EPT[Champion] Udyr - Page 47
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unjugon
Spain119 Posts
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Zess
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
On January 19 2013 03:03 unjugon wrote: Or a bit later you could have Warmog´s+Negatron and completely laugh at magic damage. HP regen is important in the same way Innervating Locket was important. HP regen IS important on Udyr. Innervating locket used to give your entire team the HP regen. It also provided mana regen. It also cost like nothing compared to Warmog's. Finally, when it was remade/nerfed around Sona patch, it still provided 50 hp over 2 seconds. In the midgame, you can expect to have an HP pool of around 2400-2600 with Warmog's which provides 14-15 hp over 2 seconds Locket provides HP regen too! Someone asked a bunch of pages ago, and unless I'm really bad at math Udyr's passive work on total resists rather than bonus resists which makes it almost as cool as Garen W. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On January 19 2013 03:19 xes wrote: Innervating locket used to give your entire team the HP regen. It also provided mana regen. It also cost like nothing compared to Warmog's. Finally, when it was remade/nerfed around Sona patch, it still provided 50 hp over 2 seconds. In the midgame, you can expect to have an HP pool of around 2400-2600 with Warmog's which provides 14-15 hp over 2 seconds Locket provides HP regen too! Someone asked a bunch of pages ago, and unless I'm really bad at math Udyr's passive work on total resists rather than bonus resists which makes it almost as cool as Garen W. I think this is a trap a lot of people fall into. They see that a kit works with something and they go overboard. Udyr has a shield: that mean's we should only build resists Rammus has armor: that mean's we should only build health No. You build what you need. Health in the mid game is more efficient than resists at giving you EHP or survivability and MR is better when a lot of people have magic pen. Udyr has a great shield but that doesn't mean Warmogs is that much worse. As a single item its still awesome. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23342 Posts
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
If your team complelty dumps on the other team and you can afford to buy 2 major items before the other team is a threat, by all means, build warmogs. hell, buy 2 cause the item is op right? | ||
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Eishi_Ki
Korea (South)1667 Posts
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
On February 10 2013 14:25 Eishi_Ki wrote: So what do we reckon for Diamond's runes then? Taking that lv3 Dragon must have meant no points in bear plus he picked up super fast Madred's in terms of items. AS Quints as well as AS Marks? No idea on his setup but I watched his jungle path very closely because I didn't trust the pick. He started wolves > blue, smited blue, went to wraiths then red then b. Upgraded his machete to wriggles, stayed to buy a mana pot (had 2 health pots remaining), walked to dragon pit, flashed over the wall, and snuck it. | ||
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obesechicken13
United States10467 Posts
On February 10 2013 14:35 Zdrastochye wrote: No idea on his setup but I watched his jungle path very closely because I didn't trust the pick. He started wolves > blue, smited blue, went to wraiths then red then b. Upgraded his machete to wriggles, stayed to buy a mana pot (had 2 health pots remaining), walked to dragon pit, flashed over the wall, and snuck it. Holy.. someone just did this in a pro game? I haven't seen the video but aspd marks make sense to me, and so does 2 points in turtle one in tiger. Level 3 madreds... to dragon. Wow. | ||
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Eishi_Ki
Korea (South)1667 Posts
On February 10 2013 14:44 obesechicken13 wrote: Holy.. someone just did this in a pro game? I haven't seen the video but aspd marks make sense to me, and so does 2 points in turtle one in tiger. Level 3 madreds... to dragon. Wow. He didn't go Tiger, it was definitely some combination of Turtle/Phoenix. I suspect 1/2 but it could have been 2/1 | ||
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Zooper31
United States5713 Posts
Champs I'd pick Udyr against: Nidalee, Lee, Irelia, Jax, Darius, Rumble, Tyrn. You can trade effectively against all those people and even outright ignore Nidalee/Rumble once you get a sceptor. Basically you become an unkillable wall in lane with maxed turtle stance and a VS. You can literally just auto creeps all day and people can't do dmg to you with their autos. Max tiger stance 2nd or first depending on the champ and if you're ahead or not. The burst from tiger stance is all front loaded and 3/4 of the people you fight are going to not realize how much dmg is actually does (and it's fucking magical dmg, they will build armor) and you will rip them a new one. Cloth + 5pots or Flask + ward + pots or Rejuv Beads + ward + pots. Usually cloth. If you started cloth thats going to be used to build a Tabi, if not you're going Merc for boots, maybe even swiftness if you srsly think you might need it. Tabi/Merc, Hydra, Warmogs, Zephyr (if you didn't get Merc, 3/4 times I get Tabi/Zephyr), Randuins, and TF/Mallet - for my end game build. Almost forgot about Visage, it's a must have item if you are going against a team with at least 2 AP carries. Swap out Zephyr for Visage since you will alrdy be getting Merc for the MR and Tenacity, also probably means getting TF over Mallet as you might want slightly more dmg and you are alrdy getting enough HP from Visage. Usually a sceptor rush with Tabi and rush into a Hydra. You have a ton of inate tankiness with max'd turtle stance and his passive which gives 12%+ Armor/MR so you just want some dmg. Phage and Warmogs are next and then into a Zephyr. If you're fed just rush right into Zephyr after Hydra. You should be chunking people for half their HP easy with a basic combo. (Bear stun, Tiger proc, auto, auto, Hydra proc, auto) so building tanky isn't even needed yet as you alrdy have godlike sustain. Hate Udyr jungle, feels so slow and the majority of junglers nowadays have better ganks. Don't see a reason to use him over Vi, Hecarim, Xin, Amumu, Olaf, etc. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23342 Posts
Udyr top isn't strictly worse than udyr jungle now because trinity is quite cheap again and ad costs got shaved down a bit which is alright for tiger. You probably should be going 2 dblades into locket/trinity or something. Tabi zephyr is probably not terrible but I dont see the point. Udyr doesn't really need more attack speed though it's not bad, trinity is definitely the better buy. You could always pick udyr top vs just about everything btw. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
On February 10 2013 14:35 Zdrastochye wrote: No idea on his setup but I watched his jungle path very closely because I didn't trust the pick. He started wolves > blue, smited blue, went to wraiths then red then b. Upgraded his machete to wriggles, stayed to buy a mana pot (had 2 health pots remaining), walked to dragon pit, flashed over the wall, and snuck it. Has anyone been able to replicate this, I haven't been able to in customs yet :\ | ||
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YouGotNothin
United States907 Posts
On February 10 2013 22:28 mordek wrote: Has anyone been able to replicate this, I haven't been able to in customs yet :\ I watched the game again, and he went 2 in turtle and 1 in phoenix. He also got a little bit of help from ez at the end of the drag, but I must say it looked like he would have done it by himself though since he had about 200 hp when finished. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
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Zooper31
United States5713 Posts
On February 10 2013 21:48 Slayer91 wrote: Why hydra? Udyr top isn't strictly worse than udyr jungle now because trinity is quite cheap again and ad costs got shaved down a bit which is alright for tiger. You probably should be going 2 dblades into locket/trinity or something. Tabi zephyr is probably not terrible but I dont see the point. Udyr doesn't really need more attack speed though it's not bad, trinity is definitely the better buy. You could always pick udyr top vs just about everything btw. Of course you cna pick him vs anything but I just found those champions to be easier than most. Loved Hydra for the wave clear/split push, massive amounts of lifesteal and adds some burst to his alrdy decent dmg. I'm not a fan of dblades unless I'm going adc bot, and then I only one early game. Might start getting TF earlier now because they basically took away the combine cost. | ||
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Thereisnosaurus
Australia1822 Posts
That said, phoenix is nowhere near as good as it used to be, tiger is definitely the go to stance for early jungling meaning you need to transition into phoenix a bit later. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23342 Posts
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unjugon
Spain119 Posts
- The item cost-efficiency is kinda through the roof after the buffs. You might not use the spell vamp to the extent a pure mage would use it, but you might not need to. - Udyr loves some mana regen early as well as cooldown reduction. The AP is ok. - Udyr is always in the fray but has no reliable burst; he normally wins by outlasting opponents. In other words, he is always making use of that spell vamp. - Smite a big minion or monster for 350+ heal in a pinch. Tell that to Soraka. Every 40-45 seconds. Now again, this isn´t impressive except for the fact that we are talking about Udyr, not your typical mage with 30 magic resist. - It´s funny when you think about it, but if you level tiger and phoenix early you need no damage items to be a threat! And since you get a bunch of free damage you are actually making use of the spell vamp! Not to mention you melt towers as well. - The improved damage to monsters coupled with early high level tiger and phoenix means you melt the jungle throughout the game with no damage items. - Leveling Tiger without damage items has always felt ineficient. However, with spell vamp making use of single target damage and high level phoenix making use of the attack speed buff, it feels much better. The build I have been using is something like: - 0/9/21 masteries, taking improved smite and lifesteal/spell vamp masteries. - Attack speed reds, spell vamp quints, armor yellows, magic resist/lvl blues. Spell vamp quints are probably not optimal, but we can do without move speed thanks to 21 points in utility masteries. Might try lifesteal quints. I suspect flat AD might be best. - Level Tiger to lvl 5 asap, 1 point in Bear, and level Turtle and Phoenix as you prefer. Good point here is that even 1-2 points in phoenix help you clear the jungle much faster due to the AoE on the small monsters. - Doran Blade start, because we can. I get 0 attack damage after this. Tiger/Phoenix/Tiger/Bear/Tiger/Turtle to start. You can start with Phoenix also. - Doran Blade, Spirit of the Spectral Wraith, Treads, Visage, Chain Vest as core for items. I am still thinking about the armor item. Iceborn or Frozen Heart would put us way above the cooldown reduction limit. I´d go for Randuin´s probably since we might need the slow. Note that the only way such a build could work is by using high level Tiger and Phoenix in tandem. - Since the build might leave you vulnerable to burst/stun (you are more of a lifestealing tank), I am testing Barrier as summoner. Probably not optimal and should not be used by new Udyr players, but it´s very fun. | ||
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Tommie
China658 Posts
If I am up against a lot of magic damage I tend to build Warmogs+Wit's end. If I'm up against heavy AD it's gonna be tabi Sunfire BT and then a Warmogs or a Randuins. My favourite lane is when I'm up against an AD champ with short range, and then I usually get a Sunfire cape, Merc/Tabi and BT+ Warmogs/Randuins. Against Magic damage I go Warmogs, Wit's end, Merc threads and Either a BT or a Randuins.I dont like building AS on Udyr since he already gets massive attack speed boosts from his Q and from his passive. If you don't build any damage but pure as you'll notice. The reason Wit's end works so well on Udyr is because with his attack speed boost you can proc the passive very often. Udyr has attack speed and Wit's end synergises with AS, not the other way around ( this is a mistake some people make ). I level Q first if I can go aggro but I prefer getting W, maybe a single point in Q if the opponent is getting too confident. I get my E before level 6, usually around 2/3 but I try to make sure that I have it when my jungler comes for a gank. Level 1 is when Udyr is very strong but he is so unbelievably predictable. If comes towards you just run, that's it. I prefer starting defensive and going really aggro when I have a big defensive item and at least basic boots and I can stance dance, which is around level 8-9 usually. Once you build a BT on top of that you can take on pretty much any champion in a straight up close range fight. In teamfights I tend to protect carries more than that I'm diving the enemies' carry, mostly because it's so easy to kite Udyr and he doesn't have any initiation. If anyone dives my carry he get stunned and gets a massive q proc on his ass. Only when that has been taken care of I go and look for whatever juicy meet I can find. Just run around, pop Randuins, stun them all and give them all a Q proc. I pick Udyr when I see: Nidalee Akali ( skill based lane but in teamfights it's nice ) Anything AD melee. Anything that begins with 'kat' and ends with 'arina' ( stun so much fun ) DONT PICK UDYR AGAINST: Teemo Vladimir Teemo Vladimir Teemo Vladimir | ||
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DrunkenOne
United States302 Posts
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