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On July 31 2013 00:12 ETisME wrote:
man, any tips on how to deal with Jax if you are going for some AD heavy champion like irelia or rengar?
I almost always lose on top lane in normal draft if they ever pick Jax, getting my jungler to help works but that means he can't gank other lanes well.
How should I play?? Should I just roam along with jungler?
Afaik you should lose to Jax as Irelia, level 6 at the latest, simply because his ult's passive will let him outdamage you with raw autoattacks, and even though you outdamage him when you activate Hiten Style, 2s of counterstrike + 1s stun basically halves your damage and he can simply sustain it during the cooldown or stack HP and be fine the way Olaf does (Jax prefers HP to resists due to his ult's active).
Because of its long cooldown Hiten Style is basically a huge cd, true damage nuke, while Jax's ult passive and W are dps tools.
If he's bad he'll try to engage you with EQ, stun and keep hitting, your own stun followed with Hiten Style should outtrade him and easily punish any premature Counterstrike. Just make sure that he's not doing it as a bait for a gank.
No idea about Rengar, played against one recently but he wasn't really good. Spamming E is annoying for Jax because he can't really answer to it (and it doesn't pish the lane) plus you can easily engage him through bushes, however if you try to Q-ampQ him in a predictable fashion he'll just counterstrike it then (if post-6) win the trade. If you can bait his E you'll mostlikely outdamage him unless he ults though. But attrition war when he doesn't have sustain yet, or freezing the lane so he can't farm easily (exposes himself to ganks, pushes if he trades so easier freezing, no ranged farming ability) probably works kinda well. Worst case is he doesn't push as fast as you (his passive helps once he gets 6 and a bit of AD, before that he's auto-reliant with a weak-ish passive, and not that much mana to spam W) so you can use your ult to roam and take objectives.
You also kill towers way faster than him.
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On July 31 2013 00:21 RetZ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 00:12 ETisME wrote:
man, any tips on how to deal with Jax if you are going for some AD heavy champion like irelia or rengar?
I almost always lose on top lane in normal draft if they ever pick Jax, getting my jungler to help works but that means he can't gank other lanes well.
How should I play?? Should I just roam along with jungler? You need to outplay him crazy hard to win as irelia, Bait his stun and q away from it, trade while its down. Never W unless his stun is down. If you get ahead early you can bully him for a while but its really hard to keep him down since he has such a huge matchup advantage over you. You can also, if ahead, go for sheen first instead of cutlass then build into botrk since sheen is a lot better against him. If you're really just getting wrecked then an early wardens>randuins can keep you in lane enough to farm.
that sounds really difficult. man I hate Jax, how come he isn't picked more? Such a nice counter to any autoattack dependant champion
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On July 30 2013 23:48 mordek wrote:Personally this is the image that comes to my mind when I hear snare + Show Spoiler +
Order this.
+ Show Spoiler +
Lastly, Ice Age best lands.
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If it's Howling Abyss and it's the same victory conditions they used at all stars, I don't think bruisers would be best because the bushes are actually somewhere that matters. And the first tower is pretty hard to take, so what's preventing you from just sitting behind it and just wailing on them? Also you can't back for doran's blades or doran's rings.
If the victory conditions are to clear the nexus, then yeah, bruisers would probably be better.
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oh, magic. thats a new one.
on longer games on howling abyss, supports are probably not that good because you get so much free gold.
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United States15536 Posts
So I think I've finally experience the terrible lag spikes rumored to be happening on NA recently. Wow. So much for THAT promo.
Has anyone else dealt with these recently? Is the answer simply to not play? Or is it to play Normals?
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Quinn+Caitlyn.
Just nuke the @#*$ out of people and you'll be fine.
On July 31 2013 00:28 AsmodeusXI wrote:
So I think I've finally experience the terrible lag spikes rumored to be happening on NA recently. Wow. So much for THAT promo.
Has anyone else dealt with these recently? Is the answer simply to not play? Or is it to play Normals?
When I had it, I used vpn hotspotshield to play, my ping goes up to 130, 150 but still playable.
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On July 31 2013 00:26 ETisME wrote:Show nested quote +On July 31 2013 00:21 RetZ wrote:On July 31 2013 00:12 ETisME wrote:
man, any tips on how to deal with Jax if you are going for some AD heavy champion like irelia or rengar?
I almost always lose on top lane in normal draft if they ever pick Jax, getting my jungler to help works but that means he can't gank other lanes well.
How should I play?? Should I just roam along with jungler? You need to outplay him crazy hard to win as irelia, Bait his stun and q away from it, trade while its down. Never W unless his stun is down. If you get ahead early you can bully him for a while but its really hard to keep him down since he has such a huge matchup advantage over you. You can also, if ahead, go for sheen first instead of cutlass then build into botrk since sheen is a lot better against him. If you're really just getting wrecked then an early wardens>randuins can keep you in lane enough to farm. that sounds really difficult. man I hate Jax, how come he isn't picked more? Such a nice counter to any autoattack dependant champion
He gets shat on by champions like Malphite or Nasus, and especially by Singed. That one match-up is so one-sided that Singed can be terrible and not do much by himself and he'll still win, simply because you're so bad at pushing there's nothing you can do against him ignoring you, Qing the whole wave then running, flinging you into his poison or just farming between towers.
It's almost impossible to stick to Singed as Jax, even with Phage or BotRK, and your burst won't ever be enough to get him. Plus Fling has a lower cooldown than Counterstrike, and his ult gives him sizable regen and defenses to stay in lane even after you all-in him. You'll lose a bunch of farm to the tower too.
Jayce, Darius, Elise are amongst annoying match-ups too (Elise and Jayce have broken kits for laning though).
I could see Zac doing pretty well against him. Vayne top can probably annoy him her fair share too (she's more vulnerable to Irelia for example, but Jax doesn't have a reset on his gap closer to make up for Condemn).
He tends to really suck in 1v2s. Somewhat weak pre-6 (Shen destroys him pre-6, but once they get their ults Jax is much stronger although a decent lead or manipulating the minion wave can late Shen keep winning).
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malphite and singed really arent that good against jax and nasus can win but its not always that simple
i mean i played a lot of malph and quite a bit of jax and never thought the mu was clear cut for either. (after the malphite E nerfs)
i kinda stopped playing jax for no particular raeson but i never remember having too much trouble in laning phase
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On July 30 2013 19:44 chinstrap wrote:
I am having some serious success recently with Darius top purple side.
I just hit gold 5 and basically every game I can wait for them to facecheck the brush en route to lane after covering blue. Auto > auto > W > auto auto basically forces every other top laner out of lane, sometimes including a blown flash. If they stand and trade they just die (only maybe riven can match the dmg at lvl 1). Then I have like a 2 level advantage where i can just flash hook for a free fb when they come back to lane. People seriously underestimate the darius early level deeps!
Sometimes I do this cheese with 21/9/0 ad marks/quints red elixir Xin Zhao.
As they walk into bush, use elixir -> auto -> cancel immediately into Q(1), Q(2), Q(knockup), auto x2, ignite. If they flash you flash to follow. If they facecheck it's guaranteed FB no matter what. But if for whatever reason you don't get a kill, push hard to get level 2, xin has a ridiculous level 2 all-in with his EQ combo.
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On July 31 2013 00:36 Slayer91 wrote:
malphite and singed really arent that good against jax and nasus can win but its not always that simple
i mean i played a lot of malph and quite a bit of jax and never thought the mu was clear cut for either. (after the malphite E nerfs)
i kinda stopped playing jax for no particular raeson but i never remember having too much trouble in laning phase
Jax is a pretty complex champion with how his kit allows him to engage and disengage (one or the other) fairly well. Singed vs Jax isn't Singed dominated as you may believe. Singed can win, but it's not a free lane at all.
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i remember destroying some terribel singed players when i was playing jax a lot but its one of those skill wars because of the way singed poison works and his fling theres so much room for going in to trade and taking 0 damage or going in and losing half ur hp
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On July 31 2013 00:28 AsmodeusXI wrote:
So I think I've finally experience the terrible lag spikes rumored to be happening on NA recently. Wow. So much for THAT promo.
Has anyone else dealt with these recently? Is the answer simply to not play? Or is it to play Normals?
Yeah it makes me so sad. Tried playing a game last night and it was completely unplayable and I had to leave. For me it tends to happen more at night (usually after 9 pm or so). Fuck comcast.
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On July 30 2013 18:16 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2013 17:01 gtrsrs wrote:
so after all you guys ripped on him, i've been playing with the only syndra guy and he's a pretty cool, reasonable, hard-working guy. rips on some people in all-chat a bit much but he asks a ton of questions and really seeks to improve
i think you were all too hard on him i've seen you say this about a few people and their reputation never improves from there, lol. I think you're cursed.
BEHOLD THE ARTOSIS CURSE OF THE TL LEAGUE SUBFORUM.
On July 30 2013 18:56 De4ngus wrote:
this forum is the best
Haven't seen this guy for awhile.
Other stuff:
Impressed with how fast Xildarkz has improved. His/your champ pool could use some work (one champ in two positions is *very* low), but getting to Gold that fast I think is impressive. I highly discourage going dual mid, even if you do non-terribly, its likely you're getting reported for stuff like that.
PrinceXizor's Skarner shenanigans still seems predicated on either being better than the enemy team or having a draft/ ingame advantage. Ward wars are never that exciting anyways except in the odd ranked 5's game.
Besides, if you really want a pick and push you can just play Trundle.
Went to talk to my BBA advisor, and apparently I'll be suffering death-by-double major for the rest of the time in college. Not sure how much lol I'll have time to play even on weekends with all my other crap. :<
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Singed vs Jax was about as close as you can get to a free lane in my opinion. Maybe I just suck at Jax, but I played him a ton right around when proxy Singed started getting popular, and eventually I just stopped playing Jax and picked up Renekton because I was sick of racking up kills and still having deal with the prick pushing all day long and being nearly unkillable after a point. It's probably a bit better now since there's more of a gold penalty to doing stupid crap like that, but you guys are either on a completely different level than I am or haven't played the matchup much.
Also Malph vs Jax is about the same level, if Malph gets even a shred of jungle support.
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Thing about Malph is is laning isn't always that important. He doesn't really lose then you can just boss up teamfights.
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Maybe this is a dumb question but is top lane soloQ meta like
Tier 0: Kennen / Jayce
Tier 1: Elise (post nerf) / Riven / Renekton / Ryze / Wukong / Tryn
Tier 2: Singed / Malph / Vlad / Nasus / Yorick / Rumble / Jax / Cho / Shen
Edit: Where tier is some weird subjective combo of popularity / win rate
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u rate jayce too high he isnt that strong top anymore, yes he will be able to farm vs pretty much anyone but he isnt uncounterable lane bully without counters like kennen or elise, after nerfs he actually has quite few unfavourable matchups and most of matchups are just farm lanes
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Yeah just feel like it doesn't matter because Jayce will eventually get strong enough to chunk support/ADC/mid to like half-health with one Q and then you just win once they back, but I don't really understand what's going to happen to post nerf jayce.
But anyway is this the general opinion of top lane champ viability?
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On July 31 2013 01:09 Mauzel wrote:
Maybe this is a dumb question but is top lane soloQ meta like
Tier 0: Kennen / Jayce
Tier 1: Elise (post nerf) / Riven / Renekton / Ryze / Wukong / Tryn
Tier 2: Singed / Malph / Vlad / Nasus / Yorick / Rumble / Jax / Cho / Shen
Edit: Where tier is some weird subjective combo of popularity / win rate
good enough, there's always something to disagree about when it comes to something as subjective (and counterproductive) as soloq tier lists, but i think this is fine
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/tDvvE2Q.jpg)
