On February 11 2012 05:19 Terranasaur wrote: I tried the no damage tank only route before and I didn't like it. If it works for you Shikyo, good for you. But it isn't for me.
I think gunblade is the best start for him. Having the sustain, the burst, and the active are just all so crucial.
I agree that his build is very flexible. Gunblade is the one item I always want the most. I find myself most often going for Gunblade, then Mallet, Rageblade, GA, and then Atmas or Tri-Force.
For jungle I start boots3, get a wriggles and a sheen and then some tanky stuff but I don't think I've ever build FH on him. I don't really think I need the mana that bad. I've never really thought about it.
Smash, if you want to try him toplane, I recommend the Dyrus 0/29/1 build. You can pretty much shrug off anyone and farm safely, and once you get some items Jax is still a beast. I'd actually really like to see you play him. His dunks are pretty special.
I'm still up in the air about Wriggles, even in the jungle. He can do very well without it, just going Cutlass for lifesteal instead, but I miss having the ward. I don't feel the proc is that big of a loss for him considering how high his damage already is (though I suppose it does make him a massive Dragon threat if you have it).
I don't know. I kind of want it, but I don't know if I can justify going 1600g into an item that I don't need, per se.
On February 11 2012 05:19 Terranasaur wrote: I tried the no damage tank only route before and I didn't like it. If it works for you Shikyo, good for you. But it isn't for me.
I think gunblade is the best start for him. Having the sustain, the burst, and the active are just all so crucial.
I agree that his build is very flexible. Gunblade is the one item I always want the most. I find myself most often going for Gunblade, then Mallet, Rageblade, GA, and then Atmas or Tri-Force.
For jungle I start boots3, get a wriggles and a sheen and then some tanky stuff but I don't think I've ever build FH on him. I don't really think I need the mana that bad. I've never really thought about it.
Smash, if you want to try him toplane, I recommend the Dyrus 0/29/1 build. You can pretty much shrug off anyone and farm safely, and once you get some items Jax is still a beast. I'd actually really like to see you play him. His dunks are pretty special.
0/29/1 is stupid, regardless of everything.
And na, I've tried jax and he doesn't work for me. Wukong dunks are my newest flavor. Only good Jax dunk I've ever seen was this one:
On February 11 2012 05:19 Terranasaur wrote: I tried the no damage tank only route before and I didn't like it. If it works for you Shikyo, good for you. But it isn't for me.
I think gunblade is the best start for him. Having the sustain, the burst, and the active are just all so crucial.
I agree that his build is very flexible. Gunblade is the one item I always want the most. I find myself most often going for Gunblade, then Mallet, Rageblade, GA, and then Atmas or Tri-Force.
For jungle I start boots3, get a wriggles and a sheen and then some tanky stuff but I don't think I've ever build FH on him. I don't really think I need the mana that bad. I've never really thought about it.
Smash, if you want to try him toplane, I recommend the Dyrus 0/29/1 build. You can pretty much shrug off anyone and farm safely, and once you get some items Jax is still a beast. I'd actually really like to see you play him. His dunks are pretty special.
I'm still up in the air about Wriggles, even in the jungle. He can do very well without it, just going Cutlass for lifesteal instead, but I miss having the ward. I don't feel the proc is that big of a loss for him considering how high his damage already is (though I suppose it does make him a massive Dragon threat if you have it).
I don't know. I kind of want it, but I don't know if I can justify going 1600g into an item that I don't need, per se.
My feelings EXACTLY. If I get off a couple early ganks I just build the scepter into a gunblade and forget about wriggles. But again, miss the ward, miss the proc on Dragon. Clearly camps with Jax is easy and fast with anything, but the Wriggle Proc scales with your passive and feels great on Dragon and Baron.
I ran him with my Attack Speed rune page and went Wriggles, TriForce, Wits out of the jungle and it felt pretty strong.
I certainly haven't been able to thoroughly explore him yet.
On February 11 2012 05:19 Terranasaur wrote: I tried the no damage tank only route before and I didn't like it. If it works for you Shikyo, good for you. But it isn't for me.
I think gunblade is the best start for him. Having the sustain, the burst, and the active are just all so crucial.
I agree that his build is very flexible. Gunblade is the one item I always want the most. I find myself most often going for Gunblade, then Mallet, Rageblade, GA, and then Atmas or Tri-Force.
For jungle I start boots3, get a wriggles and a sheen and then some tanky stuff but I don't think I've ever build FH on him. I don't really think I need the mana that bad. I've never really thought about it.
Smash, if you want to try him toplane, I recommend the Dyrus 0/29/1 build. You can pretty much shrug off anyone and farm safely, and once you get some items Jax is still a beast. I'd actually really like to see you play him. His dunks are pretty special.
I'm still up in the air about Wriggles, even in the jungle. He can do very well without it, just going Cutlass for lifesteal instead, but I miss having the ward. I don't feel the proc is that big of a loss for him considering how high his damage already is (though I suppose it does make him a massive Dragon threat if you have it).
I don't know. I kind of want it, but I don't know if I can justify going 1600g into an item that I don't need, per se.
My feelings EXACTLY. If I get off a couple early ganks I just build the scepter into a gunblade and forget about wriggles. But again, miss the ward, miss the proc on Dragon. Clearly camps with Jax is easy and fast with anything, but the Wriggle Proc scales with your passive and feels great on Dragon and Baron.
I ran him with my Attack Speed rune page and went Wriggles, TriForce, Wits out of the jungle and it felt pretty strong.
I certainly haven't been able to thoroughly explore him yet.
That's the issue everyone's having, lol. Thoroughly exploring his options is absurd because his options are basically "yes". Whenever I get to play him, I just start Boots or Scepter in jungle and just build whatever the hell my team needs/wants.
On February 11 2012 06:02 Terranasaur wrote: do you start red or blue?
Blue, with it you can just tear through the jungle with no remorse. I haven't considered Red, maybe I'd do it if I really wanted a level 2 gank, but even then your ganking is fine without Red thanks to your high damage and stun. I've more or less been starting at Blue or Wolves depending on how helpful my team is at leashing. I'll start with W if the leash is good, E if not.
I've been playing a lot of jax top in the past few days. I'm a little suspicious about the fact I'm destroying my lane by just facerolling. His W is so strong in early trades it's a little ridiculous.
I stopped trying to build gunblade or wriggles or triforce and that's helped a lot, I'm now going 9/21/0 and ap/magic pen runes. It's a matter of finding a build that doesn't nosedive in teamfight power as the game goes on, I've been slowly iterating until I find something I like. Right now I'm going wota rylais with a dring or maybe a shield. Last game I picked up a rageblade as my third item and that felt a lot better than anything else I've tried.
I've kept playing him. He is basically all I play top now and I play top whenever it's open so I'm getting some practice. He's such a hard hero to figure out, I think I'm finally getting close to the right setup though.
Saw a dyrus game on Jax and he's still maxing Q first. I tried it for a day and it just wasn't as good, maxing empower is so much stronger. I don't think dyrus is a jax expert anymore since the hero is so different now and he doesn't like playing the remake.
Currently my build is like 9/21/0 with armor pen in offense, flat ad marks and quints, armor yellows, flat mr blues, usually I get a wriggles, treads and a dblade before starting any major items. I was going rageblade into warmogs for quite some games but I keep coming back to rylais, and wits is just a much better item than rageblade. My 'cookie cutter' right now is wriggles mercs 1-2 dblades wit's end rylais atmas.
Every single game I've built gunblade I've regretted it, even if I got fed and was carrying despite building it.
On March 16 2012 18:27 UniversalSnip wrote: I've kept playing him. He is basically all I play top now and I play top whenever it's open so I'm getting some practice. He's such a hard hero to figure out, I think I'm finally getting close to the right setup though.
Saw a dyrus game on Jax and he's still maxing Q first. I tried it for a day and it just wasn't as good, maxing empower is so much stronger. I don't think dyrus is a jax expert anymore since the hero is so different now and he doesn't like playing the remake.
Currently my build is like 9/21/0 with armor pen in offense, flat ad marks and quints, armor yellows, flat mr blues, usually I get a wriggles, treads and a dblade before starting any major items. I was going rageblade into warmogs for quite some games but I keep coming back to rylais, and wits is just a much better item than rageblade. My 'cookie cutter' right now is wriggles mercs 1-2 dblades wit's end rylais atmas.
Every single game I've built gunblade I've regretted it, even if I got fed and was carrying despite building it.
What would you get as a sixth item if it goes that far? Probably not that relevant since they're changing him again so we will have to adapt once again, but I'm just interested.
GA, fon, banshee's, zeal ---> triforce or phantom dancer, it's pretty much up in the air. After you finish whatever your sixth item is eventually you would sell wriggles for gunblade. I've never actually gotten that far though because you should be triple potting well before that point and it's expensive.
None of this matters now, it kinda looks like they're gonna screw his ult.
I actually liked the idea of where they were going with Jax's new ult. It fits the original theme of the champ much better. Would be nice if it was something more interesting, but I thought the defensive steroids scaling off of offensive stats was kinda cool.
That being said, the numbers are retardedly low imo. Terrible scaling and way too long a cooldown. I know it isn't good to compare single abilities in general, but to me this is the single worst steroid/stat boosting ult in the game (compared to the likes of nasus, renekton, trynd, alistar, singed, etc.). Going off of theorycraft atm since I am still patching.
Edit: Forgot about the passive portion of his ult. Still think the numbers are too low on the active.
Played Jax a few times since the change. I still build him almost exactly the same. 9/21/0 masteries, ArPen marks, Flat AD quints, flat armour seals, and Mr/lvl or flat MR glyphs.
Wriggles -> Rageblade -> Frozen Mallet or Warmogs -> Atma's -> Black Cleaver or Last Whisper or MR item (FoN, Abyssal)
I could see replacing the BC with the new super Hexdrinker.
If I am against an AP in lane, I get 2 Dorans and an early Vamp scepter to later upgrade into Gunblade. I wouldn't get Frozen Mallet anymore ofc.
While the defensive steroid is pretty strong, building more glass cannon than I am is just not going to be viable. 8s is a short amount of time against a lot of team comps, and building glass cannon is going to get you rolled in lane.
Skill order is start Q and get 1 pt in E at level 3, otherwise R > W > Q > E
So far I've been doing about the same with Jax as before the patch, so I'm not sure how much of a nerf the ultimate change was.
Just wanted to contribute a little to the discussion about one of my favorite champs.
Recently i've been pretty successful with a Wriggles start into a fast Sheen before Atmogs. 2 autoattacks on creeps followed by q to enemy + w + sheen proc (including third strike of his ultimate's passive) results in a pretty neat burst. Follow up with counterstrike and get out or stay if you want to trade. The additional AP on the sheen helps with the empowers and leap strike aswell.
So my typical build looks like this: Wriggles - Sheen - Warmogs - Atmas
As I lack some form of slow to stick on the enemies, I get a rylais most of the games. I like the emphasis on the AP side of Jax, feels a little more like his old version before the remake. At last, I either finish Triforce or get a FoN or even an Abyssal Scepter for some additional AP combined with enough MR to survive.
His new ulti seems ok, you can initiate to a certain extent without getting instagibbed. I don't even miss the AP/AD, cause hands down, Jax still does a shitton of damage when he's decently farmed. You have to build tanky nevertheless.
Im running standard 9/21/0 bruiser masteries with AD reds, flat armor yellows, MR/lvl blues and flat HP reg quints.
I'm hangin around 1600~ elo on EU West, just to give you an impression of my laning enemies. I honestly don't know if Jax can still be viable in High Elo, but at my level, he can carry games if you make it through early game with decent farm.
I like the idea of sheen. With your damage being ridiculous no longer, it will likely be better to build full tank with sheen and be the first guy into the fight. Possibly upgrade sheen into triforce, but I wouldnt do it fast.
With the lifesteal nerfs, perhaps you can go sheen -> tank without any lifesteal whatsoever, even foregoing lifesteal quintessences and masteries. Definately something worth trying.
I'm thinking you could play him like the pre-many nerfs irelia, except worse.
EPT
