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[Patch 4.6] Twitch VU General Discussion - Page 5

Forum Index > LoL General
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Updated TL LoL policy in regards to the use of "lomo"
Zess
Profile Joined July 2012
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
April 22 2014 01:14 GMT
#81
Yea plus its dumb and gimps creative play due to "Riot Enforced Meta"

Normative design will always have to restrict possible actions taken by the player, and in the extreme case of these really short patch cycles (3 weeks?) there is almost no room for emergent gameplay
Administrator@TL_Zess
| (• ◡•)|八 (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35174 Posts
April 22 2014 01:19 GMT
#82
On April 22 2014 10:13 chalice wrote:
i kind of like kassadin's shield being given strong scaling and base numbers, because it only lasts 1.5 seconds how effective it is will probably be determined mostly by player skill differences.

Be careful, people might think you're talking about Riven there.
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-22 01:41:13
April 22 2014 01:32 GMT
#83
On April 22 2014 09:12 iCanada wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2014 08:56 cLutZ wrote:
Its kinda garbage to have an automatic timer. Its like a slightly less bs version of a macroing cheat that keeps all your production facilities building 1 unit at a time and all yall gots to do is turn them on/off.


Baron and Dragon already time themselves via "player X has slain the Y".

Its not like it even changes anything. All it does it save the jungler 2s of typing while autoing wraiths. My give a shit level there is ridiculously low.

It times ults too though, and has a countdown on the screen for them.

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


I mean sure, you could argue that you could type to your teammates and ask, but you can't deny that a player who has curse voice and can see everyones ult timers perfectly has an advantage over a player who has to ask, (and have people need to sit still and type numbers in potentially very time-constrained situations like teamfights.) He has extra knowledge allowing him to make split second decisions.

For example, a thresh player knowing he can follow that hook he just hit on the adc and engage, even though malph and yasuo's ults are on cooldown, because he can see they're up in exactly 2 seconds. While a non curse voice user, in the same situation in a solo queue game would look, see their ults weren't up, and not follow it.

But even regardless of what it does, it's just the fact that there's a third party addon, (which is currently not even publicly available) without which you are playing at a disadvantage compared to someone who has it, regardless of your skill level. That shouldn't be something which is allowed in a supposedly competitive environment like league ranked gameplay.
canikizu
Profile Joined September 2010
4860 Posts
April 22 2014 01:42 GMT
#84
CD timer is what LoL should have long time ago, in dota, you can just click on your teammates and see the cd.
Rito should replace the green dot on the avatar with the actual timer.
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
April 22 2014 02:20 GMT
#85
In DotA it's been there for something like a month or two? It's been put in like 2 patches ago max, if you say it like that you make it sound like it's been way longer.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
iCanada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada10660 Posts
April 22 2014 02:25 GMT
#86
I dunno, anyone who would look at a CD timer and put any stock into it probably doesn't need a CD timer for big things like ults and flashes anyway.

I mean, it certainly helps, but its not like you couldn't just type "Yo malph when your ult up?".

That being said, I do see the potential for hazard here, and I do understand why some people dont like it.
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35174 Posts
April 22 2014 02:28 GMT
#87
On April 22 2014 10:42 canikizu wrote:
CD timer is what LoL should have long time ago, in dota, you can just click on your teammates and see the cd.
Rito should replace the green dot on the avatar with the actual timer.

I remember when the spectator client went live people wanted the frames for their team. A Rioter said "We plan on it but it isn't a priority right now" aaand nothing came out of it.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-22 02:45:40
April 22 2014 02:31 GMT
#88
On April 22 2014 09:27 GolemMadness wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2014 08:56 cLutZ wrote:
Its kinda garbage to have an automatic timer. Its like a slightly less bs version of a macroing cheat that keeps all your production facilities building 1 unit at a time and all yall gots to do is turn them on/off.


This is the worst comparison ever. Timing buffs, which you can do yourself in like a second, vs a program that gives you perfect macro? What?


You see I was under the impression it was more like what it actually is as indicated by the picture below. Which means its incredibly powerful, because it doesn't just save you the typing time (I agree, fairly meaningless), but it saves you the need to check chat, remember to check chat, etc.

Most importantly it times more than any normal person could keep timed in their head in a countdown format so you can be like: "Oh, Dragon spawns in 45 seconds, karthus ult isn't ready for 15 seconds, we should rush it."

On April 22 2014 10:32 killerdog wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2014 09:12 iCanada wrote:
On April 22 2014 08:56 cLutZ wrote:
Its kinda garbage to have an automatic timer. Its like a slightly less bs version of a macroing cheat that keeps all your production facilities building 1 unit at a time and all yall gots to do is turn them on/off.


Baron and Dragon already time themselves via "player X has slain the Y".

Its not like it even changes anything. All it does it save the jungler 2s of typing while autoing wraiths. My give a shit level there is ridiculously low.

It times ults too though, and has a countdown on the screen for them.

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


I mean sure, you could argue that you could type to your teammates and ask, but you can't deny that a player who has curse voice and can see everyones ult timers perfectly has an advantage over a player who has to ask, (and have people need to sit still and type numbers in potentially very time-constrained situations like teamfights.) He has extra knowledge allowing him to make split second decisions.

For example, a thresh player knowing he can follow that hook he just hit on the adc and engage, even though malph and yasuo's ults are on cooldown, because he can see they're up in exactly 2 seconds. While a non curse voice user, in the same situation in a solo queue game would look, see their ults weren't up, and not follow it.

But even regardless of what it does, it's just the fact that there's a third party addon, (which is currently not even publicly available) without which you are playing at a disadvantage compared to someone who has it, regardless of your skill level. That shouldn't be something which is allowed in a supposedly competitive environment like league ranked gameplay.


I would guess that even up into challenger if one team had such an addon on 5 players, and the other had it on 0, it would be significantly larger than the 55/45 of blue vs. purple.

Edit: Its just basically one of those things like Macro, SHFFLing, or simply making free throws, that are all things that you technically "should" be able to do, but no one can do 100%, and the fact that you have to do them, actually makes the rest of the game harder.
Freeeeeeedom
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
April 22 2014 02:32 GMT
#89
On April 22 2014 10:42 canikizu wrote:
CD timer is what LoL should have long time ago, in dota, you can just click on your teammates and see the cd.
Rito should replace the green dot on the avatar with the actual timer.

lol thats cause it was based on warcraft 3 where you could select and hotkey >_>.

though i wish they would do that in league, but im sure bads would bitch about clicking something else
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
red_
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8474 Posts
April 22 2014 02:34 GMT
#90
#FreeSprayNPray

Worst patch change in the game's history.
How did the experience of working at Mr Burns' Nuclear Plant influence Homer's composition of the Iliad and Odyssey?
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35174 Posts
April 22 2014 02:39 GMT
#91
On April 22 2014 11:34 red_ wrote:
#FreeSprayNPray

Worst patch change in the game's history.

First they came for Finales Funklen...
AlterKot
Profile Blog Joined January 2014
Poland7525 Posts
April 22 2014 02:45 GMT
#92
Thorin is trying to make Monte and Froggen admit that Nien is a bad toplaner on his show. For 10 minutes neither of them admitted it nor denied it. I want him to play ADC for Coast too, but this is getting really mean.
Americans don't like to use unblockables, it is considered not honest. You press a button at the wrong time and hit the other person, you are random, not a top player. You DP Sim's far fierce, it is random and not honest.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
April 22 2014 02:57 GMT
#93
Bjergsen is offering Curse Voice beta keys to subscribers and he's just getting a constant stream of new subscribers.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
Gahlo
Profile Joined February 2010
United States35174 Posts
April 22 2014 03:01 GMT
#94
On April 22 2014 11:57 onlywonderboy wrote:
Bjergsen is offering Curse Voice beta keys to subscribers and he's just getting a constant stream of new subscribers.

When he had the sub chant set to 3 TSMs I got a massive headache.
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
April 22 2014 03:04 GMT
#95
On April 22 2014 11:45 AlterKot wrote:
Thorin is trying to make Monte and Froggen admit that Nien is a bad toplaner on his show. For 10 minutes neither of them admitted it nor denied it. I want him to play ADC for Coast too, but this is getting really mean.


Their last show was like 4 hours, I dont see how you can think about watching it live.

I really want to know what happened in G3 vs. TSM starting here:

Freeeeeeedom
Chrispy
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada5878 Posts
April 22 2014 03:08 GMT
#96
Hopefully Riot does something about the Curse voice/timer thing. I guess the only practical solution is to put up their own timers on the client... so let's hope they do that. Because having those timers easily accessible like that is an unfair advantage.. without doubt.
Retvrn to Forvms
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
April 22 2014 03:12 GMT
#97
On April 22 2014 12:08 Chrispy wrote:
Hopefully Riot does something about the Curse voice/timer thing. I guess the only practical solution is to put up their own timers on the client... so let's hope they do that. Because having those timers easily accessible like that is an unfair advantage.. without doubt.


They've responded to it: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=46621008#post46621008
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
April 22 2014 03:14 GMT
#98
Tried out Tristana in a ranked game. Tristana + Fiddle vs Caitlyn + Karma is no fun at all.
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
dae
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada1600 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-22 03:16:24
April 22 2014 03:15 GMT
#99
On April 22 2014 12:08 Chrispy wrote:
Hopefully Riot does something about the Curse voice/timer thing. I guess the only practical solution is to put up their own timers on the client... so let's hope they do that. Because having those timers easily accessible like that is an unfair advantage.. without doubt.


I hope the community backlash is enough to get curse voice banned, or at least have them remove the timers from it.

This stuff just starts a slippery slope for which there isn't a good answer to except riot saying exactly what is and what isn't allowed by a 3rd party app, which is weird and alot of work for them and just not a good policy.

Ban all 3rd party apps imo, if it should be in the game let riot add it. Don't make it so people have to get app's to be on an even footing (poor mac players).
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-22 03:25:39
April 22 2014 03:16 GMT
#100
On April 22 2014 11:31 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2014 09:27 GolemMadness wrote:
On April 22 2014 08:56 cLutZ wrote:
Its kinda garbage to have an automatic timer. Its like a slightly less bs version of a macroing cheat that keeps all your production facilities building 1 unit at a time and all yall gots to do is turn them on/off.


This is the worst comparison ever. Timing buffs, which you can do yourself in like a second, vs a program that gives you perfect macro? What?


You see I was under the impression it was more like what it actually is as indicated by the picture below. Which means its incredibly powerful, because it doesn't just save you the typing time (I agree, fairly meaningless), but it saves you the need to check chat, remember to check chat, etc.

Most importantly it times more than any normal person could keep timed in their head in a countdown format so you can be like: "Oh, Dragon spawns in 45 seconds, karthus ult isn't ready for 15 seconds, we should rush it."

Show nested quote +
On April 22 2014 10:32 killerdog wrote:
On April 22 2014 09:12 iCanada wrote:
On April 22 2014 08:56 cLutZ wrote:
Its kinda garbage to have an automatic timer. Its like a slightly less bs version of a macroing cheat that keeps all your production facilities building 1 unit at a time and all yall gots to do is turn them on/off.


Baron and Dragon already time themselves via "player X has slain the Y".

Its not like it even changes anything. All it does it save the jungler 2s of typing while autoing wraiths. My give a shit level there is ridiculously low.

It times ults too though, and has a countdown on the screen for them.

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


I mean sure, you could argue that you could type to your teammates and ask, but you can't deny that a player who has curse voice and can see everyones ult timers perfectly has an advantage over a player who has to ask, (and have people need to sit still and type numbers in potentially very time-constrained situations like teamfights.) He has extra knowledge allowing him to make split second decisions.

For example, a thresh player knowing he can follow that hook he just hit on the adc and engage, even though malph and yasuo's ults are on cooldown, because he can see they're up in exactly 2 seconds. While a non curse voice user, in the same situation in a solo queue game would look, see their ults weren't up, and not follow it.

But even regardless of what it does, it's just the fact that there's a third party addon, (which is currently not even publicly available) without which you are playing at a disadvantage compared to someone who has it, regardless of your skill level. That shouldn't be something which is allowed in a supposedly competitive environment like league ranked gameplay.


I would guess that even up into challenger if one team had such an addon on 5 players, and the other had it on 0, it would be significantly larger than the 55/45 of blue vs. purple.

Edit: Its just basically one of those things like Macro, SHFFLing, or simply making free throws, that are all things that you technically "should" be able to do, but no one can do 100%, and the fact that you have to do them, actually makes the rest of the game harder.

The issue isn't that it's making the game easier (or harder or whatever.)

It's that it's a proprietary, third party program which does it.

If there's something which has an acknowledged benefit for the user, then it should be either included in the client for everyone, or banned. Riot have always been clear on the fact that everyone should, so far as they can control, play on an equal footing. Even duo queue's are punished for their communication advantage by being made to play vs higher ranked opponents. Having it attached to third party software means that we're forced to blindly put our faith into this entirely new company to not only have safe and clean software, but also to take it upon themselves to make sure it's perfectly available to (and reliable for) everyone.

This doesn't just mean not paywalling it, it also means it needs to run perfectly on every single system league runs on, be it some wierd windows set up, a max client, some WINE style emulator or whatever else. Curse have no incentive to do this if it only affects a small portion of their userbase. There's also the fact that it runs off curse's own servers. So this "advantage" is also reliant on curse having reliable servers for everyone. etc etc

Independant companies don't have the incentive to ensure that their software works for *everyone*, People shouldn't be required to "trust" non riot companies by downloading their software in order to not have a disadvantage (whether it's curse, or "notavirusRU incorporated"), and if curse want to try and compete with teamspeak/mumble/skype for peoples communication needs, they shouldn't be allowed to bundle proprietary advantages with their software just to make it competitive.

We shouldn't have to have convoluted and seemingly intelligent arguments about "slippery slope" and whatever else.

If riot want to make these changes (which aren't necessarily bad) then do it client side, keep third party addons the fuck away from this game.
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