On January 16 2014 04:24 TheYango wrote: Yeah i know that. My point is that if stability is their aim, then 6 month patch cycles are going to give you a much more stable game than patching every month. That doesn't mean the game is going to be better just because it's "stable".
i agree
Regarding early vision: you could reduce the duration of the trinket ward to make it a tactical choice early on, for warding off jungle invades and what not. Currently, though, perhaps reducing the trinket ward to a 30s duration levels 1-6s, and 75s from 6-9, and 120s from 9 onwards may be an acceptable duration.
Don't entirely buy it, but it's possible.
On January 16 2014 04:33 Ketara wrote:
On January 16 2014 03:51 Lord Tolkien wrote:
On January 16 2014 03:50 Ketara wrote: You know how I'd like them to reduce level 1 vision?
I'd like it if the enemy teams summoner spells didn't come up in the loading screen.
That'd be awesome.
But what exactly does that change besides hitting tab right after you load?
If you had to actually see a champion on the minimap before you knew their summoners like you do for their items, it'd put more weight on level 1 scouting, and make it easier to do cheesy strategies like that 4 man mid rush that we saw in whatever Korean tournament it was.
Oh, the APAM strat.
I don't think opening up the room for cheese makes for a fun experience lol.
Go watch the 4 mid game and tell me it's not one of the most awesome games ever.
I'm sure it's on youtube somewhere. Somebody help me find it!
if people only played aram, then games with dynamic laning phase, jungling, roaming from lanes to gank, dragon plays, split pushing etc. would be fucking amazing
On January 16 2014 04:37 cLutZ wrote: 1. Do you want smart drafting, outlaning your opponents, then making good objective calls and teamfights to win games.
OR
2. Do you want fog of war and calculated, but still essentially random choices to determine games.
The way you present this dichotomy is so biased that it's absurd.
How would you describe it then?
There is no better way for a worse team to win a game than to exploit the earlygame fog of war. And it is not even always about making the right call to counter that, which is why people hate it. You could be going to do a normally safe (and wise) thing, like ward a banana bush, and get first blooded.
Fog of war sometimes rewards dumb decisions, and sometimes rewards smart decisions. It will reward smart ones more often than not, just like raising with pocket kings will typically pay off more than raising with 2s. It is straight up the correct way to compare and contrast the two philosophies: do you want to lean more towards action-chess or action-poker?
its a combination, just like nearly every game that is played, in starcraft theres a combination of skill and mind games also
its pretty hard to "exploit" fog of war and get lucky enough that you beat a better team unless you are already NEARLY as good as them and need like a 5% gold advantage to win teamfights
because you can still have smart drafting and all that stuff but then also more random elements promoting not just picking for teamfights but also perhaps for an early game strat like on doto
the problem is in LoL its too easy to pick super safe ungankable laners and promoting this just makes easier to gank champs who aren't even stronger (think talon vs zed, zed has an escape and is just as good or better) unplayable.
I usually don't care about stuff like patches etc. but the one thing I really really cared about what the increase of avaliability of vision in the early game. Back when everyone went boots+3 because boots gave 50mspeed and you really needed it sooo much of decision making in jungle were coinflips with different risk/reward and it was really painful to play sometimes, because went on nothing more than guesses. I really like trinkets, because they allow some form of vision, but since their uptime is only 50% earlygame there is still a lot of room for unseen aggresion and a lot of decisions to be made. It's like the perfect balance imo I wouldn't really want to touch it too much from fear of ruining it. so for what it's worth Rito gets my +1 for early game vision changes
On January 16 2014 01:59 Ghost-z wrote: I hope when they rework PD and Shiv to be more distinct they remove Avarice from the recipe just like the other gold items. Avarice should be reworked into an AD item that increases gold from monsters and made only to build into Wriggles (madreds+avarice). Then they can re-balance that shit into something useful.
And where are the Rune changes they've been talking about!
Put Avarice blade in IE, get rid of the cloak. That item needs some help. Crit on Wriggles would be awful and it's getting an upgrade anyway.
On January 16 2014 02:03 Sufficiency wrote: Rune changes saved for S5 I bet.
The goal was to get it done before the season. Surprise surprise, Riot mismanaged their time and missed their goal.
The only thing that bothers me at first glance is the change to outer turrets.
I thought that the inherent risk in doing a 2v1 swap was weakening your dragon-side anyway, so the attempt to force 2v2 bot lanes is really something that I don't much appreciate.
On January 16 2014 01:59 Ghost-z wrote: I hope when they rework PD and Shiv to be more distinct they remove Avarice from the recipe just like the other gold items. Avarice should be reworked into an AD item that increases gold from monsters and made only to build into Wriggles (madreds+avarice). Then they can re-balance that shit into something useful.
And where are the Rune changes they've been talking about!
Put Avarice blade in IE, get rid of the cloak. That item needs some help. Crit on Wriggles would be awful and it's getting an upgrade anyway.
On January 16 2014 05:16 Slayer91 wrote: because you can still have smart drafting and all that stuff but then also more random elements promoting not just picking for teamfights but also perhaps for an early game strat like on doto
the problem is in LoL its too easy to pick super safe ungankable laners and promoting this just makes easier to gank champs who aren't even stronger (think talon vs zed, zed has an escape and is just as good or better) unplayable.
That is literally, 100% a balance issue. A champ with an escape should be significantly weaker in 1v1s, 2v2s, etc. Like Lee Sin should get dumpstered by Olaf when they fight, Renekton should get trucked by Udyr, Talon should have much more damage or tankiness than Zed (in your example), etc.
On January 16 2014 05:28 Scip wrote: I usually don't care about stuff like patches etc. but the one thing I really really cared about what the increase of avaliability of vision in the early game. Back when everyone went boots+3 because boots gave 50mspeed and you really needed it sooo much of decision making in jungle were coinflips with different risk/reward and it was really painful to play sometimes, because went on nothing more than guesses. I really like trinkets, because they allow some form of vision, but since their uptime is only 50% earlygame there is still a lot of room for unseen aggresion and a lot of decisions to be made. It's like the perfect balance imo I wouldn't really want to touch it too much from fear of ruining it. so for what it's worth Rito gets my +1 for early game vision changes
Scip kinda saying what I was feeling, but much more jungler-centric.
I have never in my life ever dreamt of agreeing with cLutZ on anything :D I think laners generally enjoy the bigger avaliability of vision early game too, it allows you to be a lot more aggresive in lane instead of just do things like play pussy and let the lane get pushed to you to your opponent gets scared and you freeze in front of tower lol, that was just rather silly imoimo
Udyr used to truck renekton, but riot nerfed him because he used to truck renekton
It is a balance issue its just a kinda weird way to balance based on how good your champ is at avoiding ganks because it's not THAT hard to play pretty safe and you can snowball super hard if you're really buffed that much that you HAVE to gank them to make up for it. I can see why riot is being cautious.
On January 16 2014 05:50 Slayer91 wrote: Udyr used to truck renekton, but riot nerfed him because he used to truck renekton
It is a balance issue its just a kinda weird way to balance based on how good your champ is at avoiding ganks because it's not THAT hard to play pretty safe and you can snowball super hard if you're really buffed that much that you HAVE to gank them to make up for it. I can see why riot is being cautious.
It's because of how small the map is and how turrets work.
EPT
