EPT[Patch 3.10: Yimake Patch] General Discussion - Page 325
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FSKi
United States901 Posts
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The_Unseen
France1923 Posts
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Nos-
Canada12016 Posts
On August 22 2013 00:55 wei2coolman wrote: In regards to support picks for yolo queue, you guys looking at utility too much. Strong base dmg bruisers are really good support just because people don't expect the damages. lee sin support | ||
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Simberto
Germany11310 Posts
On August 22 2013 00:49 PrinceXizor wrote: Thresh does not want to be using pull and flay on warwick, he wants to be preventing the carry from fighting with them, Taric isn't one to save his stun or he'll never get to use shatter effectively, and without his stun he's just worse than warwick in straight up fights, Nami is a blend of both, she doesn't want to be using bubble on warwick and shes not exactly very strong in fights without it. Regardless of what you are up against though, just running in and using infinite duress or ANY channeling spell without any thought is bad. I'm willing to play thresh against your WW supp any day. Or Nami. Not taric though, since i am pretty sure that he isn't a viable support currently. I just can't imagine how you would even reach 6 without being incredibly far behind with a melee supp with no threat harass or any danger of...anything because you have no CC. And even if you do, i can't imagine a single way to play aggressive as WW. You can maybe capitalize if the enemy does a bad engage because they got cocky because they are far ahead. I just can't see you even going even, and now remember that if you are going even, you are losing since WW supp is worthless lategame compared to thresh. | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On July 31 2013 11:25 PrinceXizor wrote: Ohmwrecker is an amazing item that costs way too much. Yes, Ohmwrecker is a great item. It's bought so often because the active is so useful. On August 01 2013 12:12 PrinceXizor wrote: n my defense i'm far better at explaining when i can physically show things because i'm a visual kind of person. Why won't you 1v1 then? On August 01 2013 12:28 PrinceXizor wrote: Ohmwrecker is pretty strong on kass overall though and i'd like to test it out as a first big item. new MR item might be strong on him though. Yes, please show me your Ohmwrecker Kassadin and your MR Kassadin play. On August 01 2013 17:13 PrinceXizor wrote: As a side note. Elder lizard soraka is hilarious. You vs Sylverfyre 1v1? Sylverfyre goes DShield vs your Elder Lizard? Who wins? Battle of the century 2.0? On August 07 2013 05:30 PrinceXizor wrote: As an interesting note; what is wrong with having a support that becomes very effective at level 6 just take double golems (on blue or lane swapped purple) with a machete every time they spawn, giving the ad more levels, the support more levels (and more gold after a few minutes), provided the AD can actually lane solo for 10-20 seconds at a time. PX please. Your AD carry just wants to farm, and you're gonna ditch him? Your AD carry doesn't get levels if you do this lol. On August 07 2013 05:50 PrinceXizor wrote: This should only be true if the ad is playing horribly. No, if the enemy AD isn't playing horribly, then your AD carry gets chunked/zoned and will start flaming you like I am right now for being a fucking moron. And so are you. On August 07 2013 13:22 PrinceXizor wrote: Per level Runes are strictly superior on the majority of the character base to flat power rune in all regards. PX once again with his wise words of the day. I hope you get raped in the jungle and in lanes with scaling armor/lvl and scaling MR/lvl. Smart man. On August 14 2013 14:30 PrinceXizor wrote: Raka can jungle pretty effectively, and makes 1v2 lanes pretty reasonable for your team. Hitting level 6 in 6 minutes gives you a very strong global ability. Solo queue though its decidedly pretty poor since people will rant at you for not doing a level 3 gank. and then if you DO level 3 gank, they rant at you for picking soraka. Strong ganks bro. Autos with bananas are strong? On August 16 2013 19:43 PrinceXizor wrote: poppy is pretty damn balanced. her role isn't something that is typically filled in LoL, but shes one of the very few who can fill it. Situational champions are good for the game. every champ being useful at any time leads to one of two things: blatent power creep, or homogenized gameplay. So your idea of a balanced champ is one that has never seen any professional play like ever? On August 17 2013 00:16 PrinceXizor wrote: Against teemo you really should just be maxing flame breathe and clearing much faster than him. there honestly isn't anything he can do to win the lane against shyvana if shyvana doesn't go chasing teemo around in circles. It becomes a stalemate in which one side can clear much better than the other, and one side becomes much scarier sooner. I can't think of a matchup shyvana can't at least go even and accept the farm in. maybe ryze? but i dunno how much the range nerfs would affect that. If you think so strongly about Shyvana vs Teemo, why'd you dodge Req? How do you clear fast with E? On August 17 2013 00:27 PrinceXizor wrote: before level 4 shyvana can just use flame breath from range and teemo can't get close without getting hit. 925 range > 500 range after level 4 teemo isn't going to outrun shyvana without maxing move quick which isn't done. Shyvana is one of the safest laners right now. Teemo can't deal much damage to her without putting himself horribly out of position by shoving against a laner who is great at last hitting under tower, or missing tons of last hits and trying to tank creeps. Yes, you farm with your E that's on ridiculous CD. Walk up and try to CS. See what happens. Even a monkey could outtrade you in that matchup. Even if Western only meant NA, this is still blatantly wrong. On August 21 2013 18:59 PrinceXizor wrote: If you want to play a character as support, the main things you need to look at are: What do i gain from playing this character, What is unique about this character, What impact do i have on laning, And finally, what can i do mid-late game with mostly health stacking. Tryndamere, Amumu, Vi, Urgot, Ezreal, Galio, fiddle, lissandra, warwick all pass these four questions pretty damn well. But some of them require unusual play from your partner to be strong, similar to how Leona does. Making it difficult to use them in solo queue in addition to general trolling that you will receive for trying. Good ideas. Please show us PX. We need visual evidence. We're visual learners. On August 22 2013 00:12 PrinceXizor wrote: Depends. when locket came out but wasn't live on the servers i explained how strong of an item it was and how cost efficient it was, everyone ignored me. Then, when i actually play things and they work, and i explain them here, everyone tries to tell me i don't understand anything. :/ See all the above. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On August 22 2013 01:01 Simberto wrote: I'm willing to play thresh against your WW supp any day. Or Nami. Not taric though, since i am pretty sure that he isn't a viable support currently. I just can't imagine how you would even reach 6 without being incredibly far behind with a melee supp with no threat harass or any danger of...anything because you have no CC. And even if you do, i can't imagine a single way to play aggressive as WW. You can maybe capitalize if the enemy does a bad engage because they got cocky because they are far ahead. I just can't see you even going even, and now remember that if you are going even, you are losing since WW supp is worthless lategame compared to thresh. I think at this point PX would rather just talk and come up with ideas rather than actually attempt them where they can go under scrutiny (even though he says he does). I wouldn't expect him to take you up on this. | ||
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
my god | ||
onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
On August 22 2013 01:05 SagaZ wrote: oh my god Deep cuts | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
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ComaDose
Canada10352 Posts
EDIT: pantheon great support. support mid and bot >.< | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
bad ideas get talked about more than good ideas, because good ideas dont need to be discussed, just utilized. | ||
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On August 22 2013 00:24 NeoIllusions wrote: In retrospect, we give you plenty of credit for the S3 Locket. TheYango consistently brings it up as one of your redeeming points. But for every Locket idea, you have an Eve Top idea. The thing about item theorycraft is that its largely based on math. There need to be a practicality level if you're going to talk about champions. Sometimes I wonder (and several of staff agree with me) if you take a heretical stance on things because you just like to be different. But it boils down to your presentation, there's several thing you could easily do differently to theorycraft without drawing the ire of many. Idk, pros were super far behind on the locket train, no idea why. Everyone in soloQ knew it's OP like 3 days after release and anyone who looked at the items before they were released knew instantly, like we were on vent with other EU LP guys when reading the new items and everyone went "wtf locket is so OP LOOOL" Also stop saying that Fiddle is a non traditional support. He's been played for months in high elo soloQ games and everyone agrees it's super strong. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
However, WW has no means at all to force trades. All he can do is run at people and Q them, which burns his mana pool very fast. Sure his autoattacks aren't too shabby (Blitz and Alistar have close base AD but his passive keeps him ahead) but he has to reach people to use them, and to keep up with them, making boots very important on him asap. Considering he doesn't have gap closers (hard or MS buffs) the tiniest slow or creep block is devastating to him, sticking his head to take a beating from ranged champs. Basically, PX seems (personal interpretation) to suggest that you should pick him with a long range/pokey marksman to do the work in lane by himself, playing passive/having the marksman shove until he hits 6 or an AD-oriented jungler comes to gank. A bit like how Soraka+Graves was about allowing Graves to shove the lane and harass people with Q spam, except Soraka actually helped Graves. However, to me it also means you basically surrender the entire laning phase by going for a farm fest at best, until level 6 where you can try all-ins and ganks setup on a low cooldown with a reliable cc (although against the low cd of Thresh's Flail it looks like a pretty inane idea to me). The ult is good for pick-ups during roaming phase because of its cd and how it works and people still aren't too rich. However, you are less likely to win lane unless you snowball at level 6, and you are straight-up useless if you get shoved to tower (esp. if paired with Ezreal), I don't really expect the ability to take the enemy tower first and roam from the WW lane as the standard outcome. You also have nothing to defend from ganks, unless the enemy jungler is dumb and comes with less than half-HP (and you'll burst him down anyway when that happens unless it's Zac or Sej or Amumu). As for the "don't cc him" claims, considering how useless WW is without his ult, it's not about cc-ing his ult and outtrading the enemy. Sure, if his AD is reactive you'll lose the trade. However, cc him, disengage (Flay him then run away with W to reduce the poke from his AD; Bubble him then use your passive's MS and maybe the slow from E to run away; Taric is bad now so it's nothing new but he doesn't care because he has sustain to make up for your damage), wait your cooldowns to come back up/heal some, and then WW has nothing but an AS buff (which can be negated by hard cc on the marksman during its duration). He also has the same weakness as Leona that he needs to get in so he's open to being baited while the jungler waits nearby, 'cept even Leona disengages better than him (W survivability, ranged ult, and Q to gain a bit of ground). Really, I could see it work somewhat with Cait/Varus using Infinite Duress to chain cc and force a longer trade (and Varus maxing Q could have the burst to take down a squishy) but barring that there's nothing wrong with cc-ing WW, disengaging then wrecking your duo. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
I feel like Nunu actually threatens the lane pre 6 without being in melee range. If WW runs up to hungering strike your average ADC they're going to auto him and use whatever escape move they have to not get hit. WW takes damage and then has to Q creeps and deny his ADC farm to heal up. I feel like even though Blood Boil is "only 5% more attackspeed" than Hunters Call, it also gives movespeed (which early game is more important) and has near 100% uptime compared to Hunters Call's 50% or so uptime early game. If your big plan is that the enemy duo will be scared to fight you while you have such a strong buff, even if that were true they could just wait till it is on cooldown and have 10 seconds in which they can trade with you, which they can do just with autos since you have no ranged attacks and no gapclosing ability. I feel like WW's level 6 all in is fairly scary, but the supports he wants to play it against all have CC, and if he thinks a Taric won't hold stun back and wait for a WW ult to stop it he's silly. I feel like WW does not get tankier by stacking health, which was one of PX's things a support needs to be good. He gets tankier by stacking resists since he has so much built in sustain and no built in damage reduction. I feel like WW's mid/late game is pretty terrible even with farm and items, which is why nobody plays him jungle or top lane. As support what's he going to do, ult the enemy diver and then hang around Qing and buffing? Nunu does the same shit. Nunu iceblast+ult is one hell of a slow in the back line. And, at the end of the day, basically what I'm saying is that a support that nobody plays anymore because they think he's bad (Nunu) is still better than Warwick. And his suggested support WW counters (Taric) is another one nobody plays anymore because they think he sucks. I think you should like, post some replays or something or drop this conversation entirely, PX. You have no evidence for your argument and your theory is incredibly suspect. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
sona/taric/leona all have better 6 burst than ww anyway | ||
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Chexx
Korea (South)11232 Posts
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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