saves the mafia - after all, the vigi should be following what the thread says.
It depends on the vigi and the medic both, honestly. Vig don't always follow the clear path of the thread - and for good reason. If the mafia can predict who the vig is going to hit, the mafia can use this knowledge to their advantage. A couple examples off the top of my head:
1) The given target of the vig could roleclaim DT and out another suspicious mafia, thus garnering themselves credit.
2) Another mafia could whisper in someone's ear roleclaiming DT and saying that the targetted mafia is mafia, thus garnering credit and perhaps gaining a unwitting spokesperson.
There are a lot of twists and turns. I'm not saying vigs should go out and make random hits, but if they allow the hits to be predictable, the mafia will use that against us. It follows from this that medics similarly can't be too sure either - though I would hope that medics and mafia don't cross paths since that means the vig thought a player was mafia when the medic was similarly convinced the same player was town. This can definitely happen though - especially if a target is mired in contraversy.
|
All the mayoral candidates seem suspicious to me anyway.
Wouldn't it be so sick if all the current candidates Zeks, Yellowink and Darth were all mafia and just tricking us, since they all know who the mafia members are.
Since we are doing voting what if the public were to chose someone to be a mayor ( basing it from reading his posts and seeing if he is pro town ). Of course the person would have to agree but it would kind of be like a surprise to the crowd.
MTF looks like a town person to me, i might be completely wrong though. What do you guys think?
|
On June 04 2010 06:22 MTF wrote:
YellowInk, I feel I have to address something regarding your campaign. You know the problems I have with your main selling point, the clue, already. However, assume for the sake of argument that I believe all of those assumptions. There are still some problems with using it as your platform:
1. Having no communication between DT's, there is no guarantee that any will check you, as well as no guarantee that they won't all check you, wasting opportunities.
Lack of communication between the DTs would put us in the same position as if any other player were mayor, so this is a wash. If they all check me, this isn't terrible, because then they will all be able to entrust me with all knowledge. (On the flip, if all the DTs investigate me and I were to turn up red, yeah, it would be redundant. However it's not much more likely than DTs overlapping investigating someone else that is high profile and suspicious. I wouldn't be surprised if I got double DT checked even if I weren't elected for mayor.) The long term benefit is that after they both investigate me (and tell me that they trust me), I could work with them to ensure they don't overlap targets in the future. I would become a focal point for organization.
2. The stance that having a Mafia member in office is not so bad for town just because of an increased likelihood of being discovered is a faulty one. The Mayor has three votes, protection from Mafia hits, and the ability to become a mouthpiece for town. Eliminating that for town (as well as silencing an outspoken townie upon election, if one were that ballsy) for one Mafioso, who doesn't even reduce KP from their death, isn't too bad of an idea. Not a brilliant idea, mind. But, also certainly not a terrible one.
I claim that it's an increased likelihood of being discovered for me in particular. If I were mafia and there's this thing out there that's a clue pointing at my face, I make a bad mayoral candidate because I'll be discovered. As a part of team mafia, I'd much rather let one who is not suspected make a run for office. (see previous post for more elaborate explanation)
Also, the mayor is really only a mouthpiece for the town if people trust him. Mayors do hold a lot of power - the crux of the matter is that they typically do not hold a lot of trust. I believe that because of my position with respect to the clue it will cause more people to be more trusting of me once I can be publicly cleaned (if they're not already convinced just by my campaign).
There needs to be more of a reason to vote for you. So far you have shown yourself to be intelligent and reasonable, which is good, but pushing hard for the vote simply based off of self-implied innocence is not going to work.
I don't expect people to vote for me simply based on self-implied innocence. While hopefully this is weighted into your thoughts since the risk vs reward implies that I am town, it's not the only thing I have going for me. My original reason for deciding to run was because of the obvious clue pointing at me. This puts me in the unique position of being able to create a position of both power and strong trustworthiness in the mid game - a truly effective mayor.
|
On June 04 2010 06:47 MooCow wrote:
All the mayoral candidates seem suspicious to me anyway.
Wouldn't it be so sick if all the current candidates Zeks, Yellowink and Darth were all mafia and just tricking us, since they all know who the mafia members are.
Since we are doing voting what if the public were to chose someone to be a mayor ( basing it from reading his posts and seeing if he is pro town ). Of course the person would have to agree but it would kind of be like a surprise to the crowd.
MTF looks like a town person to me, i might be completely wrong though. What do you guys think?
I like the way of your thinking, MooCow. However, if this were the case, Zeks has all but put his head on the block for merely the chance at getting me into the mayorship - one which would not be stable since a clue check could out me. So... we'd have to be pretty bad to have tried this kind of play. ^.~
I hope at this point no one will vote for Zeks. I would not be averse to one more (townie) putting their name up. If we have more than 3 people in the running creating vote split, it would make it much easier for the mafia to get one of their own elected.
To be honest, though, I think Darth will make a great pardoner because he has shown himself to have clear thought processes. If he starts spewing doubletalk or making inexplicable pardons later in the game, it'll be clear that he's mafia because he won't be able to hide behind the 'oh I'm noob and just messed up' defense. Plus, I'm leaning towards him being pro-town as well.
So to sum it up, I don't think we need a 3rd, but it wouldn't be bad either. Having a 4th would be bad.
Vote YellowInk for Mayor.
|
On June 04 2010 06:49 YellowInk wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2010 06:22 MTF wrote:
2. The stance that having a Mafia member in office is not so bad for town just because of an increased likelihood of being discovered is a faulty one. The Mayor has three votes, protection from Mafia hits, and the ability to become a mouthpiece for town. Eliminating that for town (as well as silencing an outspoken townie upon election, if one were that ballsy) for one Mafioso, who doesn't even reduce KP from their death, isn't too bad of an idea. Not a brilliant idea, mind. But, also certainly not a terrible one. I claim that it's an increased likelihood of being discovered for me in particular. If I were mafia and there's this thing out there that's a clue pointing at my face, I make a bad mayoral candidate because I'll be discovered. As a part of team mafia, I'd much rather let one who is not suspected make a run for office. (see previous post for more elaborate explanation) Also, the mayor is really only a mouthpiece for the town if people trust him. Mayors do hold a lot of power - the crux of the matter is that they typically do not hold a lot of trust. I believe that because of my position with respect to the clue it will cause more people to be more trusting of me once I can be publicly cleaned (if they're not already convinced just by my campaign). Show nested quote +There needs to be more of a reason to vote for you. So far you have shown yourself to be intelligent and reasonable, which is good, but pushing hard for the vote simply based off of self-implied innocence is not going to work. I don't expect people to vote for me simply based on self-implied innocence. While hopefully this is weighted into your thoughts since the risk vs reward implies that I am town, it's not the only thing I have going for me. My original reason for deciding to run was because of the obvious clue pointing at me. This puts me in the unique position of being able to create a position of both power and strong trustworthiness in the mid game - a truly effective mayor.
At this point I believe you are town, but I'm still a little wary of your tactics so far. There's still a possibility you are Mafia, and you're using the fact that the most obvious clue from the opening day post pointed to you to your advantage - you would be outed eventually because of it, so why not cause a blow to the town before you go down by taking the mayor out of the game, as well as wasting possibly all the detective's actions for the first day on finding you out.
Also, like others, I'm a little disturbed at your aggression in pushing for yourself as mayor. Coupled with the glaring clue pointing towards you, that's why I voted for Darth. He could be mafia, but he's not associated with any clues as of yet, and he seems pretty clean from his posts. Hopefully that's a genuine sign that he's a town and not just skill picked up from playing multiple games.
|
On June 04 2010 07:15 littlechava wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2010 06:49 YellowInk wrote:On June 04 2010 06:22 MTF wrote:
2. The stance that having a Mafia member in office is not so bad for town just because of an increased likelihood of being discovered is a faulty one. The Mayor has three votes, protection from Mafia hits, and the ability to become a mouthpiece for town. Eliminating that for town (as well as silencing an outspoken townie upon election, if one were that ballsy) for one Mafioso, who doesn't even reduce KP from their death, isn't too bad of an idea. Not a brilliant idea, mind. But, also certainly not a terrible one. I claim that it's an increased likelihood of being discovered for me in particular. If I were mafia and there's this thing out there that's a clue pointing at my face, I make a bad mayoral candidate because I'll be discovered. As a part of team mafia, I'd much rather let one who is not suspected make a run for office. (see previous post for more elaborate explanation) Also, the mayor is really only a mouthpiece for the town if people trust him. Mayors do hold a lot of power - the crux of the matter is that they typically do not hold a lot of trust. I believe that because of my position with respect to the clue it will cause more people to be more trusting of me once I can be publicly cleaned (if they're not already convinced just by my campaign). There needs to be more of a reason to vote for you. So far you have shown yourself to be intelligent and reasonable, which is good, but pushing hard for the vote simply based off of self-implied innocence is not going to work. I don't expect people to vote for me simply based on self-implied innocence. While hopefully this is weighted into your thoughts since the risk vs reward implies that I am town, it's not the only thing I have going for me. My original reason for deciding to run was because of the obvious clue pointing at me. This puts me in the unique position of being able to create a position of both power and strong trustworthiness in the mid game - a truly effective mayor. At this point I believe you are town, but I'm still a little wary of your tactics so far. There's still a possibility you are Mafia, and you're using the fact that the most obvious clue from the opening day post pointed to you to your advantage - you would be outed eventually because of it, so why not cause a blow to the town before you go down by taking the mayor out of the game, as well as wasting possibly all the detective's actions for the first day on finding you out. Also, like others, I'm a little disturbed at your aggression in pushing for yourself as mayor. Coupled with the glaring clue pointing towards you, that's why I voted for Darth. He could be mafia, but he's not associated with any clues as of yet, and he seems pretty clean from his posts. Hopefully that's a genuine sign that he's a town and not just skill picked up from playing multiple games.
I understand your line of thought. I'm glad you are tending towards a clean read on me. In more direct response to your argument, see http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=127781¤tpage=14#262 + Show Spoiler +The worst thing that could happen is a mafia mayor that you have no way to figure out if they're mafia. After the clues got compiled, the mafia team perhaps got together and put up a candidate for mayor that does not have any current suspicion (eg Darth). If he wins this election and ends up being red, it will be devastating to the town. On the flip side, the best thing that could happen is to have a townie mayor that you're able to clean. That's me! Once you know you can trust me, I will be a devastating force against the mafia due to my immunity to hits and ability to be a focal point for all knowledge. I will be able to mobilize the town into an effective force to root out all of the red. In the middle, we have the mayors we can't confirm and mayors who are shown to be red. The mayor can be hung just like anyone else. If the mayor can't be confirmed in some way (remember they're immune to rolechecks), his real power is largely left dormant. Now I am leaning towards Darth being town just from his posting style. But I wouldn't put my life in his hands. I wouldn't be comfortable trusting him with any info I might have. The result will be that he's either a middle strength mayor or our worst nightmare. On the other hand, I will eventually be cleaned by a DT or shown to be red - either a best case scenario or at worst falling in the middle. This is why you should vote YellowInk for Mayor!
I know that you know that if I turn up red from the clue check, you'll be able to get rid of me. If I were mafia, I wouldn't be putting myself up for the mayorship. I'd probably be keeping quiet in the election while one of my mafia brethren who had no suspicion ran for office. I wouldn't support them since when I turn up red it'd destabilize his position. I just wouldn't be participating. I'd be keeping quiet at probably 1-3 posts, maybe making an excuse, contributing a bit to clue digging, or just saying nothing of particular relevance like about 10-15 of our 30 are currently doing. The mafia would be MUCH better served by having a suspicionless mayor in position than having me be put up for it.
|
Maybe i'm being a bit too cynical but Darth posted that he'd be happy with you being the mayor or pardoner and now you post that you'd also be happy with him being either or.
If we do get you both as either Mayor/pardoner we should hopefully be correct or we'd be screwed for a long time if you both are mafia.
|
OK i finally caught up with all the reading! There seems to be a general agreement that Darth is pro-town; I'm getting the same vibe (excuse the strange word choice please :D). YellowInk DOES have sound logic despite his somewhat suspicious eagerness--meaning he's probably good too. BUT, as someone said above, he is causing quite a bit of conflict in general.
As people are posting more, I'm getting a better understanding of their character and thought processes and such. This is my first game, but it's been sick so far!
SO as of now, I'm leaning Darth until someone gives me a (good) reason otherwise
|
I also agree with a lot of what crate said regarding strategy, also sound logic.
remember, we have to unite and minimize conflict--failing to do so plays right into the mafia's evil hands.
there are also a bunch of inactives still afaik---u guys should come out and post!
|
oh and what exactly happened with Darth last game lmao. i'm curious >>
|
On June 04 2010 07:36 MooCow wrote:
Maybe i'm being a bit too cynical but Darth posted that he'd be happy with you being the mayor or pardoner and now you post that you'd also be happy with him being either or.
If we do get you both as either Mayor/pardoner we should hopefully be correct or we'd be screwed for a long time if you both are mafia.
From my limited experience playing mafia in real life, I don't know how much can carry over. From my experience in the more serious games we played, the mafia are often the ones who are desperately portraying themselves as town. Oftentimes that will lead to extremes (and often depends on the skill of the player). Mafia are generally on guard (and often have a "nervous" look that gives them away in RL). They will often aim to be very active or tend to shy back. In this online version, I can't really equate the idea of "activity" directly, but my spidey-senses are tingling.
For someone that has worked so hard campaigning on mayor, to suddenly switch to be pardoner is indeed suspicious. While you do have a systematic detailed plan outlined out, I find that you're often pushing your candidacy more than your plan. Again, my intuition tells me that if you truly have faith in it, you would have no problem merely putting it out for discussion. Although I've played with "defensive townies" before, you seem to adamantly defend your innocence (often before citing "reasons"). Consequently based on the mechanics of the game, I think it's rather risky to vote you as the mayor.
Since clues are limited, I can only speak from experience. I wonder if any vets can help us out on the "nature" of clues as the game goes on.
|
Alright, I'm back.
And holy crap, has stuff been happening. Mayoral contest is heating up, with YellowInk pushing for himself pretty heavily, despite a lot of people being rather skeptical. It looks like people are reading way too much into the "hot ink/yellowink" clue, which I find odd, because it is Day 1 after all. Clues are traditionally very vague/nonexistant on day 1, and they're also usually very well hidden and not obvious.
Since mayoral elections are kinda the big deal today, I thought I'd look at the candidates who have been pretty vocal - YellowInk, zeks, and Darth.
YellowInk:
He reeeeeeeallly wants to be mayor. Like, seriously. There's been a lot of back and forth between him and Darth re: exactly what being mayor entails. He seems to think that he can be completely cleared by cluechecks, which is not true, sorry bro. However, because pretty much everyone in this game is new, that's a very understandable mistake, so it also doesn't make him look scummy. He's been the most incendiary candidate so far, attacking both zeks and Darth on their plans for their mayorship.
Here's what I think: A DT should CLUECHECK (not rolecheck) the hot-ink part of today's post tonight. If that's a clue, then that's pretty damning for poor YellowInk, although we should profile-analyze everyone else just to be sure. It's far more likely that it's nothing, however, which is why I'm not advocating a rolecheck this early in the game (I do not think rolechecks should be used night 1. It's unlikely the DTs are going to die night 1, and having rolechecks late in the game is very useful), so if it's not a clue, then I'd be ok with YellowInk being mayor. Unfortunately, since there's no way to cluecheck before the elections are done, I can't endorse YellowInk for mayor, sorry bro.
zeks:
he has a plan. He posted his plan. I'm really not a fan of it. His logic behind the DT rolecheck pattern is flawed, for this reason: there is something like a 48% chance they are both in the same bracket. Even though there's a 1 in 225 chance that they both rolecheck the same person, there's a 100% chance that half the players in the game are being completely ignored. This is very very bad.
Again, he doesn't look scummy, he looks new. This is not a bad thing, but again, I can't in good conscience vote for a candidate who i don't agree with.
DarthThienAn:
I've played a game with him before (3 kingdoms mafia rawr :3) and we did pretty well. From his posts so far, he's very pro-town, which I like. His style of play in the last game we played was to make some slightly scummy decisions to try and draw people out. Mafia players tend to love to accuse any town player acting even slightly weird of being mafia, as it draws the suspicion away from him. He had been cleared town by alignment checks, so he went fishing, and (iirc) it didn't really pay off that much, but it wasn't a bad tactic.
I feel most comfortable voting for Darth, if only because I have played with him before, and I know he knows the game reasonably well. It's nothing against the new players (this is a new player game after all ^^), but mayor is a role that can make or break town, and we need someone with slightly more experience in the role, plus there are no clues against him and he has a pro-town attitude. So I say, vote Darth for mayor!
Now that that's out of the way, I'd like to announce my candidacy for Pardoner. There haven't been any clear pardoner candidates yet, so I thought I might as well get the ball rolling. As pardoner, here's what I would do:
1) Attempt to establish clear connections to confirmed townies
I want to try and work with the most active, coolest town people in the game. I would try to coordinate with DTs secretly to attempt to catch scum, I would work with the medic(s) to protect those that need protecting, and the vigilantes to nail confirmed scum.
2) Pardon power roles if necessary
If a confirmed townie ever comes under fire from the town and is about to get lynched, I will pardon and protect them. I cannot stress enough how important it is to keep the confirmed townies, particularly the power roles, alive, as they will be the ones that win us the game.
Here are my credentials:
Have played 2 mafia games before. Won one handily (3 kingdoms) and just barely lost the other (The Life Aquatic). Was townie both times.
I am a standard, green townie this game. No special roles, so I am a low-priority target.
I am completely clean from the day 1 clues, and there is no suspicion against me.
I AM NOT SCUM.
That last point is the most important one, and let me stress why: It's bad to let a mafia player (or god forbid, the GF) get into any elected role, but especially bad to give them Pardoner. The reasoning is, Pardoner gets a free ability to protect ANYONE from lynch, two times, and we have no way to block it. What this means is, if a mafia has Pardoner role, unless we catch on really quickly, we essentially have to lynch 8 mafia instead of 6, as the pardoner can protect his brethren twice. This is something we DON'T want to happen.
Now consider this. There are 6 mafia. If they vote as a bloc, that probably won't be enough to get any scum into the mayor slot, but seeing as there doesn't seem to be a strong second candidate, that just might be enough to give one of them Pardoner. They can probably hide it pretty well too, by have one of their own announce candidacy for mayor and posting a bunch of stuff so he seems legit, then just having them all vote for him, spreading it out throughout the day so it's even less obvious. I don't want that to happen.
Thus, I want you to elect me for Pardoner. What this means is, I am trying to place SECOND in the mayoral election. Whoever you guys choose for mayor (I'm backing Darth, but it doesn't necessarily have to be him) needs to be ahead of me, but I should be ideally, just one vote behind him. So here's what I'm proposing:
I am voting for myself now. That will give me 1 vote, Darth currently has 4. Two more people should vote for me, then we should go by the following: One person votes for Darth, one votes for me. Thus, we will slowly creep up, I will never tie or pass Darth in terms of voting, and, assuming for random 3rd party candidates, Darth should end up with something like 9 votes, I should then end up with 8. That should be enough to keep the scum out of office.
I hope you all agree with me.
|
Yellowink, not only will not vote for you as mayor at this point, at this point I am leaning towards lynching you first.
|
On June 04 2010 07:49 onihunter wrote:
oh and what exactly happened with Darth last game lmao. i'm curious >>
On June 01 2010 12:43 DarthThienAn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:43 LunarDestiny wrote:
Night ends in 20 minutes and I suspect day will then end in the next minute. I will make sure of it >=D
On June 01 2010 12:52 DarthThienAn wrote:
F5F5F5F5F5
F5F5F5F5F5
F5F5F5F5F5
F5F5F5F5F5
F5F5F5F5F5
On June 01 2010 12:57 DarthThienAn wrote:
zzz man dis take too long.
On June 01 2010 12:59 DarthThienAn wrote:
Just in case.
Kill: Nikon
On June 01 2010 13:00 DarthThienAn wrote:
Well I guess I'll just do it again.
LD, I "claimed" by quoting L's "I can shoot"
On June 01 2010 13:00 DarthThienAn wrote:
Kill: Nikon
tl time so bad
On June 01 2010 13:00 DarthThienAn wrote:
I GOT THIS GUYS I SWARE. :D
On June 01 2010 13:02 Ace wrote:
DarthThienAn (Vanilla Towny) has been killed.
|
Oh shit, that's right. I totally forgot about Bang Bang Mafia.
That game doesn't count though, lol.
|
On June 04 2010 07:58 BrownBear wrote:
That last point is the most important one, and let me stress why: It's bad to let a mafia player (or god forbid, the GF) get into any elected role, but especially bad to give them Pardoner. The reasoning is, Pardoner gets a free ability to protect ANYONE from lynch, two times, and we have no way to block it. What this means is, if a mafia has Pardoner role, unless we catch on really quickly, we essentially have to lynch 8 mafia instead of 6, as the pardoner can protect his brethren twice. This is something we DON'T want to happen.
Now consider this. There are 6 mafia. If they vote as a bloc, that probably won't be enough to get any scum into the mayor slot, but seeing as there doesn't seem to be a strong second candidate, that just might be enough to give one of them Pardoner. They can probably hide it pretty well too, by have one of their own announce candidacy for mayor and posting a bunch of stuff so he seems legit, then just having them all vote for him, spreading it out throughout the day so it's even less obvious. I don't want that to happen.
Brownbear beat me to it. But I want to add something.
Mafia has a number of 6. So if they run for election. Their votes will be 6+others voting for them (who have no clue that they are voting for the mafia) which is HUGE. This will probably give them a mayor and pardoner spot. What we need is not multiple candidate running for mayor but just decide on one candidate to vote for. I would be happy just having the town getting mayor spot while leaving the pardoner's spot to the mafia.
Also to point out if the mafia is running for mayor, it will be a close election since they only want to expose just enough of their members voting for their candidate to avoid being bundled up as a group of mafia voting for their candidate.
The alternative is the mafia choose not to take part in the election which is pretty stupid in my mind.
So, we must decide on one candidate alone and hope that he is not mafia. I am willing to change my vote from darth to another candidate if the town agree on another candidate.
|
Important grammar issue:
This will probably give them a mayor OR pardoner spot.
|
I'm still waiting before voting for anyone, I hate hasty decisions.
For now I only know who I am not going to vote for. (zeks, no surprise here)
Well, time to sleep in Europe, i'll have some text to read with when i'll wake up, that is for sure.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
