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On July 12 2013 16:43 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 16:37 Aldrovandi wrote:
I think E max is the way to go on Nami. The slow gets to be almost as strong as a frozen mallet, except ranged, and the difference of 40 magic damage if you had been maxing (and landing your q) in a fight is offset by the fact that your adc has way more time to wail on the enemy. The problem I have with slow on the E; is often bot lane engagements are all about quick trades. If it's an extended fight you yourself often get fucked by having the ADC miss a lot of cs. Q max is apparently obvious; oh I just landed 1.5 second stun/knockup; hit some auto attacks. Unlike if I put E on my ADC they don't know what to do with it. Am I harass? Get CS? Even if he gets the slow on them, you're essentially asking your ADC to walk past minion line just to continue a few extra auto attacks; all while eating minion damage. Q max is just stronger for the most part.
Why put it on your adc? Put it on yourself, tag the enemy once to set up the Q, drop a W on your adc if they still need to catch up. The damage is way more reliable, and if you miss the Q or things go south, you have better ability to disengage.
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with Vayne, which was the original question, E interaction with night hunter is too strong to ignore. The reliablity of E when duo que'd with the AD (again from the original question) and hitting Q with E max more than makes up for the tradeoff in damage.
I don't think Q max is bad, but it's not the best in this situation
On July 12 2013 16:10 wussleeQ wrote:
looking at what pros usually max on nami is quite confusing.
5-EWQ
4-WEQ
1-WQE
1-QWE
1-EQW
From probuilds and looking at a bunch of separate games
With Vayne as a partner, Madlife chose E, pretty sure if he wanted to he could hit his Qs, I personally think what to max on Nami is largely dependent on the AD(champion, not player), but in almost all matches in Champions E has been maxed.
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On July 12 2013 16:56 Aldrovandi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 16:43 wei2coolman wrote:On July 12 2013 16:37 Aldrovandi wrote:
I think E max is the way to go on Nami. The slow gets to be almost as strong as a frozen mallet, except ranged, and the difference of 40 magic damage if you had been maxing (and landing your q) in a fight is offset by the fact that your adc has way more time to wail on the enemy. The problem I have with slow on the E; is often bot lane engagements are all about quick trades. If it's an extended fight you yourself often get fucked by having the ADC miss a lot of cs. Q max is apparently obvious; oh I just landed 1.5 second stun/knockup; hit some auto attacks. Unlike if I put E on my ADC they don't know what to do with it. Am I harass? Get CS? Even if he gets the slow on them, you're essentially asking your ADC to walk past minion line just to continue a few extra auto attacks; all while eating minion damage. Q max is just stronger for the most part. Why put it on your adc? Put it on yourself, tag the enemy once to set up the Q, drop a W on your adc if they still need to catch up. The damage is way more reliable, and if you miss the Q or things go south, you have better ability to disengage.
Comically I think Q is more reliable than E; E requires over extending to get maximum effect of it. Q in itself is an engage and disengage tool.
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On July 12 2013 16:21 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 16:10 wussleeQ wrote:
looking at what pros usually max on nami is quite confusing.
5-EWQ
4-WEQ
1-WQE
1-QWE
1-EQW
From probuilds and looking at a bunch of separate games W max way too mana expensive; level 5 is like 130 mana a cost; it's so silly. The main usage of W I feel is mostly for speed boost; and a slight heal. E max is interesting; it's far more dependent on your ADC; and how HAM he wants to go. Each rank of E and Q both do equivalent amount of damage; the difference is upfront damage. Q gets the upfront damage; which is always better.
thank you so much for your posts. they made me look up the lolwiki for her to find the exact numbers -- I was maxing W lately or E if vayne wasn't taking any significant damage/vs someone like Leona who I was scared of being killed by. W's mana costs go up so much, the heal is pretty weak if it doesn't get the poke off and that feels like it's not always easy/safe to spam although I certainly could be much better at it.
But, Q is only 60 mana entire game, and as someone else pointed out, apparently is similar to Rupture ahhh that's crazy
On July 12 2013 16:43 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 16:37 Aldrovandi wrote:
I think E max is the way to go on Nami. The slow gets to be almost as strong as a frozen mallet, except ranged, and the difference of 40 magic damage if you had been maxing (and landing your q) in a fight is offset by the fact that your adc has way more time to wail on the enemy. The problem I have with slow on the E; is often bot lane engagements are all about quick trades. If it's an extended fight you yourself often get fucked by having the ADC miss a lot of cs. Q max is apparently obvious; oh I just landed 1.5 second stun/knockup; hit some auto attacks. Unlike if I put E on my ADC they don't know what to do with it. Am I harass? Get CS? Even if he gets the slow on them, you're essentially asking your ADC to walk past minion line just to continue a few extra auto attacks; all while eating minion damage. Q max is just stronger for the most part.
This is really solid info you give really great reasons. The ADC missing CS thru E has bothered me, but the synergy with silver bolts sounds theoretically rly cool. However, apparently the bubble and E do the same dmg, and the Q does it instantly. Veryy crazy. Thanks again. Do you use standard support runes/masteries?
I felt like Janna was really fucking strong at disengaging so yeah I'm assuming it's best just to play passive. Would you still max Q since they have no heal? And maybe use it just to deny last hits since it's going to be passive.
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United States47024 Posts
It's also legitimately possible that the specific usefulness of Q max has not been thoroughly explored yet.
I lost a lot of faith the League professional community's ability to figure things out when even Korean teams didn't pick up on how blatantly absurd beginning-of-S3 Locket was until after Diamondprox showed everyone at IEM Katowice.
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On July 12 2013 17:21 TheYango wrote:
It's also legitimately possible that the specific usefulness of Q max has not been thoroughly explored yet.
I lost a lot of faith the League professional community's ability to figure things out when even Korean teams didn't pick up on how blatantly absurd beginning-of-S3 Locket was until after Diamondprox showed everyone at IEM Katowice.
my prediction is Q will be nerfed to be duration based on rank before we get a definitive max for her.
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On July 12 2013 17:21 TheYango wrote:
It's also legitimately possible that the specific usefulness of Q max has not been thoroughly explored yet.
I lost a lot of faith the League professional community's ability to figure things out when even Korean teams didn't pick up on how blatantly absurd beginning-of-S3 Locket was until after Diamondprox showed everyone at IEM Katowice.
I love Locket, but more in a "it feels really awesome to save someones life with it even though that doesn't happen every game, and the defensive stats + CDR is strong enough anyway" kind of way. is there more to it than that? or is it just in teamfights if you hit 4-5 allies with it the net dmg absorbed is.. good?
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On July 12 2013 17:21 TheYango wrote:
It's also legitimately possible that the specific usefulness of Q max has not been thoroughly explored yet.
I lost a lot of faith the League professional community's ability to figure things out when even Korean teams didn't pick up on how blatantly absurd beginning-of-S3 Locket was until after Diamondprox showed everyone at IEM Katowice.
That's pretty much the case for every competitive community : change is always hard to accept and play with !
Kor was very creative when the game was new in their region, but now it has become quite stale.
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Q max against Leona lane is actually insanely good; Her harassing capability is so very straight forward, If she zenith blades onto you or Vayne; Just put the Q on your ADC and voila; you've just disengaged Leona off your ADC; and your free to now chase her down.
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On July 12 2013 17:32 wei2coolman wrote:
Q max against Leona lane is actually insanely good; Her harassing capability is so very straight forward, If she zenith blades onto you or Vayne; Just put the Q on your ADC and voila; you've just disengaged Leona off your ADC; and your free to now chase her down.
you say that like Q rank has an effect on this.
Q is always more damage
E is always more cc, the extra slow % makes a difference.
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On July 12 2013 17:30 Vei wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 17:21 TheYango wrote:
It's also legitimately possible that the specific usefulness of Q max has not been thoroughly explored yet.
I lost a lot of faith the League professional community's ability to figure things out when even Korean teams didn't pick up on how blatantly absurd beginning-of-S3 Locket was until after Diamondprox showed everyone at IEM Katowice. I love Locket, but more in a "it feels really awesome to save someones life with it even though that doesn't happen every game, and the defensive stats + CDR is strong enough anyway" kind of way. is there more to it than that? or is it just in teamfights if you hit 4-5 allies with it the net dmg absorbed is.. good?
they nerfed it, it was stupid.
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EUW down ? just woke up and server is unavailable
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On July 12 2013 17:33 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 17:32 wei2coolman wrote:
Q max against Leona lane is actually insanely good; Her harassing capability is so very straight forward, If she zenith blades onto you or Vayne; Just put the Q on your ADC and voila; you've just disengaged Leona off your ADC; and your free to now chase her down. you say that like Q rank has an effect on this. Q is always more damage E is always more cc, the extra slow % makes a difference.
Well the idea is that Q max is easier to hit (against leona); and since it's more damage there's less risk more reward for it.
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On July 12 2013 17:51 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 17:33 Slusher wrote:On July 12 2013 17:32 wei2coolman wrote:
Q max against Leona lane is actually insanely good; Her harassing capability is so very straight forward, If she zenith blades onto you or Vayne; Just put the Q on your ADC and voila; you've just disengaged Leona off your ADC; and your free to now chase her down. you say that like Q rank has an effect on this. Q is always more damage E is always more cc, the extra slow % makes a difference. Well the idea is that Q max is easier to hit (against leona); and since it's more damage there's less risk more reward for it.
how is it easier to hit, you said you predict her positioning based on zenith, that's independent of what you max
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So I'm looking at this 3000rp 16 team icon bundle and I really think it needs a 17th that simply says E-sports. Maybe with like the riot logo underneath as well. I think that would be ace.
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Reading more, "The projectile speed is dependant on how far it is cast. the orb will always take a equal time to land after use."
I did not know this heh... I really should look up the wiki pages for all my champions I feel like that's a good idea ~_~
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On July 12 2013 18:00 Slusher wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2013 17:51 wei2coolman wrote:On July 12 2013 17:33 Slusher wrote:On July 12 2013 17:32 wei2coolman wrote:
Q max against Leona lane is actually insanely good; Her harassing capability is so very straight forward, If she zenith blades onto you or Vayne; Just put the Q on your ADC and voila; you've just disengaged Leona off your ADC; and your free to now chase her down. you say that like Q rank has an effect on this. Q is always more damage E is always more cc, the extra slow % makes a difference. Well the idea is that Q max is easier to hit (against leona); and since it's more damage there's less risk more reward for it. how is it easier to hit, you said you predict her positioning based on zenith, that's independent of what you max
The increased damage of maxing Q over E becomes more apparent if you hit your Q's. Therefore Q max against leona now has less risk of missing; thus higher reward margins. I don't know how else to explain it.
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I don't think any ground cast abilities have differing actuation times based on distance apart from Ziggs' Q.
A little off-topic, but would really appreciate if you guys could drop in https://www.facebook.com/events/392964390814732/?context=create and vote for xEquivocal. Basically it's an all-stars match thingy in Singapore where we vote for 2 captains and they draft their own lineup to play against each other. Chawy from SGS is pretty much guaranteed one spot already, but the other 2 are pretty close at the moment. I'm of the opinion that xEquivocal is a much more deserving player than LY4, so yeah!
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On July 12 2013 18:01 FR4CT4L wrote:
So I'm looking at this 3000rp 16 team icon bundle and I really think it needs a 17th that simply says E-sports. Maybe with like the riot logo underneath as well. I think that would be ace.
20% goes to the team, the other 80% goes towards esports.
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Does anyone else get massive fps drops at the start of the game? It only started happening after I did some windows updates last night. Oh now the client is crashing after every game.
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EPT
