[Patch 4.6] Twitch VU General Discussion - Page 37

On April 24 2014 21:19 Alaric wrote:
Well I perceived Nautilus as weak because he can't safely gank at level 3, which at some point was nearly mandatory (his level 2 gank sucks too and he's boned even harder if he can't hit 3 off of it), so if it isn't standard anymore it obviously helps him, but not having to do it doesn't change the fact the he sucks at it, which at least hurtshis versatility.

On April 24 2014 21:41 Alaric wrote:
How do you build CDR on him though? SV isn't exactly good on him (even before the nerfs), FH is ass for its price (even though it's good for his kit, CDR, armour and the aura to keep the shield alive, mana he really needs as E drains his pool pretty fast during teamfights) and Glacial was already bad when they nerfed it to 10% CDR, so now that they raped it's defensive value...

Another problem with Naut is that he falls off pretty fast by himself, so your window is short if your teamcomp doesn't have the damage to pick up the slack once midgame is reached, but he isn't a good farmer and he requires quite a bit of gold to be useful/durable (because as you said CDR is important on him he can't get an early Sunfire like Amumu and call it a day; Maokai could do that too if he didn't need mana/mp5 so desperately).
It's not that he'd bad per see, but it's so easy to fall behind or screw up and miss your opportunity, which is pretty harsh on such a teammate-dependant champion.

On April 24 2014 20:21 GolemMadness wrote:
Does anyone else have a lot of trouble CSing after playing mostly support/jungle for a while? I've been supporting a lot recently, and now when I go mid my CSing is just terrible.

On April 24 2014 22:31 pokerface wrote:
Today I witnessed the unthinkable:Alistar jungle with feral flare into Botrk.By the time I gathered my shattered jaw from the floor he was 10-0.Plat 4 btw.

On April 24 2014 22:50 Sufficiency wrote:
Sorry what.

Since when did alistar clear fast?

On April 24 2014 18:56 arb wrote:

wonder if he thinks saying that makes him sound smarter l0l

On April 24 2014 17:50 Goumindong wrote:

It's possible but it's not realistic. Look at how often pro players miss smite when that is a pretty simple timing issue.

Anyway in a burst situation you have to know four things. Your unmodified damage, their hp, their effective armor, their effective mr. Your I modified damage is pretty easy. You know your full ratio and base damages (at the very least roughly) and you can read your AP. You can calculate your burst ahead of time so that you don't have to look. If I am lux and level 16 I can say 1200 + 2.05 AP. 400 AP is 810 so 2000 damage burst minimum (more with autos/ignite)

But then I have to figure it out for the enemy hp/mr/armor. So I have to have them in vision long enough to see their mr/armor and I have to be able to click on them before I am planning my burst to read their HP. I have to recalculate every back.

If it's a burst situation you can only do this if the enemy is in vision long enough (as their hp is changing). In those situations you have the time to do this, great. But largely the situations where it's going to be possible are the situations where these opportunities are going to be fleeting and fast with little to no time to prep.

Importantly while this is going on you need to be giving full attention to your positioning, cooldowns, enemy cooldowns, etc making the overhead to do the calculation even if it's simple, very high.

Alternately the action will have an obvious dominated solution (as in yes always engage its obvious you win the exchange) or (no don't its obvious you lose).

Add all this together and it seems reasonable that precise values are good(especially during laning) but intuitive estimates are probably better. Additionally things like cooldowns like heal and shields are going to make far more of an impact than the difference between your intuitive and precise calculation so it's better to take the mental energy to track those.

On April 24 2014 23:06 chalice wrote:

i'm not saying that they are doing calculations on the fly, but rather that it's very likely that they have memorized exactly how much base damage a flash-E-auto-Q-ignite combo from a lulu with 4 points in Q and 2 points in E will do to a midlaner with no mr/lvl scaling and a chalice of harmony worth of mr itemization and how much that damage changes based on glyph choices and if the lulu has a codex, blasting wand, or NLR.

and there is no reason at all to think that a 300apm former starcraft pro doesn't have the multitasking to always be aware of exactly how much hp/armor/mr their lane opponent has and what items everyone on the other team has. there is such a small actual apm requirement in league compared the general korean pro gamer level of multitasking and it's silly to think that kind of ability isn't going to be used in some way.

On April 24 2014 23:26 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:


I'm sure everyone knows the base damages of their skills and their scaling, but they don't memorize the damage exactly, nor how that is impacted with different resists. It's 100% played on intuition and experience.

LS has some weird obsession with making every Koreano sound like perfect robot players, and by association try to raise his own prestige or something stupid like that. As multiple people have pointed out, LS is basically full of shit. If you're taking his word for it, well, that's a little bit absurd.

It was easy for BW pros to memorize build times because, well, it's just one number attached to a limited number of buildings and units, and the times aren't offset by anything else. In Dota, magic damage is mitigated by a constant percentage, with very very few ways to alter it, so people often committed to memorizing the actual damage done by spells. In League, it's simply not worth the effort due to the sheer number of variables present.

And the claim that people went and measure how long it takes to get from fountain to Baron with different move speeds and skill usages is patently absurd.

To make it clear: I don't doubt the players' ability to do these things, but that doesn't mean I think they're stupid enough to not realize there are far, far better uses of their time and efforts when trying to improve at the game.