• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 23:45
CET 05:45
KST 13:45
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview1TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners11Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12
Community News
[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation10Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA8StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview [TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada Craziest Micro Moments Of All Time?
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 3 Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Tenacious Turtle Tussle Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle Brood War web app to calculate unit interactions [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BW General Discussion Terran 1:35 12 Gas Optimization
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] RO32 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group C - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers PvZ map balance How to stay on top of macro?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Gospel – a Pulp No…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1590 users

[Patch 4.17] Soraka/Viktor General Discussion - Page 65

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 63 64 65 66 67 78 Next
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 16:54 GMT
#1281
On October 08 2014 01:53 iCanada wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 01:43 Sufficiency wrote:
On October 08 2014 01:40 iCanada wrote:
On October 08 2014 01:35 Sufficiency wrote:
On October 08 2014 01:30 iCanada wrote:
On October 08 2014 01:00 Sufficiency wrote:
On October 08 2014 00:53 iCanada wrote:
On October 08 2014 00:51 Sufficiency wrote:
Right so you need to ward too! And it's not free gank! Wow what a surprise!


Except most jungles deep ward to track other jungle anyway, and jungle probably has sightstone and oracles and you don't.



Damn. I know nothing of deep warding. I am such a retard.

Where can I buy this "oracle" item? Can you teach me senpai?


Upgrade sweeper lens.

And don't be sarcastic, doesn't add anything. I'm sure you ward jungle paths nearly every game. The wrath brush, the one near red, the pathways near wolves / Wight.



Oh you mean upgraded sweeper!

Damn. I didn't know Morde had stealth.


It's not for morde stealth, for vision control. Kind of hard to gave vision when enemy jungler is killing two ward's every minute.

In soloqueue most people just stop warding.



That's a great idea. Thanks for teaching me senpai.


Oh wait. By the time you get it you are already level 9! By that time support would have roamed mid and helped me ward! And why would you spend 475 gold just for the lower cooldown?

It's not the lower cooldown, you can clear more ward's with the upgrade...

If I spend 475 gold, I can press 4 and walk by Dragon and kill probably 3 ward's every minute or until they stop warding which is with 475 easily because then you basically have full Dragon control.

I'm sorry I insulted your favorite champion, but the butthurt here is ridiculous.


Oracle's require level 9 last time I checked. You just said free kills... I didn't know you meant free kills after you are level 9.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 07 2014 16:59 GMT
#1282
--- Nuked ---
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:03 GMT
#1283
We have already established that in competitive Spellthief is more appealing due to its passive gp10. No one was arguing with that.

Don't you think these players may also go for the same build in solo queue as practice?
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
October 07 2014 17:05 GMT
#1284
Pre level 9 you probably have a lot less vision.

It's hardly trolling to suggest morde is easier to gank than the common mid laners. Except Yasuo, some Yasii so easy to kill, but by the sane token some Yasuo are impossible to kill, lots of outplay potential there.

For the record, I never upgraded trinkets before, but after watching every Korean jungler do it at worlds, I've started rushing it. The results have been good.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:09 GMT
#1285
On October 08 2014 02:05 iCanada wrote:
Pre level 9 you probably have a lot less vision.

It's hardly trolling to suggest morde is easier to gank than the common mid laners. Except Yasuo, some Yasii so easy to kill, but by the sane token some Yasuo are impossible to kill, lots of outplay potential there.

For the record, I never upgraded trinkets before, but after watching every Korean jungler do it at worlds, I've started rushing it. The results have been good.



Easier to gank != unplayable due to uncontrollable feeding to enemy jungler.


Thank you and have a nice day
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 07 2014 17:11 GMT
#1286
--- Nuked ---
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
October 07 2014 17:12 GMT
#1287
On October 08 2014 01:50 Ketara wrote:
It's because Sufficiency and Goumindong refuse to admit that they're wrong and that not buying boots on a champion is pretty stupid.

I mean it's not like you aren't one of the worst offenders here too, pot/kettle and all that.
Thing is everyone is so engrossed in their damn ego wars that whenever someone mentions how shitty these thread are becoming, there's typically someone showing up and saying "yeah X is really bad" when it's all of us who are a collective of shitters.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
kongoline
Profile Joined February 2012
6318 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-10-07 17:13:36
October 07 2014 17:13 GMT
#1288
as a morde i go mid only to instantly push the wave then do jungle theres no point to stick around and wait to be ganked
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
October 07 2014 17:13 GMT
#1289
I don't think I implied that was the case. More that most mordes I come across are quite easy to kill.

You're putting words in my mouth if you think I said he was unplayable. I just said I got excited as a jungle. That's not me trolling, that's you being hyper sensative.

Every jungle likes easy ganks.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:16 GMT
#1290
In competitive Lee Sin is almost first pick first ban, Elise is a fairly popular pick. On the other hand, Amumu/Sejuani/WW/Rammus are almost non heard of

In solo queue Lee/Elise has mid 40% win rate. And guess who wins a lot?

You can't equate what pros need and what solo queue players need. The same goes for items. You can't just say X is good in professional, premade games when voice comm and 0 lantecy is automatically goos in solo queue. It's a bit stretched.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:18 GMT
#1291
On October 08 2014 02:13 iCanada wrote:
I don't think I implied that was the case. More that most mordes I come across are quite easy to kill.

You're putting words in my mouth if you think I said he was unplayable. I just said I got excited as a jungle. That's not me trolling, that's you being hyper sensative.

Every jungle likes easy ganks.



As a jungler I get giddy when I see people lock in morde, I know for a fact I can kill him at least four times during lane and take a tower / Dragon each time.

It's basically freelo. Only time you can't flat out kill Morde with jungle pressure is if he's bad in the first place and getting completely smashed regardless.


Any other questions?
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-10-07 17:21:09
October 07 2014 17:19 GMT
#1292
On October 08 2014 02:13 kongoline wrote:
as a morde i go mid only to instantly push the wave then do jungle theres no point to stick around and wait to be ganked

Yeah, as Morde you want to just push once, and then ward out your wraiths, and just go straight to wraiths. Morde's all about trading farm, not about denying farm.
On October 08 2014 02:16 Sufficiency wrote:
In competitive Lee Sin is almost first pick first ban, Elise is a fairly popular pick. On the other hand, Amumu/Sejuani/WW/Rammus are almost non heard of

In solo queue Lee/Elise has mid 40% win rate. And guess who wins a lot?

You can't equate what pros need and what solo queue players need. The same goes for items. You can't just say X is good in professional, premade games when voice comm and 0 lantecy is automatically goos in solo queue. It's a bit stretched.

something something communication is overrated.
ie, royal club.
liftlift > tsm
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-10-07 17:23:09
October 07 2014 17:19 GMT
#1293
--- Nuked ---
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:22 GMT
#1294
On October 08 2014 02:19 krndandaman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 02:16 Sufficiency wrote:
In competitive Lee Sin is almost first pick first ban, Elise is a fairly popular pick. On the other hand, Amumu/Sejuani/WW/Rammus are almost non heard of

In solo queue Lee/Elise has mid 40% win rate. And guess who wins a lot?

You can't equate what pros need and what solo queue players need. The same goes for items. You can't just say X is good in professional, premade games when voice comm and 0 lantecy is automatically goos in solo queue. It's a bit stretched.


Yeah because surprise champions make up a teamcomp that determines their worth. If the same does go for items, can you please name another example where an item X is a must buy in competitive and isn't in soloqueue? Or the other way around? Isn't it more stretched that you're assuming voice com and latency makes an item that is bought 100% of the time in pro play become inferior to another item?



Rengar. Competitve Rengar builds tanky for survivability. He is there to facilitate for his team, not to one shot people.

In solo queue you try to carry so you build damage. You can't just rely on your teammates to do the damage.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
kongoline
Profile Joined February 2012
6318 Posts
October 07 2014 17:23 GMT
#1295
On October 08 2014 02:19 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 02:13 kongoline wrote:
as a morde i go mid only to instantly push the wave then do jungle theres no point to stick around and wait to be ganked

Yeah, as Morde you want to just push once, and then ward out your wraiths, and just go straight to wraiths. Morde's all about trading farm, not about denying farm.

if u push fast enough its not even trading enemy laner cant freeze they wont be able to tank full wave for 30s most of the time they jsut end up last hitting under turret or push it back if they have wave clear
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:26 GMT
#1296
The jungle changes hurt Morde quite a bit. He cannot take wraiths anymore (at least not very easily) until level 5.

He can still apply pressure to the lane and prevent the enemy laner from roaming though.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
October 07 2014 17:27 GMT
#1297
On October 08 2014 02:18 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 02:13 iCanada wrote:
I don't think I implied that was the case. More that most mordes I come across are quite easy to kill.

You're putting words in my mouth if you think I said he was unplayable. I just said I got excited as a jungle. That's not me trolling, that's you being hyper sensative.

Every jungle likes easy ganks.



Show nested quote +
As a jungler I get giddy when I see people lock in morde, I know for a fact I can kill him at least four times during lane and take a tower / Dragon each time.

It's basically freelo. Only time you can't flat out kill Morde with jungle pressure is if he's bad in the first place and getting completely smashed regardless.


Any other questions?


To be fair, the majority of the time in solo queue, easy ganks are usually freelo. If you knew your jungle would gank more successfully than the other teams, what would you say your teams chances of winning were?

Is having easier ganks not having a higher percentage chance to have your jungle out gank theirs?
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
October 07 2014 17:28 GMT
#1298
On October 08 2014 02:23 kongoline wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 02:19 wei2coolman wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:13 kongoline wrote:
as a morde i go mid only to instantly push the wave then do jungle theres no point to stick around and wait to be ganked

Yeah, as Morde you want to just push once, and then ward out your wraiths, and just go straight to wraiths. Morde's all about trading farm, not about denying farm.

if u push fast enough its not even trading enemy laner cant freeze they wont be able to tank full wave for 30s most of the time they jsut end up last hitting under turret or push it back if they have wave clear

That's best case scenario, that you deny maybe 2 creeps a wave if they can't last hit under turret. But that's a bonus when you shove waves like that. You should be aiming to trade out waves.
liftlift > tsm
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 07 2014 17:31 GMT
#1299
--- Nuked ---
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
October 07 2014 17:35 GMT
#1300
On October 08 2014 02:31 krndandaman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 08 2014 02:22 Sufficiency wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:19 krndandaman wrote:
On October 08 2014 02:16 Sufficiency wrote:
In competitive Lee Sin is almost first pick first ban, Elise is a fairly popular pick. On the other hand, Amumu/Sejuani/WW/Rammus are almost non heard of

In solo queue Lee/Elise has mid 40% win rate. And guess who wins a lot?

You can't equate what pros need and what solo queue players need. The same goes for items. You can't just say X is good in professional, premade games when voice comm and 0 lantecy is automatically goos in solo queue. It's a bit stretched.


Yeah because surprise champions make up a teamcomp that determines their worth. If the same does go for items, can you please name another example where an item X is a must buy in competitive and isn't in soloqueue? Or the other way around? Isn't it more stretched that you're assuming voice com and latency makes an item that is bought 100% of the time in pro play become inferior to another item?



Rengar. Competitve Rengar builds tanky for survivability. He is there to facilitate for his team, not to one shot people.

In solo queue you try to carry so you build damage. You can't just rely on your teammates to do the damage.


http://www.probuilds.net/champions/Rengar

How come pros here are doing the soloqueue build and they aren't for janna? I don't see much tankiness in here at all.



Interesting. You should just keep doing that Spellthief build then.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Prev 1 63 64 65 66 67 78 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
01:00
#57
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 126
Nina 112
NeuroSwarm 63
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 381
Noble 22
Icarus 7
Dota 2
monkeys_forever435
XaKoH 286
League of Legends
JimRising 546
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox367
Other Games
summit1g17824
shahzam362
C9.Mang0249
ViBE172
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick996
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 67
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22033
League of Legends
• Scarra1636
• Lourlo625
• Stunt358
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
5h 16m
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
Kung Fu Cup
7h 16m
GuMiho vs MaNa
herO vs ShoWTimE
Classic vs TBD
WardiTV Korean Royale
7h 16m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 5h
RSL Revival
1d 5h
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
1d 7h
Cure vs Reynor
IPSL
1d 12h
ZZZero vs rasowy
Napoleon vs KameZerg
BSL 21
1d 15h
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
[ Show More ]
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
BSL 21
2 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
IPSL
2 days
Dewalt vs WolFix
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
BSL: GosuLeague
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
BSL: GosuLeague
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
RSL Revival: Season 3
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.