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[Patch 4.14] Gnar General Discussion - Page 35

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
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Frudgey
Profile Joined September 2012
Canada3367 Posts
August 18 2014 21:50 GMT
#681
That's interesting. I would have just assumed that he wasn't a good pick right now (not that it stopped me from playing him haha) just because I thought that the meta picks were good against him. Of course, I don't know who is the meta right now for top lane picks (could someone be so kind as to tell me who they are? Thanks!) but I just though that meta picks would just roll Darius.
It is better to die for The Emperor than live for yourself.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-18 21:53:33
August 18 2014 21:50 GMT
#682
On August 19 2014 06:39 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I dunno, my personal thoughts are that she's very strong in the meta right now. The ADCs that are good against her (Corki, Sivir) are not in favor and she's good against Lucian as far as I can tell. You win lanes like Ezreal and you can just safe farm against a lot of lanes with Volley even from behind. Twitch is probably a hard matchup but Arrow kinda negates that at 6 and as long as your jungler comes bot a lot you basically always win a 2v3/3v3.

I'm gonna test more and see if I find any really unplayable matchups. I just dominated an Ezreal/Leona lane as Ashe/Morg in d1 even though my last hitting sucked. As long as you can get away with it I feel like double dorans -> avarice/zeal/zerks -> shiv -> IE is really strong.

In unrelated news, Darius is top tier right now for top laners, imo.

There is no adc in the game that doesn't win vs ezreal.Ashe/morg should win that lane easily dunno why is it surprising to you that you won it.

Twitch is hard for ashe?Why?Twitch is garbage in lane as well.

As I said her laning can be good the real problem is later.Her low damage and high utility don't compensate for no escape.

I have been having real big issues with lucian after last patch.Even though he is my favourite champ he is just so underwhelming :/.

Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-18 22:00:05
August 18 2014 21:51 GMT
#683
I assume Darius is a nice "fuck you" to the %DR used by the popular Maokai and Alistar to stay alive too.

Lucian wouldn't be so bad if they didn't pair the changes with itemisation changes that completely fucked over the lower ranged marksmen.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
August 18 2014 22:01 GMT
#684
loss forgiven on again lol 3 times in 3 days zzzzzzz
Carrilord has arrived.
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
August 18 2014 22:05 GMT
#685
Darius absolutely smashes Mao and ali. It's pretty gross actually.
Usagi
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Spain1647 Posts
August 18 2014 22:08 GMT
#686
On August 19 2014 07:01 Slusher wrote:
loss forgiven on again lol 3 times in 3 days zzzzzzz

Be grateful, EUW doesnt even turn it on =D
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
August 18 2014 22:09 GMT
#687
These DDOS attacks are getting out of hand again
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
kongoline
Profile Joined February 2012
6318 Posts
August 18 2014 22:23 GMT
#688
On August 19 2014 07:05 iCanada wrote:
Darius absolutely smashes Mao and ali. It's pretty gross actually.

i imagine he also dies to every gank LOL
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
August 18 2014 22:35 GMT
#689
yea this isn't playable
Carrilord has arrived.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
August 18 2014 22:42 GMT
#690
On August 19 2014 07:23 kongoline wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2014 07:05 iCanada wrote:
Darius absolutely smashes Mao and ali. It's pretty gross actually.

i imagine he also dies to every gank LOL


Darius is like Renekton and Heimer, in the category of, if you don't punish me for bullying before 6 I'll just kill you both.
Carrilord has arrived.
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
August 18 2014 23:08 GMT
#691
On August 19 2014 07:42 Slusher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2014 07:23 kongoline wrote:
On August 19 2014 07:05 iCanada wrote:
Darius absolutely smashes Mao and ali. It's pretty gross actually.

i imagine he also dies to every gank LOL


Darius is like Renekton and Heimer, in the category of, if you don't punish me for bullying before 6 I'll just kill you both.


Yeah, kills the laner while baiting, then turns around, combos the jungler, grabs him when he tries to run and dunks him too.

lol.

Its a feast or famine lane for sure, but if there is no jungle intervention the Darius will be absolutely huuuge.

So that means that in soloqueue, he absolutely bodies these guys top.
ZERG_RUSSIAN
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
10417 Posts
August 18 2014 23:43 GMT
#692
On August 19 2014 06:50 nafta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2014 06:39 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I dunno, my personal thoughts are that she's very strong in the meta right now. The ADCs that are good against her (Corki, Sivir) are not in favor and she's good against Lucian as far as I can tell. You win lanes like Ezreal and you can just safe farm against a lot of lanes with Volley even from behind. Twitch is probably a hard matchup but Arrow kinda negates that at 6 and as long as your jungler comes bot a lot you basically always win a 2v3/3v3.

I'm gonna test more and see if I find any really unplayable matchups. I just dominated an Ezreal/Leona lane as Ashe/Morg in d1 even though my last hitting sucked. As long as you can get away with it I feel like double dorans -> avarice/zeal/zerks -> shiv -> IE is really strong.

In unrelated news, Darius is top tier right now for top laners, imo.

There is no adc in the game that doesn't win vs ezreal.Ashe/morg should win that lane easily dunno why is it surprising to you that you won it.

Twitch is hard for ashe?Why?Twitch is garbage in lane as well.

As I said her laning can be good the real problem is later.Her low damage and high utility don't compensate for no escape.

I have been having real big issues with lucian after last patch.Even though he is my favourite champ he is just so underwhelming :/.


I disagree that her damage is low. Volley and Shiv crits put out a ton of AoE. She has high range, a stun, and two ways to apply a constant slow. When was the last time you actually played Ashe? Also, it takes a competent team. I would never dream of picking her in low diamond, but in d1 she's actually quite strong.

Just so I'm clear as to what I should be explaining, what is your current tier/division?
I'm on GOLD CHAIN
turdburgler
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
England6749 Posts
August 18 2014 23:49 GMT
#693
but her damage is low, shiv is not ashe, shiv is an item anyone can have. only having 1 ability that deals damage is objectively less damage than any other adc and half her ults power budget is taken up in the fact its a global stun, its got mediocre damage and doesnt scale.

ashes damage is just objectively the lowest, thats not to say shes instantly terrible but its also not really a point up for discussion.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-18 23:53:19
August 18 2014 23:49 GMT
#694
On August 19 2014 08:43 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 19 2014 06:50 nafta wrote:
On August 19 2014 06:39 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I dunno, my personal thoughts are that she's very strong in the meta right now. The ADCs that are good against her (Corki, Sivir) are not in favor and she's good against Lucian as far as I can tell. You win lanes like Ezreal and you can just safe farm against a lot of lanes with Volley even from behind. Twitch is probably a hard matchup but Arrow kinda negates that at 6 and as long as your jungler comes bot a lot you basically always win a 2v3/3v3.

I'm gonna test more and see if I find any really unplayable matchups. I just dominated an Ezreal/Leona lane as Ashe/Morg in d1 even though my last hitting sucked. As long as you can get away with it I feel like double dorans -> avarice/zeal/zerks -> shiv -> IE is really strong.

In unrelated news, Darius is top tier right now for top laners, imo.

There is no adc in the game that doesn't win vs ezreal.Ashe/morg should win that lane easily dunno why is it surprising to you that you won it.

Twitch is hard for ashe?Why?Twitch is garbage in lane as well.

As I said her laning can be good the real problem is later.Her low damage and high utility don't compensate for no escape.

I have been having real big issues with lucian after last patch.Even though he is my favourite champ he is just so underwhelming :/.


I disagree that her damage is low. Volley and Shiv crits put out a ton of AoE. She has high range, a stun, and two ways to apply a constant slow. When was the last time you actually played Ashe? Also, it takes a competent team. I would never dream of picking her in low diamond, but in d1 she's actually quite strong.

Just so I'm clear as to what I should be explaining, what is your current tier/division?

http://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=lainovoz

Yeah that part is something I dont exactly expect when I click play lol.

I get it you are excited you got d1 but including it in literally every single post is just annoying.

Ashe damage compared to other adc champs is low no clue how is that even debatable.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2014 00:01 GMT
#695
I hate the "Ashe no escape" argument. It's kind of like the 500 range Lucian thing all over again. You can't judge her over a single aspect without looking at her kit as a whole.

Also Kog/Varus have no escape either. GG bad adc?
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
August 19 2014 00:04 GMT
#696
'cause you know Kog deals double Ashe's dps or something from even farther range and he can easily bolster his MS from afar using his ult and the Rage passive.
Kog's easier to protect overall, and he has a much better midgame and laning phase. Then again it's Kog being broken in general.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
August 19 2014 00:10 GMT
#697
On August 19 2014 09:01 Sufficiency wrote:
I hate the "Ashe no escape" argument. It's kind of like the 500 range Lucian thing all over again. You can't judge her over a single aspect without looking at her kit as a whole.

Also Kog/Varus have no escape either. GG bad adc?

It comes down to "is this champ worth peeling for?".In varus/ashe case the answer most of the time is no.Sure they are good for teamplay and stuff but that isn't how you win in soloq.Your only strength being negated completely by an item that most supports buy and most people can just dodge is very underwhelming.

Hell I would argue that ashe is better the lower you go not higher.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
August 19 2014 00:17 GMT
#698
So uh, Ashe's damage is definitely pretty low. But that's obviously not why you pick her.

I think playing Ashe is kind of weird. As ADC you do not want to get focused; but say you are Ashe and your mid laner is ranged, the enemy team has little choice but to focus you first - because if they initiate on your mid laner, and especially if they are melee, they will get brutally kited by your 35% perm slow and volley. This, compounded with the fact that Ashe has no escape, makes the situation even worse for her.

That doesn't mean she is bad, but I feel Ashe requires a different build from other ADCs and she requires specific comps.

As far as comps, Ashe is kind of like Twisted Fate in a teamfight (no I am not talking about their globals). Because you have a pretty good slow, you can help your mid laner kite very efficiently - kind of like what TF can do for an ADC in a teamfight. So she needs a ranged mid laner with good damage/CC and coordinate with her. If your mid laner is something like TF/Orianna/Lulu you will be kiting flawlessly.

I think Ashe is not too demanding on damage on her build so long as her team has another source of ranged damage. So she can go Warmog/something else protective as a second item without any guilt.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
August 19 2014 00:26 GMT
#699
to be fair about the shiv argument, Ashe, like Yasuo can create garunteed multiple person shiv crits at the start of a fight.
Carrilord has arrived.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-19 00:40:31
August 19 2014 00:39 GMT
#700
One Ashe build (20+ games played already) I have been trying a lot recently is IE -> SotD -> Vamp Scepter -> BT/LW. I don't claim this is an optimal build in any situation, but it does increase her dueling power by quite a bit and sometimes the best way to get rid of those pesty assassins is to kill them faster than they kill you. It's also quite funny.

Ideally you can make 4 guaranteed crits when combined with her passive. Against a target with little bonus armor you can do around 1.2k damage in around 2 seconds in the mid game. But unfortunately that means you won't get last hit minions which can make you pretty sad. More realistically you probably want to auto 1-2 times, hopefully get a natural crit, then use SotD.

Assuming you do kill your target (best case scenario) your SotD will go on cooldown and your damage will take a pretty big dive. But you are Ashe! You don't need totally amazing DPS to be effective. Even with just zerker boots you will still be able to get 1+ hit per second fairly quickly, which is enough to perm slow whatever other "low threat" targets on the opposing team.

https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
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