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On July 26 2014 17:59 padfoota wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2014 16:50 Sufficiency wrote:On July 26 2014 16:06 JazzVortical wrote:On July 26 2014 14:52 Sufficiency wrote:On July 26 2014 14:41 JazzVortical wrote:
Bought 3 mystery skins:
Jack of Hearts Twisted Fate
Freljord Ashe
Gatekeeper Galio
It's a shame I don't play much of these champs. I never play Ashe, I always consider learning TF and Galio, but I never have actually followed through with it. Still saved a lot of change with the Gatekeeper pick up. Might have to give him a whirl. Ashe free elo. You should do it more often. I have no idea how to play her. I don't know how anyone wins a trade with her. I know she scales decently well naturally and has hardcore initiation but laneing is so painful. Freljord is a pretty boring skin though, maybe if I got amethyst I'd play her more. Plus my go to ADC is Varus, and I don't see that changing anytime soon. If I have to ADC, I always seem to do well with him. Uh Ashe is really good and people grossly underestimate her. I underestimate her myself sometimes even though I play her quite often. Her R by itself makes her worthwhile - in soloQ initiation spells are really good, and Ashe is one of the few ADCs who can initiate. Yes her laning phase is close to garbage. That's a trade off. Pros - super spammable aoe slow, built in auto attack slow modifier, long range aoe stun+slow. Cons - Poor AD scaling, terrible wave clear spell, lack of innate auto attack damage modifiers (no magic/% hp/true, no AS), lack of escape spell, low range. I dunno man. IBG ezreal takes all the kiting and slow spam away from her already, and varus has the better wave clear, damage modifiers and decent ranged initator too. Ashe isnt completely terrible, its just she cannot carry as well nor kite as well as certain champs, shes terrible in lane and works as a semi-support-dpser in teamfights. Very, very weird champ that doesnt fit properly into any category You want to carry? Trist/Kog/Draven Kite? Lucian/Ezreal Poke? Corki/Ezreal Spam slow? IBG Ezreal Cone shaped damage? Graves Initiate with ulti? Varus Counter Initiate with ulti? Sivir. Wave clear? Too many. Caitlyn fits into a bunch of them.. I always wished they would change her Q so that it gave magic damage per auto attack that scaled from AD or something
Ashe is a kiting beast once she gets level 3~5 frost arrows. Her late game is honestly really goddamn powerful between the initiation power of her ult and the fact that it's impossible to stick to her, especially if she takes flash+ghost, or run away from her.
The reason why she doesn't see play is because she is by far the most item dependent AD carry because her stats/stat growth are pretty bad compared to other AD carries (Ashe has the lowest AD at level 18 and second lowest hp at level 18; she has the highest attack speed at level 18 though, bar abilities ofc), plus she has virtually no offensive steroid/power outside of her W, which is mediocre compared to other AD carry nukes. Combine that with a pretty damn weak early/mid game and Ashe is not gonna see much play. She used to be a staple despite all that because her ulti is just that powerful, but Riot nerfed the cooldown of her ult, making her even less useful. Plus, the AD carry pool was a lot smaller when she was popular, too.
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On July 26 2014 12:22 JazzVortical wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2014 10:47 wussleeQ wrote:On July 26 2014 10:41 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 26 2014 10:27 MindBreaker wrote:
Wierd question what do you guys think about naut top? Ive been trying it the last couple of days and he is a suprisingly strong lane bully personally I think lane naut and lane maokai are both underrated. I'm not sure if they're competitive viable, but it's a lot stronger than it gets credit for. lane mao used to be pretty strong but i have no idea whether his recent changes have made it stronger or not Top lane Mao was picked in Eu by Xaxus in Roccat vs Gambit. + Show Spoiler + He was outfarmed early by Mundo, but finished the game strongly in the teamfights.Burnt an early Mundo flash but no further ganks came. Surprising, considering Mao has some of the best gank support in the game. Roccat played better overall, but the Mao picked worked well. Would need to see more of it before you could judge it, but it wasn't bad overall.
He was played top in Asia too, LPL or GPL can't remember.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
I don't remember any topkai in GPL, now topgana that's GPL's stuff.
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On July 26 2014 19:02 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2014 17:59 padfoota wrote:On July 26 2014 16:50 Sufficiency wrote:On July 26 2014 16:06 JazzVortical wrote:On July 26 2014 14:52 Sufficiency wrote:On July 26 2014 14:41 JazzVortical wrote:
Bought 3 mystery skins:
Jack of Hearts Twisted Fate
Freljord Ashe
Gatekeeper Galio
It's a shame I don't play much of these champs. I never play Ashe, I always consider learning TF and Galio, but I never have actually followed through with it. Still saved a lot of change with the Gatekeeper pick up. Might have to give him a whirl. Ashe free elo. You should do it more often. I have no idea how to play her. I don't know how anyone wins a trade with her. I know she scales decently well naturally and has hardcore initiation but laneing is so painful. Freljord is a pretty boring skin though, maybe if I got amethyst I'd play her more. Plus my go to ADC is Varus, and I don't see that changing anytime soon. If I have to ADC, I always seem to do well with him. Uh Ashe is really good and people grossly underestimate her. I underestimate her myself sometimes even though I play her quite often. Her R by itself makes her worthwhile - in soloQ initiation spells are really good, and Ashe is one of the few ADCs who can initiate. Yes her laning phase is close to garbage. That's a trade off. Pros - super spammable aoe slow, built in auto attack slow modifier, long range aoe stun+slow. Cons - Poor AD scaling, terrible wave clear spell, lack of innate auto attack damage modifiers (no magic/% hp/true, no AS), lack of escape spell, low range. I dunno man. IBG ezreal takes all the kiting and slow spam away from her already, and varus has the better wave clear, damage modifiers and decent ranged initator too. Ashe isnt completely terrible, its just she cannot carry as well nor kite as well as certain champs, shes terrible in lane and works as a semi-support-dpser in teamfights. Very, very weird champ that doesnt fit properly into any category You want to carry? Trist/Kog/Draven Kite? Lucian/Ezreal Poke? Corki/Ezreal Spam slow? IBG Ezreal Cone shaped damage? Graves Initiate with ulti? Varus Counter Initiate with ulti? Sivir. Wave clear? Too many. Caitlyn fits into a bunch of them.. I always wished they would change her Q so that it gave magic damage per auto attack that scaled from AD or something Ashe is a kiting beast once she gets level 3~5 frost arrows. Her late game is honestly really goddamn powerful between the initiation power of her ult and the fact that it's impossible to stick to her, especially if she takes flash+ghost, or run away from her. The reason why she doesn't see play is because she is by far the most item dependent AD carry because her stats/stat growth are pretty bad compared to other AD carries (Ashe has the lowest AD at level 18 and second lowest hp at level 18; she has the highest attack speed at level 18 though, bar abilities ofc), plus she has virtually no offensive steroid/power outside of her W, which is mediocre compared to other AD carry nukes. Combine that with a pretty damn weak early/mid game and Ashe is not gonna see much play. She used to be a staple despite all that because her ulti is just that powerful, but Riot nerfed the cooldown of her ult, making her even less useful. Plus, the AD carry pool was a lot smaller when she was popular, too.
she used to be popular when her tristana and miss fortune were the only adcs rofl
lack of steroid/range and her only upside is her initiation with arrow, but why take that when you can pick someone else to do the initiating then have a carry with more range/an actual steroid that will do damage instead?
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IMO Ashe needs a BAT buff, while keeping her AS/lvl scaling. Bump it up by 0.2 and she'd probably start seeing some picks, bump it up 0.3 and she'd be insane.
I like the idea of Q doing something in addition slowing though. Maybe combined with the buff above, every 3 shots could mini-root somebody for 0.2-0.4 seconds. She'd have a monstrous lategame then.
Problem is, as samsung white showed, you can build a comp to kill mobile carries while simultaneously winning fights with zilean/kayle ult on a suicide rengar initiation.
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Problem with ashe is in the end she has no escape AND no steroid so you have to land good arrows AND your team has to follow them.She isn't an actual carry.Which is why I have always recommended champs like her/mf/varus for people who don't main the adc role.
Her laning is ok.Not really top tier but you can easily win lanes with good support.Problem is in order to win lane you have to push and then you get ganked and die because of no escape.Which is pretty much the problem of most champs that aren't played.
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yeah my ashe is amazing when my arrows hit
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On July 26 2014 15:33 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2014 15:20 Sufficiency wrote:On July 26 2014 15:08 Gahlo wrote:On July 26 2014 14:49 Sufficiency wrote:
Well, this is kind of broken. Challenger players now has a 58% chance to play on purple side because Riot's new matchmaking algorithm places better players on the purple side to compensate for the blue side advantage. If they want blue, they should just suck more. I plan to run a test to see what happens to the top (say) 10 soloQ ladder players. Maybe they play on purple 80% of the time or something. Pretty sure Riot's algorithm is bugged. I plan to blog this tomorrow. Purple has always had the higher ELO. they probably just intensified that advantage to try to guarantee a better winrate. if thats what they did, thats a shoddy and somewhat deceptive way of "fixing" blue side advantage.
On every MMR guesser I've seen, purple is always 20-30 points higher. Nowhere near enough to make up the difference as seen by the 55:45 split.
On July 26 2014 15:35 Djin)ftw( wrote:
Hm qhat do you guys think about getting a sightstone as jungler? Besides Lee I only saw it twice or so on Elise and Nunu in LCS.
I mean, if you wanna go DPS, its obviously not the item of choice. But even if you wanna go tanky/support I dont know if its worth it. 800 gold for 150 health.. if you get 2 ruby chrystals you are obviously better off hp-wise, which means better 2v2/3v3s. So what are the parameters that cause pRos to get a sightstone for more vision rather than real (combat) items?
I feel like you can get away with it more in competitive, because they'll make more use out of your vision, but in soloq people are just stupid and it's entirely not worth it unless you can wardhop.
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On July 26 2014 22:23 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2014 15:35 Djin)ftw( wrote:
Hm qhat do you guys think about getting a sightstone as jungler? Besides Lee I only saw it twice or so on Elise and Nunu in LCS.
I mean, if you wanna go DPS, its obviously not the item of choice. But even if you wanna go tanky/support I dont know if its worth it. 800 gold for 150 health.. if you get 2 ruby chrystals you are obviously better off hp-wise, which means better 2v2/3v3s. So what are the parameters that cause pRos to get a sightstone for more vision rather than real (combat) items? I feel like you can get away with it more in competitive, because they'll make more use out of your vision, but in soloq people are just stupid and it's entirely not worth it unless you can wardhop.
I'd say it's the opposite, soloq supports don't ward as effectively, laners (mid and top) don't ward at all compared to lcs (at most elo's), and people don't use red trinkets anywhere near as much, so your contribution to vision is much more valuable as a soloq jungler then an lcs jungler.
Also solo q people just aren't used to thing being warded at all, so they very rarely take different routes to avoid potential wards, other then the basic lane bush wards.
obviously it's more effective on people who can ward jump (lee) or who will aim to counter jungle/counter gank a lot, but it's (situationally) really impactful on all junglers imo
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It looks like with enough armor and the 10 damage reduction ammumu gets from his E that minions are actually doing negative damage with their attacks. I guess Bloodthirster mis-calculates it as healing from life-steal.
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Lastshadow with his usual delete Facebook/twitter then start them up again for attention. I genuinely feel bad for the guy.
CLG if you lose to TSM tomorrow I swear to god
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On July 26 2014 23:52 schmutttt wrote:
Lastshadow with his usual delete Facebook/twitter then start them up again for attention. I genuinely feel bad for the guy.
CLG if you lose to TSM tomorrow I swear to god
Always bothered me that shitbag can still post here especially given his past.
But people still seem to want to feed his ego and give him the attention he shouldnt have i guess
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The thing about ashe having no steroid is that her slow lets her do a lot of extra damage in practice. If you're a support and you accidentally get within 600 range of ashe, you're dead, and often even flashing away doesn't help. With the exclusion of champs with multiple jumps, unless you gib ashe immediately you're basically dead if you let her build up to late game.
Additionally, thanks to how difficult it is to escape from her, if you're ashe and you get an advantage in lane, you do have some very sharp dueling with enemy squishes, so there is a lot of snowballing you can do well, and arrow is insane for pick-offs in solo queue.
also passive crit + volley follow up on arrow and a burst support like annie or zyra can oneshot a lot of people, not to mention great jungler follow up
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On July 26 2014 23:54 Vanka wrote:
The thing about ashe having no steroid is that her slow lets her do a lot of extra damage in practice. If you're a support and you accidentally get within 600 range of ashe, you're dead, and often even flashing away doesn't help. With the exclusion of champs with multiple jumps, unless you gib ashe immediately you're basically dead if you let her build up to late game.
Additionally, thanks to how difficult it is to escape from her, if you're ashe and you get an advantage in lane, you do have some very sharp dueling with enemy squishes, so there is a lot of snowballing you can do well, and arrow is insane for pick-offs in solo queue.
also passive crit + volley follow up on arrow and a burst support like annie or zyra can oneshot a lot of people, not to mention great jungler follow up
The problem is teamfights. It doesnt matter that you can kite really well if meanwhile your team gets wiped and your left in a 1v3 orso.
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On July 26 2014 23:54 Vanka wrote:
The thing about ashe having no steroid is that her slow lets her do a lot of extra damage in practice. If you're a support and you accidentally get within 600 range of ashe, you're dead, and often even flashing away doesn't help. With the exclusion of champs with multiple jumps, unless you gib ashe immediately you're basically dead if you let her build up to late game.
Additionally, thanks to how difficult it is to escape from her, if you're ashe and you get an advantage in lane, you do have some very sharp dueling with enemy squishes, so there is a lot of snowballing you can do well, and arrow is insane for pick-offs in solo queue.
also passive crit + volley follow up on arrow and a burst support like annie or zyra can oneshot a lot of people, not to mention great jungler follow up
Late game i would rather have any ADC other than Ashe 9/10 times slow or no slow tbh.
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So basically Ashe has a "win more" kit and that's why she doesn't do well when she actually lacks the tools to get ahead by herself to begin with?
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Ashe is very strong in lane when her support can cancel/peel the enemies initiation. Supports like Thresh and Nami are top dog. Zyra and Annie can be but are much better for the lvl 6 nuke/kill. Ashe has very strong peel at level 13 with Q maxed but until then she needs her support to peel. She probably does really well with Alistar too but nobody plays him.
Ashe has excellent poke with crit+volley that she can abuse with her 600 range but if she gets hooked or stunned its over, trade lost which is why thresh and nami are so strong. Ashe's slow is weak in lane but combine that with Nami's slow and save the her bubble for peeling you can auto them all the way back to their tower.
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Too bad her passive resets on fucking minions.
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If you can play immobile ADs, Ashe is fine, the issue is, most people are so used to having a get out of jail free card, that they suck at staying safe. I love playing Ashe and Varus, they're probably my two best ADs, but that's because I cheese in lane/play fearlessly during fights and bank on the fact that I can get a good ult off on 1-2 people.
I'm also partial to Ashe since I've stolen buffs with her arrow before. It's funny ^^
Like I told Scip last night, if I knew he was playing Ashe, I would have banned Eppa's blitz since I hate blitzcrank as a champion due to how rocket fist works and how safe you have to play in lane and out...Then again, I love it if I'm playing a massive, immobile tank, then it's a free initiate 
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EPT
