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On December 01 2014 03:51 JimmiC wrote:
Been playing with my friend at high silver and low gold. I'm used to high gold low plat. The only difference is rage. Down here such a high percentage of people blame each other, rage, say gg at 8 min mark fight all game. That bs happens higher as well, just not as often. I'm convinced if half of these people just muted, or just ignored others they would move up. Then again that would cause me to fall, so keep on raging!
My experience is bronze, silver and golds flame just as much as plat and diamonds. The lower divisions just seemingly refuse to actually try and turn the tide while flaming.
dat high MMR flaming multitasking.
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I would say it can be worse in plat and diamond because the higher the elo, the higher the god complex people have where they think there play is always perfect.
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On November 29 2014 10:40 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2014 00:55 padfoota wrote:
Theres a reason why they say supports can be good adcs but adcs cant be good supports. At least not instantly Can you expand on this because I really have no idea how to play support at all and I mained ADC last season
Because ADC is fucking easy. Well, not really, but still. Heres my argument.
Current ADC's all have the same thing - a burst aoe/single target damage, a secondary burst damage that uses up too much mana early on to spam effectively but has its uses in all ins etc, an escape tool on moderately long cool down, and a burst ulti or an ulti that complements the other spells.
Graves, Corki, Caitlyn, Lucian, Tristana (arguable) etc
With that in mind, you can effectively argue that mastering the ADC is just about getting used to him/her and the rest is interchangable between champs. Skills such as positioning, knowing when to trade, and item build is pretty much flat across the board, with the most variable factor being effective range of skill and aa
Supports are split into a variety of roles that all play out, build, and "support" their teammates in a completely different way,
In these different roles, each play style again split into different styles depending on the opponent support.
Example - Leona Graves is a kill lane sure. Leona graves vs caitlyn blitz? Completely different style of play, and is more about whoever moves first loses.
An ADC main wouldnt really pay attention to this. They think oh its leona if she goes in I all in and its a good trade because its leona. Or for blitz if he hooks the ADC we go in hard and ignore the leona. This is completely untrue in actual fight.
Leona goes in and manages to stick on cait. Graves goes in, but immediately gets knocked up by blitz. Leona's CC ends and Graves ends up getting hits first, and cait Es away before graves can retaliate effectively. While leona tries to back out, she either gets hooked under the tower or takes a fuck ton of damage on her way back.
If blitz hooked first and manages to hooks graves, leona goes in on caitlyn before she can properly attack, graves E gets him super up close and personal to cait while shes CCd and suddenly its a fucking dead caitlyn. Blitz gets blamed for not peeling because hes the support.
In either scenario, if the ADC whose support goes in first decides to dodge the retaliating support spells, they will waste the CC time, and end up in either a poor position to attack while their support takes a ton of damage on the way back.
This is one fucking matchup. For ADC mains all they know is position correctly and kill the priority target, which would be the damage dealer in this case. Sure, itll get you to diamond no problem, but supports whos job has been to observe and understand each match up correctly gets positioning down decently because they know exactly how close each support needs to be to peel effectively, or they stay the fuck back and shoot whatever is closest (also gets you to diamond with practice as long as you get your CS down).
im not even going to bother with all the nami matches, which play completely different depending on the opponent support, the thresh matchups where you play AND build different starting at the beginning depending on the opponent support.
Sona, Janna, alistar etc etc.
But adcs have one job thats pretty much interchangable. Sure its not easy to master, but it sure as hell is easy to pick up when all the support mains have been doing is observation, while ADC's concentration is dumped mostly on CSing well and positioning (which is correct)
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On December 01 2014 09:45 Complete wrote:
what a pussy attitude
Played enough during the Diana\Eve days, I know what free losses are, haha.
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[QUOTE]On December 01 2014 21:53 padfoota wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 29 2014 10:40 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
[QUOTE]On November 29 2014 00:55 padfoota wrote:
Why does every single ad main have to be brain dead?Why can mid players play jayce and look at minimap and shotcall but if an ad player is cs-ing he can't do anything else in game lol.That logic has always made me question the player base.
I have the exact opposite experience.Most ad players do fine in lane as support but just suck dick at vision control and support mains just pick a utility ad and hope they aren't too useless.
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Because everybody wants to be S2 doublelift.
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Everyone who plays with adc is bound to have games where he gets fed and/or has insane peel and he just scores triples and quadras in every teamfights, thus creating the illusion they are indeed hard-carrying games so they only need to cs for items then they will wreck teamfights.
If you see an adc with a ward or even better, a vision ward, you know he actually understands the game.
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On December 01 2014 22:56 Volband wrote:
Everyone who plays with adc is bound to have games where he gets fed and/or has insane peel and he just scores triples and quadras in every teamfights, thus creating the illusion they are indeed hard-carrying games so they only need to cs for items then they will wreck teamfights.
If you see an adc with a ward or even better, a vision ward, you know he actually understands the game.
I am that adc haha, but I am former main support (now top) xD
Regarding the difference in the transitions from adc to support and vice verse, basically, adc is mechanics, support is game knowledge and understanding
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Adc is hard because not only are you the biggest potential damage dealer in the game (depends if you get focussed every single time due to bad positioning or bad mobility or w/e), but also because the bottom lane in how it plays out is so much more difficult than, let's say, the mid lane nafta said as an example.
2 People to focus on, minions to cs, your own support moving, your and their jungle, all are receipe for bigger concentration and less room for error.
It's also a very unrewarding role at times, where you can play like a god, but when your team either leaves you alone, either through your own immobility, or they just simply refuse to peel for you, you'll just flatout die.
It's also bad if you're fed, but an enemy tank/cc bot/burstchamp is more fed, the power will be so scewed that you might've won the lane, you will still get blown up, cc-ed into death.
Lesson as adc actually really is: play like a chicken, untill most threats that can fuck you, are gone. Kind of like going in as Katarina. Just wait out the initial chaos, clean up. Ofcourse the difference is you still have to try to maximize your damage while the fight starts and not just, you know, clean up.
I feel like I kind of went on a tangent somewhere down this post...
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Bug or Feature?
Me rengar jumped on enemy yasou from behind while he ultied our adc and instead of the adc, he ultied me, since, I was closer to him and obviously in the air (i jumpled out of ulti too). The adc was further ahead so yasou did not get us both in it, just the closest target.
If its not a bug, it means that you can intercept jumpers with yasuo xD
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I think if you play ADC long enough you learn how botlane matchups work and know what the support is supposed to do. The problem is ADCs who are newer don't tend to understand the lane as well for reasons mentioned above (there's like 2 maybe 3 main archetypes of ADC but all ADCs play fairly similarly).
I'm a dogshit support after laning is done because support is my least played role but I mained ADC from S1-halfway through S3 and I tend to do really well during lane phase as a support because I know exactly what I would want my support to do in lane if I was the ADC. Of course, after laning is done my vision control sucks but that's mostly cause I don't play the role often enough.
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On December 01 2014 23:38 M2 wrote:
Bug or Feature?
Me rengar jumped on enemy yasou from behind while he ultied our adc and instead of the adc, he ultied me, since, I was closer to him and obviously in the air (i jumpled out of ulti too). The adc was further ahead so yasou did not get us both in it, just the closest target.
If its not a bug, it means that you can intercept jumpers with yasuo xD
It's a bug. Yasuo's ulti was meant to be coded so that only if you or your allies caused the enemies to get airborne you can ulti. It's pretty buggy thought like the rest of league it seems.
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On December 02 2014 01:02 Numy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2014 23:38 M2 wrote:
Bug or Feature?
Me rengar jumped on enemy yasou from behind while he ultied our adc and instead of the adc, he ultied me, since, I was closer to him and obviously in the air (i jumpled out of ulti too). The adc was further ahead so yasou did not get us both in it, just the closest target.
If its not a bug, it means that you can intercept jumpers with yasuo xD It's a bug. Yasuo's ulti was meant to be coded so that only if you or your allies caused the enemies to get airborne you can ulti. It's pretty buggy thought like the rest of league it seems.
Yasuo's ultimate is obviously coded as a minion.
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On December 02 2014 00:59 overt wrote:
I'm a dogshit support after laning is done because support is my least played role but I mained ADC from S1-halfway through S3 and I tend to do really well during lane phase as a support because I know exactly what I would want my support to do in lane if I was the ADC. Of course, after laning is done my vision control sucks but that's mostly cause I don't play the role often enough.
I love support after laning phase, it's when I don't care (at all) about any one specific person on my team and I can make (in my estimation) the best play for our team. Babysitting self-entitled adcs who insist on "just play passive" and "let me cs" makes me want to roam right there. And most times I do. Hell yes!
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On December 02 2014 01:11 Zdrastochye wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2014 00:59 overt wrote:
I'm a dogshit support after laning is done because support is my least played role but I mained ADC from S1-halfway through S3 and I tend to do really well during lane phase as a support because I know exactly what I would want my support to do in lane if I was the ADC. Of course, after laning is done my vision control sucks but that's mostly cause I don't play the role often enough. I love support after laning phase, it's when I don't care (at all) about any one specific person on my team and I can make (in my estimation) the best play for our team. Babysitting self-entitled adcs who insist on "just play passive" and "let me cs" makes me want to roam right there. And most times I do. Hell yes!
I feel the pain in that, I play supprot to and love to play the aggressive like leona. Just to then hear my ADC "let me cs for a while and we can fight with I get 1 items" DUDE lvl 2 all-in all the way xD.
If all you wanted was to farm. tell be before and I'll got with a passive support 
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Pick Leona, ADC picks vayne afterwards,say "ok just let me farm up", lets the enemy shove in hard at level 1 and pretty much any time afterwards, keeps getting chunked and is never above 50% hp for inexplicable reasons, falls way behind in CS because he can't cs under turret, but lets the enemy push him under turret all the time anyways, and then complains about the "useless support, 1v2 lane"
No longer pick Leona.
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So I'm a support main and got to gold with it. I got a lot of experience with Janna, Thresh, and Blitz but recently I picked up Nami and she is providing a unique new challenge for me.
I can't figure out if I should be maxing Q or W first. And I'm having trouble landing the same kind of harass on the enemy support and adc as I would with Janna/Thresh. I feel really squishy as I don't have the tankier stats like Thresh or the Shield of Janna. Is there a specific spell rotation or bad matchups I should be avoiding when playing/trading with her?
Anyone with more experience on Nami have any insight into how to get the most out of her in lane without getting chunked to death when trying to harass?
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
On December 02 2014 01:51 rewired wrote:
So I'm a support main and got to gold with it. I got a lot of experience with Janna, Thresh, and Blitz but recently I picked up Nami and she is providing a unique new challenge for me.
I can't figure out if I should be maxing Q or W first. And I'm having trouble landing the same kind of harass on the enemy support and adc as I would with Janna/Thresh. I feel really squishy as I don't have the tankier stats like Thresh or the Shield of Janna. Is there a specific spell rotation or bad matchups I should be avoiding when playing/trading with her?
Anyone with more experience on Nami have any insight into how to get the most out of her in lane without getting chunked to death when trying to harass?
While playing Nami I think you should max R>W>E>Q.
Also Blitzcrank in bronze-plat is probably one of the most satisfying and most rewarding support to play, clutch hooks can turn around the game.
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On December 02 2014 01:51 rewired wrote:
So I'm a support main and got to gold with it. I got a lot of experience with Janna, Thresh, and Blitz but recently I picked up Nami and she is providing a unique new challenge for me.
I can't figure out if I should be maxing Q or W first. And I'm having trouble landing the same kind of harass on the enemy support and adc as I would with Janna/Thresh. I feel really squishy as I don't have the tankier stats like Thresh or the Shield of Janna. Is there a specific spell rotation or bad matchups I should be avoiding when playing/trading with her?
Anyone with more experience on Nami have any insight into how to get the most out of her in lane without getting chunked to death when trying to harass?
R>W>Q>E.
Wing yourself actually increases the initial bounce range, compared to if you simply Wd the enemy. Pretty much always W yourself if you want to poke unless you are at max hp.
Im only on 4.19 but her mana regen is pretty bad until you get a crucible for mikhaels or whatnot, so try not to waste too much.
Her Q is ridiculously easy to dodge and takes quite a lot of practice to get half decent at.
You can auto an enemy and immediately E yourself - the slow will count and will use up one of the bubbles. You can also do this with any other ranged champ (your adc). Using the E slow into Q is a lot better.
VS some matchups - if leona E's your ADC, immediately Q your adc. If you react fast enough itll immediately knock leona up before she can Q. Likewise, if you just throw your Q around carelessly vs leona/thresh they will gut you.
VS Janna you can immediately pop her shield with your W, which in turn removes the AD bonus (afaik, someone correct if wrong)
With nami you cannot play too passively but you also cannot play too aggressive - shes a more toned down thresh but has a great heal in this regard. Shes great vs Sona and Janna, decent vs thresh/leona/blitz (do NOT get cced), bad vs Braum (you hate him. You hate his fucking shield more) and Morgana (she hates you too tbh, but its overall a matchup in her favor early on vs very good morganas)
Personally the more I try nami the more I lose. Shes just...hard to carry with. She ccs and she heals but her spells just dont scale well enough with AP, compared to other supports who either go into late game as tank+cc monsters, or they buy mejis and have ridiculous ap scaling that they just somewhat "carry" harder. Of course if your region doesnt commonly rush meji+DC on janna, and leblanc/karma support carry, and you dont run into braum (hes a goddamn nightmare for nami) you should be fine.
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On December 02 2014 01:11 Zdrastochye wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2014 00:59 overt wrote:
I'm a dogshit support after laning is done because support is my least played role but I mained ADC from S1-halfway through S3 and I tend to do really well during lane phase as a support because I know exactly what I would want my support to do in lane if I was the ADC. Of course, after laning is done my vision control sucks but that's mostly cause I don't play the role often enough. I love support after laning phase, it's when I don't care (at all) about any one specific person on my team and I can make (in my estimation) the best play for our team. Babysitting self-entitled adcs who insist on "just play passive" and "let me cs" makes me want to roam right there. And most times I do. Hell yes!
I think botlane is all about playing to the strengths of your partner. If I'm support and can tell my ADC is a pussy I'll give them a heads up when I'm gonna go in. I like to play aggressive as an ADC but if I can tell my support doesn't wanna fight I'll be a bit more reserved. What's great is when I get matched up with an ADC or support that also likes to play aggro but I can play either role passively if I get the vibe that my partner is a more passive laner. Although in my opinion the more passive botlane tends to get rolled, I'd rather be at a CS disadvantage than feed kills when my lane partner gives zero follow up.
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EPT
