[Patch 3.10: Yimake Patch] General Discussion - Page 327
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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nafta
Bulgaria18893 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:03 JimmiC wrote: Karthus support more OP. Super slow, smarty poke, Aura does huge damage in long fights. Can do damage after he dies and has global ult. He's better support then ww. AND he can check bushes without facechecking.OP | ||
JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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wussleeQ
United States3130 Posts
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
I've thrown out quite a few odd ideas as support before... but no one ever really pays attention. Perhaps I should learn from PX to get more responses... ![]() WW is not a good support. Period. The minimum necessity of a support is to have some sort of non-ult CC or some other non-ult utility. You also cannot play a champ as support because "oh, well abilities X, Y, Z are really good and make my team that much stronger". That is simply looking at team composition from the wrong angle. But real talk play support Darius. Bleed damage OP, pull and dunks all day. | ||
Seuss
United States10536 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:09 wussleeQ wrote: i don't get why we're even giving a silver theory crafter attention who isnt willing to prove any of his theories in game. People like arguing. More seriously, this is a forum that's willing to entertain crazy ideas. We like discovering the next OP jungler, the next OP item, or the next OP team composition before other people. You don't have to be Diamond to think of something novel. But you do need to vigorously and convincingly defend your idea, which may or may not involve testing it in game, dueling other TLers, or bringing it to TROLLS. | ||
ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:15 Seuss wrote: People like arguing. More seriously, this is a forum that's willing to entertain crazy ideas. We like discovering the next OP jungler, the next OP item, or the next OP team composition before other people. You don't have to be Diamond to think of something novel. But you do need to vigorously and convincingly defend your idea, which may or may not involve testing it in game, dueling other TLers, or bringing it to TROLLS. SHAMELESS SELF ADVERTISING ALERT | ||
Parametric
Canada1261 Posts
On August 22 2013 01:39 PrinceXizor wrote: If WW is forward and your ADC is csing what's stopping a ranged support from right clicking WW all day?with a long range carry like varus or cait, they aren't dependent on a large amount of space bought by their supports, the way vayne would be for instance. which means you can put your Warwick in a somewhat forward position to be covered by the carry. Warwicks AS boost is essentially equivalent to nunu's with regards to pushing a tower down quickly, but better than nunu's during ganks/being ganked. How is an AS boost better when being ganked compared to a nunu with an AS/MS buff and an AS/MS slow?Warwick attacking and retreating simultaneously during a gank is incredibly powerful, and the enemy team deciding to go for warwick instead of the carry allows you to deal quite a bit of damage. How is WW not being blown up when he's a melee support with no built in tankiness/CC like Ali/Leona?But lets be honest about being ganked. if you are warding properly, and you are ganked without your jungler nearby to counter gank, its kind of a play issue rather than a matchup issue. Or the enemy support started a pink ward war. This myth about bot lane being ungankable due to wards 24/7 is really dumb; time their wards and tell your jungle where the wards are.Warwick excels at drawn out fights, his passive and his Blood Scent ensure this, There is little the enemy can do against long range carry + warwick just walking up and auto attacking early on except attempt to outdo them in burst and retreat. lulu and sona have the ability to win these sort of early trades, while the other supports don't. Or they have a ranged support (pretty much everyone) with CC and you just get kited all day and beaten to death when you try to harassWarwick is powerful enough that if a team attempts to engage him and his carry without using cc (presumably saving it to stop his ultimate) warwick should win those fights and be able to heal up more afterwards. in counter gank scenerios warwick is very effective as he will be fairly high health due to his passive and Q and he will be dealing quite a bit of damage by the time the cavalry arrives. What is WW autoattacking to get back his HP?he can then turn the tides with a single hunters call. he's not bad against ganks unless its a gank you set yourself up to receive. Lets say WW has level 3 hunters call, how is 60% AS for 10 seconds on a 20 second CD going to turn a gank around? Stop assuming omnipresence and never getting ganked, it just doesn't happen.Edit: What would you do against a zyra/lulu in lane? | ||
upperbound
United States2300 Posts
I do want to see xildarkz and PX talk about the merits of duo mid with Syndra, though. | ||
WiseBagus
Canada452 Posts
On August 21 2013 12:53 wei2coolman wrote: I wish I was this rich when I play support. But I gotta buy wards and stuff. Low levels has its advantages, I can usually get at least 15 assist in one game. | ||
LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
Be warned. finally relog, game was disbanded. Start a new game...doesnt launch again. | ||
-Zoda-
France3578 Posts
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chinstrap
United Kingdom253 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:11 ticklishmusic wrote: So do we deserve better or worse than Roffles? I've thrown out quite a few odd ideas as support before... but no one ever really pays attention. Perhaps I should learn from PX to get more responses... ![]() WW is not a good support. Period. The minimum necessity of a support is to have some sort of non-ult CC or some other non-ult utility. You also cannot play a champ as support because "oh, well abilities X, Y, Z are really good and make my team that much stronger". That is simply looking at team composition from the wrong angle. But real talk play support Darius. Bleed damage OP, pull and dunks all day. I have played Darius support before. Its not terrible in lane against short range marksmen, just max w first land land hooks for kills. Just be sure to dunk early when you don't want to steal the kill like a troll. The problem is that outside of lane you have 0 presence. The only way Darius has any impact late game is if he is tanky enough to just walk at the enemy team without being blown up. Without tank items you will do literally 1 shit dmg Q before you die. | ||
Alaric
France45622 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:25 LaNague wrote: started game, my client did not launch, restart launcher...15 mins queue. Be warned. I walked into the drake pit to ward it (just out of habit, I was already 0-5 in ~12 minutes because random freezes and lags vs Draven+Blitz kinda hurts, esp. when you're supporting a Vayne tagging the jungler until the first wave hits her tower), and the fog of war was a bit slow in dissipating... then all of a sudden when I get in vision range of the drake it all clears and I'm surrounded by 4 opponents which stayed "invisible" (or at least not displayed, along with any spell/aa particle) until that point. They quickly disappeared again though, since vision fades on death. Think that's my new record wrt server lag (already had worse situations but the lag was on my end). | ||
sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:19 upperbound wrote: All joking aside, at first when conversation started in this direction I thought we were gonna hear about Lee or Jarvan or Annie support or something that has some upside and a prayer of a chance. Then we got Tryndamere and Warwick, and I facepalmed. I do want to see xildarkz and PX talk about the merits of duo mid with Syndra, though. Even Syndra is a better support than literally everything PX has suggested. | ||
sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On August 21 2013 18:59 PrinceXizor wrote: If you want to play a character as support, the main things you need to look at are: What do i gain from playing this character, What is unique about this character, What impact do i have on laning, And finally, what can i do mid-late game with mostly health stacking. Tryndamere, Amumu, Vi, Urgot, Ezreal, Galio, fiddle, lissandra, warwick all pass these four questions pretty damn well. But some of them require unusual play from your partner to be strong, similar to how Leona does. Making it difficult to use them in solo queue in addition to general trolling that you will receive for trying. Going back to your square one, you fail the very test you put forth in all counts except Fiddlesticks. Ultimately, no they don't pass your 4 questions. If you gain more in all of those categories from playing a normal support than you get from one of your special snowflake supports, then there is literally 0 reason to pick your special snowflake and you're just doing it to be a special snowflake. Remember there's an opportunity cost there as well. | ||
Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:15 Seuss wrote: People like arguing. More seriously, this is a forum that's willing to entertain crazy ideas. We like discovering the next OP jungler, the next OP item, or the next OP team composition before other people. You don't have to be Diamond to think of something novel. But you do need to vigorously and convincingly defend your idea, which may or may not involve testing it in game, dueling other TLers, or bringing it to TROLLS. Yes, and we are taking the surest way of discovering the new OP. Proclaim everything to be OP -> new OP gets discovered -> quickly forget about all of our wrong guesses. | ||
Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
On August 22 2013 02:33 sylverfyre wrote: Going back to your square one, you fail the very test you put forth in all counts except Fiddlesticks. Ultimately, no they don't pass your 4 questions. If you gain more in all of those categories from playing a normal support than you get from one of your special snowflake supports, then there is literally 0 reason to pick your special snowflake and you're just doing it to be a special snowflake. Remember there's an opportunity cost there as well. Ahem. Lissandra support is perfectly viable, especially if you're playing push composition so you can just "bounce" Q on minions, for huge ranged harass, everytime oppotunity arises. ![]() But yeaaaah. Prefer Zyra, Janna or Thresh. Always stop ganks or initiate them, always win, never lose. huehuehue | ||
kainzero
United States5211 Posts
If you fall behind you still have potential to be useful since you have a very strong (AoE) stun, but your Q and W are useless (I guess you could use it to check bushes, but that's it) and you're pretty much a gimped support. However, she also has very strong laning (and roaming, even) as support, so the chances of snowballing are tilted in your favor. | ||
remedium
United States939 Posts
LeBlanc is pretty good too. | ||
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