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seppolevne
Canada1681 Posts
What items and in what order, because I don't see him doing enough damage if I don't rush deathcap... Build: Cloth + 5 -> razor -> recurve bow -> Deathcap -> void staff -> madred's? Other options: DFG, Lichbane, Wit's End Some sort of AP build that can follow up with proc magic dmg later. My current theorycraft... Help please! | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On September 30 2011 01:22 seppolevne wrote: I suck balls as Master Yi, and yet he's my absolute favourite character, and as such I'm trying to develop an AP-ish jungle build, (though it requires farrrrrrrrmm T_T) help would be appreciated. (>1250) What items and in what order, because I don't see him doing enough damage if I don't rush deathcap... Build: Cloth + 5 -> razor -> recurve bow -> Deathcap -> void staff -> madred's? Other options: DFG, Lichbane, Wit's End Some sort of AP build that can follow up with proc magic dmg later. My current theorycraft... Help please! I've tried just about every kind of Yi at higher levels and I can tell you right now that if you're going to be succeeding with AP Yi it will be in situations where the opposing team falls behind early and you're really the only magic damage dealer on the team. If you really want to go AP Yi, jungling doesn't really work, which is one of the major issues with playing him AP. Your build is more or less fine, but it will always be hit or miss for you and generally won't be successful if you get to higher levels. Yi in general is just a rubbish champion, I haven't played in a while but unless they buffed him recently, he doesn't really fit into any line-up better than various other champions. I would basically pick Xin Zhao over him at any time. Meditate is an absolutely idiotic ability on him in it's current form, he's a melee assassin who relies on mobility to stay alive and has an ability that makes him stand still for no gains afterwards. It's major use is in-combat and even then it's super-duper-duper situational. I recommended reducing the duration to 3 seconds while keeping the heal the same, and having half the armor/magic reduction remain for 3 seconds after channeling, would give it some more use. Currently, he's just a very difficult hero to be successful with at high levels and a testament to the role redundancy and role superiority issue that exists within League of Legends for me. He can work well with a well put together team, but in every single situation you can think of, there's a champion who can do what he can do just as well, and is also better in other situations. Back to your question, you want to get a sheen early if you're going AP, I don't know why you'd want to go half and half which is why jungling with him as AP is kind of wonky. You want to get a single level of your wuju style to proc the sheen early on. You can have decent damage. Still not worth it in the end. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 30 2011 01:32 Mogwai wrote: why the fuck are you doing anything AP related from the jungle? whole point of AP Yi is that he can lane afaik. This. Pretty much the only thing that's any good about AP Yi is the fact that exerts quite a lot of pressure in lane, due to having free harass and a ton of sustain. | ||
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seppolevne
Canada1681 Posts
On September 30 2011 01:32 Mogwai wrote: why the fuck are you doing anything AP related from the jungle? whole point of AP Yi is that he can lane afaik. The "AP in the jungle" was because I'm usually jungling (not many jungle/ I prefer it)... Sort of a "make lemonade" kinda thing. On September 30 2011 01:40 Mordiford wrote: I've tried just about every kind of Yi at higher levels and I can tell you right now that if you're going to be succeeding with AP Yi it will be in situations where the opposing team falls behind early and you're really the only magic damage dealer on the team. If you really want to go AP Yi, jungling doesn't really work, which is one of the major issues with playing him AP. Your build is more or less fine, but it will always be hit or miss for you and generally won't be successful if you get to higher levels. Yi in general is just a rubbish champion, I haven't played in a while but unless they buffed him recently, he doesn't really fit into any line-up better than various other champions. I would basically pick Xin Zhao over him at any time. Meditate is an absolutely idiotic ability on him in it's current form, he's a melee assassin who relies on mobility to stay alive and has an ability that makes him stand still for no gains afterwards. It's major use is in-combat and even then it's super-duper-duper situational. I recommended reducing the duration to 3 seconds while keeping the heal the same, and having half the armor/magic reduction remain for 3 seconds after channeling, would give it some more use. Currently, he's just a very difficult hero to be successful with at high levels and a testament to the role redundancy and role superiority issue that exists within League of Legends for me. He can work well with a well put together team, but in every single situation you can think of, there's a champion who can do what he can do just as well, and is also better in other situations. Back to your question, you want to get a sheen early if you're going AP, I don't know why you'd want to go half and half which is why jungling with him as AP is kind of wonky. You want to get a single level of your wuju style to proc the sheen early on. You can have decent damage. Still not worth it in the end. Thanks ^^ I almost always choose Xin over him, for pretty much all your reasons. Thoughts on DFG-> Lichbane-> Deathcap? It would make him super bursty and maybe not so reliant on kill stealing to proc ult. | ||
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
I do want to try AP Yi + soraka bot lane sometime though... | ||
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Vei
United States2845 Posts
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GhostOwl
766 Posts
The only thing he's good at is mobility, high attack speed, and backdoor For one, he's incredibly squishy and has no CC whatsoever. He's the true definition of pubstomper...noobs who don't CC him or build armor will continue to get raped by Yi. Good players will shut down Yi as he isn't very hard to kill. I think Tyrn is a better champ for carrying and dishing out raw damage output...at least he has way more survivability. Noct is like a Yi plus a utility bag of tricks like fear, spell shield, darkness. I think Tyrn or Noct existing just makes playing Yi meaningless. | ||
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
On September 30 2011 07:06 Vei wrote: Is the guide still up-to-date? I'd like to learn how to not suck as jungle Yi. if anyone would be willing to teach me the ropes later on tonight, i'd really appreciate it. i learn quickly/take criticism well and would love to get good with a jungle character. (i'm also leaning towards buying noc~) Learn a different jungler. You'll thank yourself for it later on. Nocturne is like Yi version 2.0, he does everything Yi does, except better. The one thing Noc doesn't have is the alluring "OMG if I kill 1 guy, then my cooldowns reset, and I can kill the next guy, and the next and get a penta a win"... which doesn't really happen in practice. Much better ult for ganking on Noc, has built in CC, built in sustain. Either that or learn a jungle champ that doubles as a good top laner, like udyr. I hear Noc top lane also works though. Long story short, getting Yi instead of Nocturne is like buying an Iphone 3 in a shop for $400, and then going to the shop next door to see them selling an Iphone 4 for $300. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 30 2011 07:06 Vei wrote: Is the guide still up-to-date? I'd like to learn how to not suck as jungle Yi. if anyone would be willing to teach me the ropes later on tonight, i'd really appreciate it. i learn quickly/take criticism well and would love to get good with a jungle character. (i'm also leaning towards buying noc~) The guide is still generally correct. A few things I'd do differently/make note of: - Flash is probably better than Ghost after the Ghost nerfs - I'd run 25 armor pen instead of attack speed on reds/quints, but this is personal preference (25 armor pen is better for damage midgame, and IIRC saves you 1 autoattack on small wraiths at level 1--making wraith jacks faster and safer) - Triforce is one of the better 2nd damage items to get--some people even prefer it to GB as a first damage item (I used to do this) - Minigol start is by no means set in stone. Yi is a flexible jungler, so he can start at quite a few different camps, and is hard to track because alpha procs make him so unpredictable On September 30 2011 07:24 Dgiese wrote: Long story short, getting Yi instead of Nocturne is like buying an Iphone 3 in a shop for $400, and then going to the shop next door to see them selling an Iphone 4 for $300. How is that comparison remotely valid when Yi is 450 IP and Nocturne is 6300? Hell, if you're learning to jungle for the first time, why would you blow 6300 IP on a champ you've never played to do so? In fact, looking at the 450/1350 IP champs, I'd say that Yi is probably one of the better junglers to learn on--Nunu, Amumu, FIddle, and Warwick might be better junglers overall, but their gameplay is much less similar to common top-pick junglers like Lee Sin or Nocturne than Yi's. Not to mention, Yi's drop-off lategame requires you to be successful in the early-game; playing Yi forces you to gank/counterjungle successfully because you can't fall back on a strong lategame if you screw up or play too passively early game. Yi is by no means a good champion. But in the early phases of the game, his jungle control is very good, and there are a lot of things you can learn about jungling by playing Yi. For 450 IP, I'd say that he's a fun champ that's worth spending some time with. | ||
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Vei
United States2845 Posts
Thanks for the tips guys. | ||
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
On September 30 2011 07:25 TheYango wrote: The guide is still generally correct. A few things I'd do differently/make note of: - Flash is probably better than Ghost after the Ghost nerfs - I'd run 25 armor pen instead of attack speed on reds/quints, but this is personal preference (25 armor pen is better for damage midgame, and IIRC saves you 1 autoattack on small wraiths at level 1--making wraith jacks faster and safer) - Triforce is one of the better 2nd damage items to get--some people even prefer it to GB as a first damage item (I used to do this) - Minigol start is by no means set in stone. Yi is a flexible jungler, so he can start at quite a few different camps, and is hard to track because alpha procs make him so unpredictable How is that comparison remotely valid when Yi is 450 IP and Nocturne is 6300? Hell, if you're learning to jungle for the first time, why would you blow 6300 IP on a champ you've never played to do so? In fact, looking at the 450/1350 IP champs, I'd say that Yi is probably one of the better junglers to learn on--Nunu, Amumu, FIddle, and Warwick might be better junglers overall, but their gameplay is much less similar to common top-pick junglers like Lee Sin or Nocturne than Yi's. Not to mention, Yi's drop-off lategame requires you to be successful in the early-game; playing Yi forces you to gank/counterjungle successfully because you can't fall back on a strong lategame if you screw up or play too passively early game. Yi is by no means a good champion. But in the early phases of the game, his jungle control is very good, and there are a lot of things you can learn about jungling by playing Yi. For 450 IP, I'd say that he's a fun champ that's worth spending some time with. Didn't realise noc was 6300. Meh, I'm still of the opinion that even though there is such a large price difference buying Yi is essentially 450ip thrown away. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 01 2011 10:24 Dgiese wrote: Didn't realise noc was 6300. Meh, I'm still of the opinion that even though there is such a large price difference buying Yi is essentially 450ip thrown away. The vast majority of champs in the game are "ip thrown away" if you consider fun champs that aren't that good to be wasted IP. | ||
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crate
United States2474 Posts
Also no one bans Yi. | ||
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hubbathegrate
Sweden9 Posts
The only real way to avoid this is to either have him fed by the ennemy team, or them letting him freefarm early-on which can lead to him quickly becoming a huge threat. Yis main strength as I see him is that he is neigh un-catchable on ulti and/or ghost, and as such is a strong split-pusher and Backdooring hero and building a team that can defend or push on 4 can make him super-viable even if he didnt get fed if you want to go for a teamfight composition I think almost any other AD champion will serve you better, and I recomend learning Udyr/Lee-sin/noct/gangplank/olaf if you wantto play a mele AD carries which can snowball realy hard, they are allso a more versitle picks not only bringing CCs but allso allowing for tankier builds, which is especialy usefull if you allready have a ranged AD | ||
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
On October 01 2011 10:50 TheYango wrote: The vast majority of champs in the game are "ip thrown away" if you consider fun champs that aren't that good to be wasted IP. It's just my own perspective. When I play Yi I find myself thinking... why am I not just playing nocturne instead. That takes away from the fun I get from playing the character. I'm just a stickler for stuff like that. Same goes for other champs as well, I just don't get as much fun from playing a character that fills a certain role when there is another character that fulfills most of, if not all of that roles qualities better. I mean, Yi is still fun, and as I mentioned earlier i think an ap yi + soraka lane would be fun. But that's something for dicking around in normals... and TBH there are other champs much higher on my 'fun but not good' list than yi. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On October 01 2011 12:45 Dgiese wrote: It's just my own perspective. When I play Yi I find myself thinking... why am I not just playing nocturne instead. That takes away from the fun I get from playing the character. I'm just a stickler for stuff like that. Same goes for other champs as well, I just don't get as much fun from playing a character that fills a certain role when there is another character that fulfills most of, if not all of that roles qualities better. I mean, Yi is still fun, and as I mentioned earlier i think an ap yi + soraka lane would be fun. But that's something for dicking around in normals... and TBH there are other champs much higher on my 'fun but not good' list than yi. Don't worry, that doesn't make you a stickler, that's just bad design and balance and it's one of the reasons I started playing less and less of League of Legends until I basically stopped. Simply, because of the very generalized roles that are predetermined for champions you find that there are just some champions that fill those roles better than others, whether it be an extra escape mechanism, more damage output, more survivability. Since champions aren't built around individual niches, you may get stuck with a champion that you like, but ultimately isn't more useful than his peers in any specific situation. Master Yi is basically the poster-boy for this. | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
Never miss gap closer means ganking with Yi is pretty easy too. Plus if you ever find yourself in a pinch, just press R and run. Real fun. | ||
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RogerX
New Zealand3180 Posts
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crate
United States2474 Posts
On October 01 2011 18:35 RogerX wrote: Queuedodgethis did an amazing review of Master Yi, covered every aspect like they normally do. Without them, I wouldn't of known that master yi's blade turned blue o.o I was like wtf, because i played LoL on all low settings, put the effects to medium and it started turning blue, so cool. Does it turn blue when its E is charged? Because im not 100% sure, I always thought it turned blue when it was ready to do doublestrike. It turns blue when you activate E. | ||
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