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HereAndNow
United States185 Posts
On October 18 2011 01:24 Navi wrote: clearly 21 utility and flash mastery are overrated Don't most Ez players go 21-0-9? Like, all of them? And I never E into a fight, that's suicide. Only E towards an enemy if you're chasing for a kill, otherwise save it for escape. Even at low levels and during a gank against me, I've never not had it up when I needed it. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
On October 18 2011 01:24 Navi wrote: then you're doing it wrong ezreal doesn't e into 5 people and get instagibbed and boom 6 second fight he kites and pokes and shit and chases when needed and that can last for minutes at a time i'd rather have an escape up even when "more than i need it to be" than have it not up when i need it like wtf doesn't the same go for flash clearly 21 utility and flash mastery are overrated I don't play Ezreal and like I said, I'm still going to be maxing E > W the few times I do play him. That said, I think there's a little too much stock on how good maxing E is. W is another poke to itself and having high levels of it, while making you less mobile, will increase the amount of damage you actually do since you can't rely on E for damage on the right target, a majority of the time. Don't people leave valkyrie on corki till last as well? | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 18 2011 01:32 HereAndNow wrote: Don't most Ez players go 21-0-9? Like, all of them? And I never E into a fight, that's suicide. Only E towards an enemy if you're chasing for a kill, otherwise save it for escape. Even at low levels and during a gank against me, I've never not had it up when I needed it. I believe Chauster goes 15-0-15. On October 18 2011 01:42 Juicyfruit wrote: Don't people leave valkyrie on corki till last as well? Yes, but that's because the scaling on Gatling Gun's armor shred is retardedly good. 1st rank is 1 shred per tick for 3 seconds. 5th rank is 5 shred per tick for 5 seconds. When the attack speed debuff on Essence Flux is 5 times better at rank 5 than rank 1, then we'll talk. | ||
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ArC_man
United States2798 Posts
On October 18 2011 01:24 Navi wrote: then you're doing it wrong ezreal doesn't e into 5 people and get instagibbed and boom 6 second fight he kites and pokes and shit and chases when needed and that can last for minutes at a time i'd rather have an escape up even when "more than i need it to be" than have it not up when i need it like wtf doesn't the same go for flash clearly 21 utility and flash mastery are overrated You go utility spec on Ez? I don't find that I need to E or Flash so much to warrant going full on utility. In a normal teamfight at most I'm using 2 E's along with my Flash/Exhaust. There are fewer and fewer champs that can actually be kited. BTW I saw the discussion on CDR earlier. CDR isn't capped with Bruta/Boots/Masteries+Elixer if you're going offensive spec (38%), you need 2-3 CDR runes (3 flats or 2 per level) if you really want that 40%. | ||
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Navi
5286 Posts
making that comparison is just silly, if w was a aoe armor shred (or even single target) that was %ad, im sure people would max it on ezreal as well you don't always max jump skills, but if there are no better alternatives and the nuke is really significant in 1v1 or 2v2 skirmishes (especially on a person whose 1v1 ability is very strong during the levels he is maxing e due to the way mystic shot works) y not that 21 util and flash mastery are just examples of getting cdr on flash, not to ezreal in particular u can play him however u want, im done arguing about this cuz everything is extremely doable and up to playstyle but the playstyle you have to adopt to cast a spell that has 2x mystic shot's mana cost at all ranks and does less damage if you don't rune for it is weird | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
- At low ranks, it does little to no damage unless you go that hybrid/rush TF build. Then it does... minimal but alright damage. - The ASpd debuff/buff is pretty noticeable when dropping towers with teammates and when vsing auto champions. - By playing smart, I never really feel like I'm screwed with the longer E CD. You can't really play as aggressively mid game and stupid over extend, but you're still strong. - The mana use is kinda large, but again, if you do focus on W, you'll probably be TF rushing and getting Sheen for that little extra mana, so it's not a huge deal. - Even by not leveling it and it only doing a minimal amount of damage, it actually gives you good lane control, psychologically. Once your opponents realize that they're not safe just standing behind the creep wave, they're more cautious about approaching you or going in for last hits. It doesn't really phase Caits, but Vayne, Kog, and Ashe all think twice about hanging around when you can poke them with no real repercussion. As a random note, I just started noticing that Ezreal is one of very few champions who gets use out of EVERY stat on Trinity. I never realized how amazing this thing was on him, my new favorite build. | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
I've been toying with a low-cost ez build which gets a lot of the cheaper items as opposed to going straight for a big one like BT or IE. rageblade/brutaliser/sheen/malady for example. I dunno how viable it is, but it feels a lot stronger midgame and only becomes a problem in really long games when you want to sell off the brutaliser and malady for bigger items (you build sheen into TF obv) That said, nothing wrong with either straight brutaliser or straight sheen openings. | ||
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Ente
Germany1795 Posts
It scales with AD which your build doesnt give much (just brutalizer a lil bit) | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
I still don't think Guinsoo's is a great item. You don't really need the AS passive on it, as you'll get AS from Trinity as well as your passive. The stats on it are great, but if you're going to go for an item that expensive, you want more from it. Just AD and AP won't make up for the fact that BT will give more AD and overall damage, and even Gunblade will probably be more useful because it provides that sustain that Ez overall lacks. I really don't think Hybrid items are amazing on him in general. TF only is because of all the amazing things it brings outside of just damage: two awesome procs, health, mana, AS, move speed. If you're looking for just a damage item, BT, IE, and LW are better than Rageblade. | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
that all said, since you build your brut and rageblade first, you aren't wearing a vanilla sheen for that early game where it helps you dominate with poke so much. it's as much there to give you some extra mana to sustain mid game as for the proc and to build into TF asap. | ||
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Ente
Germany1795 Posts
http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Sheen | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
Unique: On cast, for 10 seconds, your next standard attack deals extra damage equal to 100% of your base attack damage. 2 second cooldown. I get it because I rush to TF. If I'm going full AD (see our discussion a few pages back), it's not a good item, Bruta outdoes it. Rageblade isn't a terrible item, it just lacks compared to most others. I play hybrid midgame with TF because TF brings a lot of utility, but full hybrid Ez doesn't bring as much damage as full AD Ez. You're sacrificing super-powerful Q and amazing autos for a stronger W (which doesn't scale as hard as Q) and E (which you're not going to use for damage unless you're chasing, at which point it's damage doesn't really matter anyway). | ||
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HereAndNow
United States185 Posts
so was this the only build being used at IEM? I didn't see all the games, wondering if Bruta > BT builds are still viable. | ||
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AwayFromLife
United States441 Posts
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ArC_man
United States2798 Posts
On October 21 2011 02:49 AwayFromLife wrote: Honestly, just play Graves now. He's essentially the same thing, but much, much better. Didn't know Graves had a 4 second CD poke that has 1000 range and only costs 50 mana. | ||
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AwayFromLife
United States441 Posts
On October 21 2011 03:07 ArC_man wrote: Didn't know Graves had a 4 second CD poke that has 1000 range and only costs 50 mana. Who needs it when you have a 450 range dash and 750 range cone of fuck everything? Graves' Q doesn't get blocked by minions and demolishes, Ezreal's Q gets blocked half the time (or more), is easier to dodge, and is single target only. Graves has a great utility spell rather than Ez's W that does little damage and eats all the mana. Ezreal's E is only slightly longer, cooldown only affected by Q. Graves' is reduced by autos and gives, essentially, Trist's Q buff that synergizes with itself to lower it's own CD faster. Ults are too different to compare. Both are good, Ez's hits harder and is global, Graves' is easier to land and shorter base CD. Graves' passive makes him tanky, which you need as a ranged dps. The only thing Ez has on him is range, which isn't that strong anymore with every single champ having a gap closer. | ||
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ArC_man
United States2798 Posts
On October 21 2011 03:20 AwayFromLife wrote: Who needs it when you have a 450 range dash and 750 range cone of fuck everything? Graves' Q doesn't get blocked by minions and demolishes, Ezreal's Q gets blocked half the time (or more), is easier to dodge, and is single target only. Graves has a great utility spell rather than Ez's W that does little damage and eats all the mana. Ezreal's E is only slightly longer, cooldown only affected by Q. Graves' is reduced by autos and gives, essentially, Trist's Q buff that synergizes with itself to lower it's own CD faster. Ults are too different to compare. Both are good, Ez's hits harder and is global, Graves' is easier to land and shorter base CD. Graves' passive makes him tanky, which you need as a ranged dps. The only thing Ez has on him is range, which isn't that strong anymore with every single champ having a gap closer. lol I'm commenting at the fact you said Graves is "essentially the same thing, but much, much better". Then you just said that they really have nothing in common other than the fact that they're both AD carries. People play Ezreal because they like him, ever since the big Ez nerfs people have played Ez because they like the character. Don't try to dissuade people with inaccurate arguments (Graves isn't anything similar to Ez in playstyle). | ||
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AwayFromLife
United States441 Posts
On October 21 2011 03:34 ArC_man wrote: lol I'm commenting at the fact you said Graves is "essentially the same thing, but much, much better". Then you just said that they really have nothing in common other than the fact that they're both AD carries. People play Ezreal because they like him, ever since the big Ez nerfs people have played Ez because they like the character. Don't try to dissuade people with inaccurate arguments (Graves isn't anything similar to Ez in playstyle). They really are. They both have: - A ranged poke (Q/W and Q) - An attack speed steroid (passive and E) - A mobility spell that can be used as both escape and chase (E and E) - And AoE ult skillshot that hits really hard - Built in CDR reduction on at least one ability The only difference in their skillsets is that Ez has the mostly useless attack speed debuff/buff from W and Graves gets Smokescreen, which is fucking awesome. Ez's Q and W are basically just rolled into Graves' Q for a skillshot that deals a fuckton of damage and goes through targets. They both have playstyles that reward the player for spamming and using autos, and they both have skillshot abilities for burst. The actual differences are rather minor, and heavily in Graves' favor. | ||
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
On October 21 2011 03:20 AwayFromLife wrote: Who needs it when you have a 450 range dash and 750 range cone of fuck everything? Graves' Q doesn't get blocked by minions and demolishes, Ezreal's Q gets blocked half the time (or more), is easier to dodge, and is single target only. Graves has a great utility spell rather than Ez's W that does little damage and eats all the mana. Ezreal's E is only slightly longer, cooldown only affected by Q. Graves' is reduced by autos and gives, essentially, Trist's Q buff that synergizes with itself to lower it's own CD faster. Ults are too different to compare. Both are good, Ez's hits harder and is global, Graves' is easier to land and shorter base CD. Graves' passive makes him tanky, which you need as a ranged dps. The only thing Ez has on him is range, which isn't that strong anymore with every single champ having a gap closer. OLAF DOESN'T | ||
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