I am kind of enjoying new Irelia* in games and competitive (even though I think old Irelia could do this well if you just gave her straight buffs like the rework basically did), but her stun has a really bad visual problem in competitive where it is really easy to lose in compared to other similarly impactful spells. It needs some sort of afterimage (like a Karthus wall sort of thing/how the ground breaks from Ali's Q), a unique noise (Cait Trap), or an indicator on the affected champ (morg Q). She's being used a lot in Demacia cup and that stun can change whole fights, but its basically invisible on a first watch because both ends can end up being within champion models, the animation is tiny and quick, and then the people just are generically stunned. It also doesn't help that her animations are always doing things, so you cant see her doing an obvious cast animation.

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

June 02 2018 16:20 GMT

#42

Pyke hotfix

My games: still free gold

Challenger streams: looks like he might be strong now

DarkCore

Germany4194 Posts

June 02 2018 17:20 GMT

#43

If they get Irelia stun down properly, she might be pretty balanced. I agree with the animation being hard to really eyeball, so many pros think they're out of range and then get destroyed because it sets up her entire combo.

General_Winter

United States719 Posts

June 02 2018 18:21 GMT

#44

Arg. So it looks like they are just sick of banner and want to kill it. Going from 70% to 40% is a huge drop in durability. At this point I’m doubtful if you could push through active resistance with a bannered siege minnion. Still, I suppose I’ll need to wait and see, or just build it and lose some games.

Numy

South Africa35471 Posts

June 02 2018 18:30 GMT

#45

Honestly banner just feels like a poorly designed item. What purpose is it meant to have? Give heroes who dont have strong lane pushing pressure an option to make that better?

Doesn't this ignore that heroes are meant to have strengths and weaknesses? That compositions should excel at certain things while being weak to others. Surely it undermines this duality if its just a little bit good? So why even have that item in the first place.

JimmiC

Canada22817 Posts

June 02 2018 19:26 GMT

#46

--- Nuked ---

Alaric

France45622 Posts

June 02 2018 19:35 GMT

#47

Also helps split pushers (or fighting against it) by chucking a minion in the sideline that won't just get instacleared by a mage so you can actually pressure the map and force people to deal with it.
The other problem is that its stats don't punish that much in 5v5 or such for building it.

Especially when it was spammed on Cho and other such champions which would routinely tank 1v5 anyway so having a bit lower stats in exchange wasn't a big deal.

DarkCore

Germany4194 Posts

June 02 2018 21:19 GMT

#48

I might be wrong, but I don't think the item was ever bought when Ziggs was meta, textbook example of an item not filling the purpose it was designed for.

I like the idea of using a minion to force a lane to push, just that it's been poorly implemented.

Honestly banner just feels like a poorly designed item. What purpose is it meant to have? Give heroes who dont have strong lane pushing pressure an option to make that better?

Many of those champions are still bad split pushers in a 1vs1 scenario, which is how you're supposed to counter them. Big problem right now is that Banner kills minions too fast, and it can be rushed before real splitters come online. I think if they gutted its damage and made the minion really tanky instead, allowing for a slow push, it would be much better.

cLutZ

United States19574 Posts

June 02 2018 21:55 GMT

#49

Banner was added at the beginning of S3, when I think they decided to add a ton of item actives. They had the one that disabled towers, sightstone, crucible, and added all the jungle items. So it was pretty much just throwing shit at the wall.

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

June 03 2018 01:00 GMT

#50

Banner was also a hybrid ap/def item before it started getting used (and I think it might have been full ap at one point) it was getting abused immediately after it got converted to a tank item, this isn't Censor situation, it got buffed and became meta instantly.

Bladeorade

United States1898 Posts

June 04 2018 15:27 GMT

#51

Pyke is horrible. He is going to need a rework to so he can jungle but his ganks are going to be so strong he will just get nerfed anyway. Just delete from the game

chipmonklord17

United States11944 Posts

June 04 2018 18:22 GMT

#52

Does Pyke ult trigger Draven's cash in or a Kindred stack?

General_Winter

United States719 Posts

June 04 2018 18:54 GMT

#53

Yeah. It seems like if he stacks HP regen and isn’t dumb he is basically unkillable.

Bladeorade

United States1898 Posts

June 04 2018 18:56 GMT

#54

On June 05 2018 03:54 General_Winter wrote:
Yeah. It seems like if he stacks HP regen and isn’t dumb he is basically unkillable.

Uhh how is he unkillable? If he is picked support you just CC him and kill him. If he picked jungle you LoL at him while he falls behind 2 levels because he cant farm and you counter gank him.

Gahlo

United States35174 Posts

June 04 2018 18:59 GMT

#55

I believe the point of "isn't dumb" is "don't over extend like a knob."

Bladeorade

United States1898 Posts

June 04 2018 19:11 GMT

#56

On June 05 2018 03:59 Gahlo wrote:
I believe the point of "isn't dumb" is "don't over extend like a knob."

Can't anyone stack hpregen and sit back? How is that a Pyke exclusive?

In the context of what Pyke is supposed to be he seems terrible. Every game he is in is free elo for the opposite team.

Looks like his win rate is abysmal across the board no matter where he is picked

Slayer91

Ireland23460 Posts

June 04 2018 19:14 GMT

#57

how exactly is a diving melee with low xp and no ability to buy hp going to not die lol

hp regen might heal you 10% of your hp over 4 waves or 2 minutes in an actual fight you just get one shot

I mean assassins usually work better in a lane like mid with high xp, safe laning and good roam potential.

but pyke has terrible ad ratios and can't play tank so he has to play a role he sucks at

Bladeorade

United States1898 Posts

June 04 2018 19:18 GMT

#58

On June 05 2018 04:14 Slayer91 wrote:
how exactly is a diving melee with low xp and no ability to buy hp going to not die lol

hp regen might heal you 10% of your hp over 4 waves or 2 minutes in an actual fight you just get one shot

Seriously. There cannot be a functioning AD support assassin.

If an AD support assassin can function without gold then you put it in a lane and give it real items and now its broken.

He is almost certainly going to end up in the jungle but his cooldowns are super high and his attack speed seems really low. He reminds me of old Alistar jungle where you hit level 2 and just go gank. That just cant work anymore. You end up 2 or 3 levels behind everyone else.

cLutZ

United States19574 Posts

June 04 2018 19:18 GMT

#59

I'm very confused about the idea of picking a melee assassin support with the goal of "sitting back" and waiting for regen. Wouldn't that be the strategy for, say, Janna/Soraka? This is a guy who's kit is basically Leona without tankiness combined with Diana without waveclear.