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[Patch 4.1] Season 4 Start General Discussion - Page 163

Forum Index > LoL General
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Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
February 02 2014 19:53 GMT
#3241
On February 03 2014 04:28 nafta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:26 wei2coolman wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:58 Slusher wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:35 Shikyo wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:09 Slusher wrote:
wtf leona needs dshield less than like any other support

How? She's melee... I'd say she needs it more than like any other support


Relic shield isn't worse enough to justify the gold difference when you take into consideration

a) W
b) the nature of Leona trades
c) How good Leona scales with items
d) Leona can put 21 in D, does not need as much of the utility tree as a lot of the ranged supports. (or I should say is too good with 21 D to justify deep utility ofc deep utility "could" be useful)

it (unintentionally I'm sure) is a lot better on ranged supports who want to auto trade a lot, because it allows them to get a lot more out of the trade than an adc with a dblade think, Annie, Karma, Lulu, Thresh

oh and Sona ofc, Sona virtually nonviable w/o dshield I would say she needs it more than any other support.

The problem with relic is the level 1-2, where leona sorta gets shoved on and enemies get level 2 earlier. If you can hit level 3 without getting dumped on by an all in at level 2, then relic shield is better. But Dshield mitigates a lot of the level 1-2 shenanigans that happens.

You could just buy 3 pots and it would be literally the same except you would get more gold and heal your ad a bit.Most people know you have to 1v2 pretty much really early when you playing with leona.It is standart to stay in xp range and miss a few cs not the end of world.


I am not sure. I feel that in the Leona vs Thresh matchup, if Leona has D Shield and Thresh does not, Thresh will get pushed around like crazy. The difference is huge.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
yamato77
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
11589 Posts
February 02 2014 19:55 GMT
#3242
Riot's problem has always been their inability to see the game as an organic being. Just because they designed something with a particular purpose in mind DOES NOT mean that emergent gameplay will see it in the same light. Thus, their decisions are often heavy-handed because they are insistent on forcing their ideas instead of letting the game evolve on its own.

GP10, Wriggle's, jungle items, jungle camps, warding and now the support items have all seen inelegant changes forced upon them so that Riot can dictate how their game is to be played. Of course, they do this with the mindset that they are creating a game that is both fun to play and fun to watch, as is obviously their business interest.

So, my question to you, GD, do you enjoy playing or watching the game now more than you did before all these changes? Obviously some of these changes date back to S2 or earlier, so some of you might have a different perspective, but it is still important nonetheless. Is Riot doing a good job making a fun game to watch/play?
Writer@WriterYamato
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 19:57:59
February 02 2014 19:55 GMT
#3243
what else is thresh seriously going to start though

also thresh has a ranged attack to harass her away so it all depends on thresh hooks on how leona engages like every other thresh and leona matchup
Shiznick
Profile Joined December 2008
United States2200 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 19:58:37
February 02 2014 19:56 GMT
#3244
On February 03 2014 04:49 Slayer91 wrote:
Dorans shield damage reduction occurs BEFORE all defensive scaling I think. Otherwise it would be broken
ancient coin is much worse as gp10 , I often get 800-1000 gold from the relic shield shit.

I've read in multiple places that Doran's Shield applies after armor, but they didn't really corroborate with test results or anything like that.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 20:00:12
February 02 2014 19:59 GMT
#3245
On February 03 2014 04:56 Shiznick wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:49 Slayer91 wrote:
Dorans shield damage reduction occurs BEFORE all defensive scaling I think. Otherwise it would be broken
ancient coin is much worse as gp10 , I often get 800-1000 gold from the relic shield shit.

I've read in multiple places that Doran's Shield applies after armor, but they didn't really corroborate with test results or anything like that.


source?
http://www.reignofgaming.net/forums/strategy/runes-and-mastery-discussion/30802-mastery-theorycrafting-reinforced-armor-doran
"For those who did not want to read the full test result:

Doran Shield blocks 6 raw damage before armor calculation"
this was before the block buff but there's no reason that riot would change
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
February 02 2014 20:00 GMT
#3246
On February 03 2014 04:53 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:28 nafta wrote:
On February 03 2014 04:26 wei2coolman wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:58 Slusher wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:35 Shikyo wrote:
On February 03 2014 03:09 Slusher wrote:
wtf leona needs dshield less than like any other support

How? She's melee... I'd say she needs it more than like any other support


Relic shield isn't worse enough to justify the gold difference when you take into consideration

a) W
b) the nature of Leona trades
c) How good Leona scales with items
d) Leona can put 21 in D, does not need as much of the utility tree as a lot of the ranged supports. (or I should say is too good with 21 D to justify deep utility ofc deep utility "could" be useful)

it (unintentionally I'm sure) is a lot better on ranged supports who want to auto trade a lot, because it allows them to get a lot more out of the trade than an adc with a dblade think, Annie, Karma, Lulu, Thresh

oh and Sona ofc, Sona virtually nonviable w/o dshield I would say she needs it more than any other support.

The problem with relic is the level 1-2, where leona sorta gets shoved on and enemies get level 2 earlier. If you can hit level 3 without getting dumped on by an all in at level 2, then relic shield is better. But Dshield mitigates a lot of the level 1-2 shenanigans that happens.

You could just buy 3 pots and it would be literally the same except you would get more gold and heal your ad a bit.Most people know you have to 1v2 pretty much really early when you playing with leona.It is standart to stay in xp range and miss a few cs not the end of world.


I am not sure. I feel that in the Leona vs Thresh matchup, if Leona has D Shield and Thresh does not, Thresh will get pushed around like crazy. The difference is huge.

Pre 6 leona shouldnt be able to do anything no matter your starting items.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
February 02 2014 20:00 GMT
#3247
flay can rapp leonas e but sometimes you can still get stun off actually
Haiq343
Profile Joined August 2011
United States2548 Posts
February 02 2014 20:00 GMT
#3248
On February 03 2014 04:56 Shiznick wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:49 Slayer91 wrote:
Dorans shield damage reduction occurs BEFORE all defensive scaling I think. Otherwise it would be broken
ancient coin is much worse as gp10 , I often get 800-1000 gold from the relic shield shit.

I've read in multiple places that Doran's Shield applies after armor, but they didn't really corroborate with test results or anything like that.

Go do Science!
I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination. Imagination is more important than knowledge. For knowledge is limited, whereas imagination encircles the world. -Einstein
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
February 02 2014 20:05 GMT
#3249
On February 03 2014 05:00 Slayer91 wrote:
flay can rapp leonas e but sometimes you can still get stun off actually

What do you mean?She still jumps if thresh flays too early or his ad has bad positioning and doesn't feel like babysitting him.Still think should be easy for a thresh lane to be ahead in cs at least pre 6 vs leona.
Shiznick
Profile Joined December 2008
United States2200 Posts
February 02 2014 20:09 GMT
#3250
On February 03 2014 04:59 Slayer91 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:56 Shiznick wrote:
On February 03 2014 04:49 Slayer91 wrote:
Dorans shield damage reduction occurs BEFORE all defensive scaling I think. Otherwise it would be broken
ancient coin is much worse as gp10 , I often get 800-1000 gold from the relic shield shit.

I've read in multiple places that Doran's Shield applies after armor, but they didn't really corroborate with test results or anything like that.


source?
http://www.reignofgaming.net/forums/strategy/runes-and-mastery-discussion/30802-mastery-theorycrafting-reinforced-armor-doran
"For those who did not want to read the full test result:

Doran Shield blocks 6 raw damage before armor calculation"
this was before the block buff but there's no reason that riot would change

all of the topics I saw by googling didn't actually do any experiments like in that post, so I guess I was wrong.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22425 Posts
February 02 2014 20:10 GMT
#3251
On February 03 2014 04:28 Yezzus wrote:
NA servers are so fucked and no loss forgivens...

Why would there be loss forgiven?
EU had the problem for months and months and rarely to never got loss forgiven.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
ArchAngelSC
Profile Joined April 2012
England706 Posts
February 02 2014 20:11 GMT
#3252
On February 03 2014 05:10 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:28 Yezzus wrote:
NA servers are so fucked and no loss forgivens...

Why would there be loss forgiven?
EU had the problem for months and months and rarely to never got loss forgiven.

I play on EUW and I've never had a single loss forgiven ever.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
February 02 2014 20:12 GMT
#3253
I have seen/had a lot of loss forgivens.....not enough though :D.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
February 02 2014 20:19 GMT
#3254
On February 03 2014 05:05 nafta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 05:00 Slayer91 wrote:
flay can rapp leonas e but sometimes you can still get stun off actually

What do you mean?She still jumps if thresh flays too early or his ad has bad positioning and doesn't feel like babysitting him.Still think should be easy for a thresh lane to be ahead in cs at least pre 6 vs leona.


its pretty volatile depending on hooks and engages
being ahead in cs is whatever it depends on ads
Vanka
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
China1336 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 20:23:23
February 02 2014 20:22 GMT
#3255
I've seen two losses forgiven's so far, and I'm on my promo too so this is pretty sweet

EDIT: on NA, not in china for two weeks
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
February 02 2014 20:31 GMT
#3256
On February 03 2014 04:52 nafta wrote:
Problem is there is nobody who can get talisman and it is a rather strong active.Otherwise targon gives a lot more gold yeah.


I actually think mountain shield is stronger in solo as it's power is entirely dictated by the holder in comparison
Carrilord has arrived.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
February 02 2014 20:38 GMT
#3257
On February 03 2014 05:31 Slusher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2014 04:52 nafta wrote:
Problem is there is nobody who can get talisman and it is a rather strong active.Otherwise targon gives a lot more gold yeah.


I actually think mountain shield is stronger in solo as it's power is entirely dictated by the holder in comparison


that sentence was like a badly translated chinese proverb
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
February 02 2014 20:51 GMT
#3258
Try to conserve words when phone posting
Carrilord has arrived.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
February 02 2014 20:59 GMT
#3259
I dunno having a visible GO TEAM PLS sign and being on an initiator is beast.
MattBarry
Profile Joined March 2011
United States4006 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-02-02 21:48:57
February 02 2014 21:48 GMT
#3260
I run 34 armor 12 mr 0/30/0 with dshield start on Leona/Thresh. Sometimes I buy Relic on Leona, I don't think it makes much of a difference at that point. Is there any point on getting utility/offensive tree on melee supports I'm liking this set up.
Platinum Support GOD
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