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On April 07 2012 12:31 ketchup wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:29 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 HazMat wrote:On April 07 2012 12:26 henrikyo wrote:On April 07 2012 12:24 wei2coolman wrote:
I blame riot, release new champ, completely breaks meta-game. Agreed, what is weird is that lol tournaments usually doesnt play with latest update. But lulu is just way to powerful. Got shield like janna, taric like hex/poly. And then the ulti sighhhhhhhhhhhhh Voy does good with her in a series, you guys call her broken. If she's really that broken then she would at least be banned once. Totally agree with you here. Lulu herself is fine. It's just that the overlap of all the heal/protect together is really good. It's the same way AoE Comps work. The AoE alone isn't OP. It's overlapping them all over each other that's an issue. I think this is not correct. Lulu needs to be slightly nerfed considering she was 1v2ing almost against most team comps just fine. This is a "support" who handles solo lanes easily. Even most designed top laners can't do that without trouble. There's something wrong with that.
She did have Blue Buff early which does wonders. Anyone with an AoE clear ability, poke and Blue Buff has an advantage compared to other champions at 1v2 scenarios.
I also think it's fine that a "support" can solo lane. Support is just a term we use for champions that we pidgeon hole into the no cs role. I personally think there's nothing with supports having scaling or having strong uses for gold income.
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On April 07 2012 12:30 henrikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:28 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:27 dukethegold wrote:
Can't they just ban Soraka and Lulu in selection and be done with it? It does mean that they leave up Shen, CassiOPeia, Kennen, Karthus, Lee Sin, Udyr, Janna, Ryze. Can't ban/first pcik them all. STILL, they had first pick/ban. They could have ban 1-2 of those, and still pick up like shen or any other
Won't banning soraka at least bring the game back to standard? That's 2.5 heals on soraka. I can't see them running 3 summoner heals with any other ap.
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On April 07 2012 12:31 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:28 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:27 dukethegold wrote:
Can't they just ban Soraka and Lulu in selection and be done with it? It does mean that they leave up Shen, CassiOPeia, Kennen, Karthus, Lee Sin, Udyr, Janna, Ryze. Can't ban/first pcik them all. Nidalee healing not as good as Soraka but she works as AP too. And she can mid and top. Kayle not terrible either. If a team wants to run a heal comp it's not like Lulu/Soraka are required champs. They just happen to be really good. You can easily replace one or both of them if that's the kind of comp you wanna run.
Then just band kogmaw and first pick corki
Problem is, as CLG has said before. They dont have a good range of heroes to play. They play the same shit all the time, and it just got hard countered.
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lulu is definitely op without a doubt. strong laning, very very strong teamfighting, great mobility, great utility, does pretty much everything. the support/ap of lee sin
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We can easily guess on how TSM is going to deal with this.
I predict that Chaox picks MF for the healing debuff. Reginald will no doubt pick something that counters Soraka. He should know how to since he's played it himself unlike Jiji.
Then Dyrus and Oddone will copy M5 and try to shut down mundo really hard.
The question is will it work?
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On April 07 2012 12:31 ketchup wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:29 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 HazMat wrote:On April 07 2012 12:26 henrikyo wrote:On April 07 2012 12:24 wei2coolman wrote:
I blame riot, release new champ, completely breaks meta-game. Agreed, what is weird is that lol tournaments usually doesnt play with latest update. But lulu is just way to powerful. Got shield like janna, taric like hex/poly. And then the ulti sighhhhhhhhhhhhh Voy does good with her in a series, you guys call her broken. If she's really that broken then she would at least be banned once. Totally agree with you here. Lulu herself is fine. It's just that the overlap of all the heal/protect together is really good. It's the same way AoE Comps work. The AoE alone isn't OP. It's overlapping them all over each other that's an issue. I think this is not correct. Lulu needs to be slightly nerfed considering she was 1v2ing almost against most team comps just fine. This is a "support" who handles solo lanes easily. Even most designed top laners can't do that without trouble. There's something wrong with that.
Voyboy got RAPED top. Besides, supports have ALWAYS been fine at soloing. Solo Soraka has been out forever, Taric used to be insane top carry, janna and sona too. The meta changes.
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On April 07 2012 12:33 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:31 ketchup wrote:On April 07 2012 12:29 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 HazMat wrote:On April 07 2012 12:26 henrikyo wrote:On April 07 2012 12:24 wei2coolman wrote:
I blame riot, release new champ, completely breaks meta-game. Agreed, what is weird is that lol tournaments usually doesnt play with latest update. But lulu is just way to powerful. Got shield like janna, taric like hex/poly. And then the ulti sighhhhhhhhhhhhh Voy does good with her in a series, you guys call her broken. If she's really that broken then she would at least be banned once. Totally agree with you here. Lulu herself is fine. It's just that the overlap of all the heal/protect together is really good. It's the same way AoE Comps work. The AoE alone isn't OP. It's overlapping them all over each other that's an issue. I think this is not correct. Lulu needs to be slightly nerfed considering she was 1v2ing almost against most team comps just fine. This is a "support" who handles solo lanes easily. Even most designed top laners can't do that without trouble. There's something wrong with that. She did have Blue Buff early which does wonders. Anyone with an AoE clear ability, poke and Blue Buff has an advantage compared to other champions at 1v2 scenarios.
Except, this happened in all the games. Not just this one.
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On April 07 2012 12:33 henrikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:31 overt wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:27 dukethegold wrote:
Can't they just ban Soraka and Lulu in selection and be done with it? It does mean that they leave up Shen, CassiOPeia, Kennen, Karthus, Lee Sin, Udyr, Janna, Ryze. Can't ban/first pcik them all. Nidalee healing not as good as Soraka but she works as AP too. And she can mid and top. Kayle not terrible either. If a team wants to run a heal comp it's not like Lulu/Soraka are required champs. They just happen to be really good. You can easily replace one or both of them if that's the kind of comp you wanna run. Then just band kogmaw and first pick corki Problem is, as CLG has said before. They dont have a good range of heroes to play. They play the same shit all the time, and it just got hard countered.
I dunno if that's 100% accurate though. Doublelift's Corki is pretty damn good. His Kog leaves a lot to be desired, but his Corki is excellent. And jiji can run AP Kog. In that specific situation they could easily ban Kog or Corki and pick up the other to fit into a comp they wanna run.
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I don't think the comp is super OP, just that CLG didn't respond well.
I also think banning kog wouldn't fix it, because the comp is not reliant on super long range. They got engaged on effectively plenty of times and just healed/shielded/slowed right through it. Vayne or Corki would work fine imo.
Also the lulu+soraka combo is what makes the comp so powerful. Ban just one of those and i think you are all set. That and get an assassin like poppy or akali to burst through the heal. CLG had no burst so their damage got sustained through.
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There's 6 bans in this game btw guys.
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On April 07 2012 12:34 tobi9999 wrote:
We can easily guess on how TSM is going to deal with this.
I predict that Chaox picks MF for the healing debuff. Reginald will no doubt pick something that counters Soraka. He should know how to since he's played it himself unlike Jiji.
Then Dyrus and Oddone will copy M5 and try to shut down mundo really hard.
The question is will it work?
no because people are misunderstanding how this comp works.
This is just a glorified protect the kog comp.
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On April 07 2012 12:31 BlackMagister wrote:
CLG wasted a ban on Olaf and potentially Ryze. Or am I missing something? Did Dig do well with Olaf in game one or a previous series?
Voy's Olaf is known to be very strong. Ryze has been a perma ban against Scarra since mid season 1, he almost never loses as Ryze.
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On April 07 2012 12:34 HazMat wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:31 ketchup wrote:On April 07 2012 12:29 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 HazMat wrote:On April 07 2012 12:26 henrikyo wrote:On April 07 2012 12:24 wei2coolman wrote:
I blame riot, release new champ, completely breaks meta-game. Agreed, what is weird is that lol tournaments usually doesnt play with latest update. But lulu is just way to powerful. Got shield like janna, taric like hex/poly. And then the ulti sighhhhhhhhhhhhh Voy does good with her in a series, you guys call her broken. If she's really that broken then she would at least be banned once. Totally agree with you here. Lulu herself is fine. It's just that the overlap of all the heal/protect together is really good. It's the same way AoE Comps work. The AoE alone isn't OP. It's overlapping them all over each other that's an issue. I think this is not correct. Lulu needs to be slightly nerfed considering she was 1v2ing almost against most team comps just fine. This is a "support" who handles solo lanes easily. Even most designed top laners can't do that without trouble. There's something wrong with that. Voyboy got RAPED top. Besides, supports have ALWAYS been fine at soloing. Solo Soraka has been out forever, Taric used to be insane top carry, janna and sona too. The meta changes.
If you are talking about the last game. Pretty sure it was Pirate vs Lulu bot lane(and leesin got a successful gank in due to no ward coverage for Lulu). Not too sure which game Voyboy got raped top. Reports from twitter were saying Lulu won top lane.
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On April 07 2012 12:34 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2012 12:33 henrikyo wrote:On April 07 2012 12:31 overt wrote:On April 07 2012 12:28 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 07 2012 12:27 dukethegold wrote:
Can't they just ban Soraka and Lulu in selection and be done with it? It does mean that they leave up Shen, CassiOPeia, Kennen, Karthus, Lee Sin, Udyr, Janna, Ryze. Can't ban/first pcik them all. Nidalee healing not as good as Soraka but she works as AP too. And she can mid and top. Kayle not terrible either. If a team wants to run a heal comp it's not like Lulu/Soraka are required champs. They just happen to be really good. You can easily replace one or both of them if that's the kind of comp you wanna run. Then just band kogmaw and first pick corki Problem is, as CLG has said before. They dont have a good range of heroes to play. They play the same shit all the time, and it just got hard countered. I dunno if that's 100% accurate though. Doublelift's Corki is pretty damn good. His Kog leaves a lot to be desired, but his Corki is excellent. And jiji can run AP Kog. In that specific situation they could easily ban Kog or Corki and pick up the other to fit into a comp they wanna run.
Then why didnt they do it :/
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On April 07 2012 12:35 petered wrote:
I don't think the comp is super OP, just that CLG didn't respond well.
I also think banning kog wouldn't fix it, because the comp is not reliant on super long range. They got engaged on effectively plenty of times and just healed/shielded/slowed right through it. Vayne or Corki would work fine imo.
Also the lulu+soraka combo is what makes the comp so powerful. Ban just one of those and i think you are all set. That and get an assassin like poppy or akali to burst through the heal. CLG had no burst so their damage got sustained through.
corki yes, but qtpie SUCKS at vayne (double is great on corki...hence why banning kog and taking corki is awesome)
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Katarina counterpick incoming next game against DIg.
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On April 07 2012 12:35 HazMat wrote:
There's 6 bans in this game btw guys.
you only get to do 3 of those.
Also, why would this comp not work with tristana?
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On April 07 2012 12:35 nosliw wrote:
Is IPL done for today?
yep, schedule is in OP
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I think the same thing would have happened if you put tristana in there instead of kogmaw, except the game would have been dragged out for an extra 5 minutes since trist takes 1 more item than kogmaw to beast everything/
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EPT
