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shinarit
Hungary900 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:33 Slow Motion wrote: Fnatic can definitely take out TPA. I don't think they will this time around though. Thats my feeling too. But than i can watch a finals without rooting for someone, its much calmer that way, i can really enjoy every good play. | ||
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1ntrigue
Australia948 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:32 Caphe wrote: Wtf Fnatic, they managed to pick a late game comp but constanly engage under bad situation at MID game where Cait and Eve are at top of their power curve? They didn't have much choice seeing that Cait hit her lategame during Vayne's barely-midgame. Lategame Cait is probably better than lategame Vayne. At the very least, she is safer and will reliably do damage even if she gets a bad engage (see all fights). | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:33 Requizen wrote: No, for implying that Cait is a good AD carry. Ever since the Ez/Corki/Graves era, Cait was considered trash tier by majority opinion (though I still played her /hipster). Even then, she wasn't considered as safe as the big three with their bigger mobility. Don't act like Cait wasn't shunned for like the past two months, otherwise you haven't been paying attention to popular opinion. For some odd reason, Caitlyn's E can be interrupted and not fire when she gets stunned during the casting animation. This is very different from Ezreal's E. The reduction on her casting delay on her E helped a lot, so did the Q multi-target penalty reduction. I think Caitlyn's greatest strength is in objective fights though. Her range and her W allows easy fights near towers; and her passive provides her with ~20% extra damage (not including crits) against baron and dragon. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:34 iCanada wrote: Cait Late game really good... She AD with stupid range, a dash, and a root. You give her 6 items she hurt as much if not more than any other AD. Cait is good late game because of range. Any AD Carry can buy damage. But you can't buy range. | ||
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:33 Requizen wrote: No, for implying that Cait is a good AD carry. Ever since the Ez/Corki/Graves era, Cait was considered trash tier by majority opinion (though I still played her /hipster). Even then, she wasn't considered as safe as the big three with their bigger mobility. Don't act like Cait wasn't shunned for like the past two months, otherwise you haven't been paying attention to popular opinion. Cait has always been an okay ad that has been played occasionally.Even in solo q I saw her often.Her only problem is that if you can't get her a nunu she doesn't really do any damage unless you get fed. | ||
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seRapH
United States9830 Posts
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BlueSpace
Germany2182 Posts
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:34 iCanada wrote: Cait Late game really good... She AD with stupid range, a dash, and a root. You give her 6 items she hurt as much if not more than any other AD. Nah, Cait's power is the early and mid game seige. Her damage is definately below Vayne or Kog late game. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:35 Sufficiency wrote: For some odd reason, Caitlyn's E can be interrupted and not fire when she gets stunned during the casting animation. This is very different from Ezreal's E. The reduction on her casting delay on her E helped a lot, so did the Q multi-target penalty reduction. You can interrupt the dash move of any AD Champ. My Tristana so sad. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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BlueSpace
Germany2182 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:36 Caphe wrote: Nah, Cait's power is the early and mid game seige. Her damage is definately below Vayne or Kog late game. Nunu is a huge boost to any carry late game and it prevents cait from falling off I have the feeling. She still has her range and combined with the perma-boil she can hold her own even against so called hyper-carries. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:34 1ntrigue wrote: They didn't have much choice seeing that Cait hit her lategame during Vayne's barely-midgame. Lategame Cait is probably better than lategame Vayne. At the very least, she is safer and will reliably do damage even if she gets a bad engage (see all fights). Explain to me how Fnatic did not has much choices? Cait were ahead but not that ahead (she was up 30cs compare to vayne) at the time of the mid tower dive. That dive made no sense at all while you can just split push all day with a farmed Shen(Shen was like 1 kill ahead of Irealia and up in cs too) | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:16 oogieogie wrote: because this isn't 6 items vs 6 items..vayne isn't at the hyper carry items yet. Phreak is saying that cait would be getting more attack time off because of her long range. It's not that stupid. (Also, nunu buff.) It's true too. Even after being flashtaunted and bursted low -> net and flash out of fight, cait was still able to contribute significant damage to the fight. Helped being ahead of Vayne in farm + having Nunu buff. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:36 Caphe wrote: Nah, Cait's power is the early and mid game seige. Her damage is definately below Vayne or Kog late game. Except by nature of the teamcomps, that still would work out for WE. WE had a 3-carry lineup, Fnatic's was 4-protects-1. 4+1 has a timing advantage that is strongest at the point where their AD is capped out at 6 items, and then drops off compared to multi-carry lineups because item development on the supportive 2nd/3rd position don't accomplish as much as the multi-carry strategy's damage-dealing carries. But WE got a large enough advantage to nullify this timing--i.e. at the point where Vayne capped out, Misaya and Caomei would already be approaching their 6-item development. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:39 BlueSpace wrote: Nunu is a huge boost to any carry late game and it prevents cait from falling off I have the feeling. She still has her range and combined with the perma-boil she can hold her own even against so called hyper-carries. Yeah, I agree with you on this. Didn't watch the champ select but when I tuned in to see Fnatic picked Vayne but lets WE picked Nunu, I was like wtf... -_-/ | ||
Carnivorous Sheep
Baa?21248 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
THAT DOUBLELIFT BURN.... Damn phreak, so mean! | ||
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BlueSpace
Germany2182 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:40 Caphe wrote: Explain to me how Fnatic did not has much choices? Cait were ahead but not that ahead (she was up 30cs compare to vayne) at the time of the mid tower dive. That dive made no sense at all while you can just split push all day with a farmed Shen(Shen was like 1 kill ahead of Irealia and up in cs too) Fnatic dove cait and failed, resulting in a full blown 5v5. Vayne wasn't that far behind in CS, but cait didn't buy any Dorans and had already PD+IE. Vayne at that point had only PD and a BF. So Vayne wasn't behind in gold that much, but a lot in items. Actually you might even say, that this is a result of peke dying to Baron. He lost stacks afterwards and had to replenish them by using feast. If feast would have been availble in the engagement, maybe they could have managed to bring down cait and turned the fight and the game in their favour. PS: I'm talking about the team fight before WE took baron, where only cho survived in front of WE base. | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:33 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Do you mean WE beat TPA and Fnatic beat M5? Derp. Yes. Yes that's what I mean. Clearly I need the brackets in front of me at all times. | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
On December 03 2012 05:44 BlueSpace wrote: Fnatic dove cait and failed, resulting in a full blown 5v5. Vayne wasn't that far behind in CS, but cait didn't buy any Dorans and had already PD+IE. Vayne at that point had only PD and a BF. So Vayne wasn't behind in gold that much, but a lot in items. Actually you might even say, that this is a result of peke dying to Baron. He lost stacks afterwards and had to replenish them by using feast. If feast would have been availble in the engagement, maybe they could have managed to bring down cait and turned the fight and the game in their favour. PS: I'm talking about the team fight before WE took baron, where only cho survived in front of WE base. So that were double fails from Fnatic. Has no point to tower dive while the game is pretty much even while feast was not available, for me thats double facepalm. WE has a very good chance to win anyway, but seeing Fnatic just like kill themselves is kind sad  | ||
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