On December 14 2012 08:39 Kaldr wrote: So tiamat/hydra on lee is really good, when you use the active it resets your attack animation and triggers your passive. I've just tried it on jungle lee where I build it after wriggles and boots, it really speeds up clearing and the vamp from aoe damage is significant. Dunno if it could work in the other lanes, would be nice to read if other players have tried it with or without success.
I can't see such an offensive build working on the jungle, not enuf gold and exp. On solo lanes maybe, though what makes that better than BC?
Good question, after thinking about it I would say that tiamat:
Increase's your ability to push lanes and farm jungle quickly
Is cheaper by 700g
Gives the same amount of AD as BC but sooner
Provides amazing sustain when using the active and Iron Will
Although having considered these points I do think that BC is superior since the passive is amazing and provides better single target dps (even in its nerfed state).
Despite this I think a tiamat build is still worth exploring, it seems more suited for mid where you want to clear the lane fast to roam or clear wraiths/wolves.
As for being too offensive a jungle build I do think that rushing hydra is too much (1200g more for the full item), so ill stop doing that and build more ruby crystals haha.
On December 15 2012 03:45 Kaldr wrote: Good question, after thinking about it I would say that tiamat:
Increase's your ability to push lanes and farm jungle quickly
Is cheaper by 700g
Gives the same amount of AD as BC but sooner
Provides amazing sustain when using the active and Iron Will
Although having considered these points I do think that BC is superior since the passive is amazing and provides better single target dps (even in its nerfed state).
Despite this I think a tiamat build is still worth exploring, it seems more suited for mid where you want to clear the lane fast to roam or clear wraiths/wolves.
As for being too offensive a jungle build I do think that rushing hydra is too much (1200g more for the full item), so ill stop doing that and build more ruby crystals haha.
i can't even afford a wriggles on lee in the new jungle, kinda blows my mind people buy stuff afterward =]
On December 14 2012 08:39 Kaldr wrote: So tiamat/hydra on lee is really good, when you use the active it resets your attack animation and triggers your passive. I've just tried it on jungle lee where I build it after wriggles and boots, it really speeds up clearing and the vamp from aoe damage is significant. Dunno if it could work in the other lanes, would be nice to read if other players have tried it with or without success.
I can't see such an offensive build working on the jungle, not enuf gold and exp. On solo lanes maybe, though what makes that better than BC?
I've been trying out with a bit of success just going Boots>Wriggles>Aegis>LW>More Tankiness
Though I always feel really, really starved in the jungle if i'm not able to make alot of kills happen.
On December 17 2012 09:16 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote: wriggles is trash now, just keep madreds razor until lategame
meh. I still get wriggles. Free ward is always useful and the sustain isn't bad either. Even after dragon buff wriggles lets you attempt dragon pretty early very safely.
On December 17 2012 13:53 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote: i'll get it if i go back with 900 but the raised price on vamp is a huge bitch
yea, but the total cost of wriggles is the same since madreds has been reduced in price.
good point, but i'm really comfortable with getting razor+2ward+2-3pot first back and warding top, keeping the other for wardjump
it just feels really hard for me to get the 800 for a vamp scepter after that considering i still need boots and some survivability (ruby crystal for BC/aegis)
cost of wriggles may be the same but it feels way different in practice.
madreds in s2 gave you a decent amount of pvp damage for the cost along with some armor (also good for pvp). the current madreds gives you no pvp damage. furthermore, wriggles was a very cost effective upgrade from madreds which continued to give you more damage along with that ward which is great for lee sin who can use them for movement as well as sight.
madreds gives you no additional pvp damage now, you are further costwise from finishing the wriggles, and the pvp damage increase to go further is not much of a value. and as for the free ward, a sightstone is a much better deal.
i dont get it. alot of people say wriggles is better now and alot of people say its crap now. I find the fact that madreds is cheaper awesome. I allways found madreds rush on lee sin to be a strong opening.
Are AD reds still better than AS? I feel like the clearing difference from AS reds might be better than the AD now in S3, but I'm really not sure. I keep going back and forth.
On January 04 2013 04:54 upperbound wrote: Question for fellow jungle lee sins:
Are AD reds still better than AS? I feel like the clearing difference from AS reds might be better than the AD now in S3, but I'm really not sure. I keep going back and forth.
Lee's skills scale with AD, and I feel like the clear differences between AS and AD reds aren't really enough to justify having less oomph for ganks.
Safeguard no longer refunds energy when broken down from half refunded if broken. Iron Will's Life Steal and Spell Vamp increased to 5/10/15/20/25% from 5/9/13/17/21% Iron Will no longer grants bonus armor down from 10/15/20/25/30 armor.
On January 04 2013 11:57 Decypher wrote: I have bad news guys. Lee Sin Nerfs:
Safeguard no longer refunds energy when broken down from half refunded if broken. Iron Will's Life Steal and Spell Vamp increased to 5/10/15/20/25% from 5/9/13/17/21% Iron Will no longer grants bonus armor down from 10/15/20/25/30 armor.
Do you guys think this will impact Lee Sin?
Cripple nerfed at earlier levels as well but still gets to a max of 60%. Although these are just PBE patch notes so who knows if they'll go live. Still he'll be a very strong jungler, his ganks are amazing, his dueling will still be strong and his mobility is one of the best.
When do you guys like to get your first real damage item on lee when you're jungling and you don't snowball? Often times I just get stuck rushing all the giant belt items (frozen hammer>randuins>sunfire>warmogs) because I just seem to die trying to peel or chase their adc away.
So I noticed that inSec was maxing Q the past two times I've seen him run Lee - I know most people are maxing E now because of the increased slow etc..is there any reason he's maxing Q instead?
Well, Q was the original skill to max - it decreases the cooldown, and also gives the most damage per skill point. I'm wondering if they only pick lee if they feel they don't need the jungler to carry a lot of non-ulti CC? Maybe InSec is more confident in his ability land Q?
I have always been maxing Q. Lee Sin is all about the base huge early game damage he gets, it also lets you counter jungle more safely.
I don't max E first unless I really need the attack speed reduction because there is a super fed jax/vayne whatever. I never cared for movement speed slow part of cripple (or mallet). Lee Sin is one of the most mobile champ of the game, why would you need a slow that badly?
Lee Sin is still one of the most versatile champ so I sometimes max E, or even W depending on what's happening.
EPT
