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So, I have been trying to find a solution. So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide, and I think at this point, it is far unsolved that its own thread is warranted.
I have been unable to win against Fizz as Syndra. Period. At all. I have tried a wealth of different strategies and yet, nothing has worked. I have not been able to find any VODs of a Syndra player beating a Fizz.
Strategies Tried:
1.) All-In Level 1
Go full AD and AA all-in and Flash+Ignite on him. Lose horribly.
2.) Level 1 Harass
Go full AP, Doran's Ring, and spam spells on him until he dies. Flash + Ignite. Lose horribly.
3.) Standard.
Go standard AP, harass/farm. Lose horribly.
4.) Super-defensive-farm
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in.
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Playing against Fizz is a manageable lane as Syndra in my opinion as she has such a long range. Stay out of his Q range and he can't reach you (and if hes confident enough to use E to get in Q range he blows a HUGE chunk of mana and wastes his only defensive ability to hit you, which you can abuse) and run around in unpredictable patterns so he can't catch you with his ult.
From my experience of playing as and against Fizz i can say that hes just as strong as any other champion until he picks up a kill or two, then he starts snowballing like crazy. If Fizz manages to pick up a kill then you should ask for some jungle intervention. Something i've seen some players do against me is go for Rod of Ages first item to survive the level 6 burst and it seems like a solid choice in my opinion.
To reiterate: don't fall behind, play carefully and smart and you should manage. Fizz is one of the strongest all-in champions if not the strongest in the mid lane. Harass him with auto attacks at level 1, and poke him a bit with abilities after 2 but don't get close enough for him to attack back. Once hes low he can't really go all-in on you unless you slip up.
If all else fails, play him yourself and you should get a feel for his strengths and weaknesses.
EDIT: If a Fizz has blue buff, you gotta be extra cautious as he can W+Q you then E away instantly without any chance of retaliation. If he E>W+Q's you, back off then unload back at him once at a safe distance and he starts retreating. Never take a Fizz Q+W for free, try to do some damage back but don't overdo it and get yourself killed.
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I can't help with your problem regarding the match up as I basically don't play mid. That being said, you should consider using either the syndra thread of the fizz thread for help (in the strategy section).
On August 13 2013 00:53 XilDarkz wrote:
So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide
Technically you asked in three different threads but I think for most TL- lol members you only asked in one place: general discussions. The fact that new threads were started for new patches doesn't make much of a difference.
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I don't think there is a single syndra main on TL.
The most basic way I can think of Syndra to deal with Fizz is running Flat MR runes, and 14/16 masteries.
Try opening up with early Chalice (the early mr will help tons).
Also try to abuse his E cooldowns. He needs his E to farm the lane quickly, so the second you see him use his E, try and all-in or force him out of lane.
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in.
Don't open up Null Magic Mantle, that's just bad. Fizz's timing, like most assassins is usually level 4 and level 6.
You can just open up farie charms, and get the NMM later in the chalice build.
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Baa?21242 Posts
You dont beat fizz. You just dont.
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Baa?21242 Posts
No one beats fizz all you do is get jungler to camp until he is 0-10 and 3 levrls below you at which point he will still 1 shot you 1v1 cause lolfizz is lolbalanced
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The number 1 priority laning against fizz is to keep movespeed parity with him at all times. When he recalls for an early sorcerer's shoes, you get mercs or sorc shoes to match. Boots 1 to boots 1. IF he is able to urchin strike you without using playful&trickster then that's completely your fault and you will begin to lose the lane.
Don't be afraid to flash as early as possible so he doesn't hit his shark + urchin strike when you're low. In particular no dash champions (Syndra, TF, etc) who also have long range, try a super strong early game item build (2 or 3 doran rings, boots 2 whenever you need). Don't be too concerned over early game last hits and try to be positive as a game goes on because most of the time the AP carry is also the solution to stopping fizz lategame (burst damage, zhonya item build, crowd control). Make a constant mental note on fizz's cooldowns (read it on the wiki) and force that fizz to use spells to dodge your spells while not being stupidly aggressive that you get ganked retardedly. Make a mental note on fizz's full damage as well (a bit harder to do), but if you can do that correctly you start to recognize a person's general playstyle (if he's willing to risk things, or he's willing to gank the shit out of the other laners).
EDIT: If I see you on LiquidPractice, we can discuss this match up further
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On August 13 2013 02:21 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
No one beats fizz all you do is get jungler to camp until he is 0-10 and 3 levrls below you at which point he will still 1 shot you 1v1 cause lolfizz is lolbalanced
I sense a painful history.
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On August 13 2013 02:59 MCMilo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +The number 1 priority laning against fizz is to keep movespeed parity with him at all times. When he recalls for an early sorcerer's shoes, you get mercs or sorc shoes to match. Boots 1 to boots 1. IF he is able to urchin strike you without using playful&trickster then that's completely your fault and you will begin to lose the lane.
Don't be afraid to flash as early as possible so he doesn't hit his shark + urchin strike when you're low. In particular no dash champions (Syndra, TF, etc) who also have long range, try a super strong early game item build (2 or 3 doran rings, boots 2 whenever you need). Don't be too concerned over early game last hits and try to be positive as a game goes on because most of the time the AP carry is also the solution to stopping fizz lategame (burst damage, zhonya item build, crowd control). Make a constant mental note on fizz's cooldowns (read it on the wiki) and force that fizz to use spells to dodge your spells while not being stupidly aggressive that you get ganked retardedly. Make a mental note on fizz's full damage as well (a bit harder to do), but if you can do that correctly you start to recognize a person's general playstyle (if he's willing to risk things, or he's willing to gank the shit out of the other laners).
EDIT: If I see you on LiquidPractice, we can discuss this match up further
Also important to buy plenty of wards. If the enemy fizz realizes your playing too safe to kill, it's important to also protect your teammates. If you can push the lane to enemy turret before the next wave comes it's best to do that. You don't want to be pushed up in this lane. You don't have to win every lane to win the game. This is one of those lanes where you won't win unless the other guy is terrible.
On August 13 2013 02:21 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
No one beats fizz all you do is get jungler to camp until he is 0-10 and 3 levrls below you at which point he will still 1 shot you 1v1 cause lolfizz is lolbalanced
As an anivia player, I feel your pain.
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As an Anivia player, you deserve it.
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On August 13 2013 03:50 Alaric wrote:
As an Anivia player, you deserve it.
GTFO
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Play a champion other than Syndra. Problem solved.
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I may be wrong, but it basically sounds like you main a champion who is normally a lane bully, and for the first time have encountered a champion who can consistently out-bully you. What's probably making the matchup so hard is that you aren't used to coming into the lane in a disadvantaged position, and aren't used to playing defensively.
It's essentially an issue of experience. I imagine that even if you knew the correct/optimal/best way to handle the situation that your execution thereof would be iffy just due to where the bulk of your experience.
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On August 13 2013 03:53 SnK-Arcbound wrote:
Play a champion other than Syndra. Problem solved.
At his level, it's rarely matchup dependent. Most problems can be solved just by simply being a better player.
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You can just take Barrier and cut your death rate in half
[edit] Wait I just reread this and you're losing to Fizz when you come with Barrier? You're just playing badly then, either you're runed wrong or you are simply misplaying or both. [/edit]
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This is how Lux wins lane against Fizz so I assume it works for Syndra too as long as you're not like taking Qs from him without forcing him to E first
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On August 13 2013 01:27 wei2coolman wrote:I don't think there is a single syndra main on TL.The most basic way I can think of Syndra to deal with Fizz is running Flat MR runes, and 14/16 masteries. Try opening up with early Chalice (the early mr will help tons). Also try to abuse his E cooldowns. He needs his E to farm the lane quickly, so the second you see him use his E, try and all-in or force him out of lane. Show nested quote +Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. Don't open up Null Magic Mantle, that's just bad. Fizz's timing, like most assassins is usually level 4 and level 6. You can just open up farie charms, and get the NMM later in the chalice build.
What about that mega troll guy who only goes syndra mid or jungle every game.
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On August 13 2013 05:51 Jerubaal wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 01:27 wei2coolman wrote:I don't think there is a single syndra main on TL.The most basic way I can think of Syndra to deal with Fizz is running Flat MR runes, and 14/16 masteries. Try opening up with early Chalice (the early mr will help tons). Also try to abuse his E cooldowns. He needs his E to farm the lane quickly, so the second you see him use his E, try and all-in or force him out of lane. Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. Don't open up Null Magic Mantle, that's just bad. Fizz's timing, like most assassins is usually level 4 and level 6. You can just open up farie charms, and get the NMM later in the chalice build. What about that mega troll guy who only goes syndra mid or jungle every game.
That's the OP
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Fizz wins lanes against squishy mages. That's kinda what he does. You just have to play super defensive. Load up on flat MR blues. Get a few early doran's rings and/or build into catalyst. If all else fails get a negatron; you can turn it into abyssal later.
Mostly you need to just farm at range with your skills and be very aware of your positioning.
Try using flat MR blues. Get Flat MR quints if you're really scared. Heck, get hp yellows if you're really really scared. Still go for penetration reds though. Try opening with a flask/pots/ward start. Just farm at range with your Q and W.
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Also if you let him push on you, you deserve to lose. Fizz E lets him chunk you for a bunch under your tower, so don't let that happen.
Also make sure to back often
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On August 13 2013 05:52 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 05:51 Jerubaal wrote:On August 13 2013 01:27 wei2coolman wrote:I don't think there is a single syndra main on TL.The most basic way I can think of Syndra to deal with Fizz is running Flat MR runes, and 14/16 masteries. Try opening up with early Chalice (the early mr will help tons). Also try to abuse his E cooldowns. He needs his E to farm the lane quickly, so the second you see him use his E, try and all-in or force him out of lane. Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. Don't open up Null Magic Mantle, that's just bad. Fizz's timing, like most assassins is usually level 4 and level 6. You can just open up farie charms, and get the NMM later in the chalice build. What about that mega troll guy who only goes syndra mid or jungle every game. That's the OP
Oh lol.
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On August 13 2013 00:53 XilDarkz wrote:
So, I have been trying to find a solution. So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide, and I think at this point, it is far unsolved that its own thread is warranted.
I have been unable to win against Fizz as Syndra. Period. At all. I have tried a wealth of different strategies and yet, nothing has worked. I have not been able to find any VODs of a Syndra player beating a Fizz.
Strategies Tried:
1.) All-In Level 1
Go full AD and AA all-in and Flash+Ignite on him. Lose horribly.
2.) Level 1 Harass
Go full AP, Doran's Ring, and spam spells on him until he dies. Flash + Ignite. Lose horribly.
3.) Standard.
Go standard AP, harass/farm. Lose horribly.
4.) Super-defensive-farm
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in.
syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time.
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On August 13 2013 09:59 ReachTheSky wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 00:53 XilDarkz wrote:
So, I have been trying to find a solution. So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide, and I think at this point, it is far unsolved that its own thread is warranted.
I have been unable to win against Fizz as Syndra. Period. At all. I have tried a wealth of different strategies and yet, nothing has worked. I have not been able to find any VODs of a Syndra player beating a Fizz.
Strategies Tried:
1.) All-In Level 1
Go full AD and AA all-in and Flash+Ignite on him. Lose horribly.
2.) Level 1 Harass
Go full AP, Doran's Ring, and spam spells on him until he dies. Flash + Ignite. Lose horribly.
3.) Standard.
Go standard AP, harass/farm. Lose horribly.
4.) Super-defensive-farm
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time.
If it were that easy to beat fizz as a skillshot dependant champion I think fizz wouldn't see so much success.
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On August 13 2013 10:07 Amui wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 09:59 ReachTheSky wrote:On August 13 2013 00:53 XilDarkz wrote:
So, I have been trying to find a solution. So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide, and I think at this point, it is far unsolved that its own thread is warranted.
I have been unable to win against Fizz as Syndra. Period. At all. I have tried a wealth of different strategies and yet, nothing has worked. I have not been able to find any VODs of a Syndra player beating a Fizz.
Strategies Tried:
1.) All-In Level 1
Go full AD and AA all-in and Flash+Ignite on him. Lose horribly.
2.) Level 1 Harass
Go full AP, Doran's Ring, and spam spells on him until he dies. Flash + Ignite. Lose horribly.
3.) Standard.
Go standard AP, harass/farm. Lose horribly.
4.) Super-defensive-farm
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time. If it were that easy to beat fizz as a skillshot dependant champion I think fizz wouldn't see so much success.
I'm guessin you're talking about EU LCS? Fizz usually loses in CS out of lane, which is to be expected. Sometimes quite badly, that's simply the ranged/melee interaction in lane. However, Fizz is simply able to out roam anyone, mostly because his all-in potential is so strong, that if you follow him to countergank a sidelane, you're just going to end up feeding him a kill.
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On August 13 2013 09:59 ReachTheSky wrote:
syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time.
What league are you/Summoner name? I'd like to try some custom games with you if possible (just 1v1 Syndra Fizz)
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Run semi-defensive runes - your favorite aggressive marks and quints, Armor Yellows, MR blues.
21/9/0 or 17/13/0 (block spec) should both be fine.
At level 1, figure out what he skilled. If he took Q or E, he can jump but he doesn't have a lot of damage to follow it up. Aggressively harass him, if he jumps on you then quickly switch into kiting mode while still doing damage to him (he has no escape besides flash.) Your shit is on lower cooldown, use that to win. Remember he takes less damage from minions, so you can't trade with him if you're BOTH eating minion damage (honestly this is probably partly why you lost some allins vs. him) but if he's eating ranged minions while you aren't, you should be alright. I think.
If he skills W, then NEVER LET HIM MELEE YOU. Harass-kite aggressively, he has no gapcloser beyond flash. Don't let him touch creeps while you slowpush the wave. A single melee auto attack from activated-W is basically a full nuke + an auto. Pot to keep your health high, because his passive autoattack dot is X%Missing health.
Don't fall behind in exp in these early levels - I'm not sure how you would, you're ranged and he's melee and you have spammable aoe. I recommend slowpushing the wave rather than slamming it quickly into his tower, because a big creep wave means he can't really attack you. Even his Q draws ranged minion aggro.
At level 2 he either has a lot of damage and only 1 jump, or both jumps but shit damage. Probably the former. Again, a W-active auto HURTS LIKE FUCK. Repeated ones after that hurt a bit less because the DOT only reapplies, but they hurt.
Level 3-5, he gets his whole toolkit and here's where you have to be careful (hopefully you have harassed him well up til now) At this point, if he's not using E to escape, you should be able to maul him with skill combos. If he uses E to do anything (beware, he may dodge a Q and land on your face off his pole, this is rough to deal with.) you should stun him, harass him, but beware his QW engage.
At level 6+, beware the fish, but it's one of the easily-missed skillshots. Flashdodge the fish if you need to. Shove the wave hard but safely. He can skill E to shove back, but it's incredibly mana intensive and HEAVILY REQUIRES blue buff. (Contesting his blue buff may be fruitful, but don't get fishdunked when doing so.) Just try to keep him in your lane and not triple kill counterganking bot lane or something.
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Like every hard lane you need to punish the enemy champion as hard as you can on the levels you are stronger and play defensive when he is stronger.
For this match up in particular it's easy, you are a bit stronger the first level and get shat on the following 17 so yeah. What I do about the Fizz problem or any other problem is ignore it and hope it goes away.
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On August 13 2013 10:07 Amui wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 09:59 ReachTheSky wrote:On August 13 2013 00:53 XilDarkz wrote:
So, I have been trying to find a solution. So far, I have posted in three different threads repeatedly seeking aide, and I think at this point, it is far unsolved that its own thread is warranted.
I have been unable to win against Fizz as Syndra. Period. At all. I have tried a wealth of different strategies and yet, nothing has worked. I have not been able to find any VODs of a Syndra player beating a Fizz.
Strategies Tried:
1.) All-In Level 1
Go full AD and AA all-in and Flash+Ignite on him. Lose horribly.
2.) Level 1 Harass
Go full AP, Doran's Ring, and spam spells on him until he dies. Flash + Ignite. Lose horribly.
3.) Standard.
Go standard AP, harass/farm. Lose horribly.
4.) Super-defensive-farm
Go MR, start with the 400g MR item, farm, with defensive masteries and Flash+Barrier. Die at level 6 to all-in. syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time. If it were that easy to beat fizz as a skillshot dependant champion I think fizz wouldn't see so much success.
A good syndra should always beat a good fizz. It's fairly straight forward from the get go. There just aren't that many good syndra players. She isn't exactly played that frequently.
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On August 13 2013 10:58 XilDarkz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 09:59 ReachTheSky wrote:
syndra vs fizz is really easy. I main fizz and can't even beat a half decent syndra. You should run ad reds or hybrid pen reds, ap quints, armor yellows and mr blues. 21/9/0 or 21/0/9 if you are really confident. start with flask 3 hp pots. lvl 1 just auto then q and auto again everytime he tries to last hit a creep. take your stun lvl 2. continue this process. If he gets a w/q on you lvl 2 push him away with ur stun auto q auto. continue to harass him. by level 3 you should have a nice hp advantage on him. save your stun/knockback for after his jump. You should be winning in farm nicely. Just keep qing him everytime he tries to last hit a creep lvl 3 and up. After lvl 3 if he gets a w/q on you make sure to use your slow on him so he can't get more than 1-2 autos off. If he goes to jump after this wait for the jump to end and then stun him auto q auto. anytime he uses his jump to avoid a q it means you can zone him from cs for a period of time. What league are you/Summoner name? I'd like to try some custom games with you if possible (just 1v1 Syndra Fizz)
Gold 2, eMgRoB is my summoner name.
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On August 13 2013 14:35 SagaZ wrote:
Like every hard lane you need to punish the enemy champion as hard as you can on the levels you are stronger and play defensive when he is stronger.
For this match up in particular it's easy, you are a bit stronger the first level and get shat on the following 17 so yeah. What I do about the Fizz problem or any other problem is ignore it and hope it goes away.
That's a worthwhile strategy.
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can i snowball on this topic and ask if there's any possible way for kassadin to ever beat/go even with fizz in lane? i've only ever lost that lane TERRIBLY, even with ganks. even when i'm ahead he just all-ins me and spams laugh as i die to ignite/DoT and he bounces away
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United States37500 Posts
You guys need to accept that there are some lanes that you can't win but you have to do your best to stay relevant for midgame. Treat it like you would a 1v2 swap. Now I'm not saying Fizz counters Syndra anywhere remotely to how he smashes Kass but there are counter picks for a reason.
I'm of the opinion that Syndra actually wins because I've seen really good Syndras but sylverfyre's post is damn solid.
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On August 13 2013 16:18 gtrsrs wrote:
can i snowball on this topic and ask if there's any possible way for kassadin to ever beat/go even with fizz in lane? i've only ever lost that lane TERRIBLY, even with ganks. even when i'm ahead he just all-ins me and spams laugh as i die to ignite/DoT and he bounces away
I'm pretty sure you can actually block Shark damage with Riftwalk if you practice the timing. Or you can use Riftwalk as soon as he uses playful, then QE him and you should have traded pretty well even if he QWautoed first.
I've only played this matchup 2-3 times but it seems like you can outplay him pretty hard if youre ready. Just play reactively andyou should win with the second move.
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from my experience, fizz literally never has to use playful until you use Q. he can be patient and wait for you to engage and will always win.
if you trade autos, or trade below 75% hp, he'll win with his W being much better than yours and his auto range being higher (i think? at least it feels higher)
if he uses Q on you you can counter with your own Q as he'll likely not be able to hit it, but your E has to be delayed in order to ensure that it hits him after his Q, so he gets a free auto and blocks your escape. post-6 it's not AS huge cause you can jump away but pre-6 that's how he all-ins
sure, if he ever initiates with playful i will win 100%, but i've never seen a decent fizz use playful to initiate. it's always used as a counter-aggression move to void sphere (blocks the damage, positions him to retailate).
i didn't know that about riftwalk and shark though. i will def try that next time (if i survive to 6 -_-)
a lot of my success with kass has come from just being more patient than the other guy and winning after they aggress but it just feels like fizz always wins the patient game. so frustrating
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cant be too bad just lane normal
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The only thing I've done is play super defensive. Don't go anywhere near him and use your range. You can try to be aggressive and do things like sphere him for every last hit, but Fizz is good at dodging skill shots. Playing defensive can be harsh because although Fizz might not kill you, he'll roam around and get kills anyway (most likely). If you do this, you are also relying on team mates to be aware of your pings and things like that. Play your part by warding and doing your best to keep track of him. But you probably won't lose lane at least. Syndra is a pretty good farmer.
I open 3pots and 2 faerie charms vs Fizz and go for an early Chalice. You'll need mana to farm.
Ultimately, Fizz is at the advantage. It is just that sort of matchup. An assassin that can dodge your stun is not good for Syndra. Back often and get Jungler help to hold lane.
Troll pole while your ult is in flight literally tears out your soul.
By the way, there is a Syndra champ thread that Orb posts in. He wrote a guide on her that you could check out.
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I still think a good Syndra will smash a good Fizz but that's because I've only played against diamonds who smash me regardless of the matchup
@Jazz
Obviously you never ult him unless E is on cooldown or he's in a stunlock
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On August 13 2013 18:10 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:
I still think a good Syndra will smash a good Fizz but that's because I've only played against diamonds who smash me regardless of the matchup
@Jazz
Obviously you never ult him unless E is on cooldown or he's in a stunlock
Well that's the theory, but sometimes I've been a bit trigger happy...
Syndra vs Fizz isn't her worst match up though IMO. Just a rough one. Can definitely go even or win lane.
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This is also what i would do 
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You probably want to just keep pushing and prevent him from roaming.
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On August 13 2013 16:58 gtrsrs wrote:
from my experience, fizz literally never has to use playful until you use Q. he can be patient and wait for you to engage and will always win.
if you trade autos, or trade below 75% hp, he'll win with his W being much better than yours and his auto range being higher (i think? at least it feels higher)
if he uses Q on you you can counter with your own Q as he'll likely not be able to hit it, but your E has to be delayed in order to ensure that it hits him after his Q, so he gets a free auto and blocks your escape. post-6 it's not AS huge cause you can jump away but pre-6 that's how he all-ins
sure, if he ever initiates with playful i will win 100%, but i've never seen a decent fizz use playful to initiate. it's always used as a counter-aggression move to void sphere (blocks the damage, positions him to retailate).
i didn't know that about riftwalk and shark though. i will def try that next time (if i survive to 6 -_-)
a lot of my success with kass has come from just being more patient than the other guy and winning after they aggress but it just feels like fizz always wins the patient game. so frustrating
You can dodge Fizz ult with any flash-type move. The damage is done a split second after the shark appears so you have to time your jump so that you move after the shark starts to appear, but before the damage is dealt. I've seen videos of people doing it, but never on purpose. It's really hard to actually time and dodge the damage consistently.
Fizz just wrecks Kassadin in my experience since Kass has to go into melee range to cs and Fizz just wrecks squishies in melee range.
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I may be late to the party here but check out my matchup information on Syndra vs Fizz in my Syndra guide:
http://www.lolking.net/guides/171823
Basically there are a couple pieces of information you should know going into the matchup:
1: If you don't give fizz kills and you farm safely you will be more valuable than him come mid/lategame
2: As such build tanky in your runes/masteries and items if necessary to ensure you don't feed him
3: Understand his cooldowns so you can punish them (go play some fizz games if you haven't already). This includes pressuring him hard level 1 to burn through his potions or even get him low so he's more cautious about allinning you
4: While you should always pressure fizz with harass, NEVER use your E or R before his playful/trickster is on CD. If you waste your E or R and he playfuls it you will be fucked. You need to harass with Q and sometimes W when it is appropriate, and only after he uses playful and is vulnerable should you stun and/or ult him.
5: If you are playing as said in point 4, the fizz will be pushed into a metaphorical corner while trying to farm. He will go in to cs, and you will harass him. Then he has a few options. A: Eat the harass to get the minion kill (win for you as you get free harass on him), B: Use urchin strike onto a minion or yourself to dodge your Q harass (partial win as he misses the cs, but you may take some damage in return). If he does this just use your W on him and Q and wait for his playful to E him afterwards. C: Playful to dodge the harass damage (win, he misses the cs and he is now vulnerable), in which case you stun him and drop tons of harass so that he is too weak to keep farming/going allin. D: dodge the harass just by moving (still a win for you because he misses the cs)
So basically it's actually fizz that suffers in this matchup if played properly by the syndra, because he has to work hard for every cs, and with every creep he gets you force him into a tough decision. If he eats too much harass getting cs he won't be able to cs anymore and you can zone. Thus most fizzes will get baited into just going allin every time you try to harass them. If you have a sufficiently tanky rune/mastery setup as I recommend for this matchup in my guide, then you won't die to his allin and you can pressure him hard while his abilities are on cooldown.
I play vs diamond fizzes all the time and the only way I lose is either a big misplay on my part or the enemy jungle camping my lane
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EPT
