EPT[Patch 4.10] Nidalee/Skarner Rework General Discussion - P…
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On June 19 2014 05:47 TheYango wrote: TBH I'm kind of curious why they made the decision to make Essence Reaver an AD+Lifesteal item rather than AD+Mana regen, using Forbidden Idol. Mana regeneration as one of the basic stats seems to fit the upgrade better. I initially thought it was going to be a mana AD item to help top laners with mana issues. Not really sure what the point of the item is in it's current form. | ||
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zodde
Sweden1908 Posts
On June 19 2014 05:47 TheYango wrote: TBH I'm kind of curious why they made the decision to make Essence Reaver an AD+Lifesteal item rather than AD+Mana regen, using Forbidden Idol. Mana regeneration as one of the basic stats seems to fit the upgrade better. Well, who who even consider buying an Forbidden Idol in lane on a AD champion? I agree it makes sense for the item build, but it would be utterly useless with it's current stats and building from pick axe + idol. | ||
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benefluence
United States158 Posts
On June 19 2014 05:47 TheYango wrote: TBH I'm kind of curious why they made the decision to make Essence Reaver an AD+Lifesteal item rather than AD+Mana regen, using Forbidden Idol. Mana regeneration as one of the basic stats seems to fit the upgrade better. I think the idea was to make it an all-in-one lane sustain item, so you wouldn't need to get doran's, other vamp, etc. Adding lifesteal makes it less painful to rush as your first item (although it's still pretty painful to rush) Fun Fact: it looks like the mana restore procs on anything that procs lifesteal, e.g. ez Q Nasus Q damage, Triforce proc. (Does Muramana's damage proc lifesteal? That would be lulzy) I think the awkward part about ER is that it's a mana regen item that scales with AA damage, which makes it weak early game and strong later, exactly the opposite of what most marksmen want. I think it's actually quite strong for spamming spells lategame, but that's also what Muramana is for. I feel like it's meant to be an AD grail, but it's not exactly doing that very well. And given how problematic Grail itself has been, it may not even be a good idea. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
it's only 10% cooldown reduction, so...you just shaved off 0.1 second cooldown. Yay. I guess I was wrong. It does contribute to your damage output, but in a very minimal, near-useless way. I said it before Essence Reaver went live and I'll say it again. It's a trash item that will go the way of executioner's calling. Any AD champ with mana problems would rather buy Muramana. If you don't have mana problems you won't evne consider it. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:15 benefluence wrote: I think the idea was to make it an all-in-one lane sustain item, so you wouldn't need to get doran's, other vamp, etc. Adding lifesteal makes it less painful to rush as your first item (although it's still pretty painful to rush) You can't cost a "lane sustain" item at 2650 gold. At least not when the distinguishing sustain component only kicks in when the item is completed. | ||
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Nemireck
Canada1875 Posts
It's incredibly slot-inefficient, but if spamming spells is your game, it's quite nifty to pick up first. I'ma keep testing it and see how things work out. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:27 TheYango wrote: Also, I'm not sure why an "all-in-one" lane sustain item is remotely a niche they would want to fill since literally every time such an item has existed prior, Riot's hated it out of the game. I think their thought was "no one will buy an auto attacking item that doesn't build out of vamp scepter because thats all Marksmen buy in lane right now" their new item creation division seems super separated from their balancing division that nerfed the hell out of vamp specter rushes. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:41 Ryuu314 wrote: Honestly, I think the BT nerf was warranted. It was kinda boring seeing every AD carry rush BT (unless you're playing Twitch/Vayne). That being said, new BT is so underwhelming. I wish Riot gave BT a better/cooler passive. It'd have been so sweet if it built up stacks you could activate to add a shield worth the stacks, stacks being generated at the same rate and way the shield is normally built up, but i can see the use for it right now, it may not be too useful right away but its definitely a good item to secure an advantage with. | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:41 Ryuu314 wrote: Honestly, I think the BT nerf was warranted. It was kinda boring seeing every AD carry rush BT (unless you're playing Twitch/Vayne). That being said, new BT is so underwhelming. I wish Riot gave BT a better/cooler passive/active. Eh. For AD's there will almost always be one build to rule them all. That being said there are some interesting things happening to lategame AD itemization. BT gives a shield and AD, and Scimitar gives a QSS and AD. Both of them relatively slot and cost efficiently in the lategame. This opens up the option of AD's building their big three, then finishing with BT and Scimitar instead of the current defensive items. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21509 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:34 PrinceXizor wrote: I think their thought was "no one will buy an auto attacking item that doesn't build out of vamp scepter because thats all Marksmen buy in lane right now" their new item creation division seems super separated from their balancing division that nerfed the hell out of vamp specter rushes. Remember how the balance team said mana-less champions were terrible while the creative team kept putting out more mana-less champions? Unless something changed since then there is a pretty big communication gap between the two. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:42 PrinceXizor wrote: It'd have been so sweet if it built up stacks you could activate to add a shield worth the stacks, stacks being generated at the same rate and way the shield is normally built up, but i can see the use for it right now, it may not be too useful right away but its definitely a good item to secure an advantage with. I would've liked it if Riot just tweaked the Satanic passive and put it on BT. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35118 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:17 Ryuu314 wrote: it's only 10% cooldown reduction, so...you just shaved off 0.1 second cooldown. Yay. I guess I was wrong. It does contribute to your damage output, but in a very minimal, near-useless way. I said it before Essence Reaver went live and I'll say it again. It's a trash item that will go the way of executioner's calling. Any AD champ with mana problems would rather buy Muramana. If you don't have mana problems you won't evne consider it. .1second/second. On June 19 2014 06:24 TheYango wrote: You can't cost a "lane sustain" item at 2650 gold. At least not when the distinguishing sustain component only kicks in when the item is completed. It is very Atma's like that. Overall, I think it will see play on champions like to abuse Triforce as they are guaranteed to be mana hungry and auto. The lower cost compared to other first item rushes can absorb the high cost of Triforce. Might need a bump to 60 AD for people to take it seriously like Athene's did going from 80 to 90 AP. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:27 TheYango wrote: Also, I'm not sure why an "all-in-one" lane sustain item is remotely a niche they would want to fill since literally every time such an item has existed prior, Riot's hated it out of the game. Your answer might be... On June 19 2014 06:50 Gorsameth wrote: Remember how the balance team said mana-less champions were terrible while the creative team kept putting out more mana-less champions? Unless something changed since then there is a pretty big communication gap between the two. Yea, Riot actually doesnt stick to their own balance ideas very often. | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
Also. BT would be cooler if it was an activatable shield you could stack. Or heal. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On June 19 2014 06:50 Gorsameth wrote: Remember how the balance team said mana-less champions were terrible while the creative team kept putting out more mana-less champions? Unless something changed since then there is a pretty big communication gap between the two. People that fix things and people that design things have always had a rift between them. Case in point, ask a mechanic what he thinks about engineers, and an engineer what he thinks about mechanics. | ||
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