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[Champion] Veigar - Page 8

Forum Index > LoL Strategy
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Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
October 13 2011 02:00 GMT
#141
On October 13 2011 10:53 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2011 07:40 Slaughter wrote:

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that he needs ganks to sustain but I think if you put him bot with a good support that doesn't need farm he can still farm ap all day and be fine with sustain.


Veigar sucks bot don't do it. DON'T DO IT!!! He needs levels and 2 people zone him much easier than one, really doesn't matter who your support is.


Ha, I haven't played him in forever and he is a rare pick so *shrug* Is he really only viable mid then?
Never Knows Best.
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-13 02:26:52
October 13 2011 02:25 GMT
#142
To people saying Veigar can't lane mid properly without ganks i disagree, you just have to be really passive for the first few levels.

I like to go q w q e q r, only last hit with q until about halfway through level 4, staying way far back, and only going into range of the minions to last hit. This both lets you not have to worry about dieing but sometimes causes the other champion to become a bit over confident (mainly in soloq .)
As soon as i hit level 5 i try and hit them with 2-3 q's while staying way back when its on cd. this puts them at 2/3 or 1/2 health. Then as soon as i hit level 6 they either have to blue pill, giving me free farm for 20 seconds or so, or, if they stay a flash-e-q-r and ignite if neccesary will finnish them every time.
After the pill back you can just hit them with a few q's every time they come back and they either have to play super carefully or every time you hit them with two to three q's in a row they need to pill.
Jaso
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2147 Posts
October 13 2011 02:36 GMT
#143
I never understood why people said Veigar was really not viable o_o. I stopped playing him when I heard that, lol.

He has awesome damage output and an AOE stun, making ganks on him pretty tough.. And in the current meta of AP vs AP mid he's especially strong. Plus free AP for doing what you're supposed to be doing anyway which is farming.

I realize he's far from being a top AP carry, but IMO he's not that bad.
derp
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-13 02:45:09
October 13 2011 02:44 GMT
#144
On October 13 2011 11:25 killerdog wrote:
To people saying Veigar can't lane mid properly without ganks i disagree, you just have to be really passive for the first few levels.

I like to go q w q e q r, only last hit with q until about halfway through level 4, staying way far back, and only going into range of the minions to last hit. This both lets you not have to worry about dieing but sometimes causes the other champion to become a bit over confident (mainly in soloq .)
As soon as i hit level 5 i try and hit them with 2-3 q's while staying way back when its on cd. this puts them at 2/3 or 1/2 health. Then as soon as i hit level 6 they either have to blue pill, giving me free farm for 20 seconds or so, or, if they stay a flash-e-q-r and ignite if neccesary will finnish them every time.
After the pill back you can just hit them with a few q's every time they come back and they either have to play super carefully or every time you hit them with two to three q's in a row they need to pill.


If they see you took W level 2 they'll just gank you, you'll die without stun.

Also any good mid laner can still stomp you and zone you back so far that you'll lose exp and farm. It's hard to just "stay back and farm" if they play properly.

Veigar's range is too short and he can't trade hits with people who get close, that's why he's such a shitty laner.

The whole anti-AP thing sounds great on paper until you realize that without ganks, you -will- die horribly against anyone who knows wha they're doing.
TranslatorBaa!
Cosmology
Profile Joined September 2011
Canada360 Posts
October 13 2011 19:37 GMT
#145
On October 13 2011 11:44 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 13 2011 11:25 killerdog wrote:
To people saying Veigar can't lane mid properly without ganks i disagree, you just have to be really passive for the first few levels.

I like to go q w q e q r, only last hit with q until about halfway through level 4, staying way far back, and only going into range of the minions to last hit. This both lets you not have to worry about dieing but sometimes causes the other champion to become a bit over confident (mainly in soloq .)
As soon as i hit level 5 i try and hit them with 2-3 q's while staying way back when its on cd. this puts them at 2/3 or 1/2 health. Then as soon as i hit level 6 they either have to blue pill, giving me free farm for 20 seconds or so, or, if they stay a flash-e-q-r and ignite if neccesary will finnish them every time.
After the pill back you can just hit them with a few q's every time they come back and they either have to play super carefully or every time you hit them with two to three q's in a row they need to pill.


If they see you took W level 2 they'll just gank you, you'll die without stun.

Also any good mid laner can still stomp you and zone you back so far that you'll lose exp and farm. It's hard to just "stay back and farm" if they play properly.

Veigar's range is too short and he can't trade hits with people who get close, that's why he's such a shitty laner.

The whole anti-AP thing sounds great on paper until you realize that without ganks, you -will- die horribly against anyone who knows wha they're doing.

So, are you saying Veigar is a shitty champ and not viable? or that he needs a jungler to practically babysit him?
Somewhere, something amazing is waiting to be known.
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
October 13 2011 20:45 GMT
#146
Agreed 100% with Carnivorous Sheep. Veigar has a terrible early game laning phase and needs jungle support. Once he hits level 7ish though, he can dick on pretty much every hero.
Cosmology
Profile Joined September 2011
Canada360 Posts
October 13 2011 22:30 GMT
#147
On October 14 2011 05:45 APurpleCow wrote:
Agreed 100% with Carnivorous Sheep. Veigar has a terrible early game laning phase and needs jungle support. Once he hits level 7ish though, he can dick on pretty much every hero.

So is he viable?
Somewhere, something amazing is waiting to be known.
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
October 13 2011 23:01 GMT
#148
On October 14 2011 07:30 Cosmology wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 14 2011 05:45 APurpleCow wrote:
Agreed 100% with Carnivorous Sheep. Veigar has a terrible early game laning phase and needs jungle support. Once he hits level 7ish though, he can dick on pretty much every hero.

So is he viable?


I think he's one of the best AP carries right now.

...but his weakness is definitely his early laning.
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
October 13 2011 23:05 GMT
#149
I think he needs jungle baby sitting.
TranslatorBaa!
turdburgler
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
England6749 Posts
October 13 2011 23:13 GMT
#150
if you're being zoned as hard as you say he will be makes ganks easier x)


therefore veigar is op


obviously
Cosmology
Profile Joined September 2011
Canada360 Posts
October 14 2011 12:50 GMT
#151
So how can I play him with an unreliable Jungler in low ELOs?

Also, Carnivorous Sheep, what do you think of starting with a health regen thinger/2 faerie charms and going Philo Stone?

And maybe even going into Eleisa's Miracle?
Somewhere, something amazing is waiting to be known.
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
October 14 2011 20:51 GMT
#152
On October 14 2011 21:50 Cosmology wrote:
So how can I play him with an unreliable Jungler in low ELOs?

Also, Carnivorous Sheep, what do you think of starting with a health regen thinger/2 faerie charms and going Philo Stone?

And maybe even going into Eleisa's Miracle?


Veigar can still lane well against a lot of weaker laners early, and, again, once he hits level ~7 he has a HUGE dick. He's probably fine against most in low ELO.

Philo Stone is a pretty good item on him, I like to build it and two Rings early. Gives plenty of mana regen for Q spamming.
Wala.Revolution
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
7582 Posts
October 14 2011 21:23 GMT
#153
He doesn't need babysitting - because without your ult you have a low chance of killing enemy mid without huge dps from jungle I would actually rather have my jungle help top/bot or counterjungle. It's just that since mid is in center of the map your jungle just stops by every now and then and makes it easier for you. Play passive, you may miss some cs due to pressure but then get better at last hitting at tower.

However after you get blue with ult your kill potential goes up greatly. Most likely you won't even need the jungler's help - just e-q combo once and you're set for the kill.
Stuck.
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
October 15 2011 01:44 GMT
#154
On October 15 2011 06:23 Wala.Revolution wrote:
He doesn't need babysitting - because without your ult you have a low chance of killing enemy mid without huge dps from jungle I would actually rather have my jungle help top/bot or counterjungle. It's just that since mid is in center of the map your jungle just stops by every now and then and makes it easier for you. Play passive, you may miss some cs due to pressure but then get better at last hitting at tower.

However after you get blue with ult your kill potential goes up greatly. Most likely you won't even need the jungler's help - just e-q combo once and you're set for the kill.


I don't mean waste summoners or cooldowns or anything to try to get kills. Jungler just needs to walk by your lane every now and then and toss a skill at your lane opponent. Forces him to back off, you keep farming.
TranslatorBaa!
Juddas
Profile Joined January 2011
768 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-15 16:32:00
October 15 2011 03:07 GMT
#155
does anybody else not build R>Q>E>W?

The longer the E the more likely to land the W. EZ PZ

but I have a friend who goes R>Q>W>E and hes says it is much better
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-15 08:41:00
October 15 2011 08:08 GMT
#156
That's the standard build...
TranslatorBaa!
dignity
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada908 Posts
October 15 2011 08:56 GMT
#157
I always got 2 points in E and then go max out W. Never seemed to have trouble landing W with rank 2 E. Then again this is also situational depending on how well you are doing.
APurpleCow
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States1372 Posts
October 15 2011 16:03 GMT
#158
On October 15 2011 17:56 dignity wrote:
I always got 2 points in E and then go max out W. Never seemed to have trouble landing W with rank 2 E. Then again this is also situational depending on how well you are doing.


It's not about hitting W, it's about having an AoE 2.5 second stun.
Juddas
Profile Joined January 2011
768 Posts
October 15 2011 16:30 GMT
#159
On October 15 2011 17:08 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
That's the standard build...


LoL yeah I was a ritard and meant to ask if people don't do that... XD /facepalm
Juddas
Profile Joined January 2011
768 Posts
December 15 2011 18:26 GMT
#160
Sorry to bump, but with this new patch, I feel like there is plenty of new room for discussing veigar. I am coming up with a new build, but right now it goes a little something like this.


take ghost teleport
Open Amplifying tome and mana pot


-Soulstealer 20<X<160

Blasting wand + Boots

-Ionian boots

-Morello's Evil tome

turtle shell

-RoA 80AP

Needlessly large Rod

-DeathCap

-void Staff



682 AP + Farm

725 mana

630 health

35% CDR

40% Mag Pen

now of course this is best case scenario i.e. full soulstealer stacks and RoA built up, but I really feel this is waay more viable now with less mana requirements.
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