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On October 12 2011 23:40 dignity wrote:
Just a question, does the mana from sheen mean nothing in its consideration as a viable opening? You won't have a soraka every game in lane with you.
If the item doesn`t provide enough benefit, then you can't justify sheen on the basis of mana alone. On top of proper mana conservation, 250 extra mana is not much of a deal breaker either way, as that amounts to little more than 2 mana potions per base trip and what sheen lacks over brutalizer opening is too severe to make it reasonable.
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Not to bring the discussion back, but I read a new featured guide on Solomid that doesn't recommend the Brutalizer, but rather DBlade, Boots, Wriggles, Sheen into late game items. It's been getting a lot of hits. Is it just because Wriggles is the new hotness for laning and doesn't leave a lot of money for Brutalizer?
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Wriggle solves a lot of ezreal's farming issues, so I'm not surprised it's been getting a lot of hits. It's also the best lifesteal item that isn't bloodthister and ezreal generally likes the stats.
I don't really know. I think wriggles is always a viable but situation item on any AD carry, depending on how much armor you'll need. If the enemy team has several AD sources including assassins, then wriggle probably not a bad idea to avoid being insta-gibbed by talon's AoE, for instance.
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You went on, before, about the benefits and strengths of Brutalizer as an aggressive item. So do you think Wriggles is the alternative for needing defensiveness in the early game?
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I think it's more match up dependant. If you're up against a team with a physical jungler, and laning against a hard physical damage champ starting clothe and 5 pots will give you a ton of time to farm before making that first trip back. If on that first trip back you think you're going to need wriggles get it if you're winning the lane feel free to go brutalizer and sheen.
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On October 13 2011 23:15 HereAndNow wrote:
You went on, before, about the benefits and strengths of Brutalizer as an aggressive item. So do you think Wriggles is the alternative for needing defensiveness in the early game?
I think straight up, ezreal needs to cap his CDR one way oranother, and brutalizer + CDR boots are item that I can't see being skipped.
That said, wriggles will give ezreal the sustain he needs in laning and some semblance of pushing power, and it's almost never a bad item because the stats are huge and it makes taking objectives so much easier. The damage output is just less than brut and I think if you take wriggles first, then you'll have to find another way of getting that last bit of CDR
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Forgive me if I'm wrong (didn't feel like doing a bunch of math myself >.<), but I think that even with CDRboots and Brutalizer, you're not CDR capped. Don't you need blue buff for full 40% cap? And in that vein, won't blue give you cap even without Brutalizer?
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CDR boots + bruta + blue elixir + masteries is capped CDR.
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Ah, I always forget about the elixirs 
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Alright, I'm enough of an adult to admit when I'm wrong. Brutalizer opening is amazing when you play aggressive in lane. Going 2-0 in lane FB with first tower kill. Feels good man.
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...And having said that, I just watched Fnatic Lamia go DBlade > Sheen and dominate in IEM. I guess both work if you play right?
Edit:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on.
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On October 17 2011 15:13 Requizen wrote:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on.
Is that a viable build for normal games? Watching him max W over E and just be super aggressive with Trinity seemed pretty cool.
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United States47024 Posts
On October 17 2011 15:13 Requizen wrote:
...And having said that, I just watched Fnatic Lamia go DBlade > Sheen and dominate in IEM. I guess both work if you play right?
Edit:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on.
Personally, Lamia's AD play has never impressed me hugely. You'd have to do a lot of convincing to make me believe that fnatic's success was held up by Lamia's AD play and not xPeke/Shushei/Mellisan's stellar performances.
On October 17 2011 23:52 HereAndNow wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 15:13 Requizen wrote:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on. Is that a viable build for normal games? Watching him max W over E and just be super aggressive with Trinity seemed pretty cool.
Max W over E seems wrong IMO. They gain the same damage per rank, E's CD scales while W's doesn't, and W's mana cost goes through the roof after a few ranks. Even if you're playing aggressive, it just seems better to max E (though having 1 rank W for passive stacks is always good).
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On October 17 2011 23:55 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 15:13 Requizen wrote:
...And having said that, I just watched Fnatic Lamia go DBlade > Sheen and dominate in IEM. I guess both work if you play right?
Edit:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on. Personally, Lamia's AD play has never impressed me hugely. You'd have to do a lot of convincing to make me believe that fnatic's success was held up by Lamia's AD play and not xPeke/Shushei/Mellisan's stellar performances.
I'm not saying it was all him, but going 11-0 in the finals of a major tournament and completely dominating your lane... not a small feat. He didn't win the game single handedly, but he contributed a lot.
Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 23:52 HereAndNow wrote:On October 17 2011 15:13 Requizen wrote:
Looking at it again, he rushed Triforce, so probably just because he went more of that hybrid route, also taking W pretty early on. Is that a viable build for normal games? Watching him max W over E and just be super aggressive with Trinity seemed pretty cool. Max W over E seems wrong IMO. They gain the same damage per rank, E's CD scales while W's doesn't, and W's mana cost goes through the roof after a few ranks. Even if you're playing aggressive, it just seems better to max E (though having 1 rank W for passive stacks is always good).
Yeah, I dunno if I'd max W over E... following most guides says to not even get one rank until 13 (when you can't get anything else), but I think getting it at 4, especially if you're going for this more hybrid build, might be nice.
That said, each rank adds an extra 50 damage and only 10 mana, which is pretty nice. Maybe not enough of a tradeoff for E's mobility, but I can maybe see some reasoning behind it if you really want to be able to trade pokes through minion waves.
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Well, common sense says you'd probably want to max E after Q. However, I think there's a good case for W > E as well.
E is strong, but it's not always reliable damage since you are using it for repositioning most of the time.
The buff/debuff from W is no joke. If you are getting trinity force, I can easily see why maxing W is stronger than E.
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maxing e almost halves your cd
maxing w only 2x's the effective aspd buff/nerf
half cd on a person with a flat cdr mechanic is godlay
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I agree about the damage, but I think it'd have to depend on lane opponent and general flow of the game, as that mobility that you get from E really saves you sometimes. 8 seconds off at max rank stacked with Q's CDR, it's quite nice for escaping.
I'll probably mess around with it a bunch. Like I said, it probably varies on a game-to-game basis.
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On October 18 2011 00:34 Navi wrote:
maxing e almost halves your cd
maxing w only 2x's the effective aspd buff/nerf
half cd on a person with a flat cdr mechanic is godlay
-shrug- you only need as many points in E as how often you need to actually blink though. I mean, I have never done anything other than maxing Q>E>W, and but I won't lie that I have found E can actually be up way more than you need it to be.
And to be fair, W's cooldown is innately always going to be lower than E's, even with max E, so in a way that synergizes with Ezreal's CDR mechanics just as well by keeping severa enemies permanently AS-debuffed the entire time while also dealing quite a lot of damage on top of that.
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That was my thought too. There are very few times that I thought that having E up 8 seconds earlier would save me, you rarely get to use it twice at max rank in a single fight as it is.
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then you're doing it wrong
ezreal doesn't e into 5 people and get instagibbed and boom 6 second fight
he kites and pokes and shit and chases when needed
and that can last for minutes at a time
i'd rather have an escape up even when "more than i need it to be" than have it not up when i need it
like wtf doesn't the same go for flash
clearly 21 utility and flash mastery are overrated
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EPT
